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Antropov to Vancouver (e4)

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Old
02-23-2009, 12:32 AM
  #101
shadow1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mae44 View Post
Everyone's favorite guy is hearing a prospect and a #1 for Antropov
The voices in his head told him. Or maybe it was his dog again.

This deal isn't the far fetched, but anyone could come up with similar deals.

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02-23-2009, 12:38 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by dubey View Post
Antropov for Hodgson + 1st ? ?
All of Toronto just got slightly stupider for living in the same city as you.

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02-23-2009, 12:39 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Speedy Kesler View Post
All of Toronto just got slightly stupider for living in the same city as you.
Haha, I think he was being facetious.

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02-23-2009, 12:41 AM
  #104
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Haha, I think he was being facetious.
God I hope so

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Old
02-23-2009, 12:41 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Speedy Kesler View Post
All of Toronto just got slightly stupider for living in the same city as you.
ya hate when people do that... kinda as bad when people don't know sarcasm in its most basic form?

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Old
02-23-2009, 12:42 AM
  #106
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I remember when zeke said Kesler was given tons of chances to play a scoring role but he's only good as a checking center.

Now that Kesler is ripping it up on the second line, what does zeke say?

"He should go back down to the third line".

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02-23-2009, 01:14 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by zeke View Post
Antropov is a serious upgrade on either Burrows or Kesler.

What's better, he'd let you guys reunite Burrows and Kesler on get your very good 3rd line back.
I'm not sure if your posts in this thread are sarcasm or delusion, or a bit of both. At least dubey makes his obvious.

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02-23-2009, 01:22 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by CM- View Post
So he is going to Florida...

If Gillis gives a 1st and a prospect for Antropov. I will drive to Van just to smack the stupid out of him...
And yet I will swim to Vancouver to give him a kiss!

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02-23-2009, 01:34 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by zeke View Post
best be keeping that late 1st rounder. Maybe in five years you get lucky and have another player as good as Ryan kesler is this year, five years after he was drafted. Or maybe you get another decent goalie prospect 4 years from now who's as good as Schenider is right now 4 years after he was drafted. Or maybe you end up with another Nathan Smith or Artem Chubarov.
Or that 1st round draft pick could be a Cody Hodgson.

It's not that Antropov won't help us it's the cost that you have to pay to add a guy like Antropov. If this organization was deep enough in terms of young talent then they'd be able to afford to pay a 1st round draft pick for Antropov. The fact is that we've got 2 maybe 3 real legitimate NHL prospects and that's pretty sad.

This organization has already traded away far too many picks over the last few years and on top of that they haven't drafted well enough to make up for that.

Gillis has made it clear that he wants to put a strong emphasis on drafting and developing players. On top of that he's made it clear that he's not interested in trading away a 1st, 2nd or 3rd round draft picks for rental players that will only help us for a few months. That could always change but it depends on the type of player that Gillis would get in return.

If, for example, Gillis could get Bouwmeester(who would be a rental player for now) for a 1st round draft pick he'd obviously make that deal.

Antropov is a player that would add secondary scoring to our team and he's just not worth the price that some team is going to be willing to pay.

A team like Boston or Columbus can afford to trade a 1st round draft pick for Antropov because of the depth they've got in their respective systems however Vancouver can not say the same.

Also this Canuck team is starting to play well and even though they aren't always playing their best game they are still finding ways to win which is a real positive note.

I honestly do believe that Gillis will be more than satisfied to enter the playoffs with the current roster that he has.

In a perfect world they'd love to add some offensive depth and depth on the blue line as well but if they can't get that done then he'll take his chances in the playoffs and hope that Luongo will be on top of his game.

We've all seen what great goaltending can do in the playoffs.

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Old
02-23-2009, 01:59 AM
  #110
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I would personally go down to GM Place and start a protest if Gillis pulled this move off.

Which, considering that Eklund's a baboon, is very unlikely.

We're not in position to trade any top picks and/ or prospects.

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02-23-2009, 02:01 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by zeke View Post
But hey, keep your pick. If it's not you guys, it'll be someone else.
No it won't...think 2nd and a prospect.

The guy is not that good. When he's healthy he a decent second liner. Let's not get carried away....

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02-23-2009, 02:02 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by King of Anarchy View Post
I would personally go down to GM Place and start a protest if Gillis pulled this move off.

