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Milan Lucic

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Old
04-03-2009, 12:35 PM
  #51
Donkeyz
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I think Lucic defines what an ideal Bruins player should be; he'll probably named captain in the not so distant future.

Bruins fans' idol won't be traded, and it's pretty understandable.


Last edited by Donkeyz: 04-03-2009 at 12:43 PM.
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04-03-2009, 12:36 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Just as an aside, Neely was very highly regarded back then being a recent high draft pick. Vancouver screwed up by not being more patient with him. In addition Pederson was coming off some very serious health issues. He was never the same after that and his trade value had plummetted from what the Bruins could have gotten after his first couple of seasons. In addition, it cost more than Neely to get Pederson. I believe it was Neely and a 1st (Wesley).

Let's just say:

Neely at the time of the trade > Lucic
Weber >>>>> Pederson at the time of the trade

Acquiring a guy like Weber would cost significantly more than Lucic.
and aquiring a guy like lucic would cost significantly more than weber.

sometimes cost does not equal value.

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04-03-2009, 12:38 PM
  #53
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Lucic + Rask for Grabner, Schneider amd 2011's 1st rounder.





I blame Nonis for trading away the 2nd round pick that we would have used to pick up Lucic ourselves...

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04-03-2009, 12:53 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Hiphopopotamus View Post
I get that Neely had a poor season as a 20 year old but he had a much better season than lucic did as a 19 year old. Also, Neely really came into his own when he was traded to Boston. for whatever reason, Vancouver wasn't as good a fit for him.

I'm not trying to discredit lucic. As a Sens fan, it pains me to say that I actually like Boston (mostly because of my love for the city itself...It's like Ottawa but with stuff and the ex-Senators influence) and Lucic is a joy to watch. I just don't think he is going to be the best power forward in the game nor will he join the 50 in 50 club.
I'm not arguing that Lucic is better than Neely, that's a silly argument, basically because we won't and can't know that for a few more years. Given his stats to date though, and his work ethic, I think he could approach that level. No one approaches the 50 in 50 club these days, so it's tough to compare accross generations.

I do think, however, that he may one day be recognized as one of, if not the, premier power forward in the game. We're talking about a kid who has 40 points in 66 games as a 20 year old playing the majority of his time on the 3rd line, with no PP time at all. Just for comparison sake, Shane Doan never hit 40 points until he was 23years old.

Quote:
Also, I'm very jealous he is not a Sen and I wouldn't want to trade him unless there was a gross overpayment to be made but let's be realistic and say Boston would indeed trade him for much less than a Sidney Crosby or a #1 overall pick.
Of course they would. That's just a silly statement.

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04-03-2009, 01:19 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1025 View Post
Lucic + Rask for Grabner, Schneider amd 2011's 1st rounder.





I blame Nonis for trading away the 2nd round pick that we would have used to pick up Lucic ourselves...
Honestly, you couldn't get Lucic alone for that package.

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04-03-2009, 01:29 PM
  #56
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Lucic + Sturm

for

Cogliano + Smid + EDM 1st 2009 (currently 10th overall)

I dunno. About the best I could come up with. A deal would have to work around another team willing to take some of Boston's longer term salary off their hands to give them cap room to resign Kessel and Krejeci I would assume.

I don't think Boston would want to take on more salary.

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04-03-2009, 01:30 PM
  #57
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I really liked the Fisher comparison. He reminds me of a Scott Hartnell type player. Bruins fans will probably argue that he's better than both, but right now he only projects to be.

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Old
04-03-2009, 01:45 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunb View Post
Lucic is worth a top 5 overall draft pick or a young star like Shea Weber. I see him having a Clark Gilles or Trevor Linden-like career.

First and foremost, Lucic is the perfect lockerroom guy. A captain-material individual who is beloved by teammates and respected by the league. He stands up for his team and is feared by the opposition. One of the best fighters in the league, he is unique and adds a special dimension to Boston.

Secondly, he has great offensive potential. At only 20 years old, he can crack the top two lines or most teams. His 41 points in 67 games doesn't do him justice as his physicality creates tons of opportunities for his team. Like a powerforward, he adds a unique aspect for any line.

