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I Consider us Winners at the Deadline

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Old
03-05-2009, 05:35 AM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Jacques Demers View Post
What did you expect? tanguay to retire? Let's all applaud gainey for not murdering Tanguay in the night.

We're improved, but we're still far from good enough. And we could have done much better.
thats the problem there... your expectations... you expected a blockbuster.

Lets not forget that Tanguay was acquired this past summer for this very scenario to help this team in the stretch run and the playoffs.

Name me the last team that went out and got a NUMBER 1 centre or a NUMBER 1 defenceman at the deadline and won the stanley cup. Doesn't happen.

the deadline isn't about totally revamping your team.. .its about adding the Brad Stuart (Detroit)... the Darryl Sydor (Tampa)... the Doug Weight (Carolina) of the league to help you and compliment your team in the playoffs. Chemistry is important, and I don't remember the last time the team that made the biggest splash on deadline day went out and won the cup. The teams the won the cup made these minor additions... their 4th defenceman... their 3rd line centre.... etc.

Thats what we've done too we've added a top 4 dman who plays the PP for us, and a bottom line centre... shoring up two areas of weakness. Going out and getting that Gigantic Piece... the jaybo, the pronger, the jokinen... the facts show they wouldn't help us this year. maybe down the road the way bourque and colorado won one season later. but the team that makes the most noise on deadline day is not usually the stanley cup champion.

I like our little tweaks... they addressed two areas of need.

We've known all season that success in the playoffs was gonna come down to three things
1) the play of our young goaltender (either Halak or Price one of them must be good in the playoffs for us to win)
and
2) our forwards led by Kovalev, Koivu, Tanguay and others firing..
3) Markov, Komisarek and hamrlik being healthy and playing their best.

Regardless of what happens with any trades today, you weren't gonna change that and become a better team. Those three key ingredients could not be changed. But what we've done is support those three key ingredients by improving the defence and the PP and getting a RH centre who can win draws and play some defensive hockey. Still I don't see the trade that was gonna allow us to still win in the playoffs if we don't get the results from our best players

Bottom line our best players as we made the roster in october, have to be our best players as we made the roster in april may and june for us to have any hope. Everything else is just complimentary.

You wanna change this roster around and make wholesale changes... thats what you do in the offseason... not on one panicked day in March.... cause those wholesale changes in March aren't gonna be ready to gel as a team in April.

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Old
03-05-2009, 06:14 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Pacioretty67 View Post
thats the problem there... your expectations... you expected a blockbuster.

Lets not forget that Tanguay was acquired this past summer for this very scenario to help this team in the stretch run and the playoffs.

Name me the last team that went out and got a NUMBER 1 centre or a NUMBER 1 defenceman at the deadline and won the stanley cup. Doesn't happen.

the deadline isn't about totally revamping your team.. .its about adding the Brad Stuart (Detroit)... the Darryl Sydor (Tampa)... the Doug Weight (Carolina) of the league to help you and compliment your team in the playoffs. Chemistry is important, and I don't remember the last time the team that made the biggest splash on deadline day went out and won the cup. The teams the won the cup made these minor additions... their 4th defenceman... their 3rd line centre.... etc.

Thats what we've done too we've added a top 4 dman who plays the PP for us, and a bottom line centre... shoring up two areas of weakness. Going out and getting that Gigantic Piece... the jaybo, the pronger, the jokinen... the facts show they wouldn't help us this year. maybe down the road the way bourque and colorado won one season later. but the team that makes the most noise on deadline day is not usually the stanley cup champion.

I like our little tweaks... they addressed two areas of need.

We've known all season that success in the playoffs was gonna come down to three things
1) the play of our young goaltender (either Halak or Price one of them must be good in the playoffs for us to win)
and
2) our forwards led by Kovalev, Koivu, Tanguay and others firing..
3) Markov, Komisarek and hamrlik being healthy and playing their best.

Regardless of what happens with any trades today, you weren't gonna change that and become a better team. Those three key ingredients could not be changed. But what we've done is support those three key ingredients by improving the defence and the PP and getting a RH centre who can win draws and play some defensive hockey. Still I don't see the trade that was gonna allow us to still win in the playoffs if we don't get the results from our best players

Bottom line our best players as we made the roster in october, have to be our best players as we made the roster in april may and june for us to have any hope. Everything else is just complimentary.

