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Per Zipay, the Rangers aren't done on the trade front

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Old
02-02-2009, 10:27 AM
  #101
SingnBluesOnBroadway
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Not going to win many Cups when Gomez, Drury, Redden and Rozsival are earning a combined 26 million in a salary cap league, either, you can count on that.
You can if they play the way they're capable of. You can when you have a goalie who can get hot and carry a team.

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02-02-2009, 10:27 AM
  #102
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I think I would as well trade Dubinsky if the return was a winger that is similar in age, skill, and size. It's not that I think Anisimov will be better, it's that I think this team would benefit quite noticeably with a good winger right now as opposed to a center.

I do, however, think that Anisimov will eventually develop into what Dubinsky is now but without the feistiness.


Another thing - there is a certain center named Derek Stepan who looks like a very promising prospect right now. There is a good chance that if we keep Dubinsky there won't be any room for him in 2-3 years to make the team.

Still though, the return would have to be more than worthwhile

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02-02-2009, 10:29 AM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Not going to win many Cups when Gomez, Drury, Redden and Rozsival are earning a combined 26 million in a salary cap league, either, you can count on that.
Well, the Sharks have the same amount tied up in their (4) top paid skaters and they're a Cup favorite this year.

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02-02-2009, 10:32 AM
  #104
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I'd rather the Sharks top paid players than ours...

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02-02-2009, 10:44 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Mikkel Boedker is an example of someone who might be a complimentary player to Dubi, TODAY, addresses the need for a LW'er and addresses the need for cheap, young talent with a multi-year contract. Maybe Dubinsky's edge in experience is of value of Phoenix, although I'm not sure if he fills a need positionally for them. Again, just an example......
If the Rangers acquired Boedker, even at the expense of Dubinsky, I would do a backflip. I love Phoenix' youth.

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02-02-2009, 10:45 AM
  #106
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it is tough to "rebuild" when you're making the playoffs. The mentality is to make the playoffs, not tear it down. Perhaps the direction the organization should've taken was to trade Jagr and get a huge return of those young players this organization sorely craves. Perhaps there are others. But, of course, Sather wasn't saying to himself that he doesn't have a Stanley Cup winning team. I do understand the other side of the equation. That there is the potential to build something just above mediocrity each season, make the playoffs, get mid-round picks that Sather may waste, and never really get a real shot at the Cup. But again, how do you tear down a competitive team.

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02-02-2009, 10:48 AM
  #107
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Looks to me like the guys that will be dealt are sitting. I think it's obvious they want a bigger look and Prucha and Dawes are small players

hopefully they can net a good top 6 back

I am cool with Drury, Dubinsky, Zherdev but want Naslund and Gomez with a sniper...........then have Korpikoski, Anisimov, Callahan........Sjostrom , Betts , Orr with Voros sitting around

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02-02-2009, 10:49 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Synergy27 View Post
If the Rangers acquired Boedker, even at the expense of Dubinsky, I would do a backflip. I love Phoenix' youth.
Trading Dubinsky for a similar young player is fine. Exactly like the Tyutin for Zherdev trade. If he has to go, we can atleast get a guy who is young and fills a need too.

Sather knows this. Or else we would have traded Toots, and ended up with Jason Blake instead of Z.

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02-02-2009, 10:50 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Well, the Sharks have the same amount tied up in their (4) top paid skaters and they're a Cup favorite this year.
Come on...seriously? This is your response?



You're going to compare the Sharks top 4 paid guys with the Rangers top 4 paid guys?

Thornton - 48 games, 56 points (7.2 mill)

Marleau - 48 games, 53 points (6.3 mill)

Boyle - 44 games, 38 points (6.6 mill)

Blake - 46 games, 31 points (5 mill)

I never said it was impossible to win the cup with that many players earning that much money. I said it was impossible with Gomez, Redden, Rozsival, and Drury making that much money.

BTW, LOL @ Boyle outscoring Gomez this season, in less games.

