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Re-signing Babchuk and Ruutu: what's it going to take?

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Old
04-12-2009, 08:16 AM
  #51
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I'd like to see Babs, Ruutu, and Rosey back for sure... I'm OK with letting Jussi go because his price tag will be too high for a versatile 4th liner. I'm completely fine with letting Seid go... He blocks a lot of shots but he is out of position far too often for my liking... And unfortunately he doesn't provide enough offensively to make up for the defensive short comings like Corvo does...


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04-12-2009, 08:40 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
I'd like to see Babs, Ruutu, and Rosey back for sure... I'm OK with letting Jussi go because his price tag will be too high for a versatile 4th liner. I'm completely fine with letting Seid go... He blocks a lot of shots but he is our of position far too often for my liking... And unfortunately he doesn't provide enough offensively to make up for the defensive short comings like Corvo does...
Seids ended with 30 pts, while Corvo ended with 38. Sure, more of Corvo's points came via goals. But Seids had assists. Now, I haven't been able to watch anything lately, so im not sure if they were secondaries that he just got lucky to get, or if he actually made some sick passes...but #s wise, he isnt too far behind.

That being said, numbers arent everything. But when you have Wallin and Kaberle not doing jack back on the blue line, and you have Seids, still a relatively young d-man learning his trade, im sure we could take into consideration his 30 pts this season and the fact that he has already improved immensely since coming here, I would say that personally, I'd rather have him back there than either Wallin or Kaberle. Keep him and Gleason behind Pits, Corvo, and Babchuck and bring up for good one of Borer, Carson, Rodney....or probably more likely McBain (my personal choice).

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04-12-2009, 08:53 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by AmericanSoldier15U View Post
Seids ended with 30 pts, while Corvo ended with 38. Sure, more of Corvo's points came via goals. But Seids had assists. Now, I haven't been able to watch anything lately, so im not sure if they were secondaries that he just got lucky to get, or if he actually made some sick passes...but #s wise, he isnt too far behind.

That being said, numbers arent everything. But when you have Wallin and Kaberle not doing jack back on the blue line, and you have Seids, still a relatively young d-man learning his trade, im sure we could take into consideration his 30 pts this season and the fact that he has already improved immensely since coming here, I would say that personally, I'd rather have him back there than either Wallin or Kaberle. Keep him and Gleason behind Pits, Corvo, and Babchuck and bring up for good one of Borer, Carson, Rodney....or probably more likely McBain (my personal choice).
I just think he nothing really special and being a FA will make his cost exceed his value.

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04-12-2009, 09:08 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanSoldier15U View Post
Seids ended with 30 pts, while Corvo ended with 38. Sure, more of Corvo's points came via goals. But Seids had assists. Now, I haven't been able to watch anything lately, so im not sure if they were secondaries that he just got lucky to get, or if he actually made some sick passes...but #s wise, he isnt too far behind.

That being said, numbers arent everything. But when you have Wallin and Kaberle not doing jack back on the blue line, and you have Seids, still a relatively young d-man learning his trade, im sure we could take into consideration his 30 pts this season and the fact that he has already improved immensely since coming here, I would say that personally, I'd rather have him back there than either Wallin or Kaberle. Keep him and Gleason behind Pits, Corvo, and Babchuck and bring up for good one of Borer, Carson, Rodney....or probably more likely McBain (my personal choice).
There's not enough money for Seidenberg even if we get rid of one of Wallin/Kaberle/Walker. Seidenberg can probably get around $2.5m/yr on the open market with the solid season he has had.

I think Cole/Ruutu/Babchuk will all be back season. LaRose has likely priced himself out of our range, while Jokinen's qualifying offer is too high for his level of play (though he could be back if he's willing to take a discount off it).

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04-12-2009, 09:43 AM
  #55
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Following up on my earlier post, here's an interesting stat: Babchuk is first in the league among defensemen in powerplay goals per 60 minutes of 5-on-4 time (minimum 40GP and 2:00/game on the powerplay).

