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Problems with the Kostitsyns?

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:29 PM
  #26
Capitano
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
It took the Sedin twins 4years before really becoming dominant.
We can't even wait 2years before some fans require the Kost Broz be traded.

The Kost broz are probably the 2 most talented forward prospects we have. We have to be patient with them.

Typical sophomore jinx is what is happening to them. They'll learn and bounce back.
Ya, I know, but I guess I was kind of hoping for less headaches along the way...ugh.

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03-31-2009, 02:30 PM
  #27
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Please, don't you EVER compare Zetterberg to S.Kost again...
Please tell me you realize I was being very, very sarcastic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
Because how dare we question the drafting of Trevor Timmins. Questioning and discussing draft picks is what hockey fans do. I still have trouble swallowing the passing on Richards and especially Getzlaf when we've been hearing for 15 years in this city that we're missing a big skilled tough centerman. But, around here thinking that way is not allowed for some reason.
Yes it's too bad but this is what drafting is. Sorry to tell people, it's not going to be a home run every time. We have Andrei Kostitsyn. For better or for worse. We may not have Mike Richards but we don't have Hugh Jessiman either. So what's the point in whining about it or playing "oh we should've picked so-and-so"? I think even Timmins himself will tell you he should've picked Richards or Getzlaf, but he didn't, and that's life.

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03-31-2009, 02:32 PM
  #28
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I dont think anyone is questioning the skills the Kost's have. Its more that their mind isn't in the game. AKost is probably one of the most talented on the team next to Kovy, I really like the guy but I think there is something going on behind the scenes.

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03-31-2009, 02:36 PM
  #29
Melvin Udall
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
How much longer (AK 46)? Some of those players drafted in 2003 are already major stars on their teams,it's time Andrei wake's up!

What you see is what you get!

For whatever reasons Anfre Savard thought AK46 was a great prospect - at #10 overall in a strong draft year (2003).

Reallity Check: Habs missed on taking Jeff Carter, Zack Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Mike Richards, Corey Perry and Dan Boyle! Hell, Habs took the now infamous Cory Urquhart over Shea Weber in 2nd round of the 2003 draft.

AND - Looking at what the Habs passed up in other drafts prior to and since 2003 - is it any wonder this team is battling for 8th place in the east? Not enough impact players!

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03-31-2009, 02:37 PM
  #30
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Isnt all this Kovalev's fault. I mean he their Mentor and they look up to him.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:40 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Capitano View Post
Ya, I know, but I guess I was kind of hoping for less headaches along the way...ugh.
I think we all were, but nothing we can do about it other than stay patient.

Patience is a virtue!

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:41 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Jigger77 View Post
Because how dare we question the drafting of Trevor Timmins. Questioning and discussing draft picks is what hockey fans do. I still have trouble swallowing the passing on Richards and especially Getzlaf when we've been hearing for 15 years in this city that we're missing a big skilled tough centerman. But, around here thinking that way is not allowed for some reason.
And I'm sick of hearing fans whine about picks we could have made as if it was as simple as picking a shirt for work.

Are you going to whine about it if A.Kost nets 35G/70ish Pts next year?..

Sure, maybe A.Kost is taking longer to develop than other prospects on other teams, but who cares? You can't get them all right and at least we still have hope that A.Kost can become a dominant player. It's only his true 2nd season here, people are saying he's been horrible, yet still has 23G.
So, if he's playing great he'll get what?..30ish-40ish Goals??..I'm willing to be patient enough with him. His development is taking longer than others, but he's no flop. Not yet.

Would I have preferred Getzlaf or Richards, today I can say sure. At the time of the draft?..I have no idea. Easy to come back 4years after the draft and point out the mistakes that were done.

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03-31-2009, 02:43 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
And I'm sick of hearing fans whine about picks we could have made as if it was as simple as picking a shirt for work.

Would I have preferred Getzlaf or Richards, today I can say sure. At the time of the draft?..I have no idea. Easy to come back 4years after the draft and point out the mistakes that were done.
I can understand SOME of the questioning. There is some really good insight here from more than a few people on junior/undrafted players and I'm sure there were more than a few guys who were yelling for Getzlaf, etc.

So I can understand if they're upset because they have a different opinion. I on the other hand don't know much about junior hockey so I normally put my faith in Timmins and trust his opinion - as I mentioned in another thread though, his Minnesota picks and his first round picks bug a me a little because sometimes they seem to be off the board (Fischer, AKost come to mind for me).

