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Old
03-08-2004, 11:15 PM
  #51
ddheyman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -El Duderino-
Yes!! Its florida's 2nd. The avs channel just showed it.
That makes it more palatable ... still not great, but now we're moving up 30 spots instead of 10 ...

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03-08-2004, 11:21 PM
  #52
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damn. i think it would have been kind of neat to have the moore's on a line together, but alas...

isn't the word that the second round is pretty bare this draft? i bet we trade a bunch and get a better first rounder.

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03-08-2004, 11:21 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by ddheyman
That makes it more palatable ... still not great, but now we're moving up 30 spots instead of 10 ...
i agree this changes things but...................not by much. still not thrilled with the deal but at this point i'll take it

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03-08-2004, 11:27 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyrod
damn. i think it would have been kind of neat to have the moore's on a line together, but alas...

isn't the word that the second round is pretty bare this draft? i bet we trade a bunch and get a better first rounder.
that would have been crazy cuz it looks like moore is gonna be out for a while. Bertuzzi just face planted him into the ice. Horrible, dirty play. Bertuzzi should be suspended for AWHILE.

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03-08-2004, 11:51 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SatherExecutioner
I am a little dissapointed with this deal. I was hoping for Boychuk or Slovak and maybe McCormick or Hahl. And losing our 3rd rounder really hurts.

I think we now don't have 3rd, 4th, 7th and 8th round picks
I don't think losing our third rounder "really hurts" the issue is whether we got as much value as we could have ... I thought we would have gotten more for Barnaby ... basically we moved up 30 spots and we got Liffiton which is a 2nd (2003). So the questions is was Barnaby worth more than a 2nd and moving up 30 spots? I thought so based on the previous trades ...

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03-09-2004, 12:27 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by SatherExecutioner
Me too, if our 3rd wasn't envolved this would be a good trade, but I think Barnaby is worth a lot more than what we got. Oh well, can't always get a great return.
Agreed. Hopefully we get more for Rucinsky ... Vancouver may really need him now.

As a total aside Bertuzzi should be gone for a LONG time. Just saw the replay... absolutely disgusting ... don't know if Rangers fans know the history, but Moore hit Naslund high a couple of weeks ago, concussion and missed three games. No penalty, and after review by the league deemed no suspension necessary (i.e. clean hit - Nuck fans disagree, but it looked borderline to me). Bertuzzi vowed revenge ... basically sought out Moore in a like 8-2 game, sucker punched him in the side of the head (from behind - and Islander fans were upset with Purinton's punch on Cairns - hah bertuzzi's got him beat by about a million miles) and slammed his head down onto the ice and then landed on him. Moore didn't move for like 20 minutes, pool of blood formed at the side of his head, and he was carted off in stretcher .... pretty violent conversations going on on the Av's and 'Nucks boards ... even some 'Nucks fans are saying Bertuzzi is a disgrace to the game and should be banned for a long, long time. Ugly, ugly scene, reminds me of the Brashear/McSorley incident.

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Old
03-09-2004, 12:48 AM
  #57
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guys u realize when looking at where hf ranks him.. they put very little stock in one year draft picks after the first round.. u can not find one nonslipping prospect drafted in the second round with much of a ranking or player rating... this kid is no better or worse then baranka which we still have hopes for.. nothing wrong with that...

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03-09-2004, 12:55 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -El Duderino-
that would have been crazy cuz it looks like moore is gonna be out for a while. Bertuzzi just face planted him into the ice. Horrible, dirty play. Bertuzzi should be suspended for AWHILE.
well, i hadn't heard about that incident when i posted that

i'm kind of on the fence about resigning barnaby. part of me wants him back, and part of me wants ever member of this horrible team gone(except jagr ortmeyer and lundmark.)

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03-09-2004, 01:02 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by rickyrod
well, i hadn't heard about that incident when i posted that

i'm kind of on the fence about resigning barnaby. part of me wants him back, and part of me wants ever member of this horrible team gone(except jagr ortmeyer and lundmark.)
i cant understand how u would want jagr ortmeyer or lundmark over barnaby.. to me hes done more then everyone of them including jags

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03-09-2004, 05:39 AM
  #60
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people, i know matty played extemely well as a ranger. but remember what we got him for, Ciger......

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Old
03-09-2004, 06:27 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FACEMAN
people, i know matty played extemely well as a ranger. but remember what we got him for, Ciger......
The point isn't what we got him for, it's what he did for us. The answer is a he// of alot more then most have done for us. The guy has worked and given his best. He's also a leader.... i'd take him on my team any day.

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03-09-2004, 06:32 AM
  #62
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I'd take him back next year, also.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnaby
The point isn't what we got him for, it's what he did for us. The answer is a he// of alot more then most have done for us. The guy has worked and given his best. He's also a leader.... i'd take him on my team any day.
But, sticking around through what will be the death march to the top of the draft would not have guaranteed him resigning here. So, Sather gets another prospect, takes a warm body to hold down the fort and improve his drafting position in the upcoming draft.

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Old
03-09-2004, 07:23 AM
  #63
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Thanks for everything Matty. I did not get to watch tons of Rangers' games the past two years, but in the ones I managed to catch you gave it all and deserved to wear a Ranger sweater, unlike most here. We'll be glad to have you back next season.

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03-09-2004, 07:46 AM
  #64
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Trade

Guys, let's be realistic.

Barnaby is a rental. He's been a 3rd/4th liner or healthy scratch for most or all of his career. In exchange for him, in a buyer's market, we got a middle-tier prospect, and we moved up about 30 spots in the draft. In McAllister, we got a warm body to occupy Malakhov's spot in the lineup.