Here's the Top 10:

1. Anton Babchuk - 3.21 goals per 60 minutes
2. Mike Green - 2.97
3. Zdeno Chara - 1.90
4. Alexandre Picard - 1.90
5. Brendan Bell - 1.88
6. Pavel Kubina - 1.75
7. Mark Streit - 1.68
8. Marek Zidlicky - 1.63
9. Marc-Andre Begeron - 1.62
10. Jay Bouwmeester - 1.59

Source: http://www.behindthenet.ca/2008/5_on...=2&team=&pos=D

At 5-on-4, Babchuk has outscored Corvo/Pitkanen/Seidenberg combined 9 goals to 8.


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04-12-2009, 12:36 PM
  #56
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All I know is it won't be easy to re-sign Babchuk after he walks up in Vegas at the NHL Awards and collects his Norris Trophy.

If anything, a Rick Dipietro '15-year' deal should probably be on the table.





In all honesty I think something was done to Anton while he was back in Russia. Something along the same lines of the movie Iron Man. Doubt Babs is even human anymore.

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Old
04-12-2009, 01:54 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton Babchuk View Post
Some interesting Ruutu stats:

At home: 33GP, 6G-9A-15PTS -7
On the road: 33GP, 15G-16A-31PTS +5 (17th in the league in road points)


Even strength points: 35 (tied for 45th--as many or more as Kessel, Roy, Doan, Whitney, Gagne, Richards, Zetterberg, Hemsky, Brown, Spezza, etc)

Last season: 100 shots in 77 games (1.3/game)
This season: 153 shots in 66 games (2.32/game)
This proves that Ruutu hates Carolina! I hope we don't try to re-sign him!

In all honesty, I think Babs and Cole are our priority signings. If Babchuck's play doesn't regress next season, that gives us four 30-pt defensemen, a luxury that only a few other teams in the league can boast. We all saw what a deep balance of offensively capable defenseman and an offensive-minded system can do.

Cole, for obvious reasons, needs to re-sign. Him and Staal are magic. I think someone posted that Staal's stats are 25 pts in 16 games since Cole's return, and I don't think it's a coincidence that Staal and the rest of the team started picking up their play once Cole came on board.

Ruutu and LaRose are fine players, but I think JR is going to have to work some magic to retain both of them. I agree with most on here that LaRose is probably gone. I don't know how the locker room would react to LaRose leaving though since he's the team's sparkplug

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04-12-2009, 03:02 PM
  #58
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The more I look at the numbers, the harder it is to fit Ruutu...

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04-12-2009, 03:07 PM
  #59
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Babchuk should get around 2, IMO.

He's really been great this season.

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04-12-2009, 03:11 PM
  #60
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I'd like to see LaRose, Babs, Cole taken care of first... That will probably be cheaper by $2 mil than signing Cole, Babs, and Ruutu... We might be able to roll part of that $2mil towards Jussi or sign an UFA... or add that $2 mil into money saved from trading Kaberle and get a very nice UFA

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04-12-2009, 03:18 PM
  #61
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Bottom line is that we need to dump Kabs and Walker. That's nearly 5 million going to waste. I like Eaves, but if it means keeping Ruutu by trading his salary away, then it was to be done. JR needs to work some magic and call in some favours, give away pick to get those contracts off of the books.

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04-12-2009, 03:31 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
I'd like to see LaRose, Babs, Cole taken care of first... That will probably be cheaper by $2 mil than signing Cole, Babs, and Ruutu... We might be able to roll part of that $2mil towards Jussi or sign an UFA... or add that $2 mil into money saved from trading Kaberle and get a very nice UFA
What UFA are you going to get that is better/equal to Ruutu? Letting go of a physical 25goal/55point player who just turned 26 so we can have Jussi Jokinen and Chad LaRose on the team = . I'd rather have Ruutu than both of them. Besides, we need to have a spot open in the Top 9 for one of Boychuk/Bowman.

