HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Chi-Phi-Tor

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-23-2009, 11:20 AM
  #76
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
 
BrindamoursNose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
And Jeremy Williams has a .290 career gpg, yet he cleared waivers last week.

Bear in mind that Lupul makes more money than all of these players, on a longer term, and is being out-produced by them all. This makes me wary, regardless of what his career gpg is.
Oh yeah, cause that's the same thing we're talking about. Comparing a scrub to real NHLers who've played more than a full NHL season. It's not the same thing..everyone I did the numbers on have played more then 3-4 NHL seasons.

Lupul makes less money than all of them right now, aside from Antro, and he's going to get a pay-rise. The extension didn't kick in yet for Lupul

BrindamoursNose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 11:21 AM
  #77
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
 
BrindamoursNose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eraser View Post
Didn't know goal totals made a player "better".
Did I say Lupul was better? Nope. You're saying I did though...

All I said was that Lupul won the battle of goal scorers between Blake,Hagman, himself and Antro. That's all.

BrindamoursNose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 11:31 AM
  #78
grabo84
Registered User
 
grabo84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Atlantic Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,448
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
Oh yeah, cause that's the same thing we're talking about. Comparing a scrub to real NHLers who've played more than a full NHL season. It's not the same thing..everyone I did the numbers on have played more then 3-4 NHL seasons.

Lupul makes less money than all of them right now, aside from Antro, and he's going to get a pay-rise. The extension didn't kick in yet for Lupul
But it will though, and it lasts for another four years. Why do you think Flyers fans want to deal him?

Obviously Williams is a different case, but my point was that career gpg is not a valid way of comparing players. All of these guys spent a lot of time in a defensive role before they started getting top line minutes, something that Lupul never had to do.

grabo84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 01:37 PM
  #79
SnS
Mod Supervisor
 
SnS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 12,327
vCash: 500
Most Flyers fans who know what they're talking about, want to move him for the simple fact that we'll have giroux and possibly JVR into the top 6 next season. And we know he's expendable.

SnS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 02:51 PM
  #80
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
 
BrindamoursNose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
But it will though, and it lasts for another four years. Why do you think Flyers fans want to deal him?
Because we have guys that do the same thing he does, some better than him (we have 5 guys with over 20 goals already, add in a healthy Briere and that is 6, easily). His contract makes him logical to go, but it is not all about the contract...he's still a pretty good player.

BrindamoursNose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 02:53 PM
  #81
grabo84
Registered User
 
grabo84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Atlantic Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,448
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
Because we have guys that do the same thing he does, some better than him (we have 5 guys with over 20 goals already, add in a healthy Briere and that is 6, easily). His contract makes him logical to go, but it is not all about the contract...he's still a pretty good player.
All right, that's fair enough. I just wouldn't be that interested in picking up that contract unless it was coming for next to nothing.

grabo84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 03:49 PM
  #82
Tyler Myers
Registered User
 
Tyler Myers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sydney
Country: Australia
Posts: 1,334
vCash: 500
i counter with

To Blackhawks
C Matt Stajan
G Martin Biron

To Flyers
G Nikolai Khabibulin
Hawks 2nd round pick

To Maple Leafs
RW Joffrey Lupul
Flyers 3rd round pick

makes more sense considering chi is in a playoff run

Tyler Myers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 03:51 PM
  #83
Tyler Myers
Registered User
 
Tyler Myers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sydney
Country: Australia
Posts: 1,334
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
And Jeremy Williams has a .290 career gpg, yet he cleared waivers last week.

Bear in mind that Lupul makes more money than all of these players, on a longer term, and is being out-produced by them all. This makes me wary, regardless of what his career gpg is.
owned.


graboski (sp?) i think would be our most skilled player, but consistency is another thing...

Tyler Myers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 04:04 PM
  #84
mja
Negative Creep
 
mja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,194
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
All of those players have more goals this year and similar career highs. Blake has him beat by a fairly wide margin in both respects.
Blake isn't as talented as Lupul in the same way that Knuble isn't as talented as Lupul. But they have other aspects of their games that have made them just as or even more productive then him. They're also much, much older. Blake at 25 wasn't nearly the player that Lupul is. Heck, he wasn't even in the same universe.

