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RUMOR: TSN says JVR for Lehtonen is a strong possibility

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Old
02-26-2009, 02:23 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Georgia Dawg View Post
Go back and read some of my other post. I would rather have Kari, but he is hurt every season. It is hard to depend on a guy that is out every year for chunks of time. As I said in my first post, try to get a FA goalie. I do not think Hedberg or Pavs is the answer.
The UFA goalie market doesn't look particularly exciting to me, especially this year. I think we really are better off keeping Lehtonen, and depending on the development of Pavelec, Kangas, and Carrozzi, we may be able to deal Pavelec around 2010 draft time.

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02-26-2009, 02:31 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by decadentia View Post
If you truly believe that every single team in the league wouldn't be interested in a top draft pick, then fair enough it is your prerogative. Though I tend to think this goes against the whole point of a draft system.
Want Patrik Stefan? Former #1 overall. He can be had for cheap.

No? Alex Daigle, then?

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02-26-2009, 02:48 PM
  #78
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Forgetting all the other numbers, the team just doesn't seem to win any more with Kari than with anyone else, regardless of the stats:

05-06
Others (Dunham, Garnett, Berkhoel, Shields)
21w 18 8t
Kari Lehtonen
20w 15 0t

06-07
Hedberg
9w 4 2t
Kari Lehtonen
34w 24 9t


07-08
Others (Hedberg, Pavs)
17w 18 3t
Kari Lehtonen
17w 22 5t


08-09
Others (Hedberg/Pavs)
10w 15 3t
Kari Lehtonen
12w 18 3t

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Old
02-26-2009, 02:50 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by flerd_trandle View Post
Want Patrik Stefan? Former #1 overall. He can be had for cheap.

No? Alex Daigle, then?
Again, moot point. If I were a GM before Patrik Stefan and Alex Daigle were drafted would I want them? The answer is a resounding yes. Drafts are simply projection, but nonetheless you hope that player pays dividends for you.

Furthermore, those two players mentioned were the exception, not the norm.

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02-26-2009, 03:28 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Georgia Dawg View Post
The most telling numbers of all the ones you posted to me are the games played by Kari. A number 1 goalie who is to carry a franchise out of the dumps should be playing more then he is. He is simply a risk. His issue this year was the back which tends to linger on people.

Go back and read some of my other post. I would rather have Kari, but he is hurt every season. It is hard to depend on a guy that is out every year for chunks of time. As I said in my first post, try to get a FA goalie. I do not think Hedberg or Pavs is the answer.
What I know also is that his number are not affected by injury and actually in some case, he even getting better then prior injury. Sure he is fragile for what we know, but I still willing to take the risk of keeping him in the lineup.

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02-26-2009, 05:58 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by toph2o View Post
Forgetting all the other numbers, the team just doesn't seem to win any more with Kari than with anyone else, regardless of the stats:
That's why some consider wins and GAA more like a team stat and SV% an individual stat.

For instance, when they showed the goalie vs. goalie matchup in Philips arena at the last home game, Budaj had more wins (16 vs. 12, right now) and a better GAA (2.98 vs. 3.15, right now) but Lehtonen had the better SV% (.908 vs. .896, right now). Granted, they haven't played the same number of games (Budaj 43 games, Lehtonen 34)

How is it that the guy with the better SV% has given up more goals per game and has won a smaller percentage of his starts?

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02-26-2009, 09:33 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by decadentia View Post
Some of these posts are pretty hilarious. He's coveted by the whole league, but simply due to hype I suppose? Nothing special?

You need to watch him play more, honestly. There's not being impressed by a player, and then there's simply discrediting one.
Forgive the posters on this board. They all seem to suffer from a severe degree of the disease known as "Homerism". They all wear powder blue colored glasses, and can't accept that, even as an unproven prospect, JVR is already better than the sieve, Lehtonen.

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02-26-2009, 10:39 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
Forgive the posters on this board. They all seem to suffer from a severe degree of the disease known as "Homerism". They all wear powder blue colored glasses, and can't accept that, even as an unproven prospect, JVR is already better than the sieve, Lehtonen.
Please forgive Lux, as he seems to suffer from a severe disease known as "Can't put the crack pipe down."

