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Murray, Ehrhoff, Cheechoo

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:34 PM
  #51
SCUDeriMISSILE
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Originally Posted by ThorntonFan19 View Post
What is your limit of trading the second for Cheechoo. What I mean is what is the highest overall 2nd rounder possible for you to trade for Cheechoo?
46 for me.

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:37 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by ThorntonFan19 View Post
What is your limit of trading the second for Cheechoo. What I mean is what is the highest overall 2nd rounder possible for you to trade for Cheechoo?
At the moment our Second is looking to be 31-40 which would be slightly too high in my opinion,How do you feel about my Dupuis(fills Cheechoo's spot on the Third Line,good PK to) Tampa's Third and Bortuzzo(defensive dmen prospect)

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:40 PM
  #53
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that's why I suggested Dupuis,He is a good third liner,excellent speed,good on PK,excellent backchecker,heavy slapshot.Signed for a 1.4million cap hit for two more seasons after this.Cheechoo's numbers are no better than Kennedy's this season so I don't see Pens moving him for Cheechoo(even though Cheechoo will produce better numbers next season if he is back in the top 6 somewhere).My best offer would be Dupuis,Tampa's Third and Bortuzzo(Defensive d-man prospect).
Im not sure Dupuis is needed on the sharks but is it just to clear cap space? Not to be annoying but would you do Dupuis and a 2nd for Cheech?

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:43 PM
  #54
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sorry about that I didn't see your reply. I would do that trade probably unless the sharks got offered a high 2nd.

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:43 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
that's why I suggested Dupuis,He is a good third liner,excellent speed,good on PK,excellent backchecker,heavy slapshot.Signed for a 1.4million cap hit for two more seasons after this.Cheechoo's numbers are no better than Kennedy's this season so I don't see Pens moving him for Cheechoo(even though Cheechoo will produce better numbers next season if he is back in the top 6 somewhere).My best offer would be Dupuis,Tampa's Third and Bortuzzo(Defensive d-man prospect).
I think would pass, but if that was the best offer, I wouldn't cry over it.

Dupuis+2nd for Cheechoo+3rd 2010 (no 09) I would consider, but IMO Dupuis isn't that much better than Plihal, who is also fast, has good speed, is good on the pk, and a good shot (better wrister than Pascal, but not as good of a slapshot. Dupuis is better, but also more expensive, and like I said previously, Cheechoo is the Sharks one movable asset. They better get a clear upgrade.

Also, the Sharks have Petrecki and Moore as far as defensive D (arguably our top 2, and 2 of the 3 most ready). They would prefer wingers and offensive d-men.

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Old
02-18-2009, 10:57 PM
  #56
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I might be tempted by Dupuis+2nd for Cheechoo+3rd 2010 (no 09).We have two decent wing prospects(Caputi and Pierre-Zabotel) but we need them desperately and one decent offensive defenseman in Alex Grant (7.5C)with one of Whitney and Goligoski likely to be moved and Gonchar getting up in age,I could see the Organisation looking to hold onto Grant.Most of our other dmen prospects project to be more stay at home types or two way guys who could be used on the Second Power Play Unit.

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Old
02-18-2009, 11:17 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I might be tempted by Dupuis+2nd for Cheechoo+3rd 2010 (no 09).We have two decent wing prospects(Caputi and Pierre-Zabotel) but we need them desperately and one decent offensive defenseman in Alex Grant (7.5C)with one of Whitney and Goligoski likely to be moved and Gonchar getting up in age,I could see the Organisation looking to hold onto Grant.Most of our other dmen prospects project to be more stay at home types or two way guys who could be used on the Second Power Play Unit.

I would do that.

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Old
02-18-2009, 11:20 PM
  #58
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What's Cheechoo's deal this year? Why isn't he scoring?

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Old
02-18-2009, 11:28 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
What's Cheechoo's deal this year? Why isn't he scoring?
He's on the third line and hardly sees any power play time. I think it's the speed of the sharks/McLellans system that keeps him firmly out of the top 6

BUT, he clearly still has the touch of a goal scorer, so while his stats are awful, I don't think the sharks should jump to unload him if all they will get is something like Dupuis or a 2nd.