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:48 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ND Irish View Post
What you see is what you get!

For whatever reasons Anfre Savard thought AK46 was a great prospect - at #10 overall in a strong draft year (2003).

Reallity Check: Habs missed on taking Jeff Carter, Zack Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Mike Richards, Corey Perry and Dan Boyle! Hell, Habs took the now infamous Cory Urquhart over Shea Weber in 2nd round of the 2003 draft.

AND - Looking at what the Habs passed up in other drafts prior to and since 2003 - is it any wonder this team is battling for 8th place in the east? Not enough impact players!
I remember reading that Andre wanted to draft Jeff Carter and Gainey went with Timmins and they picked Kostitsyn,may be wrong but I'm pretty sure about this

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03-31-2009, 02:49 PM
  #35
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Seriously, I'd be happy to see that when people are QUESTIONING things here, there aren't automatically called WHINERS.

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03-31-2009, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
I remember reading that Andre wanted to draft Jeff Carter and Gainey went with Timmins and they picked Kostitsyn,may be wrong but I'm pretty sure about this
You are right. Savard wanted Carter, but Gainey gave control to Timmins, so AK46 were Trevor's choice.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:50 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Viau View Post
You are right. Savard wanted Carter, but Gainey gave control to Timmins, so AK46 were Trevor's choice.
I'm quite sure Gainey himself said he was only an observator at the time.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:51 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Capitano View Post
I can understand SOME of the questioning. There is some really good insight here from more than a few people on junior/undrafted players and I'm sure there were more than a few guys who were yelling for Getzlaf, etc.

So I can understand if they're upset because they have a different opinion. I on the other hand don't know much about junior hockey so I normally put my faith in Timmins and trust his opinion - as I mentioned in another thread though, his Minnesota picks and his first round picks bug a me a little because sometimes they seem to be off the board (Fischer, AKost come to mind for me).
Hindsight is perfect. Carey Price was off the board and the media absolutely hammered them for the pick. Face it, drafting is a crap shoot, sometimes you're the bug and sometimes you're the windshield.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:51 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Viau View Post
Seriously, I'd be happy to see that when people are QUESTIONING things here, there aren't automatically called WHINERS.
All of our posts are somewhat opinion based so don't sweat it

I think the fact that some people question picks show that they feel they could have done better. Perhaps this is true in some cases.

I don't think it's wrong to question anybody if you think they could be wrong.

People that talk about Brodeur and stuff like that, now that's a bit of a stretch imo because it's been awhile since he was drafted, but Timmins passing on highly touted impact players shouldn't be disregarded entirely imo.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:51 PM
  #40
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I think the only reason people are disappointed is because it wasn't their big breakout season everyone hoped for. It's been a tough year for both of them with Andrei's concussion and the medias going ape**** at them. That's no excuse, one would say, but they're not that different from last year at all. I really hope they'll find chemistry with their center and play as a line, but I don't think Plekanec is the center they need. Too small, too soft and playing like crap lately as well. They played very well with Lang, so I hope they won't be traded for a big center because they're the ones who would benefit from playing with one the most.

Last year
This year

Andrei
78 GP, 26G, 27A, 53P
69 GP, 23G, 17A, 40P

Sergei
52 GP, 9G, 18A, 27P
55 GP, 8G, 15A, 23P

And Andrei would have a so much better season had Carbonneau realized HE DIDN'T FIT WITH KOVALEV.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:52 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
BULL
Mokay.

Proof?

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:53 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Garo View Post
I'm quite sure Gainey himself said he was only an observator at the time.
BULL

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:54 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ND Irish View Post
What you see is what you get!

For whatever reasons Anfre Savard thought AK46 was a great prospect - at #10 overall in a strong draft year (2003).

Reallity Check: Habs missed on taking Jeff Carter, Zack Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, Mike Richards, Corey Perry and Dan Boyle! Hell, Habs took the now infamous Cory Urquhart over Shea Weber in 2nd round of the 2003 draft.

AND - Looking at what the Habs passed up in other drafts prior to and since 2003 - is it any wonder this team is battling for 8th place in the east? Not enough impact players!
Kostitsyn would probably have been in the 5-7 range if he didn't have Epilepsy. He was rated that high. Don't question the pick, Kostitsyn was one of the most talented players at the 2003 draft.

