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Why don't you take a look above your own post for reasons on why Lube has been far and away our best Dman this season and easily in the top 20.
Holy Christ, get a grip. You are on crack if you think Vis is a Top-20 defenseman in the NHL.
Here's a list of the 30 I would take before him.
Mike Green
Brian Rafalski
Mark Streit
Nicklas Lidstrom
Dan Boyle
Shea Weber
Scott Niedermayer
Sheldon Souray
Dennis Wideman
Niklas Kronwall
Chris Pronger
Brian Campbell
Zdeno Chara
Dion Phaneuf
Ryan Suter
Rob Blake
Duncan Keith
Pavel Kubina
Cameron Barker
Kimmo Timonen
Jay Bouwmeester
Marc-Edouard Vlasic
Tomas Kaberle
Keith Ballard
Tobias Enstrom
Braydon Coburn
Brent Burns
Brent Seabrook
Sergei Gonchar
Robyn Regehr
Just to make you happy, I excluded upcoming rookies and Canucks defenseman.
There's my condensed list for you - do you want me to go on?
Gratton for a 2nd and Matthias for Bertuzzi were good.. not a fan of the other deals though.
How are you not a "fan" of Caber AND a pick for Van Ryn? Must believe the false negativity that surrounded him. He's been a huge veteran presence for the Panthers and has been very important according to all reports.
Salei was a penalty machine and isn't nearly as good as Skrastins has been. The guy is good with the puck and blocks EVERYTHING! He's been a very solid defenseman while here.
Olli had to go, both parties needed a change in scenary. Ballard's also been a huge presence in the locker room while giving a solid defensive presence as well as doing very well offensively. Boynton's been pretty solid while here, save for a few lapses, and he sticks up for his teammates. Olli mailed it in last year while trying to get JM fired.
again, the team needed a solid netminder.
__________________ Gudbranson fanboy and defender for liiiiiife!
Holy Christ, get a grip. You are on crack if you think Vis is a Top-20 defenseman in the NHL.
Here's a list of the 30 I would take before him.
Mike Green
Brian Rafalski
Mark Streit
Nicklas Lidstrom
Dan Boyle
Shea Weber
Scott Niedermayer
Sheldon Souray
Dennis Wideman
Niklas Kronwall
Chris Pronger
Brian Campbell
Zdeno Chara
Dion Phaneuf
Ryan Suter
Rob Blake
Duncan Keith
Pavel Kubina
Cameron Barker
Kimmo Timonen
Jay Bouwmeester
Marc-Edouard Vlasic
Tomas Kaberle
Keith Ballard
Tobias Enstrom
Braydon Coburn
Brent Burns
Brent Seabrook
Sergei Gonchar
Robyn Regehr
Just to make you happy, I excluded upcoming rookies and Canucks defenseman.
There's my condensed list for you - do you want me to go on?
As a Oilers fan, I'm going to say that he is under rated. When he plays for another team, you don't notice things he does but when he plays for your team and watch him play, you start to notice it. He has great speed to break up a odd man rush/breakaway without taking a penatly. I didn't know he did that in LA but when I asked some Kings fan, he was great at this when he was in LA as well. What also surprised me is at one point, he was leading the team in block shots. I'm not saying he is a top 20 defensemen but he is still a hell of a player. I find it funny, when he got hurt, the team started to show signs of going down the gutter. On your list, you had Souray. I would much rather keep Visnovsky over Souray.
O/T, do you think Willie Mitchell gets noticed alot by non Vancouver fans? I say no because they don't notice the little things he does. I live in Vancouver and watch the odd Nucks game and I think he is a great defensemen. If your wondering why I borught up Mitchell, I'm just trying to say Visnovsky is not as bad as what some fans think. You just have to watch him play.
Last edited by punk_o_holic: 03-30-2009 at 09:22 PM.
Then Florida resigns Andersen for cheaper than Vokoun. I honestly don't think the rights to Bouweemester are worth all that much. He's going to sign where he wants, and is going to field offers on July 1st.
How are you not a "fan" of Caber AND a pick for Van Ryn? Must believe the false negativity that surrounded him. He's been a huge veteran presence for the Panthers and has been very important according to all reports.
Salei was a penalty machine and isn't nearly as good as has been. The guy is good with the puck and blocks EVERYTHING! He's been a very solid defenseman while here.
Olli had to go, both parties needed a change in scenary. Ballard's also been a huge presence in the locker room while giving a solid defensive presence as well as doing very well offensively. Boynton's been pretty solid while here, save for a few lapses, and he sticks up for his teammates. Olli mailed it in last year while trying to get JM fired.
again, the team needed a solid netminder.
Olli needing to move on is irrelevant - the return on him was horrible.
Caber has bounced back well but it's not like he's outperforming his contract.
Didn't the pick from the Vokoun trade end up being Colin Wilson? He might have addressed a need but it's not like the organization didn't pay a hefty price for it.
The last thing that the Oilers should worry about is getting another high priced offensive dman. We need a scorer and probably a pk/faceoff specialist before defensemen.
On your list, you had Souray. I would much rather keep Visnovsky over Souray.
