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Old
03-15-2004, 04:57 PM
  #1
Schwang
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Dagenais

Y'know, I read posts bashing Dagenais and it ticks me off. Some fans were crying that we need goal scorers, and when we get one (for nothing i might add), you all cry because "he can't do this and he can't do that". Well, let me tell you something, the guy has more goals than a lot of goal scorers on our team (ya, Koivu and Kovalev) with fewer games played and less ice time. I mean, come on, with some luck, this guy could score 20 this year in under 55 games! Doesn't that MEAN something to you people? The habs need to further develop this guys skills - (long reach, excellent shot, nose for the net, size) rather than bench him all the time. True, he seems to lack heart some nights, but I think we need to keep this guy. He seems to enjoy it here. I know he's slow, and he doesn't usually play physical, but he can score and he uses his size in front of the net and in the corners (Dave Andreychuk anyone?)

This guy probably won't get much faster or meaner, but he can learn to play with more heart. that comes from good leadership. Letting him go would be a HUGE mistake. He's just starting to develop.

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03-15-2004, 05:02 PM
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I have to agree, except, for Dagenais to be efficient, he would have to play on the top two lines. Now can you really argue that he deserves to be there? Kovalev, Koivu, Ribeiro, Ryder, Zednik, Sundstrom and Bulis all deserve a top 6 spot more than Dagenais. If we could somehow get a third scoring line going, which gets less ice time than the top two, then I would be all for Dagenais having a regular spot. But we don't have any offensive centers after Koivu and Ribeiro.

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03-15-2004, 05:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwang
Y'know, I read posts bashing Dagenais and it ticks me off. Some fans were crying that we need goal scorers, and when we get one (for nothing i might add), you all cry because "he can't do this and he can't do that". Well, let me tell you something, the guy has more goals than a lot of goal scorers on our team (ya, Koivu and Kovalev) with fewer games played and less ice time. I mean, come on, with some luck, this guy could score 20 this year in under 55 games! Doesn't that MEAN something to you people? The habs need to further develop this guys skills - (long reach, excellent shot, nose for the net, size) rather than bench him all the time. True, he seems to lack heart some nights, but I think we need to keep this guy. He seems to enjoy it here. I know he's slow, and he doesn't usually play physical, but he can score and he uses his size in front of the net and in the corners (Dave Andreychuk anyone?)

This guy probably won't get much faster or meaner, but he can learn to play with more heart. that comes from good leadership. Letting him go would be a HUGE mistake. He's just starting to develop.

Starting to develope at, 26?

IMO Daganias stinks, badly, and deserves to be bashed. I dont like him, hope this is his last season with us.

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03-15-2004, 05:04 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Starting to develope at, 26?

IMO Daganias stinks, badly, and deserves to be bashed. I dont like him, hope this is his last season with us.
Oh yeah, he definitely deserves to be bashed. Kudos to him, he's scored some goals for the CH, but he blows. Not only does he deserve to be bashed by fans, but by hammers, pucks, rakes, staplers and other stuff like that. He is bad, bad, bad.

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03-15-2004, 05:05 PM
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I personally don't like the guy's "I'm the best" attitude. He has a reputation for being a cancer in the locker room (Talk to people in New Jersey and Florida for more info) and he didn't seem to change much...

I like his shot. But that's it, he can't do anything else but shot the puck. You'll have to say that if it wasn't for Mike Ribeiro, he wouldn't have more than 10 goals, I'd be ready to take a chance and say that Mike Ribeiro had an assist on everygoal by Dagenais.

He can be in the lineup, but only with Ribeiro. I don't want to see this guy on a 3rd or 4th line. If he won't play with Ribeiro, it must be because he's scratched. I prefer a guy like Langdon, Begin, Dowd, Ward, Juneau, Dackell, Bulis or Sundstrom on the 3rd line or 4th line instead of him.

There's also the fact that, with the playoffs coming, it will become a lot faster with a lot more hits and players need intensity and that's not the biggest quality on Dagenais. I don't think he'll be a playoff performer.

That being said, I still don't hate the guy. If he doesn't take lazy penalties, is invisible defensively (Which would be a good thing) and scores a few goals, he'll be a good asset for the Habs!

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03-15-2004, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl.roberts
Oh yeah, he definitely deserves to be bashed. Kudos to him, he's scored some goals for the CH, but he blows. Not only does he deserve to be bashed by fans, but by hammers, pucks, rakes, staplers and other stuff like that. He is bad, bad, bad.
Its my opinion, if you dont like it, too bad.

I dont like him, period.