Which, considering that Eklund's a baboon, is very unlikely.

We're not in position to trade any top picks and/ or prospects.
You can rest easy, now that Eklund has spoken we know two things:

He's not being traded to Vancouver and
He won't be traded for a 1st.

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02-23-2009, 02:14 AM
  #113
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I have this feeling that many Canuck fans are, more than anything else, pissed off at the idea that the Leafs (and Burke) have assets they need in order to compete for the cup. I also have this feeling that many don't want to admit it. Realistically speaking, without a significant upgrade to their top defense pairing and another top 6 forward, they're going to hit a wall against Detroit or San Jose.

Yes, while there are a few other options out there, the Canucks are not the only team looking to upgrade. It often seems like fans of the buying team keep saying "if that's the price, we can just go get another player instead". When there's more buyers than sellers, you're pretty much bound to lose a bidding war sooner or later. What happens when the Canucks lose one? Are they going to go into the playoffs with what they have when they could have traded a couple picks or prospects that may not make the NHL? What happens if Sundin, the Sedins and Ohlund leave this summer? Or Luongo and Demitra potentially leaving the following summer? Going to sign someone else? What makes you think you're going to automatically land them? This is a big opportunity for Vancouver to make noise in the playoffs.

Antropov is available. There's your top six forward. Kaberle is available. There's your #1 defenseman and PP quarterback. Both already have chemistry with your #1 center (and yes, come playoff time Sundin will be your top center). One increases your transition game exponentially, while the other improves your cycle game/front of net presence. If Gillis refuses to move non-roster assets for what could be his last and only chance to make a mark, then he's probably not the GM you guys need.

Doesn't make a difference to us. Someone will pay for them, and possibly reap the rewards.

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02-23-2009, 02:29 AM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C-A-P-S View Post
No it won't...think 2nd and a prospect.

The guy is not that good. When he's healthy he a decent second liner. Let's not get carried away....
2nd rounders aren't worth much... you're not getting Antropov with that.


Hal Gill got us a 2nd and a 5th rounder last year........Antropov >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gill

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02-23-2009, 02:38 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by mydnyte View Post
ask again after deadline day, after your prospects, and 1st have been traded. It may not be with the Leafs, but, expect to lose some assets.

...he lied the second he said he wouldnt trade any of those assets ...and if he wasnt lying, he should be fired. A GM is paid to win, and to win now.

This season may be Vancouvers best shot, because next season if they are sans the Sedins, and Sundin, I'd think you'd say they were in rebuild mode, and a good bet for a lotto pick in 2010
So then we can expect Burkie to be loading up before the trade deadline?

Gillis has said he is always open to improving his team. Giving away top prospects and first round picks when your organization has a serious lack of depth, doesn't really make it better.

Gillis should be looking at affordable ways to upgrade his team. Antropov, due to his skill set and size, should return around what the Leafs are asking. That's more than the Canucks should be willing to trade.

Fact is, the Canucks forwards are decent enough to make the playoffs, while we can only hope the defense can play well enough to do the same.

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Old
02-23-2009, 02:40 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Icewind Dale View Post
I have this feeling that many Canuck fans are, more than anything else, pissed off at the idea that the Leafs (and Burke) have assets they need in order to compete for the cup. I also have this feeling that many don't want to admit it. Realistically speaking, without a significant upgrade to their top defense pairing and another top 6 forward, they're going to hit a wall against Detroit or San Jose.

Yes, while there are a few other options out there, the Canucks are not the only team looking to upgrade. It often seems like fans of the buying team keep saying "if that's the price, we can just go get another player instead". When there's more buyers than sellers, you're pretty much bound to lose a bidding war sooner or later. What happens when the Canucks lose one? Are they going to go into the playoffs with what they have when they could have traded a couple picks or prospects that may not make the NHL? What happens if Sundin, the Sedins and Ohlund leave this summer? Or Luongo and Demitra potentially leaving the following summer? Going to sign someone else? What makes you think you're going to automatically land them? This is a big opportunity for Vancouver to make noise in the playoffs.

