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Old
03-17-2009, 11:36 PM
  #1
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Bad leadership

Thats the only logic possibility that explain how bad this team is playing and how stagnant our kids are in their development..

Yes we are in a market where there is alot of pressure, more than anywhere, but when your supposed leaders cant follow the pace anymore, that pressure becomes negative for everone, this isnt a sane environment for the kids to grow up in.. A kid like DAgostini was way more dynamic, energic, effective and dangerous offensively at his first few games than what he is now, what isnt normal and what could be said about alot of kids taking the mold of what is a team without soul, no spirit at all..

The house will have to be cleaned this summer, we need vets that will push our kids to get better and play at their potential.. Otherwise, just give this team to the youth, let them take the lead, learn how to win by their own, this way they will develop properly and increase their value.. Between ending 9-10th with dead horses vets in the line-up or 14-15th in the standing with our kids, I chose the second option, at least we will be in a good position to get top end talents and rebuild on solid basics.. The only way I see this team reaching another level is by getting something we have been lacking badly for years, something we dont have either with the big team or in the system.. A BIG AND SKILLED FIRST LINE CENTER!! Someone that will feed the excellent depth we have on the wings.. This isnt the only hole we have but certainly the most evident one.. So to me its Lecavalier or rebuilding mode.. I dont wanna resign guys like Koivu or Lang to live the kind of season we lived this year again.. Ive nothing against resigning Koivu 1 year at 3 millions to center our third line if ever Lecavalier comes but no way I want him back to play a signifiant role on this team, as I said, I prefer to risk ending 15th in the standing with our kids than living another season like this one, what could be a desaster, no playoffs and a mid round first rounder..

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03-17-2009, 11:39 PM
  #2
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The Weekly Bad Leadership Thread.

On Tuesday.. atleast it was early.

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Old
03-18-2009, 06:16 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
Thats the only logic possibility that explain how bad this team is playing and how stagnant our kids are in their development..

Yes we are in a market where there is alot of pressure, more than anywhere, but when your supposed leaders cant follow the pace anymore, that pressure becomes negative for everone, this isnt a sane environment for the kids to grow up in.. A kid like DAgostini was way more dynamic, energic, effective and dangerous offensively at his first few games than what he is now, what isnt normal and what could be said about alot of kids taking the mold of what is a team without soul, no spirit at all..

The house will have to be cleaned this summer, we need vets that will push our kids to get better and play at their potential.. Otherwise, just give this team to the youth, let them take the lead, learn how to win by their own, this way they will develop properly and increase their value.. Between ending 9-10th with dead horses vets in the line-up or 14-15th in the standing with our kids, I chose the second option, at least we will be in a good position to get top end talents and rebuild on solid basics.. The only way I see this team reaching another level is by getting something we have been lacking badly for years, something we dont have either with the big team or in the system.. A BIG AND SKILLED FIRST LINE CENTER!! Someone that will feed the excellent depth we have on the wings.. This isnt the only hole we have but certainly the most evident one.. So to me its Lecavalier or rebuilding mode.. I dont wanna resign guys like Koivu or Lang to live the kind of season we lived this year again.. Ive nothing against resigning Koivu 1 year at 3 millions to center our third line if ever Lecavalier comes but no way I want him back to play a signifiant role on this team, as I said, I prefer to risk ending 15th in the standing with our kids than living another season like this one, what could be a desaster, no playoffs and a mid round first rounder..
All young players look better their first few games up, they run on adrenaline, the real test is after the first 5-6 games. Look at the Islanders, that's why they were so hyper the game we played them last week.

Leadership is not our problem, consistant goaltending is.

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Old
03-18-2009, 06:20 AM
  #4
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Leadership is not our problem, consistant goaltending is.
Giving up less than 40 shots per game would be a plus, too, but I digress.

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Old
03-18-2009, 08:19 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
Thats the only logic possibility that explain how bad this team is playing and how stagnant our kids are in their development..

Yes we are in a market where there is alot of pressure, more than anywhere, but when your supposed leaders cant follow the pace anymore, that pressure becomes negative for everone, this isnt a sane environment for the kids to grow up in.. A kid like DAgostini was way more dynamic, energic, effective and dangerous offensively at his first few games than what he is now, what isnt normal and what could be said about alot of kids taking the mold of what is a team without soul, no spirit at all..