Lastly, Lucic's ceiling is enormous. Look at his torrid progression. Five years ago, he scored 23 points in 50 BCHL games. Cracked the WHL next year and scored only 19 points in 62 points. But Boston drafted him in the 2nd round anyways because they thought they could get an aggressive (but reliable) big-man who could grind it up on the 3rd and 4th lines. The next year, he exploded with a 68 point performance in 70 WHL games. As a 19 year old, he made the Bruins and scored 27 points in 77 games. This year (over 82 games), he is on pace for 20 goals and 50 points.

At Lucic's peak, he could be a 30 goal, 75 point two-way physical player. I'd be surprised if he isn't the captain of a NHL team one day. I foresee him having a Clark Gilles-like career.

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04-03-2009, 02:09 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Human Megaphone View Post
I really liked the Fisher comparison. He reminds me of a Scott Hartnell type player. Bruins fans will probably argue that he's better than both, but right now he only projects to be.
Lucic definitely has a lot more value than Mike Fisher and is having a better season as well. I'm actually looking forward to their first fight together though. They're both bulls.

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04-03-2009, 02:14 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Hiphopopotamus View Post
Lucic definitely has a lot more value than Mike Fisher and is having a better season as well. I'm actually looking forward to their first fight together though. They're both bulls.
That wasn't what I said though.

What I said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyke
I would say his value is Mike Fisher of about 4 years ago. Whether he develops into a prototypical first line center or tops out like Fisher did remains to be seen, but right now his value is high because of both his incredible spark plug type value and potential leadership.

Honestly, as a non-Bruins fan I'd be surprised to see him get moved. Players of his caliber/type don't come along that often, and it's unlikely that a package could be made that would interest the Bruins, who don't seem to have any immediate needs.

I tend to also think that because you're buying his potential as much as current stats - the cost for getting him would be pretty much overpayment for value *today*; the question of course is would the overpayment end up being worthwhile or not, and only time would tell that.

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04-03-2009, 02:20 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Human Megaphone View Post
I really liked the Fisher comparison. He reminds me of a Scott Hartnell type player. Bruins fans will probably argue that he's better than both, but right now he only projects to be.
At the same age (20) Fisher had 4 goals and 5 assists for 9 points in 32GP.

Lucic is playing Boston's top line, has 17G and 24A in 70GP. I think he has a lot of room to improve. Also, his physical game is unmatched by either Hartnell or Fisher, and that's arguably his best asset.

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04-03-2009, 02:23 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe View Post
Acquiring a guy like Weber would cost significantly more than Lucic.
Just wanted to comment, that is worded perfectly. He would indeed cost more then Lucic and every Boston fan should realize that.

However, Weber would likely be along the lines of what it would take for a Bruin fan to say, ok, do that deal.

Severe overpayment to the nth degree, else Chia better bullet proof his house.

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04-03-2009, 02:33 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
At the same age (20) Fisher had 4 goals and 5 assists for 9 points in 32GP.

Lucic is playing Boston's top line, has 17G and 24A in 70GP. I think he has a lot of room to improve. Also, his physical game is unmatched by either Hartnell or Fisher, and that's arguably his best asset.
I wouldn't go as far as saying it's unmatched by Fisher and Hartnell. Bruins fans are telling the rest of us a few different stories. In an earlier post, Lucic was a 3rd liner and now he's a first liner. What is it?

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04-03-2009, 02:33 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1025 View Post
Lucic + Rask for Grabner, Schneider amd 2011's 1st rounder.


I blame Nonis for trading away the 2nd round pick that we would have used to pick up Lucic ourselves...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Honestly, you couldn't get Lucic alone for that package.
Agreed. For Lucic we'd have to give up our '09 1st, Bernier (if they can take 2-2.5mil in salary in the offseason for a young powerforward), and Schnieder... That MIGHT do it.

Would I do it from Vancouver's perspective? Naw...

Bernier JUST turned 24 and still has untapped potential himself.. He scored 15 goals so far this season from the 3rd line with limited minutes and unskilled line mates (he barely produced on the Sedin line, he's played 3rd line most of the year). In a few years I could see him being a 20-25 goal guy with many intangibles like Lucic (physical play, finish every check, fight etc) assuming he's given the chance to gel with skilled line mates.

Schnieder, well, as a Vancouver fan I would say is a future NHL starter with the potential to be an all-star goalie.

Our first in a draft this deep is def worth something of value.

