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Jonas Hiller VS Pekka Rinne

View Poll Results: Jonas Hiller VS Pekka Rinne
Jonas Hiller 24 18.90%
Pekka Rinne 103 81.10%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-01-2009, 06:08 PM
  #26
Sean Garrity
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
When Hiller first entered the league, he played in a few excellent goaltending duels with one of Jonathan Quick or Erik Ersberg against the Kings.

But he's not a reliable #1 like I would classify Rinne.

Hiller has only looked better because of how poorly Giguere has played IMO
Fair enough, but just because Giggy has played poorly doesn't mean that Hiller's stats get better lol. Those are two unrelated events and obviously don't affect Hiller's stats.

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04-01-2009, 06:08 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
When Hiller first entered the league, he played in a few excellent goaltending duels with one of Jonathan Quick or Erik Ersberg against the Kings.

But he's not a reliable #1 like I would classify Rinne.

Hiller has only looked better because of how poorly Giguere has played IMO
I dont understand this logic...what has Rinne done to make him more of a legitimate #1 goalie? He's put up similar numbers in less games....what exactly does that prove?

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Old
04-01-2009, 06:12 PM
  #28
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Got to go with Rinne on this one.

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04-01-2009, 06:16 PM
  #29
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Old
04-01-2009, 07:05 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richardn View Post
I think your grabbing at straws here. If you do the math they both make 2.25 saves per minute played. Your also suggesting that Rinne gives up a lot of rebounds having to make 2nd and 3rd saves. Also Rinne hasn't started all 47 games either he has started 43.

Also if you look you will find Hiller has more career games and if you compare their career stats Hiller's are better then Rinne's and Hiller has 12 more games played in his career. By no means am I saying Hiller is better but I am saying that it is really close. Hiller has slipped under the radar and Rinne has been put in the spot light.
No goaltender is perfect in controlling or directing rebounds, especially at close proximity. I don't think I'm grasping at straws; stats are one thing, but I think you have to watch games to be able to assess talent. I actually have both Rinne and Hiller in my pool so I've watched a good amount of both and you are right, it's closer than most people think going by how one sided the poll is.

I just think Rinne has had to lead a lesser team, and Hiller is a little awkward when his positioning fails him. If he commits to going down to the butterfly, he has trouble with high shots.

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Old
04-01-2009, 07:39 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourdon View Post
If he commits to going down to the butterfly, he has trouble with high shots.
Which goalie does not...?

It's like saying when you save money and don't buy a lottery ticket, you have a lesser chance of winning the jackpot. It's true, but it's also pure logic. When you go down, you can get beat high more easily, but you cover the lower part far better. I'd even say that this problem applies to other goalies a lot more than to Hiller as his reflexes, especially glove hand, are lightning quick.

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Old
04-01-2009, 07:43 PM
  #32
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Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey, Pekka Rinne.

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Old
04-01-2009, 08:50 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCH View Post
Stats? Rinne's record and shutouts definitely trump the very extremely trivial difference in GAA and sv%. The difference is so small and unnoteworthy that it could take just 1 game to sway in Rinne's favor.
So? All I said was that considering the similar statistics, how can one say it's not even close. You conveniently didn't answer that, either. I'm not saying Hiller's better(I voted for him just to be a homer, tho), but to say it isn't close at all just isn't right. Hiller's been the guy down the stretch for us, and he's doing a bang up job. Rinne might be better, but it is indeed close.

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04-01-2009, 09:51 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karacter View Post
Fair enough, but just because Giggy has played poorly doesn't mean that Hiller's stats get better lol. Those are two unrelated events and obviously don't affect Hiller's stats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Static View Post
I dont understand this logic...what has Rinne done to make him more of a legitimate #1 goalie? He's put up similar numbers in less games....what exactly does that prove?
You are making the incorrect assumption that stats have any meaning for goalies... if you want to judge them, you should watch them play.

It's hard to describe, but Rinne seems to have another gear that Hiller just doens't have. He may have the best glove hand in the NHL

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Old
04-01-2009, 10:16 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
You are making the incorrect assumption that stats have any meaning for goalies... if you want to judge them, you should watch them play.

It's hard to describe, but Rinne seems to have another gear that Hiller just doens't have. He may have the best glove hand in the NHL
You're saying we should ignore player stats in lieu of some indescribable feeling you have? And that that takes priority over cold hard numbers? Are you serious? Rinne has a great glove hand but so does Hiller. I voted Rinne because of what he's done with his current team but please convince me why "it's not even close".

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04-01-2009, 10:18 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byungshin34 View Post
You're saying we should ignore player stats in lieu of some indescribable feeling you have? And that that takes priority over cold hard numbers? Are you serious? Rinne has a great glove hand but so does Hiller. I voted Rinne because of what he's done with his current team but please convince me why "it's not even close".
Because watching players >>> stats, and that's indisputable

Sorry.