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04-12-2009, 03:47 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Anton Babchuk View Post
What UFA are you going to get that is better/equal to Ruutu? Letting go of a physical 25goal/55point player who just turned 26 so we can have Jussi Jokinen and Chad LaRose on the team = . I'd rather have Ruutu than both of them. Besides, we need to have a spot open in the Top 9 for one of Boychuk/Bowman.
I agree. Letting Ruutu walk so we can keep I-should-have-had-40-goals-but-I-can't-finish-Larose would be beyond ridiculous. Larose is a 3rd line guy who can fill in on the 2nd line given the right situation. There's no way we should bend over backwards trying to sign the guy by overpaying. The priorities should be Ruutu, Babchuk and Cole, then guys like Larose and Jokinen. Ruutu and Cole are proven top 6 forwards.

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04-12-2009, 04:20 PM
  #64
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I'm just glad LaRose didn't hit 20 goals. Now we don't have to hear him referred to as a "20 goal scorer" a gazillion times in the offseason.

Call me skeptical about a 27-year old with 18 career goals who magically scores 19 in his first UFA year. And even if you count on him being able to repeat those 19 goals, he still only had 31 points.

Ruutu, on the other hand, has hit the 20 goal mark twice in four full seasons and was on pace for 20 in a third season (17 goals in 71 games). Sure, he'll be more expensive, but he's also the much better player. I could easily see Ruutu improving on this season and posting 30+30 next year.

A small market team needs to be able to introduce young, cheap talent to the roster...not overpay to keep role players (LaRose, Jokinen) to fill those very positions. One of Boychuk/Bowman should be on this team next year and they're not going to be on the 4th line.

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04-12-2009, 04:29 PM
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I think Ruutu is great, but sometimes you can't put a price on what a player brings to the table in terms of work effort. I think LaRose is probably worth about 45-60 goals over the next 3 years... What I like about LaRose is his hustle and his ability to score even strength... All his goals were even strength and that is very valuable... If we can get LaRose for 1.2-1.6 per season for 3 years, I'm all about that...

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04-12-2009, 04:34 PM
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I think there will be some talented players available... I like the idea of not sign Jussi unless it's cheap... I'd like to save the $2 mil on Ruutu and trade Kaberle and take that money added to the $2 mil and have $4.5 mil to sign a top notch physical D or multiple skills Forward... Just my preference, we don't have to agree...

Don't get me wrong... I like the idea of keeping Ruutu a lot... I hope they find away to keep both or do the scenario at the top... I think you move Eaves to make room for Boychuk, fyi (unless you lose LaRose).

But I think we all agree Babs and Cole first, then see where we stand.

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04-12-2009, 07:03 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
I think Ruutu is great, but sometimes you can't put a price on what a player brings to the table in terms of work effort. I think LaRose is probably worth about 45-60 goals over the next 3 years... What I like about LaRose is his hustle and his ability to score even strength... All his goals were even strength and that is very valuable... If we can get LaRose for 1.2-1.6 per season for 3 years, I'm all about that...
Ruutu has every bit the work ethic that Larose has, plus he actually produces. I wouldn't mind keeping Rosie but not at the expense of a talented, young top 6 forward such as Ruutu. Like AB has said, we already have Boychuk/Bowman knocking on the door to fill his spot should he want too much money. They won't be as polished but if they don't play they never will be.

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04-12-2009, 07:18 PM
  #68
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That is the problem with keeping everyone, though. Boychuk and/or Bowman are likely to make the team next year and we all know how wasted they would be on the 4th line. Plus, Sutter is in the mix too.

Top 9 already under contract:

Staal
Samsonov
Cullen
Whitney
Brind'Amour
Eaves - Could be 4th line
Walker - Could be 4th line



Top 9 to be signed next year:

Ruutu
Cole
LaRose
Jokinen
Boychuk
Sutter
Bowman

I see only one of Eaves/LaRose/Jokinen coming back. Walker they're probably stuck with, but at least he wouldn't be a waste on the 4th line. That's about where he's at now. It'll be interesting to see what they do.