I didn't want to discount Edmonton's defense - that's why I had Souray in there. But.. you'd actually prefer Visnovsky to Souray? That's something I've never heard before. (I thought Souray was the consensus favourite on the blueline)
Last edited by Saren: 03-30-2009 at 09:31 PM.
Reason: FML.
perhaps, we'll see. Again, wouldn't cause Florida to lose him.
No, it wouldn't cause Florida to lose him but some we're suggesting that Florida couldn't afford Horcoff and Visnovsky yet Bouwmeester and Booth would cost the same or more.
Just making sure people are aware that Booth will be making real money next season.
I didn't want to discount Edmonton's defense - that's why I had Souray in there. But.. you'd actually prefer Souray to Visnovsky? That's something I've never heard before. (I thought Souray was the consensus favourite on the blueline)
Like I said, Visnovsky does little things that you don't notice until you see him play. Yes I personally would take him over Souray. I'm probably in the minority though and most likely Souray is the bigger favourite player between the two in Edmonton still.
I think there are stuff that Souray brings to the table that favours him more then Visnovsky but at the same time, I think Visnovsky does stuff that Souray doesn't do.
I didn't want to discount Edmonton's defense - that's why I had Souray in there. But.. you'd actually prefer Souray to Visnovsky? That's something I've never heard before. (I thought Souray was the consensus favourite on the blueline)
Olli needing to move on is irrelevant - the return on him was horrible.
Caber has bounced back well but it's not like he's outperforming his contract.
Didn't the pick from the Vokoun trade end up being Colin Wilson? He might have addressed a need but it's not like the organization didn't pay a hefty price for it.
No, it wasn't. Many teams weren't willing to give much more for one, and for two...that's a matter of your opinion. Ballard's been huge for this team and is a leader. He also sets the pace for the team.
I didn't know he had to outperform his contract? Bounced back...from what? The Toronto media? One more time, that trade was Caber AND a 4th for Van Ryn. give me a break.
For a top 10 goalie that shored up the position after losing Louie. Not that hefty, imo. Again, matter of opinion.
No, it wouldn't cause Florida to lose him but some we're suggesting that Florida couldn't afford Horcoff and Visnovsky yet Bouwmeester and Booth would cost the same or more.
Just making sure people are aware that Booth will be making real money next season.
He could be making "real money" next season. Everyone thought Nate and Weiss would also sign for more. Bouw, Boynton, and one of Pelts or Dvorak frees almost 9 mil.
Glad that someone agree's. I wouldn't say he us much better then Souray as both brings different things to the table. But yes, I would choose Visnovsky over Souray.
-Souray has the big shot that gets him points but Visnovsky himself has a decent shot and can get points as well.
-Visnovsky has the speed to break up odd man rushes but Souray doesn't
-Souray has the leadership skills, not sure if Visnovsky does or not.
-Souray is physical but Visnovsky isn't even though he got hurt throwing a hit.
-Visnovsky had more blocked shots then Souray I think before he got hurt.
As both being Oilers fan, I'm glad we have both of them on our team. Sorry to hi jack the thread
I just assumed it was common knowledge Horcoff was basically imovable due to his contract. $6mil a year signed long term for a 60 point forward isn't something another g.m. will be willing to go anywhere near. Horcoff isn't leaving Edmonton anytime soon.
I just assumed it was common knowledge Horcoff was basically imovable due to his contract. $6mil a year signed long term for a 60 point forward isn't something another g.m. will be willing to go anywhere near. Horcoff isn't leaving Edmonton anytime soon.
It's 5.5.
Not a huge difference but it's quite ironic that someone who talks about common sense doesn't have enough common sense to figure out the correct numbers of Horcoff's contract.
The thought just came to me. Horcoff has a NMC and it changes as year goes by. We essentially can't trade him till his 2nd last year or his final year of his contract. I guess the Oilers could trade him in the Summer before his contract extention hits.
I think if you sent them Souray and your 1st, you could get Jay Bouwmeester no doubt. Booth is a stretch, sorry to say.
You think? That was one of the stupidest things I've ever read on HF. I think you should start watching and paying attention to this thing called "hockey", and then maybe you could actually contribute to this board.
Holy Christ, get a grip. You are on crack if you think Vis is a Top-20 defenseman in the NHL.
Here's a list of the 30 I would take before him.
Marc-Edouard Vlasic
Mark Streit
Niklas Kronwall
Dion Phaneuf
Ryan Suter
Duncan Keith
Pavel Kubina
Tobias Enstrom
Braydon Coburn
Brent Seabrook
Just to make you happy, I excluded upcoming rookies and Canucks defenseman.
There's my condensed list for you - do you want me to go on?
NONE of these guys are better then Lube RIGHT NOW. In the future, fine, right now? No. You obviously massively underrate Lube and it's really you that needs to get a grip if you think guys like Enstrom and Coburn are better then him RIGHT NOW. I left off a couple I thought we're debatable too, decided to throw them in the "better then" pile. Go to the Oilers board, where WE see triple of what you see of Lube and see how highly he is regarded. Much higher then Souray. So really, try watching some hockey and getting the whole story before you come into the thread making this wild freaking statements.
give me a break. 
