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(#62): 2/25/2009 New York Rangers @ Toronto Maple Leafs 7:30pm MSG+

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Old
02-25-2009, 10:31 PM
  #776
nevesis
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
LoL..yea..no.


We give up Staal i give up on the team. But Staal is going nowhere.

Defense Star > Offensive star
Staal is a solid D for a young guy, but hes floated on his name for too long. He can hardly skate. Get over it.

Do I want to keep him for the future? Of course.

Do I give him up for Ilya? Hell ****ing yeah.

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02-25-2009, 10:31 PM
  #777
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Playing a defensive defense roll? Oh hell yea he will be, you'd be crazy to think Staal won't be a elite shutdown dman in 2-3 years in his prime. He's already by far the best defensive dman on the team.
im sorry but your crazy to not take vinny or kovalchuk over staal...just crazy...

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02-25-2009, 10:33 PM
  #778
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I can't go back more than 1-2 pages of this thread.

I sat and watched all the game.

My thoughts:

1. So much more exciting, despite some nervous hands throughout the game on the Rangers side.

2. Despite #1, MUCH more entertaining game.

3. Torts might know 65% of name bars with faces. He's still learning his players.

4. Lots of forecheck, lots of pressure, tons of action.

5. Anyone that is already saying, "this is what we had with Renney" please leave. Please. Turn in your "I know hockey" ID card at the gate.

6. Gomez still grippin his stick. It'll come.

7. Callahan penalty an absolute joke. Otherwise had another outstanding game.

8. PRUCHA being played, and I even thought I noticed a double shift!!!

9. I think Torts picked the wrong guys for the shootout


Lundqvist had a relatively easy night, had to make some key saves and I know he wishes he had the hagman goal back. But most goalies in the NHL are not stopping that shot, even if they were 3 more feet out at the shooter.

As Torts starts to know his players I believe things are going to get much more aggressive and fluid.

Dubi a career 3rd liner? That is the most ridiculous thing I've read. Good thing you are couch-remote all star.


Last edited by lbrowne: 02-25-2009 at 10:37 PM. Reason: had to add #9
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Old
02-25-2009, 10:33 PM
  #779
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Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
Team looked different, much different, in a better way. Forecheck was creating chances and we were not sacrificing defense (12 shot in 40 minutes?)

PP 1,000x better all around. Moving and shooting...was that so hard to figure out Renney/Pern?

Im excited. Very excited for next season. Sather will drop some of the players(maybe trade deadline?) and get 1 or 2 good ones that will fit Torts style.

This is going to be a VERY long offseason.

Finally a coach see's he has an elite goalie and can push for offense.
That's great and all that you're excited about next season, but realistically we are going to make the playoffs and who knows what might happen??

Give this team 3 to 5 games to work out the new system and we should be scoring at least 3 goals a game. And our PP honestly looked like it did in 05-06. Same with Prucha, I believe he's still that player we saw 4 years ago.

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02-25-2009, 10:33 PM
  #780
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I don't think quiete ownest they believe in themselves. That's the biggest problem. They just can't find confidence anymore. I just hope that Tort's will turn things around. If not they'll become sellers very soon.

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02-25-2009, 10:35 PM
  #781
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I don't care what anyone says. I saw a better product on the ice today. More energy and more pride. They have been stifled down so much by Renney's system that they were shell shocked to score. They have and created a plethora of chances. I was impressed with Korpedo and even Prucha. And Callahan is a guy I NEVER want to get rid of. The 4rth line played great at this speed. But Gomez and Zherdev need to commit more to shooting the puck. At least Zherdev. Much better effort from Redden and Roszival.

Even whats his name #91 tried harder.

They just got tired. And it's understandable. They are not used to that kind of up tempo game under Renney where they just paraded their ***** around in a trap like figure skaters. Man I love the aggressive forecheck. I give this team 5 games and they will start to score in bunches. Just watch.

I don't think Dubinsky can skate on this kind of system. And Dawes really needs to get some mojo going.

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02-25-2009, 10:35 PM
  #782
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YA! Every time I go to click back I mistakenly scroll over a linked up word and then I'm suddenly in golddealers.com UGH!!
Then pony up and become a sponsor, and they'll be gone

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02-25-2009, 10:36 PM
  #783
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we have 3 or 4 solid d-men in our system... we don't have a 50 goal scorer in our system nor will we ever as long as Sather is doing the drafting. so yeah i would package staal for vinny or ilya

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02-25-2009, 10:39 PM
  #784
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Originally Posted by Abooch68 View Post
Staal will never be a star like vinny of kovy...
First of all (using two hall of famers) comparing Vinny to Kovy is fine. But adding Marc Staal to the mix is like having to choose between Mario Lemieux or Patrick Roy to build your team around. That's not an easy choice.