The house will have to be cleaned this summer, we need vets that will push our kids to get better and play at their potential.. Otherwise, just give this team to the youth, let them take the lead, learn how to win by their own, this way they will develop properly and increase their value.. Between ending 9-10th with dead horses vets in the line-up or 14-15th in the standing with our kids, I chose the second option, at least we will be in a good position to get top end talents and rebuild on solid basics.. The only way I see this team reaching another level is by getting something we have been lacking badly for years, something we dont have either with the big team or in the system.. A BIG AND SKILLED FIRST LINE CENTER!! Someone that will feed the excellent depth we have on the wings.. This isnt the only hole we have but certainly the most evident one.. So to me its Lecavalier or rebuilding mode.. I dont wanna resign guys like Koivu or Lang to live the kind of season we lived this year again.. Ive nothing against resigning Koivu 1 year at 3 millions to center our third line if ever Lecavalier comes but no way I want him back to play a signifiant role on this team, as I said, I prefer to risk ending 15th in the standing with our kids than living another season like this one, what could be a desaster, no playoffs and a mid round first rounder..

With all the drama and negativity surrounding the Habs this year, where has Saku Koivu been in all of this???

I haven't heard him say anything to the media about the teams struggles and he doesn't seem to be leading the team like he should be. He should be pushing players to be better and turn things around, but we never hear a peep from him. Komisarek is always doing interviews and talking about the team, the same with Higgins and Kostopoulos.

I'm not saying that to be a leader, you have to do media interviews, but as the captain of the greatest team in the NHL....you should do some interviews so it at least makes it look like you care and are trying to be a leader on this team. Right now it looks like Koivu is just another player on the team instead of the leader and team captain.

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Old
03-18-2009, 08:32 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckhead58 View Post
With all the drama and negativity surrounding the Habs this year, where has Saku Koivu been in all of this???

I haven't heard him say anything to the media about the teams struggles and he doesn't seem to be leading the team like he should be. He should be pushing players to be better and turn things around, but we never hear a peep from him. Komisarek is always doing interviews and talking about the team, the same with Higgins and Kostopoulos.

I'm not saying that to be a leader, you have to do media interviews, but as the captain of the greatest team in the NHL....you should do some interviews so it at least makes it look like you care and are trying to be a leader on this team. Right now it looks like Koivu is just another player on the team instead of the leader and team captain.

Koivu is probably sick of being "mr everything" in montreal for the last decade, playing in the blue white and red is no easy task, the fair weather fans/media are absolutley pathetic especially couple the fact that hes not local.

The guy is going to turn 35 this year has battled a couple serious injurys and cancer we shouldnt be surprised if theres not a whole lot left in the tank. Koivu has given his all to the Canadiens and has been rewarded with squat, not even respect from fans, its not his fault the team drafted terribly for years and lately hasnt been able to draw a big tallent UFA to the city to take atleast a little pressure off him.

And as far as NHA goes why don't you stop making these stupid threads, blaming one player for a team of underachivers is getting real old real quick.

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Old
03-18-2009, 08:38 AM
  #7
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how about avereage team thread,

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Old
03-18-2009, 09:06 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckhead58 View Post
With all the drama and negativity surrounding the Habs this year, where has Saku Koivu been in all of this???

I haven't heard him say anything to the media about the teams struggles and he doesn't seem to be leading the team like he should be. He should be pushing players to be better and turn things around, but we never hear a peep from him. Komisarek is always doing interviews and talking about the team, the same with Higgins and Kostopoulos.

I'm not saying that to be a leader, you have to do media interviews, but as the captain of the greatest team in the NHL....you should do some interviews so it at least makes it look like you care and are trying to be a leader on this team. Right now it looks like Koivu is just another player on the team instead of the leader and team captain.
You do realize that it is the reporter's that go after Komisarek, Higgins, Kostopoulos etc...to request interviews, not the other way around.

I'm sorry PH, but after all his time in Montreal. Anyone challenging Koivu's love for the Habs hasn't been paying attention.

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Old
03-18-2009, 09:12 AM
  #9
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Leadership is not our problem, consistant goaltending is.
hope you are kidding.. we give the blue line like there was none, we are looking like a bunch of lost sheets out there in our own zone.. We give over 40 shots per games and most of them are dangerous.. If we had an average goaltender in net this team would be already out from a playoffs spot.. Price and Halak are making alot of solid saves, some people just dont seems to see it or take it for granted..

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03-18-2009, 09:22 AM
  #10
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Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
You do realize that it is the reporter's that go after Komisarek, Higgins, Kostopoulos etc...to request interviews, not the other way around.

