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Trade Deadline Talk (Mar 4 3:00pm)

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03-05-2009, 06:26 PM
  #151
Mr Underhill
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Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
You mean guys like Craig, Koci, Krajicek, Hall, or Malik etc.?

Exactly who those guys are will make all the difference.
I never mentioned Koci or Malik. You just named our worse players just to be dramatic. And when I proposed that linupe, I had the XXXXX's just to say I wasnt going to make the entire lineup.

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Originally Posted by Symphony X View Post
I agree with you about Hedman. And I also agree that it probably won't take 4-5 years to make the playoffs, despite what idiot McGuire says.

But, you are taking an awful lot for granted here with being able to pick up a top flight defenseman for the number 1 pairing. They are at a premium right now, big time. If after all the crap that has gone down this season, if you were a top pairing guy and had the choice between TBL and almost anybody else (excluding ATL, NYI and maybe a couple of other teams) which would you choose? For us to even catch any interest we are going to have to overpay and I'm not sure these guys are willing or able to do that. The only thing that may help us is a lot of the top teams are pushing right up against the cap.
I said IF. If we can get one then we'll be ok. If we cant, then we're going to struggle again.

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Originally Posted by TheDaysOf 04 View Post
There are 2 parts wrong with your plan.

1.We can not gamble on Free Agents. If it was as easy as saying we need these guys for these spots, go out and get them, we wouldn't be where we are today. Just looking at last off season, we failed miserably at a lot of things..for example Vrbata that 2nd line winger we'd been missing for the past 4 years that will score 20 goals and 50+ pts turned out to be a bum of a pick up. We said ok we lost Boyle, go get a top Dman to replace him.. they tried and got no one. Guys we wanted here like Orpik, Smith, and Blake signed elsewhere. and then they fed us a spoonful of how we didn't need them and that the young guys would be fine. I would love to get a guy like Ohlund or Niedermeyer, but the reality is we may not get them. Maybe we have to over pay if we're desperate, or we have to trade someone something we don't want to give up to get one. Hopefully they will make it a top priority during the FA period and we get lucky and pick up a stud, but right now it's not as easy to just plug in names before they're signed.

2. I think Bolt32 made a lot of good points. Hedman is certainly at the top of my draft chart, but we might not get him. If we do, who says he will live up to expectations as a possible generational talent. Looking at Stamkos, I myself had him down before the season netting 20 goals and atleast 60 points. He's the next stevie y/sakic. Turned out that many though he didn't belong in the NHL and it took him almost half the season before he got going. Maybe Hedman comes here and doesn't do so well. Defence is a lot harder than offense for rookies to translate their game into the NHL. Look at Smaby. He's 24 and was drafted in 2003. He was a second round pick, and he is just showing us now he deserves to be here. Maybe Hedman needs another year, or maybe it takes him a couple more before he develops into his potential. or maybe he busts. For undrafted prospects, it's too much of an unknown...it's more a wait and see.
First off, people who say Stamkos wasnt ready for the NHL at the begining of the year are wrong. HE HAD TO DEAL WITH MELROSE. Stamkos is gonna score close to 20 goals this year and probably end up with around 40 points. Ever since January hes been on a 60 point pace. Who knows how many points he would have right now if we didnt do through Melrose and the debocle that was the the begining of this season.

Second...Like I said earlier, dont compare Hedman to Smaby. There is a world of talent difference there. He is as sure thing as your going to find in the draft. I never said he was for sure going to be a generational talent, but he has the potential to be. And anyone who has that potential doesnt sit down in the minors for a few year getting seasoned. Also, I never said he had to come in and lead our defensive core. I said he would definitely make the top 6. If Doughty, Schenn, and Bogosian, can play in their first year and make a difference, Hedman sure as hell can.

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Old
03-05-2009, 06:52 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by antdvda View Post
I never mentioned Koci or Malik. You just named our worse players just to be dramatic. And when I proposed that linupe, I had the XXXXX's just to say I wasnt going to make the entire lineup.



I said IF. If we can get one then we'll be ok. If we cant, then we're going to struggle again.



First off, people who say Stamkos wasnt ready for the NHL at the begining of the year are wrong. HE HAD TO DEAL WITH MELROSE. Stamkos is gonna score close to 20 goals this year and probably end up with around 40 points. Ever since January hes been on a 60 point pace. Who knows how many points he would have right now if we didnt do through Melrose and the debocle that was the the begining of this season.