However, I understand every Ranger fans frustration because I can relate. We need more scoring help. But I would hate to see Sather make any moves that he might regret in the future, in order to save one season. The other thing is. Tonight was the first night playing a new system. It may not start working until next year.

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02-25-2009, 10:39 PM
  #785
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most nights they win this game. They were just off, and had to learn a 100% entirely different system in 2 days. They looked GREAT out there with the exception of Gomez who was PUTRID.

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02-25-2009, 10:40 PM
  #786
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we have 3 or 4 solid d-men in our system... we don't have a 50 goal scorer in our system nor will we ever as long as Sather is doing the drafting. so yeah i would package staal for vinny or ilya
Completely disagree. Ive played/coached hockey for 22+ years, and I'll tell you this, you build a team from the backend out, period. We have the goalie, we potentially have a future Elite shutdown D-Man in Staal. You dont give up an asset like that, end of story. Its cliche, but as the old saying goes, "Offense wins games, Defense wins Championships." 100% true.

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02-25-2009, 10:42 PM
  #787
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Completely disagree. Ive played/coached hockey for 22+ years, and I'll tell you this, you build a team from the backend out, period. We have the goalie, we potentially have a future Elite shutdown D-Man in Staal. You dont give up an asset like that, end of story. Its cliche, but as the old saying goes, "Offense wins games, Defense wins Championships." 100% true.
Ah yes, much like torque wins races, horsepower wins bets.

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02-25-2009, 10:42 PM
  #788
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A loss tomm would be huge. That said, so will a win.

Play from now on needs to steadily improve, and hopefully some size upfront will be added in the next week.

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02-25-2009, 10:44 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by BleedingBlueSince92 View Post
That's great and all that you're excited about next season, but realistically we are going to make the playoffs and who knows what might happen??

Give this team 3 to 5 games to work out the new system and we should be scoring at least 3 goals a game. And our PP honestly looked like it did in 05-06. Same with Prucha, I believe he's still that player we saw 4 years ago.
1. Dude are you serious? We'll get killed in the playoffs. I don't know if you've noticed, but we don't have any good players. I heard they help. Only way we win a playoff series is to get a guy like Kovalchuk...which to me is a MUST DO for Sather. I'm sure he won't, though, because...well...he's a god awful GM.

2. The PP was better, but yeah...we don't have Jagr anymore...so...um...yeah, not even close to the PP then.

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02-25-2009, 10:46 PM
  #790
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Originally Posted by Psykedout66 View Post
Completely disagree. Ive played/coached hockey for 22+ years, and I'll tell you this, you build a team from the backend out, period. We have the goalie, we potentially have a future Elite shutdown D-Man in Staal. You dont give up an asset like that, end of story. Its cliche, but as the old saying goes, "Offense wins games, Defense wins Championships." 100% true.
What I'm saying is that since we're screwed so badly with the cap, we have little chance of ever getting a 50 goal scorer in free agency and if one is available now that can be our big scorer for the next 10 years then I suggest we take that opportunity. I'm not saying defense isn't key but we have drafted a good crop of young D-men, Sangs, DZ, Potter, and Sauer, and have no young offensive prospects and I'm not sure how we would obtain one besides trading Staal.

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02-25-2009, 10:47 PM
  #791
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deffinetely some improvement in this game...still so frustrating though..

..id really like to see us break out with big scoring game tomorrow...

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02-25-2009, 10:49 PM
  #792
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Originally Posted by Stugots View Post
What I'm saying is that since we're screwed so badly with the cap, we have little chance of ever getting a 50 goal scorer in free agency and if one is available now that can be our big scorer for the next 10 years then I suggest we take that opportunity. I'm not saying defense isn't key but we have drafted a good crop of young D-men, Sangs, DZ, Potter, and Sauer, and have no young offensive prospects and I'm not sure how we would obtain one besides trading Staal.
I get what you mean, here is the flaw though. Out of the other D-Man you listed, none are that Big Body Shutdown D-Man that can anchor the blueline in our own zone. DZ and Sangs are Offensive, Potter is at best a 6th D-Man, and Sauer does not have near the potential of Staal. If anything you look to unload one of Sangs or DZ, Sangs preferably imo, and package them with Gomez, Dubi, and hope someone bites for a goal scorer.

