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Jack Johnson for Jordan Staal in the offseason

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:00 AM
  #1
Mr Irreverent
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Jack Johnson for Jordan Staal in the offseason

Both are top 3 picks and have lots of upside. Kings are stacked at D and Johnson may be spare parts with the emergence of Doughty as the clear #1 Defenseman. Kings also have Voynov and Hickey who are most likely ready for the NHL next season. The Pens have Crosby and Malkin but are lacking some more grit and skill on defense (atleast that's my observation). The cherry on top is that Crosby and Johnson are good friends and have played together since their Shattuck days.

What say you?

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03-07-2009, 10:03 AM
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BrindamoursNose
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the Pens are pretty set at D, themselves.

Need better wingers still.

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:04 AM
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Why would Pittsburgh trade a guy signed until 12-13 for an RFA?

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:05 AM
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eXile59
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I think Staal will have more value in a couple years. He has been playing like a 2nd overall pick lately and I wouldn't want to see him leave the pens.

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03-07-2009, 10:07 AM
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Jordan Staal is worth more than Brad Stuart 2.0

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:14 AM
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Mr Irreverent
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Well, I guess we can close the thread now. Jordan Staal >>>> Jack Johnson for now atleast.

Btw, the proposal was assuming Johnson was signed for atleast 3-4 years.

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03-07-2009, 10:24 AM
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bleedgreen
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ironically this was an offer that actually happened on staals draft day. the canes offered jj around multiple times before actually trading him - but the first offer was to the pens for the pick that was to be staal, and the canes wouldve taken staal as well.

didnt happen then, probably wont now.

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:27 AM
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Haik
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Kings don't make that deal.

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Old
03-07-2009, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TearsOFaClown View Post
Kings are stacked at D
No they arent really.. I mean, they might have many D but their quality isnt that good.. Johnson is perhaps their best defenseman. Plus, Pens dont need Johnson.

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03-07-2009, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4rde View Post
No they arent really.. I mean, they might have many D but their quality isnt that good.. Johnson is perhaps their best defenseman. Plus, Pens dont need Johnson.

WOW do you know anything about Hockey.. Quality isnt that good?

Do what do you call Daoughty? or maybe even Quincey? or even Johnson please know what you are talking about before you post

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03-07-2009, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingjordan View Post
WOW do you know anything about Hockey.. Quality isnt that good?

Do what do you call Daoughty? or maybe even Quincey? or even Johnson please know what you are talking about before you post
So now that they have Doughty, Johnson and Quincey they are stacked at D?

Im talking players like Preissing, O'Donnell, Harrold and Gauthier.. none of those are top 4 D

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03-07-2009, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingjordan View Post
WOW do you know anything about Hockey.. Quality isnt that good?

Do what do you call Daoughty? or maybe even Quincey? or even Johnson please know what you are talking about before you post
Tuebert is atleast another year away, Voinov might be a call-up next year, Hickey might spend a year in the AHL. that leaves Doughty, Johnson, Quincey, O'Donnell, Greene, Harrold. we DON'T HAVE quality. We can't afford to trade Johnson right now. Once Hickey steps in, then we MIGHT be able to move him in a package for an impact forward that can actually score goals consistently.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:07 AM
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johnny canuckistan
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Seems like a good deal for both teams to me. I don't like Pittsburgh's depth on D, and they have too many centers and not enough ice time. LA would be an excellent destination for Staal, he and Kopitar would be an excellent #1/#2 center combo.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:08 AM
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LAKings4ever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4rde View Post
No they arent really.. I mean, they might have many D but their quality isnt that good.. Johnson is perhaps their best defenseman. Plus, Pens dont need Johnson.
We are stacked at D in terms of quality, I would have to say we have the best group of D prospects of any team (Hickey - 1st round and 4th overall, Tuebert - 1st round and 13th overall, Vionov). Hickey was captain for Canada and Vionov wore an A for Russia in the world juniors tournament. So far, JJ (1st round and 3rd overall) and Doughty (1st round and 2nd overall) have shown they are the real deal and are still learning on the job and should only get better...now you have to admit, that is quality!!