I've said it before and I've said it again, if he a sure thing to be on a line with Crosby or Spezza he will be a top 2 goal scorer on the team.

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Old
02-18-2009, 11:45 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDanceOfMaternity View Post
He's on the third line and hardly sees any power play time. I think it's the speed of the sharks/McLellans system that keeps him firmly out of the top 6

BUT, he clearly still has the touch of a goal scorer, so while his stats are awful, I don't think the sharks should jump to unload him if all they will get is something like Dupuis or a 2nd.

I've said it before and I've said it again, if he a sure thing to be on a line with Crosby or Spezza he will be a top 2 goal scorer on the team.
That's what I thought and that's why I think he'd be a good fit here in L.A. Any interest in Brian Boyle and a 2nd?

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Old
02-19-2009, 12:26 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
That's what I thought and that's why I think he'd be a good fit here in L.A. Any interest in Brian Boyle and a 2nd?
Instead of Boyle, how about Purcell or Moller? Sharks have plenty of C's but are short on LW/RW prospects

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Old
02-19-2009, 12:28 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
That's what I thought and that's why I think he'd be a good fit here in L.A. Any interest in Brian Boyle and a 2nd?
He would be a good fit in LA, but the guys who the sharks would want are too good, and the guys who the kings would trade aren't good enough imo (aren't people starting to call Boyle a bust?)

I've proposed Cheechoo for Tyler Kennedy plus a 2nd a few times but noone ever responds to that.

Pit gets a scoring winger with a great shot, the sharks have Mitchell and Kennedy on their checking line for cheap for while.

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Old
02-19-2009, 01:57 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by matt trick View Post
Me too, same for Clowe, Setoguchi, and Bernier. So far 0 for 1; and I am guessing the neither Clowe or Setoguchi are headed north.

I love Ehrhoff as a player, and IMO he goes nowhere. He is pretty good offensively, our #2 defensively, third best penalty killer, great shot, and elite speed. I can't remember who said it but he is essentially a dumb version of Niedermayer. If he had hockey sense he would be better than Vlasic, as he is much more physically gifted. He was also our best pker last year, despite being hurt pretty bad.

Also, in the event that Blake heads out and Ehrhoff is traded our top 4 includes Boyle, Vlasic, Lukowich, and Murray. Fantastic.

The Cheechoo and Ehrhoff for Whitney, Kennedy, 2nd would have my interest, but I would rather do Kennedy+2nd for Cheech straight up (maybe the Sharks swap 2nds or add in a 3rd). Whitney is good and all, and probably better and more valuable than Ehrhoff, but Ehrhoff is much better defensively.


If Blake takes a discount (which is IMO a real possibility), Murray is on his way out. Won't garner much but I think he would make a few teams top 4s.
As much as I like Blake... I'd rather have Murray next year. Blake can't keep up with the speed anymore, and has been a liability since day 1.

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Old
02-19-2009, 02:00 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThorntonFan19 View Post
What could these sharks players get at the draft from your team?

Douglas Murray
Christian Ehrhoff
Jonathon Cheechoo
Lukas Kaspar
Honestly, you are asking this AGAIN?! Were the five other threads not informative enough for you?

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Old
02-19-2009, 02:01 AM
  #65
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Cheechoo to Edmonton?
What would it take?

I never thought of Cheechoo as a 3rd liner???
I don't see many SJ games though.
I always thought he was a 1st or 2nd liner.

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Old
02-19-2009, 02:01 AM
  #66
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I'd love to see Doug Murray in Ducks next season but I'm afraid the cost is too much.

Mitera + 2nd rounder enough?

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Old
02-19-2009, 06:41 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by TheDanceOfMaternity View Post
He would be a good fit in LA, but the guys who the sharks would want are too good, and the guys who the kings would trade aren't good enough imo (aren't people starting to call Boyle a bust?)

I've proposed Cheechoo for Tyler Kennedy plus a 2nd a few times but noone ever responds to that.