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Old
04-01-2009, 11:48 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
Because watching players >>> stats, and that's indisputable

Sorry.
depends. people are biased, stats aren't. some people prefer one style, but it's hard to argue with results. its one thing to say that due to a small sample size the stats don't show each goalie's relative value accurately enough and after more games the stats will bare that out. and it's another to try and say that out of two goalies who succeed in stopping shots at the same rate(without mentioning that you don't believe they will continue to post the same stats), that one is clearly better.

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Old
04-02-2009, 11:18 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vipers31 View Post
Which goalie does not...?

It's like saying when you save money and don't buy a lottery ticket, you have a lesser chance of winning the jackpot. It's true, but it's also pure logic. When you go down, you can get beat high more easily, but you cover the lower part far better. I'd even say that this problem applies to other goalies a lot more than to Hiller as his reflexes, especially glove hand, are lightning quick.
I don't know if you've seen him play, but he is really awkward when he goes down. He tends to cover the bottom of the net really well, but he seems to almost bow over, which exposes the top of the net. He's a right handed glove hand, so if shooters aren't used to facing him, it isn't exposed as often.

I wouldn't say that this problem applies to other goaltenders more so than Hiller, because all goaltenders have a tougher time making high saves after committing to going down. But it's not like Hiller's reflexes are that much better than the average NHL goaltender.

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Old
04-02-2009, 12:13 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourdon View Post
I don't know if you've seen him play, but he is really awkward when he goes down. He tends to cover the bottom of the net really well, but he seems to almost bow over, which exposes the top of the net. He's a right handed glove hand, so if shooters aren't used to facing him, it isn't exposed as often.

I wouldn't say that this problem applies to other goaltenders more so than Hiller, because all goaltenders have a tougher time making high saves after committing to going down. But it's not like Hiller's reflexes are that much better than the average NHL goaltender.
Well, being a Ducks fan, I actually have seen him play a whole lot. He does go down a lot, but moves incredibly well even after being down on his pads. And for the record, I would indeed say that his reflexes, especially glove side, are above average, even on NHL level.

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04-02-2009, 12:37 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
Because watching players >>> stats, and that's indisputable

Sorry.
Then I am assuming you have watched every one of both goalie's games, because going with 'a feeling' on anything less would be really, really dumb.

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04-02-2009, 12:52 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Static View Post
Then I am assuming you have watched every one of both goalie's games, because going with 'a feeling' on anything less would be really, really dumb.
I have.

Rinne has carried his team in games, while Hiller has not. Hiller has also had the benefit of playing against some weaker opponents. On top of that, Hiller's rebound control is questionable to bad. He puts himself in some very tough spots, and forces himself to make extra saves, by putting rebounds into bad locations. Rinne is much better about his rebounds.

Even as an Anaheim fan, I'd take Rinne over Hiller.

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Old
04-02-2009, 01:53 PM
  #42
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Pekka is on fire!

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04-02-2009, 06:04 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bourdon View Post
I don't know if you've seen him play, but he is really awkward when he goes down. He tends to cover the bottom of the net really well, but he seems to almost bow over, which exposes the top of the net. He's a right handed glove hand, so if shooters aren't used to facing him, it isn't exposed as often.

I wouldn't say that this problem applies to other goaltenders more so than Hiller, because all goaltenders have a tougher time making high saves after committing to going down. But it's not like Hiller's reflexes are that much better than the average NHL goaltender.
his glove hand really is basically as good as any other goalie though. and he's quick side to side. he doesn't cover the top as well as other goalies his size, but he still covers it well. he's still getting better too. we got like the best goal tending coach in the league.

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04-02-2009, 07:09 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Static View Post
Then I am assuming you have watched every one of both goalie's games, because going with 'a feeling' on anything less would be really, really dumb.
Sorry, your done, the poster below you owned you, bye!

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04-02-2009, 07:14 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
Sorry, your done, the poster below you owned you, bye!
i can't stand these type of posts

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04-02-2009, 07:15 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
Sorry, your done, the poster below you owned you, bye!
All he said was that Rinne is better than Hiller. Nobody is arguing against that. We're trying to understand how there is a huge gap as you said.

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Old
04-02-2009, 07:33 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byungshin34 View Post
All he said was that Rinne is better than Hiller. Nobody is arguing against that. We're trying to understand how there is a huge gap as you said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chone View Post
i can't stand these type of posts
You didnt' see where he called me dumb?

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Old
04-02-2009, 11:15 PM
  #48
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can you blame him?

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Old
04-03-2009, 12:22 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
You didnt' see where he called me dumb?
Calling him better is fine, but you have to have something valid to back it up. That said, I'll absolutely take Sojourn's word for it seeing as I havent seen many of Rinne's games.

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Old
04-03-2009, 08:44 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Doughty Number 8 View Post
You didnt' see where he called me dumb?
You've done nothing but prove him right in this thread, so...

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