You wanna change this roster around and make wholesale changes... thats what you do in the offseason... not on one panicked day in March.... cause those wholesale changes in March aren't gonna be ready to gel as a team in April.
Actually... he seems to think we should have acquired BOTH a 1st pair D and a 1st line C... probably without depleting the farm is my guess...

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03-05-2009, 06:36 AM
  #28
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Gainey did not tried to get a player to replace Lang... we are not winner at the deadline.

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Old
03-05-2009, 06:42 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
Gainey did not tried to get a player to replace Lang... we are not winner at the deadline.
Ah! you're in the know... can you please, next time you hear something about the Habs, pass it along so we can be in the know too...

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03-05-2009, 06:46 AM
  #30
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He told to the media that he did not make any phone calls, that he is ok with the team he got now.

All he did say is "It is the actual players who will make us win"... the same Habs management said all season.

But he still did not replace Lang...

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03-05-2009, 06:59 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
He told to the media that he did not make any phone calls, that he is ok with the team he got now.

All he did say is "It is the actual players who will make us win"... the same Habs management said all season.

But he still did not replace Lang...
Guess he just hang up on thoses who called him...

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:09 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by skoivu View Post
I like alot of habs fans were expecting alot of movement at the deadline but i after i thought about it id consider us winners at the deadline.

Way to go Bob, GO HABS
Considering your skoivu someone who has never won anything, I can see how you'd count this as a win

Say hello to Mr.Roy next seasson Bob, the guy who'll be taking your job cause you can't get anything done.

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:48 AM
  #33
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I was watching tradecenter yesterday and one moment after Calgary got Jokinen, a comment was said that summed it up very well for our Habs.

Someone: "How come the Habs are not moving, it's their 100th season? They promised big things to the fans"

Someone: "Well there's always next season, the 101th season"

*they all burst into laughter*

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Old
03-05-2009, 07:56 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Malakhov View Post
I was watching tradecenter yesterday and one moment after Calgary got Jokinen, a comment was said that summed it up very well for our Habs.

Someone: "How come the Habs are not moving, it's their 100th season? They promised big things to the fans"

Someone: "Well there's always next season, the 101th season"

*they all burst into laughter*
Ya true but I'm not concerned by a comment from Darren Pang

Another thing is half the posters on this tread sound like Pierre Maguire. Gainey failed his team because he didn't make a move. Give me a friggin break, I would rather go to war with this team then overpay for a couple extra pieces and still have a real good chance we don't win the cup anyways.

Lets be honest here people, as much as I support my team I can also see that Detroit, San Jose, Boston , Washington and New Jersey are looking very well positioned for a cup run. Gainey tends to make his teams in the summer not at deadline day.

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Old
03-05-2009, 08:10 AM
  #35
Marco Corleone
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Teams like Pitts, Car, NYR and Buff all made moves yesterday.......while Gainey did zero.

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Old
03-05-2009, 08:18 AM
  #36
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Personally, I don't give a **** about not doing anything at the deadline, it's not like were just 1 or 2 players away from getting to the stanley cup finals. As a fan, before this season, I was expecting 3 rounds of playoffs. Now, even if we added Schneider who's tremendously helping the PP, I don't feel confident about winning 1 round.

Tanguay will be back,but he said it himself that he won't be 100% this season. Latendresse will be back,but guys like him take so much time to come back in game shape.

I don't know about you guys,but this team hasn't given me one reason to believe this year and it's frustrating. Gainey can't truly feel confident about this team, he just said it because you need an excuse for not doing anything at the deadline here in Montreal.

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Old
03-05-2009, 08:34 AM
  #37
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Bob is basically ready to be ousted in the 1st round again because there's no way this team gets any further, if they get in the playoffs at all.

Not even acquiring a filler for Lang says that much. Unless he's completely incompetent and actually thinks this team can go far... OR he just wants to wait til summer and break up the core of this team which has done NOTHING but disappoint for 6 yrs now.

If he did think we have no chance in the playoffs then he should have traded our UFAs for some returns... oh wait, he can't do that, it's the Centennial.