He'd bash Waddell for trading away Cobrun for Zhitnik because it's mortgaging the future of the team for immediate success. Now he'll bash Waddell for not doing a straight up JVR/Lehtonen trade, but next year when it's obvious Pavelic isn't ready and Moose can't be a full time player, it would be Waddell's tail on a platter.

JVR for Lehtonen.....No.

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02-26-2009, 10:51 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by oneel View Post
Please forgive Lux, as he seems to suffer from a severe disease known as "Can't put the crack pipe down."

He'd bash Waddell for trading away Cobrun for Zhitnik because it's mortgaging the future of the team for immediate success. Now he'll bash Waddell for not doing a straight up JVR/Lehtonen trade, but next year when it's obvious Pavelic isn't ready and Moose can't be a full time player, it would be Waddell's tail on a platter.

JVR for Lehtonen.....No.
Do you realize that these moves are complete opposites?

Coburn for Zhitnik = Promising defenseman for useless defenseman
Lehtonen for JVR = Terrible goalie for extremely promising forward.

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02-26-2009, 10:58 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Lux Aurumque View Post
Forgive the posters on this board. They all seem to suffer from a severe degree of the disease known as "Homerism". They all wear powder blue colored glasses, and can't accept that, even as an unproven prospect, JVR is already better than the sieve, Lehtonen.
Well, this is kind of on the opposite end of my argument. Never would I say JVR is a "better player" in comparison to Lehtonen. If anything,I would usually side with the player who has real NHL experience. Lehtonen would actually be a good return, nor do I think he is a horrible goalie. Anyhou, my previous posts clearly state my point. It would be like me saying Lehtonen is absolutely nothing special in my eyes. Opinion is fine, but I would be discrediting Lehtonen as he has quite a bit of potential. That's all.

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02-26-2009, 11:06 PM
  #86
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Patrik Stefan was promising....
Eric Christiansen is promising...
Angelo Esposito is promising...
Ilya Nikulin is promising...
Brett Sterling is promising....
Alex Daigle was promising...

We need less promising and more proven.....Seriously. You can't keep stockpiling promising players. You can't trade proven players at this point(like Lehtonen. And if you think Kari hasn't kept us in a few this year, then you're kidding yourself.) for an unknown....Especially when there's ANOTHER unknown at goal behind Kari.

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02-27-2009, 07:15 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by oneel View Post
Patrik Stefan was promising....
Eric Christiansen is promising...
Angelo Esposito is promising...
Ilya Nikulin is promising...
Brett Sterling is promising....
Alex Daigle was promising...

We need less promising and more proven.....Seriously. You can't keep stockpiling promising players. You can't trade proven players at this point(like Lehtonen. And if you think Kari hasn't kept us in a few this year, then you're kidding yourself.) for an unknown....Especially when there's ANOTHER unknown at goal behind Kari.
EC was promising
Ilya Nikulin is a freakin STAR, just wont come over
Brett Sterling was promising

EC and BS hopefully wont be around next year.

...but your point about Kari is right....screw the haters, Lehtonen is the show.

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02-27-2009, 09:53 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Capa View Post
EC was promising
Ilya Nikulin is a freakin STAR, just wont come over
Brett Sterling was promising

EC and BS hopefully wont be around next year.

...but your point about Kari is right....screw the haters, Lehtonen is the show.
A star overseas is not a star here. Don't Forget Alex Bourrett was promising!

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02-27-2009, 10:09 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Wolvesfan View Post
A star overseas is not a star here. Don't Forget Alex Bourrett was promising!
There are dozens of insurance salesmen and high school coaches that were can't miss guys.

I'm not crapping on JVR, but the guy hasn't skated a shift on NHL ice and this franchise is supposed to trade away the best goalie in their history for him? That's a lot to ask, regardless of what Lux thinks.

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02-27-2009, 10:10 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Wolvesfan View Post
A star overseas is not a star here. Don't Forget Alex Bourrett was promising!
People seem to forget about the 2005 draft. We traded down, passing on Devin Setoguchi and Anze Kopitar. Ugh.