No problems with your not liking the proposal...Staal is a player that fills a big need for us, but we still have plenty of areas to address up front so this still doesn't get us over the rebuild hump. Johnson is looking good, still remains to be seen just "how" good he will become...looking forward to watching him play next year, I believe he will jump to another level from where he is at now.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAKings4ever View Post
We are stacked at D in terms of quality, I would have to say we have the best group of D prospects of any team (Hickey - 1st round and 4th overall, Tuebert - 1st round and 13th overall, Vionov). Hickey was captain for Canada and Vionov wore an A for Russia in the world juniors tournament. So far, JJ (1st round and 3rd overall) and Doughty (1st round and 2nd overall) have shown they are the real deal and are still learning on the job and should only get better...now you have to admit, that is quality!!
Still, imo that is not quality NOW. As 1 poster above said all those prospects are at least 1 year away.. give up Johnson and you will have troubles next year. But sure, in few years the Kings will be stacked with defenseman and good ones too.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:12 AM
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this deal was proposed a few years ago... no way the kings are drunk enough to do it now. Pitt may be stuck with jordans well intentioned but lumbering ass for a few years

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:13 AM
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Mr Irreverent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the_speedster View Post
this deal was proposed a few years ago... no way the kings are drunk enough to do it now. Pitt may be stuck with jordans well intentioned but lumbering ass for a few years
Lumbering??? That's what some people say about Frolov and he's an absolute stud.

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03-07-2009, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrindamoursNose View Post
the Pens are pretty set at D, themselves.

Need better wingers still.
Pens are? They need another physical presence on the back end. Pens defense could definitely be upgraded.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:14 AM
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JMFJ is no spare part. He is going to be an important piece, and help take the pressure off the other up and comers down the line. Probably not a lifer on the Kings, but is a very important piece to the puzzle.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:15 AM
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If Staal is traded its going to be for a long term top 6 winger imo.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:17 AM
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No, period.

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03-07-2009, 11:17 AM
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Sorry for the annoying hum.

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Old
03-07-2009, 11:21 AM
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Mr Irreverent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StrakaLangKovy View Post
If Staal is traded its going to be for a long term top 6 winger imo.
Teddy Purcell?

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03-07-2009, 11:31 AM
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the_speedster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TearsOFaClown View Post
Lumbering??? That's what some people say about Frolov and he's an absolute stud.
Jordan staal LUMBERS.. period. I've watched maybe 50% of the games he's played since turning pro... great first season.. since then he's been outhustled and outplayed by lesser heralded players recieving lower ice times.. hell I'd have kept dominic moore in pittsburgh over him.

Jack johnson will be an absolute stud.. why? beause you can tell from his play effort and swagger that he WANTS to be. From day one he plays like a guy that refuses to be overwhelmed or intimidated. Injuries and all his potential is still greater than staal. Jordan staal was a function of erics mvp type season from a few years ago.

Eric was great so jordan must be.. right? Instead he seems to be content just to "hang out" and leave all the heavy lifting to malkin and crosby. When's the last time you ever heard of staal getting into it with another player? getting injured (like the former two) due to hustle? Have you ever actually WATCHED him play? its unbearable. You get tired of yelling.. move your feet! You're one of the biggest people out there! MOVE YOUR ****ING FEET!

Instead he depends on his stupid big bird-eque reach for everything.. you think that by now he'd have realised that this was the NHL.. even fourth liners can be great skaters.

Look at the others in his draft. They're either certified team carrying first line stars (toews) or emerging scorer types (backstrom, kessel, ) or young players knocking furiously on the door of success (okposo, mueller etc) Hell even freaking 5ft nothing DERRICK BRASSARD is outscoring and outhustling staal.

He reminds me of joe thornton BEFORE mike keenan. HAd achieved some success and settled into the nhl.. zero desire to push himself to the limits of his ability.

There are glimpses here and there of how jordan could make your average nhl'er his chew toy.. but then he goes RIGHT BACK to his plodding ways.. Success for him has ONLY come once joined with players like malkin and crosby. ON his own he creates no success of any kind for any other line.