I'm sorry PH, but after all his time in Montreal. Anyone challenging Koivu's love for the Habs hasn't been paying attention.
I know I defenitly woulden't challenge that fact. My issue is that Koivu doesn't look like he has much left in the tank. I haven't really made a comment on him this year as I have been observing his play over the whole season and not just a couple of games. Even if he was sick with the flu last night, that doesn't excuse the rest of the year. I think we have to face facts regarding our little Finnish captain with a heart of a lion...his career is coming to an end slowly. He has been through so much in his career (injury wise) and this has taken such a toll on his body. He has problems being on the ice for more then 30-40 seconds, has problems keeping up with the play sometimes, and is just man handled very easily by the opposition...I actually get pretty sad watching him play certain shifts...Kinda like an old warrior that is slowly being replaced. You can tell he's putting his heart into it, but he's being knocked off the puck and onto his butt so easily by younger players.

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03-18-2009, 09:25 AM
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There is only so much Saku can do to lead. We even have had Carbo and Gainey who are great leaders and it doesn't change a thing for this team. The players on this team are all responsible for themselves.

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03-18-2009, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
hope you are kidding.. we give the blue line like there was none, we are looking like a bunch of lost sheets out there in our own zone.. We give over 40 shots per games and most of them are dangerous.. If we had an average goaltender in net this team would be already out from a playoffs spot.. Price and Halak are making alot of solid saves, some people just dont seems to see it or take it for granted..
All those problem reflect bad coaching or lack of talent, not questionable leadership.

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Old
03-18-2009, 09:29 AM
  #13
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What some of you fail to understand is that the team will be significantly different next year !

Koivu , Kovalev, maybe other ''leader'' on this team will go away from the circus that is Montreal.

I know we are not asking that much but it's pretty clear that some players doesn't care anymore about playing it here and its not just UFA to be.

I might be wrong but next year edition will be very different...

Also note to disclaimer .. price and halak are nowhere near our main problems and they never was and probably never will!

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Old
03-18-2009, 09:33 AM
  #14
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Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
I know I defenitly woulden't challenge that fact. My issue is that Koivu doesn't look like he has much left in the tank. I haven't really made a comment on him this year as I have been observing his play over the whole season and not just a couple of games. Even if he was sick with the flu last night, that doesn't excuse the rest of the year. I think we have to face facts regarding our little Finnish captain with a heart of a lion...his career is coming to an end slowly. He has been through so much in his career (injury wise) and this has taken such a toll on his body. He has problems being on the ice for more then 30-40 seconds, has problems keeping up with the play sometimes, and is just man handled very easily by the opposition...I actually get pretty sad watching him play certain shifts...Kinda like an old warrior that is slowly being replaced. You can tell he's putting his heart into it, but he's being knocked off the puck and onto his butt so easily by younger players.
I've been around here for a few years now and I've read the same type of posts every season about Koivu. He's too small, he's too slow, he's washed up, he looks like he doesn't have much left in the tank.

Now this isn't a shot against you Frank. But I've seen Koivu bounce back too many times to write him off just yet. Just last week Koivu was being praised for his great 2 goal game. Let's see what happens when Tanguay comes back and is placed on Koivu's line.

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Old
03-18-2009, 09:34 AM
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stupid fans and bull**** media find any excuse to blame and bash Koivu. no offense people, its getting old

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03-18-2009, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
hope you are kidding.. we give the blue line like there was none, we are looking like a bunch of lost sheets out there in our own zone.. We give over 40 shots per games and most of them are dangerous.. If we had an average goaltender in net this team would be already out from a playoffs spot.. Price and Halak are making alot of solid saves, some people just dont seems to see it or take it for granted..
I agree, they are not even close to the problem. Anyone that says otherwise is not watching the games. I disagree with the dagger comment though, he was new guy coming in and was fighting for a spot. Now that he has it he has not been playing well.

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03-18-2009, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Puckhead58 View Post
With all the drama and negativity surrounding the Habs this year, where has Saku Koivu been in all of this???

I haven't heard him say anything to the media about the teams struggles and he doesn't seem to be leading the team like he should be. He should be pushing players to be better and turn things around, but we never hear a peep from him.
I guess you're just not reading enough.
http://www.rds.ca/canadien/chroniques/271230.html

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03-18-2009, 09:40 AM
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I've been around here for a few years now and I've read the same type of posts every season about Koivu. He's too small, he's too slow, he's washed up, he looks like he doesn't have much left in the tank.

Now this isn't a shot against you Frank. But I've seen Koivu bounce back too many times to write him off just yet. Just last week Koivu was being praised for his great 2 goal game. Let's see what happens when Tanguay comes back and is placed on Koivu's line.
I don't doubt that he will have the great game from time to time...but he can't seem to do it on a consistent basis. The fact is that he's no longer a young pup. He's 34 years old and his body has been though a lot. I would never doubt the guy because he's done so much for this team and has proven time and time again that he can be counted on, i'm just saying that I think he's on the downside of his career and probably shoulden't be counted on as much as he is right now.