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02-25-2009, 10:51 PM
  #793
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Originally Posted by Psykedout66 View Post
I get what you mean, here is the flaw though. Out of the other D-Man you listed, none are that Big Body Shutdown D-Man that can anchor the blueline in our own zone. DZ and Sangs are Offensive, Potter is at best a 6th D-Man, and Sauer does not have near the potential of Staal. If anything you look to unload one of Sangs or DZ, Sangs preferably imo, and package them with Gomez, Dubi, and hope someone bites for a goal scorer.
Gaulton

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02-25-2009, 10:54 PM
  #794
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most nights they win this game. They were just off, and had to learn a 100% entirely different system in 2 days. They looked GREAT out there with the exception of Gomez who was PUTRID.
I agree except with the bold.

They HAVE played this type of game before...and I don't ever recall them winning. Ever.

We lack any scoring touch. We don't have a single 1st liner. How many opportunities did we miss (again) tonight?

We're obviously going to be buyers...and sadly we're going to lose A LOT more than what's going to be returned.

Sather (and I'm not saying this just because we lost) why is he still here?

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02-25-2009, 10:58 PM
  #795
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Originally Posted by Stugots View Post
What I'm saying is that since we're screwed so badly with the cap, we have little chance of ever getting a 50 goal scorer in free agency and if one is available now that can be our big scorer for the next 10 years then I suggest we take that opportunity. I'm not saying defense isn't key but we have drafted a good crop of young D-men, Sangs, DZ, Potter, and Sauer, and have no young offensive prospects and I'm not sure how we would obtain one besides trading Staal.
No one in that group of D-men projects to be anywhere near the shutdown defensive force that Staal is capable of being. You don't trade away a guy who could be that good in his own zone, and who has shown strong flashes of offensive potential, as well. You don't need a 50 goal scorer to win. Scoring by committee is always a better system. When you spread the offense over a number of guys, everything becomes more effective. Much better to have a very strong blueline and score well as a group. I'd rather have 5 20 goal scorers than one 50 goal scorer and a crappy blueline.

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02-25-2009, 11:04 PM
  #796
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The defense men that the Rangers have in their system have not played a game in the NHL yet. MDZ is an offensive defense man as is Sangs. Sauer looks like a good prospect who can play physical and hit people.
But none of these players have in common what Staal has. The kid is 22 years old. Since his rookie season he's been playing the shut down role. Every year, he's going to get huskier, stronger and at 6'4" 210 pounds with that long reach. There's no telling what kind of monster he's going to develop into.
This team has a track record going back to Rick Middleton for giving away top prospects who wind up having terrific careers else where. For years we're actually going to have a guy to match up against a Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin. I'm not saying he's the next Scott Stevens or Chris Pronger but someone said he can't skate and I just don't see that at all.
I can guarantee, the same people that want to trade him now for a scorer will be banging their heads against the wall in the next 2 or 3 years when Staal is either winning or playing like a Norris Trophy candidate.

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02-26-2009, 12:05 AM
  #797
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Originally Posted by HAPPY HOUR View Post
How come this organization has so much trouble finding chemistry with its free agents.

Gomer, Drury, Redden, Holik, Kamensky, Driver, Skrudland, Keane,Theo, Devries,Ferraro,Quintal... this off the top of my head..
Because when they find it on the ice (Nylander with Jagr,) they can't wait to dump it for something that looks better on paper (Gomez/Drury.)

I know all the "right reasons" they did it, I'm not looking to turn this thread into another "team direction / lack thereof" argument. Just pointing out that sometimes neither the organization nor the fans properly appreciate what they already have here.

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02-26-2009, 12:12 AM
  #798
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This team needs to learn the offsides rule.
Seriously, I've been pounding my head against the wall all season over this. Is there an official stat kept on # of offsides? I swear we go offsides every 3rd rush. And for a team that is already offensively inept, that really hurts our chances.

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02-26-2009, 12:17 AM
  #799
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Seriously, I've been pounding my head against the wall all season over this. Is there an official stat kept on # of offsides? I swear we go offsides every 3rd rush. And for a team that is already offensively inept, that really hurts our chances.

that hurts our chances along with the countless face off losses as well. when the other team dominates you in the face off circle that kills your chances.

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02-26-2009, 12:20 AM
  #800
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The other 5 coaching changes this season have all resulted in a first game loss for the new coach

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