Ron francis might have been considered the third wheel of the 90's penguins but he showed that wether mario/jagr were there or not he could carry the team himself. His defensive prowess didn't mean his offense ever suffered..

Staal? supposedly some kind of great defensive stalwart yet if you actually WATCH the games all you see is that they put him out there because of his wing span. I don't see any impressive technique, hell half the time I see the wrong thing, yet his completely undeserved reputation has created some kind of legend. Nonesense. Good kid,.. seems harmless but results in the nhl don't come because you're a nice harmless guy.

I'd WASH the cars of EVERY single member of the kings brass for a month if they'd even CONSIDER trading Jack for Staal. Unless the kinds defense is suddenly bursting with absolute first line talent ( some of which demand a trade) I think he's staying in LA and if he does go anywhere I HIGHLY doubt jordan staal will be the bait to get him there

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03-07-2009, 11:36 AM
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Mr Irreverent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the_speedster View Post
Jordan staal LUMBERS.. period. I've watched maybe 50% of the games he's played since turning pro... great first season.. since then he's been outhustled and outplayed by lesser heralded players recieving lower ice times.. hell I'd have kept dominic moore in pittsburgh over him.

Jack johnson will be an absolute stud.. why? beause you can tell from his play effort and swagger that he WANTS to be. From day one he plays like a guy that refuses to be overwhelmed or intimidated. Injuries and all his potential is still greater than staal. Jordan staal was a function of erics mvp type season from a few years ago.

Eric was great so jordan must be.. right? Instead he seems to be content just to "hang out" and leave all the heavy lifting to malkin and crosby. When's the last time you ever heard of staal getting into it with another player? getting injured (like the former two) due to hustle? Have you ever actually WATCHED him play? its unbearable. You get tired of yelling.. move your feet! You're one of the biggest people out there! MOVE YOUR ****ING FEET!

Instead he depends on his stupid big bird-eque reach for everything.. you think that by now he'd have realised that this was the NHL.. even fourth liners can be great skaters.

Look at the others in his draft. They're either certified team carrying first line stars (toews) or emerging scorer types (backstrom, kessel, ) or young players knocking furiously on the door of success (okposo, mueller etc) Hell even freaking 5ft nothing DERRICK BRASSARD is outscoring and outhustling staal.

He reminds me of joe thornton BEFORE mike keenan. HAd achieved some success and settled into the nhl.. zero desire to push himself to the limits of his ability.

There are glimpses here and there of how jordan could make your average nhl'er his chew toy.. but then he goes RIGHT BACK to his plodding ways.. Success for him has ONLY come once joined with players like malkin and crosby. ON his own he creates no success of any kind for any other line.

Ron francis might have been considered the third wheel of the 90's penguins but he showed that wether mario/jagr were there or not he could carry the team himself. His defensive prowess didn't mean his offense ever suffered..

Staal? supposedly some kind of great defensive stalwart yet if you actually WATCH the games all you see is that they put him out there because of his wing span. I don't see any impressive technique, hell half the time I see the wrong thing, yet his completely undeserved reputation has created some kind of legend. Nonesense. Good kid,.. seems harmless but results in the nhl don't come because you're a nice harmless guy.

I'd WASH the cars of EVERY single member of the kings brass for a month if they'd even CONSIDER trading Jack for Staal. Unless the kinds defense is suddenly bursting with absolute first line talent ( some of which demand a trade) I think he's staying in LA and if he does go anywhere I HIGHLY doubt jordan staal will be the bait to get him there
It's good input for sure on Staal, and again a lot of this has been said about Frolov before too. The thing about Frolov is that he's great defensively and has really turned it on these last few weeks and most of his critics have shutup.

I agree about Jack wanting to be a stud, but with the emergence of Doughty he's hit some road bumps and his defensive play has been suffering of late. So much so that he's 2nd (to worst) on the team with a -15 after missing most of the season and Murray has taken away his PP time.

I love hockey!

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