It took Antropov until he was 27 to even have a season worthy of Lupul's best full season as a 22 year old.

Hagman still hasn't matched Lupul's 2nd season in the league.

Lupul, if he reaches full potential should score 30 goals several times in his NHL career, and throw in a 40 goal season or two as well. If he stays at his current level, he's still a perennial 20-25 goal scorer. If he can ever get back to the game he was playing last year, he's probably a 35 goal close to a PPG player in the right situation.

If there was no salary cap, the Flyers would be perfectly content to hang on to Lupul. Given their abundance of scoring forwards however, with more help on the way in prospects, Lupul is simply the most expendable guy.

Frankly, he'd be a good guy to get for a team looking to rebuild.

mja is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 04:14 PM
  #85
grabo84
Registered User
 
grabo84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Atlantic Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,448
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
Frankly, he'd be a good guy to get for a team looking to rebuild.
At that contract, I just don't agree, unless he comes at a heavy discount.

grabo84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 04:24 PM
  #86
mja
Negative Creep
 
mja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,194
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
At that contract, I just don't agree, unless he comes at a heavy discount.
No need to deal him at a heavy discount, particularly not this season. His cap hit doesn't go up until next season, so there wouldn't be any point in trading him at a heavy discount right now. There is nothing to be gained from it on the Flyers end. They can get Briere in without moving any key parts.

mja is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 06:32 PM
  #87
IBLeaf*
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Oakville, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,378
vCash: 500
I don't want Lupul. I'd rather keep Stajan.

IBLeaf* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 06:40 PM
  #88
Hawksfan12*
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,563
vCash: 500
If we didnt have to sign Keith/Toews/Kane in the next offseason(not this year, the next year), Lupul would be awesome to have

Hawksfan12* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 06:53 PM
  #89
Bob Clarke Fan Club
Registered User
 
Bob Clarke Fan Club's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,003
vCash: 500
Pretty decent proposal from a Flyers standpoint.

Bob Clarke Fan Club is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 07:11 PM
  #90
leafscrazy
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 103
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Taveras View Post
i counter with

To Blackhawks
C Matt Stajan
G Martin Biron

To Flyers
G Nikolai Khabibulin
Hawks 2nd round pick

To Maple Leafs
RW Joffrey Lupul
Flyers 3rd round pick

makes more sense considering chi is in a playoff run
better than the op's deal. How about the flyers send mike rathje (3.5 mil) to the leafs for another 3rd in a separate year or change the original 3rd into a 2nd. Rathje's LTIR this year but his salary will be there next year and the flyers would be at 54 mil without having a single goalie signed

leafscrazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 07:16 PM
  #91
Joey Moss
Registered User
 
Joey Moss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 23,350
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuy View Post
Hawks could throw Buff in as well. Please, take him...someone.....
WOW is he really that bad? I would love him in edmonton he is exactly what we need.

And also, solid proposal, I think all teams do it maybe Toronto doesnt but I really think Lupul would thrive in Toronto. He fits well with the type of team they have.

Joey Moss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 07:25 PM
  #92
leafmon
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,708
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
Blake isn't as talented as Lupul in the same way that Knuble isn't as talented as Lupul. But they have other aspects of their games that have made them just as or even more productive then him. They're also much, much older. Blake at 25 wasn't nearly the player that Lupul is. Heck, he wasn't even in the same universe.

It took Antropov until he was 27 to even have a season worthy of Lupul's best full season as a 22 year old.

Hagman still hasn't matched Lupul's 2nd season in the league.

Lupul, if he reaches full potential should score 30 goals several times in his NHL career, and throw in a 40 goal season or two as well. If he stays at his current level, he's still a perennial 20-25 goal scorer. If he can ever get back to the game he was playing last year, he's probably a 35 goal close to a PPG player in the right situation.

If there was no salary cap, the Flyers would be perfectly content to hang on to Lupul. Given their abundance of scoring forwards however, with more help on the way in prospects, Lupul is simply the most expendable guy.