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02-27-2009, 11:43 AM
  #91
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People seem to forget about the 2005 draft. We traded down, passing on Devin Setoguchi and Anze Kopitar. Ugh.
But added 3 extra picks for trading down twice (Pavelec, Denny, and Stoesz). It still may work out.

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02-27-2009, 12:56 PM
  #92
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Wings fan here. From what I've read, Detroit has had scouts at your last two games. The only player I imagine we'd be scouting is Lehtonen. To put it bluntly, Osgood has been just horrible all season. After a 10 day mental break / vacation he will be starting tonight. If he flops then I could definitely envision Detroit making a trade for a goalie. Lehtonen, if he's available, has to be the best option.

So, what would it take? I see comments that you'd want an established NHl'er in return. I also saw a comment that you don't have any goaltending in your pipeline. What about a proposal like:

to Atalanta:
Jim Howard + Val Filppula

to Detriot:
Lehtonen

Filppula is an excellent skater, perhaps the strongest on our team, and is centering the second line between Hossa and Franzen. His offensive numbers are down a bit this season because he's not getting any PP time. However, he's got 20 goal potential. He's a good passer, is very responsible defensively, and is locked up for 4 more seasons @ $3M per year. He could easily center one of your top two lines, or he can play the wing.

Howard has two more years left on his contract at a reasonable $717k average. If he were in another team's system he probably would have had a chance to play in the NHL already. A standout in college, he's had some consistency issues in the AHL. But part of that is because he's played under 4 coaches in 4 seasons. He's been an AHL all star as well as won goalie of the month & week honors several times. He's a year younger than Lehtonen.

There are other options, too. Instead of Filppula we could offer Jiri Hudler. Hudler is much more gifted offensively and would likely have a natural chemistry with Kovy because of his excellent passing ability. He's been a regular setup man on our lethal PP. The downside is that he's an RFA after the season and will probably require $4M or more to re-sign.

As far as goalies coming back to you, we have two less experienced options - Larsson and McCollum. The former is in his first season of AHL play and has posted numbers comparable to Howard's. McCollum is still in juniors, but did make the WJC roster for team USA. He's probably the brightest of the Wings goalie prospects, but is the furthest away.

Any thoughts?

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02-27-2009, 01:48 PM
  #93
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my thoughts are ATL will not move Leht in a deal where they see a prospect G coming back. they have no need of howard.

hudler + filp maybe a better fit, throw in a pick too.

outside opinion. i have no loyalty to either team. just watch them both a lot.

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02-27-2009, 02:31 PM
  #94
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I agree with Forsbergfan21. It's unlikely that we will trade Lehtonen for a non-goalie. Even though this JvR talk came up. Who would we put in the goal insted of Lehtonen? Hedberg? they don't trust him. Pavalec? not good enough (yet).

So I don't think that we will get rid of Lehtonen, without first signing a replacement.

But if we would I hope Waddell will take the Jim Howard + Val Filppula deal.

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02-27-2009, 02:58 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by oneel View Post
Patrik Stefan was promising....
Eric Christiansen is promising...
Angelo Esposito is promising...
Ilya Nikulin is promising...
Brett Sterling is promising....
Alex Daigle was promising...
Wayne Gretzky was promising...

We need less promising and more proven.....Seriously. You can't keep stockpiling promising players. You can't trade proven players at this point(like Lehtonen. And if you think Kari hasn't kept us in a few this year, then you're kidding yourself.) for an unknown....Especially when there's ANOTHER unknown at goal behind Kari.
Ilya Kovalchuk was promising...
Marian Hossa was promising...
Dany Heatley was promising...
John Tavares is promising...
Zach Bogosian is promising...
Victor Hedman is promising...

Two can play at this game.

Kari is terrible. Atlanta will never go far with him in net. He's emotionally unstable, and allows at least one really weak goal in each game.

Unfortunately for you homers, the Lehtonen rumors persist..

