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Why they need to go.

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Old
03-10-2009, 09:11 PM
  #1
TylerDurden77
 
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Why they need to go.

First off I'm fairly impressed with what Slats did at the deadline, he undoubtedly made the team better for the time being. With that said I believe that he made a huge mistake in not dealing some of the big 4 contracts we have on the books.

Let's look at these contracts as of today:

Scott Gomez - 9th highest cap# - 67th in scoring

Chris Drury - 13th highest cap# - 85th in scoring

Wade Redden - 6th highest cap#(among D) - 63rd in scoring(among D)

Michael Rosival - 20th highest cap#(among D) - 39th in scoring(among D)

The additions we made were great for the rest of this season but what I believe is that we set ourselves up to of basically thrown away a 2nd/3rd and 2 serviceable prospects. I find it hard to believe that anyone will be all that willing to take on some of these players during the offseason and the hopes of ever signing Antropov(imperitave we keep him), Morris(dont know if hed be worth his pricetag) and Mara(guys a beast, keep him w/o a doubt) seems like a pipedream.
Yes thanks Slats for giving the fans playoff hopes. But F you for crusing our hope for the future. Anyone feel like starting a new reinvigorated fire sather thread?

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03-10-2009, 09:23 PM
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ManicSubsidal15
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I think as long as they get rid or any 2 of the 4 or even really one of the four they pretty much make up the money to give everyone a bit of a raise but it would be nice to lose Gomez/Rozy. Yes I know Gomez has been good lately and hopefully he's awesome down the stretch so not only does he help this year but then in the offseason we can actually get a decent return for him

Edit: PS- there's about 500 other threads complaining about these guys did you really need to start a new one haha

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03-10-2009, 09:23 PM
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gardenfaithful44
 
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Considering every Ranger fan knows this team is in trouble with those contracts, Antropov is a goner. There is no way Slats will have enough cap room to sign Zherdev and Dubinsky and then throw 2 mil + at Antropov.

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03-10-2009, 09:36 PM
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NYRSchrute217
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Originally Posted by gardenfaithful44 View Post
Considering every Ranger fan knows this team is in trouble with those contracts, Antropov is a goner. There is no way Slats will have enough cap room to sign Zherdev and Dubinsky and then throw 2 mil + at Antropov.
He's going to want 3.75-4 minimum.

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03-10-2009, 09:37 PM
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silverfish
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Those four are the reason this team is going to have a very different look come next season.

My money's on all four of them still being here.

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03-10-2009, 10:03 PM
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Brian McCabe was traded with a 4th for Van Ryn. McCabe was owed $4.15m in each of the final 3 years of his contract which Florida picked up but he has a $5.75 cap hit and he had to waive a no trade clause.

When teams miss out on a high end defenseman in the UFA market, they will be open to the idea of trading for Roszival. And forget the doomsday scenerio where we send a 1st to unload him. If he is the one to go, we will trade him for a pick or a player with a much smaller cap hit.

Or we buy out Redden for just over $2.4 per year over 10 seasons and save $4m.

Or we trade Gomez in a situation similar to Roszival's. Gomez will be even more attractive because his cap hit is higher than what he is actually owed... a real bonus to teams looking to hit the cap floor with a small budget.

Relax.

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03-10-2009, 10:07 PM
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sweet username

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Old
03-10-2009, 10:09 PM
  #8
skymachine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden77 View Post
First off I'm fairly impressed with what Slats did at the deadline, he undoubtedly made the team better for the time being. With that said I believe that he made a huge mistake in not dealing some of the big 4 contracts we have on the books.

Let's look at these contracts as of today:

Scott Gomez - 9th highest cap# - 67th in scoring

Chris Drury - 13th highest cap# - 85th in scoring

Wade Redden - 6th highest cap#(among D) - 63rd in scoring(among D)

Michael Rosival - 20th highest cap#(among D) - 39th in scoring(among D)

I'm sure even if Slats tried, probably no team was currently dumb enough or desperate enough to take on the burden.

Slats major mistake was making these contracts happen . All we can really hope is that these guys turn it around.

Did I say ?

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Old
03-10-2009, 10:16 PM
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The Lunatic Fridge
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Someone explain to me where rozsivals contract is "horrible" because i dont see it ,rather have a somewhat offensive"overpaid" defenseman than some hack like Tom Poti

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Old
03-10-2009, 11:20 PM
  #10
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no need to mention rozi with the unmentionables. seriously open your eyes and LOOK at this league. there are barely any capable dmen and i'm straight with roz for his contract.

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Old
03-11-2009, 05:58 AM
  #11
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Roz is least of our issues!

Even with Ants we have no genuine battle horse forward who is a certain point per game go to guy!

Dubi without Jags is nice but just another plugger.

We need Jokinen and we got Antropov - simple as that.