Antropov is available. There's your top six forward. Kaberle is available. There's your #1 defenseman and PP quarterback. Both already have chemistry with your #1 center (and yes, come playoff time Sundin will be your top center). One increases your transition game exponentially, while the other improves your cycle game/front of net presence. If Gillis refuses to move non-roster assets for what could be his last and only chance to make a mark, then he's probably not the GM you guys need.

Doesn't make a difference to us. Someone will pay for them, and possibly reap the rewards.
Yes, someone will pay for them but not the Canucks. As Agent007 very nicely put it, we don't have the organizational depth to be throwing away high picks and good prospects for mediocre top-6 forwards.

A lot of people think they know what the Canucks have and need better than Canuck fans. Are we a bit biased, sure who isn't but we know our situation very well thank you. A top end defenseman would be nice but any additions made to this team will most likely be depth trades. Depth. Antropov would be nice but as of right now he would be a utility player to give some extra options in our top-6. Nothing more, nothing less.

The Canucks winning and losing in the playoffs won't come down to whether Antropov is in our line-up. This is Roberto Luongo's team and we will go as far as he will take us. If he is on his game we have a decent chance against any team in the league and now with two scoring lines we believe we have the offensive depth to get 2-3 goals a game which is all we need with Luongo in top shape. Would an Antropov or a puck moving defenseman improve our chances? Sure, but not enough to piss away our poor organizational depth if they wouldn't play a major (top-5 player on the team) role.

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02-23-2009, 02:56 AM
  #117
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The Canucks better load up for a run......this is their last year before the team gets torn apart.

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02-23-2009, 02:58 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Icewind Dale View Post


Doesn't make a difference to us. Someone will pay for them, and possibly reap the rewards.
This post is accurate in some areas and riddled with errors in others.

Yes, someone will pay for them (or not, in the case of Kaberle), and POSSIBLY reap the rewards. If history has taught us anything, it's that a team that needs to upgrade as much as you suggest the Canucks have to (and I'm not disagreeing on this point), fails to go deep in the playoffs, and they usually bow out in the first round.


I have this feeling that many Canuck fans are, more than anything else, pissed off at the idea that the Leafs (and Burke) have assets they need in order to compete for the cup. I also have this feeling that many don't want to admit it. Realistically speaking, without a significant upgrade to their top defense pairing and another top 6 forward, they're going to hit a wall against Detroit or San Jose.


Well, I would suggest your feeling about how Canucks fans are thinking is entirely wrong. Most know that the team is missing those parts, but also realize that gutting the team simply on the off chance everything will work out may not be the best thing to do.

I find it extremely unlikely that any Canuck fans are pissed at the Leafs because they have assets to trade.

Yes, while there are a few other options out there, the Canucks are not the only team looking to upgrade. It often seems like fans of the buying team keep saying "if that's the price, we can just go get another player instead". When there's more buyers than sellers, you're pretty much bound to lose a bidding war sooner or later. What happens when the Canucks lose one? Are they going to go into the playoffs with what they have when they could have traded a couple picks or prospects that may not make the NHL? What happens if Sundin, the Sedins and Ohlund leave this summer? Or Luongo and Demitra potentially leaving the following summer? Going to sign someone else? What makes you think you're going to automatically land them? This is a big opportunity for Vancouver to make noise in the playoffs.

It's exactly this kind of thinking that got the Leafs to where they are today. Nothing in the pipeline and never very far in the playoffs to show for it.

Personally, I'd rather not follow the game plan you're recommending.

I like how it's now a couple of prospects and picks that may not make the NHL. If Burke was willing to shill Kaberle and Antropov for that low a return, then I'm sure Gillis would be all over it.

If however, Gillis has to give a prospect and a first just for Antropov, as this rumor suggests, I would imagine he wants a whole lot more for Kaberle.

So how does this team look when the inevitable happens and they lose in the first or second round, the Sedins jump ship, Ohlund signs for better money elsewhere and Sundin retires?

The Canucks have absolutely nothing for depth and a team full of holes. ie, in a much, much worse situation than they would be without ruining their team on the off chance they catch lighting in a bottle and find a way to beat Detroit and San Jose.

No GM worth his value risks so much on such a small chance for winning. The good GM's build their teams so at the deadlines they can add a minor player or two.



Antropov is available. There's your top six forward. Kaberle is available. There's your #1 defenseman and PP quarterback. Both already have chemistry with your #1 center (and yes, come playoff time Sundin will be your top center). One increases your transition game exponentially, while the other improves your cycle game/front of net presence. If Gillis refuses to move non-roster assets for what could be his last and only chance to make a mark, then he's probably not the GM you guys need.