The fact that players picked after AK are currently performing better than him has nothing to do with Timmins's ability. The draft is a CRAP SHOOT. It's a gamble. What you see is not always what you get. AK is far from a bad player, scored 27 goals in his rookie year and is over 20 this year. He's not Carter or Getzlaf, but he's nowhere near a flop. Sure he's having an off year, but for christ's sake, the whole team except for about 4 players is as well.

So keep blaming Timmins for our flaws all you want if it eases your mind. The guy has been great in his tenure as Head Scout and while not having picked that perennial superstar most of you want, he picked more NHL players per draft than most. And give it some time, that Carey Price guy might become that impact player. He's having an off year as well, but don't bash Timmins while not looking at his good moves.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:54 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
And I'm sick of hearing fans whine about picks we could have made as if it was as simple as picking a shirt for work.

Are you going to whine about it if A.Kost nets 35G/70ish Pts next year?..

Sure, maybe A.Kost is taking longer to develop than other prospects on other teams, but who cares? You can't get them all right and at least we still have hope that A.Kost can become a dominant player. It's only his true 2nd season here, people are saying he's been horrible, yet still has 23G.
So, if he's playing great he'll get what?..30ish-40ish Goals??..I'm willing to be patient enough with him. His development is taking longer than others, but he's no flop. Not yet.

Would I have preferred Getzlaf or Richards, today I can say sure. At the time of the draft?..I have no idea. Easy to come back 4years after the draft and point out the mistakes that were done.

Heck, I'd stop whining if I saw him get involved after a whistle, talk to someone on the bench, stay on the ice longer after practice, show a sign of interest at all.

And it's always next year with AKost. Christ, he'll be 30 and people are still going to say he's just about to explode. And yes it's easy to point out the drafting mistakes. I'm doing it now. So what?

Having said that I'm really happy about drafting Latendresse and Pacioretty and I'm pretty stoked about McDonaugh and Subban. It's not like I think he's horrible or anything. I just think that in 2003 he royally missed the boat.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:56 PM
  #45
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I find it amazing how the general opinion last year at the same time we were praising the brothers K and now, it's the "what have you done for me lately attitude". Sure they having a bad season, so is the 85% of the team and management. So i guess we should trade every young player that we have after the first 3 years because they have a bad season. Patches came up played alright but had his problems filling the net, so we should get rid of him because he is just not going to make it in this league. I remember 3-4 years back here, everyone was destroyonh Habs management because they would never give any chances to the young players. Now the team has changed directions and is giving our youth the possibility to stand up and show us what they have. Now that they have turned this leaf, and are going with the young guys you have to give them the chance to grow and become who management thinks they can be. So keep the brothers and let's see what thye bring us next year.
Oh yeah when i was listening to BG yesterday on RDS he was talking about Pleks, and he kept repeating that Pleks has to stop complaining and get it done. The way i understood what BG was saying is that he tries to do it all by himseldf and and is selfish with the puck, so i can see why this creates tension with any winger he plays with.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:56 PM
  #46
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Mokay.

Proof?
There is no proof but what do you want to say,oh I ****ed up?Savard left cause he knew he didn't have a chance with Gainey here.Also if you think about it,if Savard is the GM at the time and Timmins is just a scout,I'm sure if Savard wanted Carter and the decision was his he wasn't going to listen to Timmins don't you think?

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:58 PM
  #47
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And sometimes you're the Detroit Red Wings. If it's a crapshoot everyone in that organization should be buying out the lottery tickets for the state of Michigan.
Funny then that they haven't won the cup more.

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Old
03-31-2009, 02:58 PM
  #48
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Hindsight is perfect. Carey Price was off the board and the media absolutely hammered them for the pick. Face it, drafting is a crap shoot, sometimes you're the bug and sometimes you're the windshield.
And sometimes you're the Detroit Red Wings. If it's a crapshoot everyone in that organization should be buying out the lottery tickets for the state of Michigan.

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03-31-2009, 02:58 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
I remember reading that Andre wanted to draft Jeff Carter and Gainey went with Timmins and they picked Kostitsyn,may be wrong but I'm pretty sure about this
Nope it was Zach Parise

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Old
03-31-2009, 03:00 PM
  #50
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Nope it was Zach Parise
It wasn't Parise I'm pretty sure it was Carter

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