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Old
03-11-2009, 07:22 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DutchShamrock View Post
Or we trade Gomez in a situation similar to Roszival's. Gomez will be even more attractive because his cap hit is higher than what he is actually owed... a real bonus to teams looking to hit the cap floor with a small budget.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=NYR

This isn't true, at least not right now. Gomez's cap hit is 7,357,143 and he will make 8 mil each of the next two years and 7.5 mil the year after that. It's not until the last 2 seasons of the contract where his salary drops below his cap hit, at 5.5 mil in 2012-13 and 4.5 mil in 2013-14.

The same holds true for Drury, Redden and Rozsival. They all will be paid more next year than their cap hit. Rozy could be a trade deadline trade next year maybe, since he will drop to 4 mil salary in 2010-11 and then 3 mil in 2011-12, the final year of his contract.

Drury and Rozsival may be the best candidates for a trade over the summer since they have the shorter contracts. I think if we can trade Drury we'll be ok cap-wise, as long as we don't do something stupid like give Antropov or Zherdev a huge amount of money/years.

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03-11-2009, 11:14 AM
  #13
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Drury must go, we need a CAPTAIN!!!

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03-11-2009, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by serakk View Post
Drury must go, we need a CAPTAIN!!!
again, people overrate the "captaincy" who do you want that is such a great "Captain"? Is crosby a great captain b/c he scores lots of points? Ilya Kovalchuck and Rick Nash are great captains b/c they're great goalscorers??

Messier got booed in 93 and won a cup in 94. Was he a crappy captain the year before when we came in last place and an awesome one when we won?

if you want drury to score more goals, then yes i agree.

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Old
03-11-2009, 12:30 PM
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FutureGM97
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I think everyone was spoiled with having Messier as a Captain. Drury isn't an outspoken guy. People have different ways of leading...Messier was very outspoken and was one of the best players in the history of the NHL...Drury is a quiet guy who is a good player. The expectations on Drury to lead are way too high by fans of the Rangers...should he lead? Of course but he isn't the kind of guy who is going to come out in the papers and guarantee a win the next night. I'm fine with Drury as captain.

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Old
03-11-2009, 12:45 PM
  #16
Section311
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Originally Posted by gardenfaithful44 View Post
Considering every Ranger fan knows this team is in trouble with those contracts, Antropov is a goner. There is no way Slats will have enough cap room to sign Zherdev and Dubinsky and then throw 2 mil + at Antropov.
Maybe Wade Redden will be playing for the Hartford Wolfpack next year

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Old
03-11-2009, 12:47 PM
  #17
Section311
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=NYR

This isn't true, at least not right now. Gomez's cap hit is 7,357,143 and he will make 8 mil each of the next two years and 7.5 mil the year after that. It's not until the last 2 seasons of the contract where his salary drops below his cap hit, at 5.5 mil in 2012-13 and 4.5 mil in 2013-14.

The same holds true for Drury, Redden and Rozsival. They all will be paid more next year than their cap hit. Rozy could be a trade deadline trade next year maybe, since he will drop to 4 mil salary in 2010-11 and then 3 mil in 2011-12, the final year of his contract.

Drury and Rozsival may be the best candidates for a trade over the summer since they have the shorter contracts. I think if we can trade Drury we'll be ok cap-wise, as long as we don't do something stupid like give Antropov or Zherdev a huge amount of money/years.
The problem is I just don't see Drury waiving his NTC

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03-11-2009, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
again, people overrate the "captaincy" who do you want that is such a great "Captain"? Is crosby a great captain b/c he scores lots of points? Ilya Kovalchuck and Rick Nash are great captains b/c they're great goalscorers??

Messier got booed in 93 and won a cup in 94. Was he a crappy captain the year before when we came in last place and an awesome one when we won?

if you want drury to score more goals, then yes i agree.
Drury and Crosby are both lousy captains. The difference is that Crosby, even though I hate the whiny, cry baby diver, actually helps his team win. Drury doesn't do anything for this team.

If you want to see what a good captain is, watch a Kings game. Dustin Brown is everything a captain should be.


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Old
03-11-2009, 01:42 PM
  #19
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Originally Posted by czechmate25 View Post
Drury and Crosby are both lousy captains. The difference is that Crosby, even though I hate the whiny, cry baby diver, actually helps his team win. Drury doesn't do anything for this team.

If you want to see what a good captain is, watch a Kings game. Dustin Brown is everything a captain should be.
This is such a non-issue to me. Do you really think the team would be in a different position than it is now if it had a different captain?

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03-11-2009, 01:52 PM
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czechmate25
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This is such a non-issue to me. Do you really think the team would be in a different position than it is now if it had a different captain?
I know what a big supporter you were of Drury's arrival here, so I would expect you to disagree.

With that said.....to answer your question, No. If someone else in the current locker room had the C on his sweater instead of Drury...I'd venture to believe that the team would still be in the same position they are in now.