Quote:
- Reports out of Philadelphia indicate that the Flyers may be willing to swap top prospect James van Riemsdyk for Thrashers G Kari Lehtonen. If the deal was actually on the table, the Thrashers would surely have to jump on it.
http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/scott_c...s=secStory_nhl

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02-27-2009, 03:48 PM
  #96
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Quote:
- Reports out of Philadelphia indicate that the Flyers may be willing to swap top prospect James van Riemsdyk for Thrashers G Kari Lehtonen. If the deal was actually on the table, the Thrashers would surely have to jump on it.
this is such a retarded quote. "the thrashers would surely have to jump on it." ? they make it sound like atlanta would be swapping lehtonen for carter or something.

sure, lets keep our rediculous losing streak against philly going even longer by giving them kari so he can destroy us and give nittymaki the night off.

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02-27-2009, 04:01 PM
  #97
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ahaha lol i can't wait to see how bad this team is if Kari gets traded. We might literally be the worst team in NHL history if this happens with an average of 5 goals allowed per game on only like 20 shots.

Flyers want to win a cup now and they know this they could care less about JVR they want Lehtonen cause they know how dominant he is. Us idiots will be the supporters to the Flyers winning a cup by donating. Just like we did Coburn. They probably figure we are the idiots of the NHL so every other year they offer us a rip off trade so we can accept it and donate to their team. Whats next? Are we going to trade Kovalchuk to them for Joffrey Lupul and Darrell Powe LOL cause its stupidity is equivalent to the Lehtonen JVR rumor.

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02-27-2009, 04:10 PM
  #98
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Wings fan here. From what I've read, Detroit has had scouts at your last two games. The only player I imagine we'd be scouting is Lehtonen. To put it bluntly, Osgood has been just horrible all season. After a 10 day mental break / vacation he will be starting tonight. If he flops then I could definitely envision Detroit making a trade for a goalie. Lehtonen, if he's available, has to be the best option.

So, what would it take? I see comments that you'd want an established NHl'er in return. I also saw a comment that you don't have any goaltending in your pipeline. What about a proposal like:

to Atalanta:
Jim Howard + Val Filppula

to Detriot:
Lehtonen
Interesting offer, but to be honest Howard is increasingly viewed as a bust around the NHL. The Wings desperately need help at G and yet they haven't been about to turn to Howard after he has had 4 years in the minors. If Howard can't handle playing in the NHL with Nick Lidstrom in front of him, how in the world is he going to handle playing with Garnet Exelby playing in front of him?

I'd consider trading Lehtonen for Lehtonen + but I'd rather get a different prospect or pick than get Howard at this point.

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02-27-2009, 04:15 PM
  #99
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my thoughts are ATL will not move Leht in a deal where they see a prospect G coming back. they have no need of howard.

hudler + filp maybe a better fit, throw in a pick too.

outside opinion. i have no loyalty to either team. just watch them both a lot.
I think Atlanta would probably have to add something in to balance out the trade if it is going to be Hudler + Filppula. That's two young, top six forwards. Each on their own is nearly worth Lehtonen in trade, together they are worth substantially more.

I also doubt our GM would be willing to part with both, at least prior to this playoff run. We could sustain losing one without sacrificing too much depth. But both? You don't exactly want to trade a third of your top six forwards while attempting to defend a championship.

Atlanta would have to pick which one they like more, and if they need something else to sweeten the deal it'll have to be either a prospect, pick(s), or more of a role player from the roster. We have some decent young defensemen we could part with, either Meech or Lebda.

Quote:
Originally Posted by machoki View Post
I agree with Forsbergfan21. It's unlikely that we will trade Lehtonen for a non-goalie. Even though this JvR talk came up. Who would we put in the goal insted of Lehtonen? Hedberg? they don't trust him. Pavalec? not good enough (yet).

So I don't think that we will get rid of Lehtonen, without first signing a replacement.

But if we would I hope Waddell will take the Jim Howard + Val Filppula deal.
Well, Detroit could trade Osgood but I don't think you'd want him. If we had someone you could plug in right away in goal then we wouldn't be making the trade, right?

Howard should be an OK backup or possible 1B type goalie for next season, but if your GM chooses to trade Lehtonen he might look to this summer's UFA market for an established replacement.

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02-27-2009, 04:16 PM
  #100
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Lol howard and val filp for Lehts?? LOL

you guys sure wanna like 3 peat dont ya. Sorry i dont wanna get ripped as much as you wanna win the cup 10 times in a row.

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