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03-18-2009, 10:05 AM
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stupid fans and bull**** media find any excuse to blame and bash Koivu. no offense people, its getting old
Its not only about Koivu, its about guys like Kovalev, Hamrlik too..

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03-18-2009, 10:09 AM
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For the last time, the problem is not the talent level on this team, nor is it the leadership. There was a feud and they lost their way. Growing pains. Deal with it. Only time can heal this. Watch the Habs fly next season under Lever.

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03-18-2009, 10:11 AM
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For the last time, the problem is not the talent level on this team, nor is it the leadership. There was a feud and they lost their way. Growing pains. Deal with it. Only time can heal this. Watch the Habs fly next season under Lever.
Keep burying your head in the sand. If you think just a new coach can change this, then your are delusional, again.

Lack of passion and heart are not "growing pains".

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Old
03-18-2009, 10:12 AM
  #22
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I don't doubt that he will have the great game from time to time...but he can't seem to do it on a consistent basis. The fact is that he's no longer a young pup. He's 34 years old and his body has been though a lot. I would never doubt the guy because he's done so much for this team and has proven time and time again that he can be counted on, i'm just saying that I think he's on the downside of his career and probably shoulden't be counted on as much as he is right now.
I think we're on the same page when it comes to Koivu. Injuries, health issues and age have all taken a toll on our little captain. In a perfect world he would be our second, maybe even our 3rd line center.

But unfortunately that didn't happen. Plekanec started the year in a serious slump and has only started to snap out of it since his suspension. The unfortunate injury to Lang also didn't help in this situation.These two things forced Koivu back into being our #1 center again.

Also throw in the fact that as our #1 center. Koivu was given many different line mates, none of them I would consider to be first line players. (Tanguay not included due to the amount of time he missed)

Like I mentioned in my last post. Koivu looked inspired and refreshed when Tanguay and A.Kost were placed on his line. I think you'll notice a difference again once Tanguay comes back.

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Old
03-18-2009, 10:15 AM
  #23
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The problems? How about:
  • A lack of hunger - I don't see these guys wanting it enough, they are losing too many of the one on one battles. I need to see desperation for 60 minutes - the Habs are effectively in the playoffs now
  • Lack of confidence - This is one fragile team right now, and nothing make a player more indecisive than a lack of confidence
  • The obvious - poor defence zone play - it all starts in the defensive zone, offense, especially transition offence comes from good play by all 5 players in the defensive zone. And goals from transition, 3 on 2's, 2 and 1's are much easier then cycling it 5 on 5. We need to see a transition game that uses this team's biggest asset - speed. Because there is no flow in the defensive zone, this team has problems breaking out and players are getting the puck standing still - it makes the team look slow. An effective breakout, getting the puck to players in motion is key

Yes, Price wasn't good in the shootout but he kept the Habs in this game, especially in the third. I know the second goal looks weak, but it deflected off the Pleks stick and fooled him. How many times have we heard Don Cherry say never get the stick in the way because it causes more problems. The trajectory of the shot was completely different than Price expected.

Koivu - I can't believe people doubt his leadership especially because he doesn't give interviews. His job as a leader is in the room and on the ice.

If we give up as fans, this team has no chance. We have all these home games - cheer until you turn blue cause booing isn't going to make it better

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Old
03-18-2009, 10:17 AM
  #24
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Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
I've been around here for a few years now and I've read the same type of posts every season about Koivu. He's too small, he's too slow, he's washed up, he looks like he doesn't have much left in the tank.

Now this isn't a shot against you Frank. But I've seen Koivu bounce back too many times to write him off just yet. Just last week Koivu was being praised for his great 2 goal game. Let's see what happens when Tanguay comes back and is placed on Koivu's line.
Yup, we hear the exact same thing every year around February-March about Koivu.

He's always had a problem in the latter half of the season, this is nothing new. But seems to be able to pull it back come playoff time.

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Old
03-18-2009, 10:29 AM
  #25
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I've been around here for a few years now and I've read the same type of posts every season about Koivu. He's too small, he's too slow, he's washed up, he looks like he doesn't have much left in the tank.

Now this isn't a shot against you Frank. But I've seen Koivu bounce back too many times to write him off just yet. Just last week Koivu was being praised for his great 2 goal game. Let's see what happens when Tanguay comes back and is placed on Koivu's line.
THE real leaderships on and of ice come from the management and coaching staff. Then you have good vet to fallow and lead the way for others.
We have been laking a real coach for far to long. result, we look terrible out there

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