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02-02-2009, 10:55 AM
  #110
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I always thought that Lee Stempniak would look great on the right side of Naslund and Gomez.. He would be a great addition at a low cap(1.882 with one more year left) and I don't think we'd have to give up Dubinsky or Anisimov.

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02-02-2009, 10:58 AM
  #111
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Singn'...

the one issue with Drury and Gomez playing the way they're capable of playing is that they need better players playing with them (better than are currently on the team, and probably players who are better than they are). I agree with your notion that with a goaltender carrying the team on his back, which he has done from time to time, and players producing at 90% of their best years, that this team should be serious contenders. I would just question how to get there from here. Can it be done from within? Can they afford to do it from the outside? There are valid cap concerns for this team, and I think Sather did give out contracts that weren't friendly to the organization. Now, he has to figure out how to round-out his team to enhance that investment. Hopefully there are ways, and those ways are for him to be creative, and honestly, today I don't have the solution, and it does affect who he can trade for, if anybody, or who he trades.

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02-02-2009, 11:00 AM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Come on...seriously? This is your response?
You said it couldn't happen.

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02-02-2009, 11:00 AM
  #113
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Sting...

let's say that it's difficult, not impossible. It may be improbable to think that Drury, Naslund, Gomez and Henke all get hot in the playoffs and they make a 'Canes-like run, but it's not impossible. They've all done it before, albeit in different situations, but again, let's not say impossible

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02-02-2009, 11:01 AM
  #114
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What about Dubinsky and Redden/Rozsival for Michalek and Erhoff/Vlasic?

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02-02-2009, 11:12 AM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
I don't know what to say other than I disagree. I've seen Backman play before, during and after his Ranger tenure and never felt he was anything less than a capable 3rd pairing defenseman. If his abilities were really on par with the assessments of his abilities as illustrated here, he wouldn't be in his 5th full NHL season.
Backman was fairly young when the Blues had him and he was a first round pick. They weren't going to just not play him. Plus, their blueline was awful for most of those years.

Dave Karpa played 557 NHL games. I don't know about you, but I don't think Dave Karpa ever belonged in the NHL.

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02-02-2009, 11:15 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
the one issue with Drury and Gomez playing the way they're capable of playing is that they need better players playing with them (better than are currently on the team, and probably players who are better than they are). I agree with your notion that with a goaltender carrying the team on his back, which he has done from time to time, and players producing at 90% of their best years, that this team should be serious contenders. I would just question how to get there from here. Can it be done from within? Can they afford to do it from the outside? There are valid cap concerns for this team, and I think Sather did give out contracts that weren't friendly to the organization. Now, he has to figure out how to round-out his team to enhance that investment. Hopefully there are ways, and those ways are for him to be creative, and honestly, today I don't have the solution, and it does affect who he can trade for, if anybody, or who he trades.
I don't disagree with anything you say Fletch. My point is the same that you made earlier you don't rebuild when you're making the playoffs. And there are teams who have managed to add youth all the while making the playoffs.

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02-02-2009, 11:16 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Dave Karpa played 557 NHL games. I don't know about you, but I don't think Dave Karpa ever belonged in the NHL.

Amen brother

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02-02-2009, 11:20 AM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Dave Karpa played 557 NHL games. I don't know about you, but I don't think Dave Karpa ever belonged in the NHL.
Sort of like Orr and Voros

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02-02-2009, 11:34 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Dave Karpa played 557 NHL games. I don't know about you, but I don't think Dave Karpa ever belonged in the NHL.
Why?

Karpa was a solid player for Carolina and Anaheim. The guy wasn't massively skilled, but didn't have to be. He played a sound positional game and was a difficult opponent play against physically. His career is not defined by his time with NYR.