EDIT: By the way when I say that MIGHT do it I mean from a GM's perspective... We all know fans value their favs way higher than they should be.

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04-03-2009, 02:37 PM
  #65
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That wasn't what I said though.

What I said:
Fair enough, I hadn't read the actual comparison itself, just the poster saying they liked it.

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Old
04-03-2009, 02:42 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiphopopotamus View Post
I wouldn't go as far as saying it's unmatched by Fisher and Hartnell. Bruins fans are telling the rest of us a few different stories. In an earlier post, Lucic was a 3rd liner and now he's a first liner. What is it?
Ah see, I said he plays on Bostons top line. He does play it more often then not, although when there's injuries Julien juggles them as needed. I am not trying to lump him in with a guy like Kovalchuk by saying that, which is often the misconception.

Currently, since Kessel went down 2 games ago Lucic has played on a line with Krejci and Ryder. It's been Boston's best line during that time, although it is considered Boston's #2 or #3 line (solely because Savard isn't on it).

When Kessel comes back, he'll play with Kessel and Savard. Boston's default #1 line.

As for the physicality comment, really, Fisher and Hartnell don't compare. I don't mind saying it, I've seen a lot of all three.

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04-03-2009, 03:13 PM
  #67
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Alright, so the general consensus is it will take an overpayment. I don't think I would trade Bernier + 1st 2009 for him. Bernier still has untapped potential and both players can turn out to be quite similar. And that 1st rounder, regardless of being around 20-30 overall would still be quite valuable, such as Carter Ashton.

And yeah, I dont think Schneider makes sense to them. What about Rask?

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04-03-2009, 03:27 PM
  #68
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Alright, so the general consensus is it will take an overpayment. I don't think I would trade Bernier + 1st 2009 for him. Bernier still has untapped potential and both players can turn out to be quite similar. And that 1st rounder, regardless of being around 20-30 overall would still be quite valuable, such as Carter Ashton.

And yeah, I dont think Schneider makes sense to them. What about Rask?
Honestly, have you seen a lot of Lucic?

Their ceilings may be close offensively, but Lucic is so much more then offense. There's a reason he's coveted by Boston fans.

That's kind of like saying Blake Wheeler and Dustin Brown have the same ceiling. Wheeler is a big boy, and throws the weight around, has 30+ goal potential... but he's no Dustin Brown.

Thats not to take anything away from Bernier (or Wheels), but I know if I offered Wheeler and a1st to Kings fans for Brown they'd be more likely to kick me in the nutz then they would be to engage in civil conversation.


Last edited by Kaoz: 04-03-2009 at 03:34 PM.
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04-03-2009, 03:57 PM
  #69
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2nd rounder

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04-03-2009, 05:37 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Honestly, have you seen a lot of Lucic?

Their ceilings may be close offensively, but Lucic is so much more then offense. There's a reason he's coveted by Boston fans.

That's kind of like saying Blake Wheeler and Dustin Brown have the same ceiling. Wheeler is a big boy, and throws the weight around, has 30+ goal potential... but he's no Dustin Brown.

Thats not to take anything away from Bernier (or Wheels), but I know if I offered Wheeler and a1st to Kings fans for Brown they'd be more likely to kick me in the nutz then they would be to engage in civil conversation.
Have you seen Bernier?

Before I start here haha.. I just want to say that if I had the chance to get Lucic for Bernier and a 1st I'd take it and RUN.

Bernier is that same type of player is all I'm saying... You know, the type of player that even when they're not scoring they are still valuable on the ice for numerous reasons.

In my eyes Bernier is a mini-Lucic, even tho he's older haha... They have the same skill set, except Lucic is a level above Bernier in his development (as in, he is better in most categories) AND is 4 years younger. That makes you kind of think, where COULD Lucic be in 4 years if he keeps developing?

Fact of the matter is, Lucic could cap out... Or he could develop into an all-star, we'll just never know until it happens. And because it's uncertain, Boston will probably only take superstar compensation for him if they were to trade him.. If they don't get it, it's simply not worth it for them.

So the question is, are we determining VALUE or what would pry Lucic out of Boston? Current value? Bernier and a 1st isn't THAT far off... Will that pry him out of Boston? Hell no. Toss in Schnieder and it's atleast a conversation I'd assume haha..