Second...Like I said earlier, dont compare Hedman to Smaby. There is a world of talent difference there. He is as sure thing as your going to find in the draft. I never said he was for sure going to be a generational talent, but he has the potential to be. And anyone who has that potential doesnt sit down in the minors for a few year getting seasoned. Also, I never said he had to come in and lead our defensive core. I said he would definitely make the top 6. If Doughty, Schenn, and Bogosian, can play in their first year and make a difference, Hedman sure as hell can.

I'm not trying to nit pick here but what I was trying to get across was sure, Hedman has an assload of potential. He has the potential to be one of the best D-man in the league. Also take into mind that Alexander Diagle (SP I know, to lazy to look it up.) had the potential to be a franchise forward. The kids that were drafting are just that, kids. If your not sure what I mean do me a favor, go into any busy pizza joint during a friday night rush and you will see exactly what i mean. There 17 year old kids, thats it, there the same age as the highschool seniors and your expecting them to just step it up and contribute into the worlds best hockey league. Its just not that simple, and given the fact that Defensemen take longer to progress.

No one is comparing Hedman to Smaby but, first off Hedman and Smaby are two completely different type of players. Hedman is more of an offensive D-man and Smaby is a rough in your face D man that is going to make the opposing forwards time against us a living hell. They do have one common theme though, both of them had ass loads of potential before the draft. Smaby wasn't a top of a line player but was still good enough to get picked in the 2nd round. It took him 5 to 6 years to crack this team, and your expecting Hedman to do it immediately???????? Thats the error I see in your logic, if you disagree thats fine. I guess I agree to disagree with you on this.

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:06 PM
  #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolt32 View Post
I'm not trying to nit pick here but what I was trying to get across was sure, Hedman has an assload of potential. He has the potential to be one of the best D-man in the league. Also take into mind that Alexander Diagle (SP I know, to lazy to look it up.) had the potential to be a franchise forward. The kids that were drafting are just that, kids. If your not sure what I mean do me a favor, go into any busy pizza joint during a friday night rush and you will see exactly what i mean. There 17 year old kids, thats it, there the same age as the highschool seniors and your expecting them to just step it up and contribute into the worlds best hockey league. Its just not that simple, and given the fact that Defensemen take longer to progress.

No one is comparing Hedman to Smaby but, first off Hedman and Smaby are two completely different type of players. Hedman is more of an offensive D-man and Smaby is a rough in your face D man that is going to make the opposing forwards time against us a living hell. They do have one common theme though, both of them had ass loads of potential before the draft. Smaby wasn't a top of a line player but was still good enough to get picked in the 2nd round. It took him 5 to 6 years to crack this team, and your expecting Hedman to do it immediately???????? Thats the error I see in your logic, if you disagree thats fine. I guess I agree to disagree with you on this.
Yes...simply because the kid is NHL ready. He is 6'6 220lbs. And he has been playing professional hockey since he was 16. Granted its the Swedish Elite League, but hes not playing against a bunch of kids.

But I wont change your mind, so agree to disagree. Either way, one thing that we have have in common is that we will both be huge Thrashers fans for the rest of the year!

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:19 PM
  #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antdvda View Post
Quote:
First off, people who say Stamkos wasnt ready for the NHL at the begining of the year are wrong. HE HAD TO DEAL WITH MELROSE. Stamkos is gonna score close to 20 goals this year and probably end up with around 40 points. Ever since January hes been on a 60 point pace. Who knows how many points he would have right now if we didnt do through Melrose and the debocle that was the the begining of this season.
I agree he was ready for the NHL, but even without Melrose, I don't believe he would have come in and contributed right away. I think it still would have taken him some time. Things that really helped Stamkos though was his work ethic and good character. He worked extremely hard to improve his game and it is paying off. I guess though we'll never know though how'd he do with Tocchet in September, and that's just my speculation. The point I was trying to make though was everyone one had him winning the rookie of the year, and putting up similar numbers to Kane and other top players that just tore it up since day 1. Stamkos is doing fine, but compared to how everyone thought he would do in preseason, he's underachieving.