However, if a player worthy of a 7 million dollar contact was signed in July 07 instead of Drury, then I tend to believe the team would be better. I never understood signing 2nd/3rd line support players to superstar size contracts.

Moreover, we all know that if Drury was never signed and a center was brought in who had offensive talent , Jagr would have hit the triggers for the option on his contract and we'd still have a captain who deserves respect.

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03-11-2009, 01:52 PM
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allstar3970
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Originally Posted by czechmate25 View Post
Drury and Crosby are both lousy captains. The difference is that Crosby, even though I hate the whiny, cry baby diver, actually helps his team win. Drury doesn't do anything for this team.

If you want to see what a good captain is, watch a Kings game. Dustin Brown is everything a captain should be.
what does he do thats so "captainly"?

i actually typed "Dustin Brown captain" into google and the second result was a 7 page thread entitled "sorry folks, but Dustin Brown is not "captain material"" on letsgokings.com

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03-11-2009, 02:00 PM
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czechmate25
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
what does he do thats so "captainly"?

i actually typed "Dustin Brown captain" into google and the second result was a 7 page thread entitled "sorry folks, but Dustin Brown is not "captain material"" on letsgokings.com

I like Frolov, so I started watching quite a few Kings games this year. Before the season started, I was like "who is Dustin Brown.....and why is he the captain of LA?" But I'll tell ya, after watching him this year, I have become a believer. Not only does he have offensive skill, he plays hard every shift, works the corners well, hits, takes hits....but more importantly, he plays with heart...and the welfare of the team seems important to him.

I guess it is one of those deals where it's hard to explain but if you watched him enough, you'd understand.

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03-11-2009, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by czechmate25 View Post
I like Frolov, so I started watching quite a few Kings games this year. Before the season started, I was like "who is Dustin Brown.....and why is he the captain of LA?" But I'll tell ya, after watching him this year, I have become a believer. Not only does he have offensive skill, he plays hard every shift, works the corners well, hits, takes hits....but more importantly, he plays with heart...and the welfare of the team seems important to him.

I guess it is one of those deals where it's hard to explain but if you watched him enough, you'd understand.
so he's a grinder with offensive talent. And you've decided that he cares a whole lot. great captain.

btw im sorry for seeming like a jerk and attacking you, just want to make my point that the Captaincy doesnt mean as much as everybody likes to think it does, and that there's no concrete example of a "good captain".

If we were winning and drury had 30 goals, everybody would say he was a great captain who "leads by example" despite not being super vocal.

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Old
03-11-2009, 04:02 PM
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This is such a non-issue to me. Do you really think the team would be in a different position than it is now if it had a different captain?
Or if it had no captain at all and you throw an A on Gomez, Drury and Naslund?

I look at it as a non issue right now as well. Messier couldn't even captain this group of players. What we need more than anything as a team is an identity. When Mark got here, at least we already had a playoff caliber team and then like Jagr we re- molded it around the super star through some trades and a coaching change.
We pretty much know what Tortorella's system is. We need players who are going to grow together and help define the NY Rangers for however long he's coaching here. Once we get some chemistry we'll figure out who emerges as the captain. Right now I don't think anyone deserves to be Captain. We're not even a team yet. We don't even know who Tortorella wants to keep around. He's a fan of Dubinsky and I think he likes Drury. As far as the rest of the team. I don't know what he thinks, and he is probably getting more of an idea who he wants in his lineup every day but that won't become clear until the season's over and we get to the end of next years training camp. I also say it's difficult for even Mark Messier to Captain a team during a year like this where we went from two opposite extremes, as far as coaching styles and coaching personalities. How could anyone captain an unstable team? This team was doomed to fall apart no matter who or if we have a captain. You can have a great captain but what good does it do when the players give up on the coach and his system?
As someone said, as far as the high contracts, we have to deal with them so there's really no sense talking about it anymore. Gomez, Drury, Rozsival, Redden and Lundqvist are going to be here at least until their contracts exprire. I hope at least 3 or 4 of these players can thrive under "Torts." Right now I think we have around 3 kids to build this team around for the future and I can see how all 3 of them can become captain some day. Hopefully there will be kids like this in Jr's, College or Hartford who can be added. I look at Gomez, Drury and Redden as the vets that are added to the group as opposed to the way it usually goes. Building a team with kids and then adding vets.

Staal
Dubinsky
Callahan

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Old
03-11-2009, 04:25 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by czechmate25 View Post
Moreover, we all know that if Drury was never signed and a center was brought in who had offensive talent , Jagr would have hit the triggers for the option on his contract and we'd still have a captain who deserves respect.
For a guy who has averaged a 20 point decline each of the previous two season, I don't think we all know that.

Of course all this is irrelevant, you already agreed that nothing really would change if someone else was wearing the C.

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