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04-03-2009, 05:45 PM
  #71
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or since schneider is from boston, starred in college there, and is better then rask ?
or hey maybe its your 2 late 30's goalies....
dont get offended or nothing though
btw hamill is awful, bust
1) And the vast majority of Bostonians have no idea who Schneider is and don't care. The most popular Bruins right now are from Vancouver, Slovakia, Michigan and Quebec. Hal Gill was hated. Please don't think that you are going to get a young star for a player we don't need because that player once played at BC.

2)Whether Cory is better than Rask is completely pointless. Because if he is, the difference isn't enough to make us give you a 20 year old physical force who happens to score. Get it?

3) Your offer and reasoning is total junk and a bust. Don't get offended though.

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04-03-2009, 05:56 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1025 View Post
Lucic + Rask for Grabner, Schneider amd 2011's 1st rounder.





I blame Nonis for trading away the 2nd round pick that we would have used to pick up Lucic ourselves...
Ok let's put aside value here, because we will never ever see eye to eye. Let's just look at what makes sense given a team's roster, prospect depth, contention ranking etc.

Schneider-Rask is a totally lateral move. If you think Schneider is better (and his numbers this year in the A are better, but he's also a year older) fine, but the Bruins are happy with Rask as their prospect and don't feel any need to upgrade their top goalie prospect.

A 2011 1st rounder is nice, but an awfully long way away and doesn't help a team that thinks it can contend right now.

Grabner is older than Lucic and putting up similar points in the minors that Lucic is putting up this year in the NHL.

Again, the Bruins think they can contend right now and next year. What on earth would be a reason they would trade their most physical forward, who is 21 years old and can score AND plays a position which is a need... for a not as good, older player who plays a position which we don't need (Kessel, Ryder, Kobasew)?

Whether your offer is "fair" or not is debatable. What isn't debatable is the fact that the Bruins would be a worse team right now and they don't want to do that.

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04-03-2009, 05:58 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Lucic + Sturm

for

Cogliano + Smid + EDM 1st 2009 (currently 10th overall)

I dunno. About the best I could come up with. A deal would have to work around another team willing to take some of Boston's longer term salary off their hands to give them cap room to resign Kessel and Krejeci I would assume.

I don't think Boston would want to take on more salary.
So 2 of our LWs for a guy who would be our 4th center? I like Smid and the pick but deal makes no sense.

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04-03-2009, 08:27 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
So 2 of our LWs for a guy who would be our 4th center? I like Smid and the pick but deal makes no sense.
and LW is the Bruins worst position for depth. It's a major reason why Wheeler has played LW so often.

We have

Lucic- almost untouchable
Axelsson- UFA
Sturm- no one knows what to expect


For next season after the proposed deal if Axelsson walks we dont' have a single LW on the team.


Last edited by C77: 04-03-2009 at 08:32 PM.
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04-03-2009, 08:42 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luck 6 View Post
Have you seen Bernier?

Before I start here haha.. I just want to say that if I had the chance to get Lucic for Bernier and a 1st I'd take it and RUN.

Bernier is that same type of player is all I'm saying... You know, the type of player that even when they're not scoring they are still valuable on the ice for numerous reasons.

In my eyes Bernier is a mini-Lucic, even tho he's older haha... They have the same skill set, except Lucic is a level above Bernier in his development (as in, he is better in most categories) AND is 4 years younger. That makes you kind of think, where COULD Lucic be in 4 years if he keeps developing?

Fact of the matter is, Lucic could cap out... Or he could develop into an all-star, we'll just never know until it happens. And because it's uncertain, Boston will probably only take superstar compensation for him if they were to trade him.. If they don't get it, it's simply not worth it for them.

So the question is, are we determining VALUE or what would pry Lucic out of Boston? Current value? Bernier and a 1st isn't THAT far off... Will that pry him out of Boston? Hell no. Toss in Schnieder and it's atleast a conversation I'd assume haha..
I actually really like Bernier, always have. Couldn't believe SJ gave up on him as quickly as they did, but he still wouldn't get a sniff from Boston if Lucic was the conversation.

I agree with your last question, if we're talking about actual value it's very debateable and Bernier, Schneider, 1st is a conversation to be had.

I took the thread to mean what would it take to pry him away from Boston, and the answer to that is "far too much".

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