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03-15-2004, 05:07 PM
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Theres more to hockey than scoring goals. If you cant play within the system the rest of the team is following you create a hole and other teams can take advantage of that opening. Its too bad Dagenais doesnt have a fraction of the desire some of our smaller players have, because hes got the size and strength to be a better player. The Habs lack pure gamebreakers and skilled offensive players so they rely on a more defensive system, and Dagenais just doesnt fit in that system with his slow speed and bad defensive awarness. He causes more turnovers than goals, hes simply lucky theres always somebody to cover up his bonehead plays in his own zone. He may make good plays, but those mistakes hes more prone to make can in the end cost us a game and in the long run, a playoff spot. With the acquisition of Kovalev there is really no need for him; Perreault, Koivu, Zednik, Kovalev, Ribeiro and Ryder form a top six that has won us games, and Dagenais just doesnt fit on the bottom lines.

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03-15-2004, 05:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Its my opinion, if you dont like it, too bad.

I dont like him, period.
I don't like him either. I wasn't being sarcastic, I was agreeing with you.

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03-15-2004, 05:09 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl.roberts
I don't like him either. I wasn't being sarcastic, I was agreeing with you.
Oh, Ok LOL!

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03-15-2004, 05:11 PM
  #10
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I'm not a big Dagenais fan but the guy can definetly score, is there anyway they can teach this guy to skate? If they can do some training with him in the offseason and improve his skating he could be very good, because he's big, has a good shot and he can put the puck in the net. But i'm serioulsy wondering is it possible for them to work with him and in improve his skating at this point in his carear? or is it gonna stay the same, because that would be the best thing for him.

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03-15-2004, 05:11 PM
  #11
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Its going to be fun finding out who will pick up his goal every 3 games....that should be interesting.

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03-15-2004, 05:12 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Starting to develope at, 26?

IMO Daganias stinks, badly, and deserves to be bashed. I dont like him, hope this is his last season with us.
Some guys don't come into their own right away, or they don't get the chance. Jersey had a strong team and play a defensive style that he doesn't fit into. But here, he has been reunited with the centre that brings out his talent. Why not use the guy? Hell, he's only played 44 games and you're casting him off already because he's not a power forward or whatever you expect him to be. He's got a role just like Begin. Should we dump Begin cause he won't score like Dagenais? No.

As for Bulis and Sundstrom deserving to be on the second line. I'm not sold on Bulis yet. He's fast, but he has no one on one moves AT ALL, and he's really not a great goal scorer. He's more of a good checker that can score the odd goal. And Sundstrom is a checker. His scoring 20 one year was a fluke.

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03-15-2004, 05:13 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonMacIsaac
Its going to be fun finding out who will pick up his goal every 3 games....that should be interesting.
Yea, especially since Kovalev isnt an upgrade over him :

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Old
03-15-2004, 05:15 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwang
Some guys don't come into their own right away, or they don't get the chance. Jersey had a strong team and play a defensive style that he doesn't fit into. But here, he has been reunited with the centre that brings out his talent. Why not use the guy? Hell, he's only played 44 games and you're casting him off already because he's not a power forward or whatever you expect him to be. He's got a role just like Begin. Should we dump Begin cause he won't score like Dagenais? No.

As for Bulis and Sundstrom deserving to be on the second line. I'm not sold on Bulis yet. He's fast, but he has no one on one moves AT ALL, and he's really not a great goal scorer. He's more of a good checker that can score the odd goal. And Sundstrom is a checker. His scoring 20 one year was a fluke.

When exactly did i say he should become a powerforward?

The Begin analogy you bring up is just silly. Im not even gona go on about this.

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03-15-2004, 05:17 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwang
Y'know, I read posts bashing Dagenais and it ticks me off. Some fans were crying that we need goal scorers, and when we get one (for nothing i might add), you all cry because "he can't do this and he can't do that". Well, let me tell you something, the guy has more goals than a lot of goal scorers on our team (ya, Koivu and Kovalev) with fewer games played and less ice time. I mean, come on, with some luck, this guy could score 20 this year in under 55 games! Doesn't that MEAN something to you people? The habs need to further develop this guys skills - (long reach, excellent shot, nose for the net, size) rather than bench him all the time. True, he seems to lack heart some nights, but I think we need to keep this guy. He seems to enjoy it here. I know he's slow, and he doesn't usually play physical, but he can score and he uses his size in front of the net and in the corners (Dave Andreychuk anyone?)

This guy probably won't get much faster or meaner, but he can learn to play with more heart. that comes from good leadership. Letting him go would be a HUGE mistake. He's just starting to develop.
True they need to further develop his skills, but this isn't the time to do it. If we're going to win in the playoffs, it's going to be from players staying within the system, backchecking hard and playing good defence. Dags sucks at all of these and although he may get better at them, the playoffs isn't the time for him to be making costly mistakes.