Pit gets a scoring winger with a great shot, the sharks have Mitchell and Kennedy on their checking line for cheap for while.
Pens say no to that,Kennedy has put up similar points to Cheech this season.If Pens would move for Cheechoo,they'd need to take some salary back that's why I suggested Dupuis and Tampa's Third and any of our dmen prospects not named Grant.

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:12 AM
  #68
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From the Bruins? None of them would be an option.

Cheechoo makes too much to add and plays a position of strength. The only thing option for us would be Ryder for Cheechoo. And despite the fact that I think Ryder is the better all around player, and right now, the better goal scorer, I don't see SJ doing this because they'd be adding salary. So no deal for Cheech

Erhoff I'd love to add but again we can't afford his salary.

Murray at 2.5 I really can't see ANY team trading for, but maybe I'm wrong.

As far as Kaspar I don't see what value you are going to get for a RFA with 1 career goal.

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:21 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDanceOfMaternity View Post
He's on the third line and hardly sees any power play time. I think it's the speed of the sharks/McLellans system that keeps him firmly out of the top 6

BUT, he clearly still has the touch of a goal scorer, so while his stats are awful, I don't think the sharks should jump to unload him if all they will get is something like Dupuis or a 2nd.

I've said it before and I've said it again, if he a sure thing to be on a line with Crosby or Spezza he will be a top 2 goal scorer on the team.
There is a reason he is on the 3rd line. If he isn't scoring then he is a 3rd liner. Anyone that wants to trade for him will offer very little more than the value of a top 3rd liner. Because if his value were more, than he would be a top 6 forward.

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02-19-2009, 08:32 AM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LGSens View Post
There is a reason he is on the 3rd line. If he isn't scoring then he is a 3rd liner. Anyone that wants to trade for him will offer very little more than the value of a top 3rd liner. Because if his value were more, than he would be a top 6 forward.
While it may be true in Cheechoo's case, it isn't overall. You completely ignore that a team is not equally strong at all positions. Havlat played on the third line in Ottawa, Detroit had quite a few players who were more valuable than a third liner yet had no place on the top two lines because the team had way too much depth.

Would a player never be worth more than a third liner just because he had Sakic/Forsberg or Yzerman/Fedorov in front of him?
Just because someone has a certain skill level doesn't mean that his team has the roster spot to accomodate that.

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:37 AM
  #71
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In this case it's true. His value is decreasing. Havlat started out on the 3rd line but worked his way up. Cheechoo is going from the top to the bottom.

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:00 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LGSens View Post
In this case it's true. His value is decreasing. Havlat started out on the 3rd line but worked his way up. Cheechoo is going from the top to the bottom.
Cheechoo started out as a 3rd liner, putting up nearly 30 goals playing with an aging Mike Ricci and Scott Thornton. He worked his way up the 1st line playing with JT because JT and Cheechoo's skills compliment each other. For Cheechoo to thrive he needs a center who has precision passing. With all the injuries at center on the Sharks, he hasn't had that this year (Mitchell, Goc, Plihal, and Roenick have all been injured at times, and are ALL injured right now).

Cheechoo is on the 3rd line on the Sharks because he doesn't have the speed of Setoguchi, who can also create a lot of his own plays. And he doesn't have the size of Clowe, who doesn't have the shot Cheechoo does, but who is also quite a good passer. He's not going to push either Seto or Clowe off the top pairing, and he's got no one in the bottom six to pass to him, so he's basically struggled offensively. Put him with the right center, and he'll still be good for around 30 goals a year I would expect. Put him with a great center, and 40 goals a year is not out the question. But I doubt he'll ever see 50 again.

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:07 AM
  #73
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Ehrhoff to TOR would cost us? Antro? Van Ryn?

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02-19-2009, 11:11 AM
  #74
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If Ottawa has interest in Cheechoo, what would be the asking price from Sharks fans?

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:26 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Cappo619 View Post
Ehrhoff to TOR would cost us? Antro? Van Ryn?
Neither would get you Ehrhoff in my opinion. I wouldn't trade him for both. If the Sharks are trading Ehrhoff, it's for cap relief. So think top prospects and 1st round picks.

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