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02-02-2009, 11:40 AM
  #120
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which teams have done that, Singn'?

you mean like the Devils, who continually make the playoffs and which still find ways to add guys like Zajac, Parise and Gionta, among others, over the years? I think that's the point right there. You build a base and add to that base. And heck, weren't the Devils in cap he!! a couple seasons ago with guys like Mogilny and Maladog? It's definitely possible, Singn'. The Rangers' main problem is that they really haven't drafted a Zajac or Parise over the years, having passed on them in order to pick up Jessiman, Montoya and Korps. But that's in the past. Looking forward, we'll see what they have. I'm not exactly high (like Zajac or Parise high) on the forwards currently in the system. The hope is that both Sangs and DZ look to be studs and one can be moved for that guy. In the near term? Just need to hope that Henke returns to form and maybe Sather can pull a rabbit from the hat.

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02-02-2009, 11:41 AM
  #121
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MJ..

I think Karpa was always that 7th defenseman who got time due to injuries. He was up and down between the AHL and NHL if I remember correctly.

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02-02-2009, 11:47 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Why?

Karpa was a solid player for Carolina and Anaheim. The guy wasn't massively skilled, but didn't have to be. He played a sound positional game and was a difficult opponent play against physically. His career is not defined by his time with NYR.
I'm not going to judge someone based on one season that they played, on a terrible team, toward the end of their career.

But I don't recall Karpa being anything more than average positionally. He was slow, he took a ton of horrible penalties, and he generally contributed nothing but physicality.

I'll take Strudwick over Karpa any day.

Every year, there are at least a handful of players playing in this league that simply don't belong, but stay around for a variety of different reasons.

I can tell you that I once interviewed a former Islanders front-office member who told me something along the lines of "you wouldn't believe how many guys stick around in this league because they're friends with someone."

Now, I'm not saying that was certainly the case with Karpa, and I highly doubt that's the case with Backman, but I do believe there is truth to that. There are guys in every pro league that get lucky and stick around.

I mean, Oliver "The World" Miller played multiple seasons in the NBA.

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02-02-2009, 11:49 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I think Karpa was always that 7th defenseman who got time due to injuries. He was up and down between the AHL and NHL if I remember correctly.
That's what he SHOULD have been by the time he got here, but Sather, Low and Trottier were just unable to put together a competent defensive effort. It made talented players like Quintal and Lefebvre look like chumps, it made mildly talented players look down-right incapable.

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02-02-2009, 11:57 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
I'm not going to judge someone based on one season that they played, on a terrible team, toward the end of their career.

But I don't recall Karpa being anything more than average positionally. He was slow, he took a ton of horrible penalties, and he generally contributed nothing but physicality.

I'll take Strudwick over Karpa any day.

Every year, there are at least a handful of players playing in this league that simply don't belong, but stay around for a variety of different reasons.

I can tell you that I once interviewed a former Islanders front-office member who told me something along the lines of "you wouldn't believe how many guys stick around in this league because they're friends with someone."

Now, I'm not saying that was certainly the case with Karpa, and I highly doubt that's the case with Backman, but I do believe there is truth to that. There are guys in every pro league that get lucky and stick around.

I mean, Oliver "The World" Miller played multiple seasons in the NBA.
Don't get me wrong, I couldn't tell you much about Karpa's early days with the Nordiques, but he earned that UFA contract he got from the Rangers with a good season in Carolina.

I won't argue that there are/were/will be players in this league who have no business in it. Purinton immediately jumps to mind. It's hard to compare the league then and now though. A decade ago, you could be a tough guy with no skill and put together an NHL career. Today, the onus is on a different kind of ability.

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02-02-2009, 11:59 AM
  #125
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Karpa came here not to be the 7th defenseman - that's what he was throughout his career. I think he was in the AHL prior to Sather signing him.

Quintal looked like a chump because he was. A very overrated defenseman, especially on the defensive side of the ledger. Lefebvre lost a few steps. I think Muck was his coach in his first season. He was horrible. Low was his coach in his second season. If I remember correctly, he seemed to be quite serviceable then and was the Rangers' steadiest defenseman. After that, he had nothing left. I think he got hurt, spent time in the AHL. I wouldn't blame the coach on those guys one bit. He didn't play after the Rangers for a reason, and it was that he had nothing left in the tank.

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