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Old
03-15-2004, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habber
True they need to further develop his skills, but this isn't the time to do it. If we're going to win in the playoffs, it's going to be from players staying within the system, backchecking hard and playing good defence. Dags sucks at all of these and although he may get better at them, the playoffs isn't the time for him to be making costly mistakes.
Theres not really any room for the guy anyways. It wont be long before higgins and perezhogan crack our line up. Maybe even hossa, if he can improve his attitude after Koivu beats the crap outa him.

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03-15-2004, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
When exactly did i say he should become a powerforward?

The Begin analogy you bring up is just silly. Im not even gona go on about this.
If you'll note I said "power forward or whatever you think he should be". The fact that you never said what you think he should be tells me that you just don't like the guy without reason.As for the Begin comparison, it was just an example. I'm trying to show that every person has a role to play on the team, and for us to expect them to be something else is ridiculous.

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03-15-2004, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonMacIsaac
Its going to be fun finding out who will pick up his goal every 3 games....that should be interesting.
Um, that's a better ratio than most of the guys on our team, ain't it?

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03-15-2004, 05:28 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Theres not really any room for the guy anyways. It wont be long before higgins and perezhogan crack our line up. Maybe even hossa, if he can improve his attitude after Koivu beats the crap outa him.
I think he's at least earned a shot at making the team next year, you gotta give him that. You can't totally dismiss 15 goals in 44 games.

I know he's terrible defensively, can't skate, can't hit, etc but he does have a goalscorer's touch, something that can't be taught and is a rare talent. If he puts his nose to the grindstone over the summer and really works on his game, he could do some damage next year.

As for this year though, he should be watching the playoffs from the pressbox.

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03-15-2004, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwang
If you'll note I said "power forward or whatever you think he should be". The fact that you never said what you think he should be tells me that you just don't like the guy without reason.As for the Begin comparison, it was just an example. I'm trying to show that every person has a role to play on the team, and for us to expect them to be something else is ridiculous.
Ok ill tell you why i dont like Daganais.

1. He cant skate
2. He cant hit
3. He cant pass
4. He cant back check very well(due to skating)
5. He cant fight
6. The man has no hockey sense(just shoots all over the place)
7. He has no heart
8. He floats 90% of the time, and never really gets involved.
9. Hes not a team guy(Ignored dowd when he arrived on team)

All he CAN do is shoot, thats it.

For me that more than enough reasons to not like him as a hockey player.

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03-15-2004, 05:34 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Ok ill tell you why i dont like Daganais.

1. He cant skate
2. He cant hit
3. He cant pass
4. He can back check very well(due to skating)
5. He cant fight
6. The man has no hockey sense(just shoots all over the place)
7. He has no heart
8. He floats 90% of the time, and never really gets involved.

All he CAN do is shoot, thats it.

For me that more than enough reasons to not like his as a hockey player.
All good reasons (except for can't fight). However, my point is IF he can further develop his skills and maybe play with more passion, this guy will be an asset. Keep in mind, he hasn't been in the NHL that long. Heart can deveop with the right motivation. God, I remember a similar shhoter who used to kill us in Buffalo named Andreychuk.

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03-15-2004, 05:37 PM
  #22
Mooch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwang
All good reasons (except for can't fight). However, my point is IF he can further develop his skills and maybe play with more passion, this guy will be an asset. Keep in mind, he hasn't been in the NHL that long. Heart can deveop with the right motivation. God, I remember a similar shhoter who used to kill us in Buffalo named Andreychuk.
Ya, but the dif between Andreychuck and Dags, one has heart, desire and drive. Thats why he succeeded.

I may be wrong about Dags, but from what i see so far, this guys is nothing more than an nhl filler.

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03-15-2004, 06:34 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by Mooch
Ya, but the dif between Andreychuck and Dags, one has heart, desire and drive. Thats why he succeeded.

I may be wrong about Dags, but from what i see so far, this guys is nothing more than an nhl filler.
I hope not. We need guys who can score.

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03-15-2004, 07:10 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas
Yea, especially since Kovalev isnt an upgrade over him :
You think he is going to stay? I am willing to bet he goes right back to NY.

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03-15-2004, 07:52 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl.roberts
Oh yeah, he definitely deserves to be bashed. Kudos to him, he's scored some goals for the CH, but he blows. Not only does he deserve to be bashed by fans, but by hammers, pucks, rakes, staplers and other stuff like that. He is bad, bad, bad.


Amen.

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