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Old
03-05-2009, 08:44 AM
  #38
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Bandwagon fans...if the Habs win another 4 straight, you will be applauding BG and Carbo. Where were all these pessimists in January when the Habs were hot? Man, the lack of patience and the panic amongst you.

Guerin? First, he is a RW. Second, he is old. Third, he stunk with the Sharks in his last playoff experience.

This team was not going to change drastically yesterday. It is too difficult and more often, those that try for big moves fail. We tend to remember the few that seem to work (Hossa) more then those that fail (Tkachuk to Atl a few years back).

This team is still so young, look at the number of players, KEY players, under age 25. This team has had way more injuries this season. Most players on this team are having subpar years. It's all unfortunate but that is the way it is. They can still correct it. And the fact that there are so many UFA's in the offseason, means BG will have flexibility.

Schneider has been a good addition. Metropolit is a good 4th line Centre. Stewart adds some sandpaper. Some needs have been addressed. It is difficult sometimes to address everything without giving up too much. And draft picks/prospects are like Gold in the salary cap world, especially with the economy struggling.

The key is that this team needs to get their confidence back.

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03-05-2009, 08:45 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Pascal View Post
Bob is basically ready to be ousted in the 1st round again because there's no way this team gets any further, if they get in the playoffs at all.

Not even acquiring a filler for Lang says that much. Unless he's completely incompetent and actually thinks this team can go far... OR he just wants to wait til summer and break up the core of this team which has done NOTHING but disappoint for 6 yrs now.

If he did think we have no chance in the playoffs then he should have traded our UFAs for some returns... oh wait, he can't do that, it's the Centennial.

Finally, someone that seems to be getting the big picture in a round about way. If Gainey started blowing off UFA's at the deadline he would have been labeled as throwing in the towel, giving up on the centennial. While I believe Gainey is a smart man he knows deep down that some teams are very strong this season for a cup run. Realistically for the Habs to win the cup this year they will need to beat Washington, Philly, Boston, or New Jersey as well as likely Detroit or San Jose, pick your 4 team poison.

By not going out and adding players with contracts past this season ie ( Jokinen ) Gainey is one of the better positioned teams for this summer cap wise. This summer's off season will go along way to determining this teams future.

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Old
03-05-2009, 09:22 AM
  #40
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It's a calculated risk. I think Gainey's way of thinking is that by not aquiring anybody (besides the fact that there really wasn't anyone who would have helped that much), he is showing a team that lacks confidence right now, that they have the confidence of management.

Realistically, you get a bunch of depth defencemen, marginally better, to replace Brisebois and Bouillon and other really good, TEAM guys, you're hurting the team. These are guys the TEAM likes.

In the end, it's a TEAM that wins cups. We won in 93 because we had a solid TEAM. If these guys believe in themselves, and believe in each other, we WILL go far in the playoffs. Because this TEAM has shown, for over a year and a half, that they are DOMINANT when they play with confidence. It's just a matter of getting that confidence back...And I don't think replacing a bunch of guys would have accomplished that.

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Old
03-05-2009, 09:27 AM
  #41
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I have more faith than a whole lot of you.. You can have the best "players" on the ice and still lose. The team has talent. It's for them management to get them to play properly.

The problem is not with the amount of good players, but more how they are used IMO..

Let's hope Carbo finds a way. But I have no doubts this team can win 2 rounds

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Old
03-05-2009, 09:29 AM
  #42
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There's never a good reason to not get a guy like Jokinen when he's available.

Aquiring the guy suddenly makes him our best player. Look at the Habs: this team stands on two old guys in Saku and Kovy, three mid-level talent in Plekanec/Higgins/A. Kostitsyn and a bunch of kids. With need real top talent to build on and Jokinen whatever his attitude would have been that. I don't even care what we would have done in the playoffs this year, heck even if we would have been eliminated less sooner, but at least for the next couple of years you would have had a player of the level of Jokinen to relly on.

And if we look at the playoffs giving your team some amunition, just to give them more confidence is more smart than do nothing and as such it would have been possible to aquire Antropov or Kotalik if Bob would have wanted to. It creats hope and fill a void in your squad.