What did you people expect to get for Barnaby?

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03-09-2004, 09:04 AM
  #65
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I don't think anybody...

can really complain about the return. He's a 3/4 liner that's a rental. In return, the Rangers get to move up in the draft and get a prospect. Now the prospect is suspect, but the prospect is also only one year removed from a draft in which he was ranked pretty highly (do we think anyhting of picks drafted after the first round? I think so). The question is, has he improved from last year, since being drafted, to this year? I'd be interested to know the strides he's made in his skating, which seemed to have been questioned.

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03-09-2004, 09:25 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
can really complain about the return. He's a 3/4 liner that's a rental. In return, the Rangers get to move up in the draft and get a prospect. Now the prospect is suspect, but the prospect is also only one year removed from a draft in which he was ranked pretty highly (do we think anyhting of picks drafted after the first round? I think so). The question is, has he improved from last year, since being drafted, to this year? I'd be interested to know the strides he's made in his skating, which seemed to have been questioned.
I agree. Is the 2nd rounder we got Florida's 2nd?

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03-09-2004, 09:44 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13
I agree. Is the 2nd rounder we got Florida's 2nd?
Yes, it is. Florida's 2nd.

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Old
03-09-2004, 10:13 AM
  #68
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How can we not be happy with this trade?

Yes, I loved Barnaby too, but it was obvious he was going to be dealt. I am very pleased with what we were able to get in return. I'm pretty sure we will see Barnaby re-sign in the off-season.

Liffiton is a great prospect. A solid, stay-at-home defenseman with a mean streak. How many of these types of players do we have in our organization? I certainly can count them all on less than one hand. It'll take him probably 2 or 3 more years before he makes an impact, but he reminds me a lot of Kurt Sauer. Nothing fancy, little offensive upside but a rock in his own end.

Everyone's acting as if we gave up our 3rd rounder for McAllister. Please. McAllister was just a throw-in so we'd have a warm body back on the blue-line. Obviously the Avs wouldn't have given up a 2nd-round prospect plus a 2nd round pick for Barnaby without getting a 3rd back as well. We move up about 30 spots in the draft. That's a lot. We now have 6 of the top 60 or so picks. Slats will probably be looking to wheel and deal at draft time. I say get two teams to swap us a 1st and a 4th or 5th for two of our 2nd's. That way we'd get four 1st round picks.

Or we can just sit tight and add six quality prospects to an organization that - before these past few weeks - was clearly lacking in that department.

Slats obviously took the best deal on the table. Ottawa was interested, but I doubt they were willing to match this package.


Last edited by Draft Guru: 03-09-2004 at 10:20 AM.
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Old
03-09-2004, 10:55 AM
  #69
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There are some players who are worth more than they're usually traded for, because their intangiables are less evident than their size and skills, and Matty's a classic case. We stole him for Ciger. With that in mind, I think we managed to get a decent, if not spectacular, return for him, especially if you consider he's potentially only a rental.

Chris Gratton, whom the Avs also traded for, is the classic example of the opposite. Big, skilled, does nothing on the ice or in the locker room.

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03-09-2004, 11:12 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 007
There are some players who are worth more than they're usually traded for, because their intangiables are less evident than their size and skills, and Matty's a classic case. We stole him for Ciger. With that in mind, I think we managed to get a decent, if not spectacular, return for him, especially if you consider he's potentially only a rental.

Chris Gratton, whom the Avs also traded for, is the classic example of the opposite. Big, skilled, does nothing on the ice or in the locker room.
I agree, but all will be well if he re-signs with us.

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Old
03-09-2004, 11:26 AM
  #71
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Why is everyone just assuming that Barnaby will be back next season? The fact is that Buffalo will be his first choice as he has indicated. The Rangers will be high on his list if the Sabres are not interested but, as long as they offer him a decent contract, he'll be a Sabre whenever hockey is played again.

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Old
03-09-2004, 11:42 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kazo
Why is everyone just assuming that Barnaby will be back next season? The fact is that Buffalo will be his first choice as he has indicated. The Rangers will be high on his list if the Sabres are not interested but, as long as they offer him a decent contract, he'll be a Sabre whenever hockey is played again.
The Barnaby's of the league are valuable yes, but it's not like we can't replace him. Yes, he's a 'heart & soul' gritty forward, but when we rely too much on a guy like him you know we're in trouble.

Barnaby is underrated, nice player, but replaceable if he signs with Buffalo.

Hopefully Slats can get Steve Ott from Dallas, that would give us a younger version of Barnaby, with skills & fists

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Old
03-09-2004, 05:01 PM
  #73
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I'm not normally this blunt, but if you're complaining about this trade you're being foolish.

Liffton is a project but he's hardly garbage. He's got a mean streak and can be a nasty stay at home defenseman.

The second round pick will be around 34ish so we moved up closer to 30 spots, not 10.

McAllister is a throw in, needed to fill the ice till next season. I mean considering the players we've turned over, we have to throw someone out there.

Essentially it comes down to Barnaby and a third for a stay at home project and and a very high second.

Keep in mind that Barnaby is also a rental. The second round pick gives them team even more flexibility for a trade {Whether it's ovechkin or adding another first rounder or even two at this point} and Liffton might turn into something, though he's gonna need more work.

And the biggest difference between Purinton and McAllister is that BigMac can actually chuck em, Purinton, for all his hype is coming off more as a pest than as a legit heavyweight.

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