Frankly, he'd be a good guy to get for a team looking to rebuild.
Yeah but Lupul is always getting dumped despite his numbers/potential. Why is that .......overall game not great.....someone tell me. Even if he is good for thirty I'd rather keep a guy like Stajan around who will accept and play his role....third line center ,good character .PK guy and still can score a little then get a over priced guy who everyone wants to dump

leafmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 08:28 PM
  #93
mja
Negative Creep
 
mja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,194
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by leafmon View Post
Yeah but Lupul is always getting dumped despite his numbers/potential. Why is that .......overall game not great.....someone tell me. Even if he is good for thirty I'd rather keep a guy like Stajan around who will accept and play his role....third line center ,good character .PK guy and still can score a little then get a over priced guy who everyone wants to dump
I don't know that it is fair calling Lupul someone who is always getting dumped. He was the centerpiece to the Pronger deal. That's just something that was gonna happen no matter how great Anaheim thought Lupul was going to be.

Edmonton definitely was trading him as a disappointment, but for Pitkanen, a player with a similar career trajectory. These are blue-chippers, not your average dump.

If Philly moves Lupul it is only because of 1) the cap and 2) Claude Giroux and JVR. The Flyers are already absolutely loaded up front. Some of these guys are going to be traded. It's not going to be any of the top 3 centers, nor Gagne or Hartnell.

If Lupul becomes the 30+ goal close to a PPG player that I think he can become, then his contract is very reasonable. If he plateaus then it is probably about a half a mill too rich a year.

I can accept the argument that you'd rather have a Stajan on your team than a Lupul, however, though I think an argument can be made that one would prefer Lupul over Stajan just as easily, if not more so.

Regardless, it is simply ridiculous to say that Stajan is twice the player Lupul is.

mja is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 08:35 PM
  #94
Blackhawkswincup
Global Moderator
 
Blackhawkswincup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chicagoland
Country: United States
Posts: 111,671
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Taveras View Post
i counter with

To Blackhawks
C Matt Stajan
G Martin Biron

To Flyers
G Nikolai Khabibulin
Hawks 2nd round pick

To Maple Leafs
RW Joffrey Lupul
Flyers 3rd round pick

makes more sense considering chi is in a playoff run
Hawks have no need for Biron! We have Huet and Niemi/Crawford in AHL

Biron went to Toronto simply because we cant take him

Blackhawkswincup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 08:39 PM
  #95
Blackhawkswincup
Global Moderator
 
Blackhawkswincup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chicagoland
Country: United States
Posts: 111,671
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
WOW is he really that bad? I would love him in edmonton he is exactly what we need.

And also, solid proposal, I think all teams do it maybe Toronto doesnt but I really think Lupul would thrive in Toronto. He fits well with the type of team they have.
No, but at 3mil a yr most fans think he should be 30-35 goal scorer. Plus alot of fans feel he reminds them of Daze in the fact that he doesn't use his body. Daze was far softer and i dont recall him ever throwing a big hit. Buff has thrown some big hits.

Byfuglien is a speedy, versatile bigman. He has struggled to find the back of the net this year and so some Hawks fans are ready to thrown him away. I feel he will find a groove at some point. He hasn't hurt the Hawks with his play.

Blackhawkswincup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 09:00 PM
  #96
lancer247
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,044
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubey View Post
4.25M for:
- A player who has scored more than 25 goals once in his entire career
- Brutally inconsistent, invisible more often than not
- Locked up until 2012-2013

Anything else?
brutally inconsistent??? he had one bad year in EDM...GOOD TWO WAY PLAYER... people act like he is a defensive liabilty but on most nights his line is going up against the flyers opponents top line

lancer247 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-23-2009, 09:55 PM
  #97
BrindamoursNose
Registered User
 
BrindamoursNose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 5,819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by leafscrazy View Post
better than the op's deal. How about the flyers send mike rathje (3.5 mil) to the leafs for another 3rd in a separate year or change the original 3rd into a 2nd. Rathje's LTIR this year but his salary will be there next year and the flyers would be at 54 mil without having a single goalie signed
Rathje will be on the LTIR again next season. It's not even worth mentioning him.

BrindamoursNose is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:33 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.