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03-05-2009, 09:31 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Pacioretty67 View Post
I know...

but here's the crazy thing... now take our lineup from any game about three weeks ago... now consider who is out... (begin)... now consider who is in: schneider (by trade); metro (waivers); tanguay (return tomorrow); latendresse (return in 2 weeks)

and tell me how with adding those four guys after the deadline and losing only 1 we are not a better lineup than we were 3 weeks ago?? Cause really it doesn't make sense to not see how we have improved.
Yes, the team is better with those four players but not one of those players helps with our problems in our D zone. In our zone, Markov has been a beast lately but the rest are horrible. Komi and Hammer are the only ones with size but the puck is like a hot potatoe on their stick. The rest are undersized and outmatched in our zone. Schneider is great on the PP but suspect in our zone and can't be expected to play 25 minutes. So unless Tanguay and Lats have been secretely practicing on D for the past month, their arrival will not help Komi and the gang play better defence. And Metropolit is just another undersized centerman who can't support the D against the bigger stronger centermen of the other contenders.

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Old
03-05-2009, 10:59 AM
  #44
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I think most people are disappointed, because we didn't fill all the holes we had. We did have quite a few though and we filled a couple by aquiring Schneider and Metropolit.

But this team still has major holes and we won't contend as is. Heck, how long has it been since we just competed for 60 minutes. Tanguay will help the offense and I don't know what Lats will help with, it depends on how quickly he can get back to game shape. But I still don't see us getting far.

First we have to make the playoffs and that's not a given. Buffalo and Carolina are only 4 points behind us with 18 games to go and even though we won 4 in a row before last night, we didn't look good in any of those wins.

If we do make the playoffs, the first round will be against Boston, New Jersey, Washington, or Philadelphia. All teams that will grind us down to nothing. We've all seen how we respond to teams that hit us. Not good. I predict a short series unless our opponent is overconfident and has a sense of accomplishment already.

What should we have done. Well it depends on what your goals are. If your goal is just to make the playoffs and see what happens, well then we did the right thing. If the goal is to contend, then there were 3 solutions.
- status quo and let the kids develop and aquire experience (option chosen by Gainey)
- be a buyer and aquire the pieces that fill the holes you have identified (option most seem to have wanted but with so many important holes, how realistic is this)
- be a seller and do a quick and simple summer retool (option taken by the Flyers 2 seasons ago)

The 3rd option is the one I wanted. We are going nowhere with this team right now, we should have sold off any pieces that we didn't think would fit into our plan for next year. Give Kovalev to the highest bidder. Jokinen got a 1st, we could have gotten a 1st. Find out the intentions of Komisarek, Koivu, Tanguay, and the rest of the UFA and anyone not looking to resign is traded away for picks and prospects. We could have gotten quite a few draft picks and come summer time, we sign the best available UFA to a huge contract, or make another pitch for Vinny or a pitch for Tavares with all draft picks acquired and go from there.

Just my opinion, anyways but I don't think Gainey took the right option. I've been waiting long enough for a contender, I could of waited another year. (It's a year we aren't contending anyways.)

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Old
03-05-2009, 11:05 AM
  #45
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That's the greatest part as far as Lats is concerned. I mean prior to both guys injuries, do people remember how Lats and Tanguay were viewed? People were starting to see why Calgary let him go, and there's always the famous Lats bashers that were still on his back A LOT.

And now both guys will suddenly help us a lot? Sure it will make us better....but how much? Instead of losing 5-1 yesterday, we would have lost 5-3? How many shots we would have given with both those guys in the lineup?

Anyway, it is just fun for both guys that suddenly they are becoming key parts in that team.....until 1 week after Lats comes back and he suddenly back to how he sucks again and how uneffective both guys will be 'cause of their injuries and will be hesitant to put their nose in the traffic again.

So a little more respect for both guys. Let's hope it stays that way after their return.

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Old
03-05-2009, 11:15 AM
  #46
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Nothing certain was traded/acquired during yesterday's trading action.

Olli does not even play all-out for his country when almost 1,000 of his countrymen come all the way across the pond to watch him. We have an entire team full of him and he's exactly what we don't need. He fits Calgary much better, because here he'd be too high profile (a situation I can't see him thriving within), and we'd end up minus the assets it took to get him.

We're in a prime position for the off-season, and Gainey's lack of activity will pay-off then.