Quote:
Second...Like I said earlier, dont compare Hedman to Smaby. There is a world of talent difference there. He is as sure thing as your going to find in the draft. I never said he was for sure going to be a generational talent, but he has the potential to be. And anyone who has that potential doesnt sit down in the minors for a few year getting seasoned. Also, I never said he had to come in and lead our defensive core. I said he would definitely make the top 6. If Doughty, Schenn, and Bogosian, can play in their first year and make a difference, Hedman sure as hell can.
I'm not trying to compare Smaby to Hedman specifically but I didn't really know who else to compare him to draft pick wise. We have never picked a defensemen that high in the draft. I didn't want to say Egener or Rogers who were both picked before Smaby because their troubles were more with injuries. If Hedman were here with us, I agree he would make the top 6 but I don't know if he would have the same impact has Schenn or Doughty. The 2008 draft was a crazy draft. It was the first time were all of the top5 picks started the season out of camp I think.

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:31 PM
  #155
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Any idea if Karsums or Lashoff play tomorrow? I'm hoping to go to the game and am a Bruins fan so it would be nice to see the two.

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:38 PM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaysOf 04 View Post
I agree he was ready for the NHL, but even without Melrose, I don't believe he would have come in and contributed right away. I think it still would have taken him some time. Things that really helped Stamkos though was his work ethic and good character. He worked extremely hard to improve his game and it is paying off. I guess though we'll never know though how'd he do with Tocchet in September, and that's just my speculation. The point I was trying to make though was everyone one had him winning the rookie of the year, and putting up similar numbers to Kane and other top players that just tore it up since day 1. Stamkos is doing fine, but compared to how everyone thought he would do in preseason, he's underachieving.



I'm not trying to compare Smaby to Hedman specifically but I didn't really know who else to compare him to draft pick wise. We have never picked a defensemen that high in the draft. I didn't want to say Egener or Rogers who were both picked before Smaby because their troubles were more with injuries. If Hedman were here with us, I agree he would make the top 6 but I don't know if he would have the same impact has Schenn or Doughty. The 2008 draft was a crazy draft. It was the first time were all of the top5 picks started the season out of camp I think.
The answer to this is yes. If Hedman was in the 2008 draft he would be the first defenseman taken. Lets just put it that way.

You could have compared him to Hamerlik. But hes an a-hole so lets not talk about him too much.

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03-05-2009, 07:56 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by antdvda View Post
The answer to this is yes. If Hedman was in the 2008 draft he would be the first defenseman taken. Lets just put it that way.

You could have compared him to Hamerlik. But hes an a-hole so lets not talk about him too much.
haha I forgot about him.

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Old
03-05-2009, 08:00 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by TampBear View Post
Any idea if Karsums or Lashoff play tomorrow? I'm hoping to go to the game and am a Bruins fan so it would be nice to see the two.
Karsums will play. Lashoff is out till at least next week with a laserated calf or something like that.

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03-05-2009, 09:54 PM
  #159
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I want to see these guys play!! Ive been hearing about Lashoff for a while now, but have never been able to gauge his skills myself... Maybe Karsums will surprise as well??

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Old
03-06-2009, 11:49 AM
  #160
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Lawton was just on NHL Live, pretty much same stuff as the other day. Couple of things. He did have a couple of trades that he had wanted to make that didn't go thru. And that he thinks there will be a lot of movement at the draft and on July 1. He implied that he plans on being pretty busy with said movement.

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03-06-2009, 12:02 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Symphony X View Post
He implied that he plans on being pretty busy with said movement.
Compared to 2008? Damn, is it possible to beat that "busy" with free agency? I suppose he'll sign 17 defense men this year instead?

This ownership seems to have a disease known as "FAB": Free Agency Bulimia.

Binge and purge.....binge and purge.

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03-06-2009, 12:21 PM
  #162
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Old
03-06-2009, 03:24 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Tokala View Post
Compared to 2008? Damn, is it possible to beat that "busy" with free agency? I suppose he'll sign 17 defense men this year instead?

This ownership seems to have a disease known as "FAB": Free Agency Bulimia.

Binge and purge.....binge and purge.
Well, I wouldnt mind them going with one D-man signing. Hopefully Vrbata decides that hes done with the NHL and then give us the chance to go after J-Bo. I would really love to have him on this team....

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