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London Free Press: No blockbuster announcements, but Burke says change is coming

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Old
02-19-2009, 12:43 AM
  #26
Dark Knight
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What Burke is doing with the Kaberle situation is perfect, IMO. There is one thing to make available publicly that one of the best offensive defenseman is available, and there is one thing giving out the feeling that you'd like him to stick around.

I think the real Kaberle will begin sometime at Noon on the trade deadling and offers could get ridiculous, IMO.

GMs know how to pay and some draft picks here and there dont mean much to them. I hope we rip someone off, a lot. Why? Because after a long time I'll have the happiness and content to say that the Leafs ripped someone off.

Here's to hoping that whatever happens, happens for the good of the Leafs.

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Old
02-19-2009, 12:55 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salsabil View Post
What Burke is doing with the Kaberle situation is perfect, IMO. There is one thing to make available publicly that one of the best offensive defenseman is available, and there is one thing giving out the feeling that you'd like him to stick around.

I think the real Kaberle bidding will begin sometime at Noon on the trade deadling and offers could get ridiculous, IMO.

GMs know how to pay and some draft picks here and there dont mean much to them. I hope we rip someone off, a lot. Why? Because after a long time I'll have the happiness and content to say that the Leafs ripped someone off.

Here's to hoping that whatever happens, happens for the good of the Leafs.
Amen

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Old
02-19-2009, 12:58 AM
  #28
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Schenn is still a prospect though. That changes the argument completely. There is a big difference between trading a Kaberle, who is likely to be on the downside of his career when we are ready to compete, and trading Schenn, a rookie NHLer no where near his potential, for picks/prospects.
Well, that's the point I was getting at. I wasn't clear enough. Sorry. What I was trying to say was that if Burke is using this argument for a guy like Schenn - only in the league for 60 games so far - then what would a guy like Kubina and Kaberle fetch in terms of prospects. I see too many people refusing to take likelihood of reaching potential into account. Flyer fans were flying off the handle at the thought of JVR+Lupul+1st for Kaberle. I think that's exactly the type of deal you're going to see, but that's me. I don't mean that one specifically, but that type of value. I don't really value prospects/picks nearly as much as established talent.

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02-19-2009, 01:27 AM
  #29
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+1

established talent is way underrated here on HF...

people would take JT over crosby.

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Old
02-19-2009, 02:54 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salsabil View Post
What Burke is doing with the Kaberle situation is perfect, IMO. There is one thing to make available publicly that one of the best offensive defenseman is available, and there is one thing giving out the feeling that you'd like him to stick around.

I think the real Kaberle will begin sometime at Noon on the trade deadling and offers could get ridiculous, IMO.

GMs know how to pay and some draft picks here and there dont mean much to them. I hope we rip someone off, a lot. Why? Because after a long time I'll have the happiness and content to say that the Leafs ripped someone off.

Here's to hoping that whatever happens, happens for the good of the Leafs.
well said brother>

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Old
02-19-2009, 02:56 AM
  #31
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well said brother>
+1 Slave.
After years of being on the butt end of the deal, nothing would please me more than seeing a complete hosing on our side.

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Old
02-19-2009, 04:41 AM
  #32
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^^^

hear hear

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Old
02-19-2009, 04:48 AM
  #33
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I didn't understand the part about "character" to suggest that there are problems with the player in that regard. I simply took it to mean that they were looking for in-depth insight into the player's personality to get a sense of how he might fit in, develop and so on. Stats are easily available, and scouts have tapes and records of watching players play. They don't - however - always have inside knowledge into what makes a player tick, how they conduct themselves at practice, or off the ice, which can make all the difference for a developing prospect or young NHLer.


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Old
02-19-2009, 06:46 AM
  #34
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Burke's looking at Kovalev

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02-19-2009, 06:56 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
Schenn is still a prospect though. That changes the argument completely. There is a big difference between trading a Kaberle, who is likely to be on the downside of his career when we are ready to compete, and trading Schenn, a rookie NHLer no where near his potential, for picks/prospects.
Exactly.

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Old
02-19-2009, 07:18 AM
  #36
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I'd speculate Whitney. My thinking is that the Pens might send Staal to us for Kaberle but we'd have to take Whitney to make it work for them...just the basis for the deal...who knows what else. Wouldn't Kaberle and Gonchar make a great pairing?

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Old
02-19-2009, 07:32 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by J. Greenstein View Post
I'd speculate Whitney. My thinking is that the Pens might send Staal to us for Kaberle but we'd have to take Whitney to make it work for them...just the basis for the deal...who knows what else. Wouldn't Kaberle and Gonchar make a great pairing?
If so, it's possible that Burke is looking to trade Kaberle when the price is right and would hope that Whitney could take up a similar role.