Yesterday's market was very poorly stocked. The contenders tweaked and Calgary panicked to become a contender. They gave up a 1st pick, Lombardi and other things to take a shot... bad move. It's not a good time for their shot. The same could be said for us, it's not a good time to take a shot.

The Sharks picking up Moen, and Hawks picking up Pahlsson will prove to be the more prudent moves.

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Old
03-05-2009, 11:16 AM
  #47
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Yeah, it showed tonight.

Calgary turned themselves into instant contenders overnight. Jokinen is also under contract for next season at a reasonable amount, and all they gave up was a goon, a 3rd line center, and a conditional first rounder.

They had an organizational need (the same one we have, down the middle) and they addressed it. We, on the other hand, did not. Epic Fail.
I do not view the signing of Olli that great and whether or not Calgary is an instant contender is yet to be seen. Leopold was a better signing

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03-05-2009, 11:20 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
That's the greatest part as far as Lats is concerned. I mean prior to both guys injuries, do people remember how Lats and Tanguay were viewed? People were starting to see why Calgary let him go, and there's always the famous Lats bashers that were still on his back A LOT.

And now both guys will suddenly help us a lot? Sure it will make us better....but how much? Instead of losing 5-1 yesterday, we would have lost 5-3? How many shots we would have given with both those guys in the lineup?

Anyway, it is just fun for both guys that suddenly they are becoming key parts in that team.....until 1 week after Lats comes back and he suddenly back to how he sucks again and how uneffective both guys will be 'cause of their injuries and will be hesitant to put their nose in the traffic again.

So a little more respect for both guys. Let's hope it stays that way after their return.
when Tanguay got hurt he was our best winger, and when Lats got hurt he was our 2nd best winger. Given the way AKost is playing lately, they would instantly become our top 2 wingers upon their return.

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Old
03-05-2009, 11:22 AM
  #49
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I like alot of habs fans were expecting alot of movement at the deadline but i after i thought about it id consider us winners at the deadline.

Many would have liked us to get a top 6 forward. Tanguay is going to be back in a week and is exactly that.

The addition of Schnieder even though not at the deadline is helping our pp alot. (tonight not included)

Metropolit is a good third line player in the league, and altough might not replace Langs 30 goals he may have gotten, metropolit is a third line player that we got for nothing.

I dont understand, how can people be mad that we gave up a 2nd to get schnieder saying we'd have no picks when we are hosting the draft then get mad when we dont make a splash at the deadline. Picks were heavily saught after this deadline would we be better off giving up a first round pick for a player to play 20 games?

Montreal fans are really confusing, Gainey is critisized for moves he makes then critisized for not making moves. We have a solid team in my mind.

Im worried about price right now but if he can regain forum and catch fire going into playoffs we will be a force to be reconed with.

We still basically have the same forwards that made us the highest scoring team in the league last year with a highly skilled past 70 pt getter coming back. By he way we were tops in the league with tanguay healthy.

Did anybody see the scores trade deadline flops?????? Some of those trades were awful and have hurt some teams for alot of years. At the time i will admit i thought they were good moves.

I give cudos to gainey for not giving into the Montreal media and fans pressure to make a big FOOLISH move and having the bag to do what he thinks is right.

When Montreal refinds its scoring touch, Price plays with confidence and plays like he can, and we make a deep play off push and contend for th cup alot of people are going to eat there words and jump on the band wagon.

Gainey knwos more about hockey then any of us, any sports reprter, or any hockey analyis on the score or TSN. If those reporters on TSN or the score were that smart theyd have GM jobs or coaching jobs instead staiting the obvious on TV.

Dont be fooled by these goofs, we are winners at the deadline.

Way to go Bob, GO HABS
yes definately

and i consider us winners last night. in fact we had 18 shots in the first period alone that proves we outplayed them

way to go bob

good no move again

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Old
03-05-2009, 11:26 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by 3TB3 View Post
yes definately

and i consider us winners last night. in fact we had 18 shots in the first period alone that proves we outplayed them

way to go bob

good no move again
The great hockey they gave us last night showed they are more than one or two players away from being a VERY good team...

The players, by oàplaying the way they did, told Gainey "you're right not to add anything, we arent that good anyway"...

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