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04-12-2009, 08:07 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Sam View Post
That is the problem with keeping everyone, though. Boychuk and/or Bowman are likely to make the team next year and we all know how wasted they would be on the 4th line. Plus, Sutter is in the mix too.

Top 9 already under contract:

Staal
Samsonov
Cullen
Whitney
Brind'Amour
Eaves - Could be 4th line
Walker - Could be 4th line



Top 9 to be signed next year:

Ruutu
Cole
LaRose
Jokinen
Boychuk
Sutter
Bowman


I see only one of Eaves/LaRose/Jokinen coming back. Walker they're probably stuck with, but at least he wouldn't be a waste on the 4th line. That's about where he's at now. It'll be interesting to see what they do.
These 3 are already under contract so unless I'm missing something I'm not sure why they're in that list.

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04-12-2009, 08:12 PM
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Well, they're still incoming and not counting against the cap yet are they? I wasn't sure what to label that section

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04-12-2009, 08:40 PM
  #71
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Sutter already started his contract, but Boychuk and Bowman's don't start til next year. Out of these 3 I think at least 2 will spend the majority of the season in the AHL barring major injuries. Assuming we re-sign Ruutu, Cole and Babchuk and let Larose, Seidenberg, and Jokinen walk here's our line up:

Ruutu - Staal - Cole
Whitney - Cullen - Eaves/rookie/who knows
Samsonov - Brind'Amour - Eaves/rookie/Walker/who knows
who knows - who knows - Conboy (I believe he has a one way contract next season)

Pitkanen - Babchuk
Gleason - Corvo
Wallin - Kaberle (won't be surprised if one or both aren't back though)

Ward
Leighton

Not sure what we plan on doing with Seidenberg either, but we'll probably let him walk so we can keep Babs, Ruutu, and Cole and just fill our empty slots from within the organization. I could probably more accurately fill out the line up by crunching some numbers and making some assumptions on salary but that's probably futile for now, plus I'm lazy.

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04-12-2009, 09:34 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caner Soze View Post
Conboy (I believe he has a one way contract next season)
Yup, he does I like having him up but in the event we need to send him down it just hampers things.

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04-12-2009, 10:05 PM
  #73
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I don't think having him on a one way contract is going to hamper much. If we don't want to play him, he'll simply be scratched or waived (doubt anyone picks him up).

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04-12-2009, 10:36 PM
  #74
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I have a feeling this team will do all it can to keep Larose. I just don't see us throwing him out after having developed him to the extent that we have. I also don't see Ruutu, Cole, or Babchuk leaving.

I think we buy out Kaberle in the offseason. I think that Wallin or even Walker with his severe injury troubles have to be considering retirement. I would also consider Brind'Amour in the retirement category despite what he said earlier in the year during his struggles.

Tim Conboy could be waived and clear. The one way contract isn't a problem there.

Carolina can also clean up some salary by allowing a lot of the AHL veteran free agents to leave the organization due to the influx of talent like Boychuk, Bowman, Terry, McBain, etc. With NHL level prospects, you don't have to sign stop gaps like Helminen and Ryan that command borderline NHL money. Bayda is allowed to pursue other options. Seidenberg is allowed to pursue other options. Eaves could potentially be shopped for a pick at the draft if nothing else. Jussi Jokinen gets offered a pittance as compared to his current salary to stay on a team with a more clearly defined role for him.

I predict that either Cole, Ruutu, or Larose sign a one year contract offer as a way to get over until the prospects are ready to contribute. One of these guys will want a one year deal as well, and it's likely Cole. Larose is probably looking for a payday. Ruutu may end up on a one year deal by the result of his agent.

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04-12-2009, 10:54 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caner Soze View Post
I don't think having him on a one way contract is going to hamper much. If we don't want to play him, he'll simply be scratched or waived (doubt anyone picks him up).
Still means he's getting paid nhl money to play in the ahl if he does get sent down. To most teams that wouldn't matter but I don't think I have to point out that we do things differently than most.

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