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Old
02-19-2009, 07:54 AM
  #38
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Would that player being evaluated for character be Whitney?
Goligoski maybe ...read that Burke asked for him AND a 1st for Antropov

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Old
02-19-2009, 07:57 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icewind Dale View Post
"you want me to trade a Top 5 pick, someone who might eventually be able to play, for an 18-year-old who is playing 22-minutes a game right now?'"

Nice to see an actual top NHL GM point out the lunacy of trading a prospect/pick for established talent. I hope more and more people on this site read this quote.
if offered on draft day, and it was #2 overall i'd take it.

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Old
02-19-2009, 07:59 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by facey View Post
+1

established talent is way underrated here on HF...

people would take JT over crosby.
i doubt anyone would ...not even JT's parents

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:06 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Greenstein View Post
I'd speculate Whitney. My thinking is that the Pens might send Staal to us for Kaberle but we'd have to take Whitney to make it work for them...just the basis for the deal...who knows what else. Wouldn't Kaberle and Gonchar make a great pairing?
I did hear Staal might be available, so I'd like to try and get him. We could draft Brayden, sign the Sedins, get Jordan Staal and then get another one of the Staals. Burke likes brothers, you know

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:14 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. Greenstein View Post
I'd speculate Whitney. My thinking is that the Pens might send Staal to us for Kaberle but we'd have to take Whitney to make it work for them...just the basis for the deal...who knows what else. Wouldn't Kaberle and Gonchar make a great pairing?

Which of them would actually play defense?

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:15 AM
  #43
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Which of them would actually play defense?
Malkin

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:34 AM
  #44
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YES WE CAN!

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Old
02-19-2009, 08:53 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by mapes View Post
I did hear Staal might be available, so I'd like to try and get him. We could draft Brayden, sign the Sedins, get Jordan Staal and then get another one of the Staals. Burke likes brothers, you know
You forgot getting Frantisek Kaberle

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Old
02-19-2009, 09:12 AM
  #46
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I can't say i have seen this point of view mentioned alot when it comes to Kabbers value.

He will be under contract to the new team that gets him.

Thus allowing them to recoup some of the trade cost in his year leading up to UFA if he chooses that route.

This is not a Hossa or Jbo situation where you risk trading assets for a 25 game run plus POs.

In the long run, the team getting him could have to trade a 1rst,blue chip and a young rosters player.

For 2 years of Kabber and his cap friendly contract and a possible return of a 1rst plus a Young roster player, if he is traded in his UFA year.

I hope BB can pull off some trades.Ones that will help heal the wounds that were caused by last years TD debacle.

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:03 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icewind Dale View Post
"you want me to trade a Top 5 pick, someone who might eventually be able to play, for an 18-year-old who is playing 22-minutes a game right now?'"

Nice to see an actual top NHL GM point out the lunacy of trading a prospect/pick for established talent. I hope more and more people on this site read this quote.
If it was the NYI or ATL I guarantee he would make the trade, and a top 5 pick today is not neccasarilly a top 5 pick tommorow, especially with the acquisistion of Schenn.

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:08 AM
  #48
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For 2 years of Kabber and his cap friendly contract and a possible return of a 1rst plus a Young roster player, if he is traded in his UFA year.
A very good point, and one that I haven't seen made often enough. I don't know how Kab's NTC works, but if whatever team was trading for him knew that they'd be able to bounce him next year @ the deadline, it would certainly make paying a high price for him now much easier to stomach for them, and much better for us

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:15 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by AddMan3001 View Post
A very good point, and one that I haven't seen made often enough. I don't know how Kab's NTC works, but if whatever team was trading for him knew that they'd be able to bounce him next year @ the deadline, it would certainly make paying a high price for him now much easier to stomach for them, and much better for us
It appears to be a somewhat complex legal question, but recent reports have suggested that No-trade-clauses remain in effect after a trade. Burke himself spelled this out at some point, but not related to Kaberle in particular.

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Old
02-19-2009, 11:23 AM
  #50
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It appears to be a somewhat complex legal question, but recent reports have suggested that No-trade-clauses remain in effect after a trade. Burke himself spelled this out at some point, but not related to Kaberle in particular.
I can confirm its a true fact .. Contracts under the new CBA are non negotiable once filed with the NHL league office and improved.

So Kabs and everyone elses contract stays in tact unless bought out and that includes all bonus and protection clauses.. Therefore if Kabs is traded to a team now at the deadline and then that team misses the playoffs the follow season the NTC window is once again void, just the same as if Kabs stays and Leafs miss the playoffs next year..

Similarly McCabe's full NMC is in effect for the life of his contract, while Tucker's was nulified by the buyout process and not sure if he was given a new protection clause with the Avs or not.

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