Sorry, I don't agree that Sundin will be the top center. It's unlike that either player will be given dominant ice time. That's the beauty of having Sundin and Sedin. They are both capable first line centers and will likely be a bigger threat as an equal tandem.

Your assumption that this could somehow be Gillis's last chance to make the playoffs in his first season as GM doesn't make a great deal of sense. It seems more likely that Sundin will be back next season, Gillis resigns the Sedins and he signs or trades for a puck moving defenseman in the off season. So pretty much a better version of this team with a huge upgrade in depth with players like Grabner, Hodgson and Schnieder trying to make the club.


Last edited by quat: 02-23-2009 at 03:06 AM.
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Old
02-23-2009, 03:01 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by HOCKEYGOON View Post
The Canucks better load up for a run......this is their last year before the team gets torn apart.
EDIT: I'm sorry, I reacted immaturely to this reply.


Listen, all I'm going to say is that you're very wrong in your assessment. That's it.

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02-23-2009, 03:08 AM
  #120
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I would personally go down to GM Place and start a riot if Gillis pulled this move off.
Fixed, after all you're a Canucks fan.

Too easy.

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02-23-2009, 03:15 AM
  #121
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Fixed, after all you're a Canucks fan.

Too easy.
Every Canucks fan would burn down General Motors place if Gillis traded away a 1st and a prospect for a utility Top-9 forward.

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Old
02-23-2009, 03:23 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by HOCKEYGOON View Post
The Canucks better load up for a run......this is their last year before the team gets torn apart.
adding Nikolai antorprov is not loading up. Adding a guy like Marion Gaborik, or a Jay Bouwmeester, is what you call loading up. Adding fringe second line players will not improve our team.

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02-23-2009, 03:26 AM
  #123
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Man, Vancouver is like a garage sale wh*re. Love everybodys junk and hope they turn out.

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02-23-2009, 04:05 AM
  #124
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Demitra - Sundin - Kesler would be even better!
Yeah, but MG won't trade a first to get Kesler!


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02-23-2009, 04:11 AM
  #125
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There are some real great posts here. Hopefully some of you read what quat and eldiablo17 have to say.

Simply put the Canucks don't have enough assets to overpay for a rental player at this point and when you're giving up a 1st or 2nd round draft pick for a rental you're overpaying for his services.

Obviously as a Canuck fan I'd like nothing more than to be able to add Kaberle and Antropov to this lineup. There's no doubt in my mind that with those two our team would be at the same level as a team like Detroit or San Jose but the fact is that we may not have enough to get it done.

I've said it before and I'll say it again for Kaberle I'd be willing to give up Raymond or O'Brien, Cory Schneider and our 1st round draft pick in 2009.

However is that a package that Gillis would offer and is that a package that Burke would accept??

On top of that rumour has it that Kaberle has only put eastern conference teams in his list of 10 teams he'd be willing to go do which would put Vancouver out of the bidding.

The Canucks need to be smart with the assets that they've got on their team. People look at our UFA's and say that we only have a small one maybe two year window to win but hasn't that been the same for the Flames since the lockout and look at where they are now??

Personally I'd be real suprised if Luongo is locked up this summer. Now if we want to lock him up we got to show him that we're going to be a competitive team for years to come and trading away the farm isn't going to help that cause.

This organization has done an awful job in drafting and developing. The first thing Gillis said was that he wanted to improve that and from everything we've seen and read he's done just that. The Canucks are now spending much more money towards development in fact it's likely among the most in the league.

You don't spend that kind of money unless you've got prospects and picks to develop and if Gillis continues to empty the tank here then it's essentially money sent down the drain.

Ask yourself this question. Why would Luongo even bother resigning with the Canucks if there's nothing left in front of him??

Unfortunately the Canucks just don't have the depth to be able to compete with certain teams that are willing to overpay.

Rumour has it that the Canucks were interested in adding Schneider but the most they were willing to give up for him was a mid round draft pick but they got out bid by a team that was willing to pay basically a 2nd round draft pick for Schneider.

I have a feeling that's something we are likely to see happen quite a bit at the deadline.

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