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04-24-2009, 11:36 AM
  #1
Comely
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Howson on the radio in Toronto

He is on sportsnet at noon right now soem things he has said
-Resigning Nash is more important then finding him help first
-Said Brassard was really good and can help Nash Right now anyways
-They overplayed Mason down the stretch and the fatigue made him play bad in the series
-Need a backup able to play 25-30 games next year.

Err, it was Hitchcock not Howson sorry....

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04-24-2009, 11:41 AM
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Agreed on all counts. Thanks for the news.

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04-24-2009, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comely View Post
He is on sportsnet at noon right now soem things he has said
-Resigning Nash is more important then finding him help first
-Said Brassard was really good and can help Nash Right now anyways
-They overplayed Mason down the stretch and the fatigue made him play bad in the series
-Need a backup able to play 25-30 games next year.

Err, it was Hitchcock not Howson sorry....
Thanks for the post. Everything looks good to me. I do hope that we can get Nash signed and put that behind us and that we can get a backup that Hitch will trust and play.

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04-24-2009, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comely View Post
He is on sportsnet at noon right now soem things he has said
-Resigning Nash is more important then finding him help first
-Said Brassard was really good and can help Nash Right now anyways
-They overplayed Mason down the stretch and the fatigue made him play bad in the series
-Need a backup able to play 25-30 games next year.

Err, it was Hitchcock not Howson sorry....
Interesting usage

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04-24-2009, 12:21 PM
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Interesting usage
Because it was an organizational decision.

In case you haven't caught on by now, Hitch is always a 'we win we lose' guy. He rarely, if ever, says 'I' or 'they'.

He is all about the team. That being said, he has no issues taking responsibility for his team on the ice...but nice, not so subtle, attempt in trying to smear his character....

The hypocrisy of him NOT playing Filatov while playing Mason is laughable.

People wanted him to 'ice the best team possible' by playing Filatov in the playoffs, yet when he rode the ONLY goalie who gave them a chance to get them there, he gets criticized.

Get it straight people, because you are making yourselves look foolish with the hypocrisy.

The mere fact of getting to the playoffs with this roster was monumental. 6 guys in double digits in scoring and one of them hasn't played since Dec 17th? C'mon--we maxed out and THAT is something the coach got the players to do...

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04-24-2009, 12:32 PM
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FYI all - if you linger over hashmarks' username with your pointer, some interesting information is presented.

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04-24-2009, 12:38 PM
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For those who want to listen:

http://fan590.com/media.jsp?content=...24_122539_8228

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04-24-2009, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by hashmarks View Post
Because it was an organizational decision.

In case you haven't caught on by now, Hitch is always a 'we win we lose' guy. He rarely, if ever, says 'I' or 'they'.

He is all about the team. That being said, he has no issues taking responsibility for his team on the ice...but nice, not so subtle, attempt in trying to smear his character....

The hypocrisy of him NOT playing Filatov while playing Mason is laughable.

People wanted him to 'ice the best team possible' by playing Filatov in the playoffs, yet when he rode the ONLY goalie who gave them a chance to get them there, he gets criticized.

Get it straight people, because you are making yourselves look foolish with the hypocrisy.

The mere fact of getting to the playoffs with this roster was monumental. 6 guys in double digits in scoring and one of them hasn't played since Dec 17th? C'mon--we maxed out and THAT is something the coach got the players to do...
I consider Hitch to be a great coach, glad that he is on our side, and he should get major consideration for Coach of the Year

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04-24-2009, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by hashmarks View Post
Because it was an organizational decision.

In case you haven't caught on by now, Hitch is always a 'we win we lose' guy. He rarely, if ever, says 'I' or 'they'.

He is all about the team. That being said, he has no issues taking responsibility for his team on the ice...but nice, not so subtle, attempt in trying to smear his character....

The hypocrisy of him NOT playing Filatov while playing Mason is laughable.

People wanted him to 'ice the best team possible' by playing Filatov in the playoffs, yet when he rode the ONLY goalie who gave them a chance to get them there, he gets criticized.

Get it straight people, because you are making yourselves look foolish with the hypocrisy.

The mere fact of getting to the playoffs with this roster was monumental. 6 guys in double digits in scoring and one of them hasn't played since Dec 17th? C'mon--we maxed out and THAT is something the coach got the players to do...
I recall saying it was hard to blame Hitch for riding Mason, though I would have encouraged giving Wade more of a shot.

That being said, I doubt very much the choice to continuously play Mason was an equal decision between Howson and Hitchcock. Hitchcock is the first to say that Howson's business is Howson's business, and I'm sure Howson would be the first to say that about Hitchcock. The final call comes from the coach. Riding Mason is very much an "I," or at least a "we," if he's feeling generous to his coaching staff.

Funny little argument, though, because my assumption is the "they" was actually Comely's wording, not Hitchcock's

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04-24-2009, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by hashmarks View Post

The mere fact of getting to the playoffs with this roster was monumental. 6 guys in double digits in scoring and one of them hasn't played since Dec 17th? C'mon--we maxed out and THAT is something the coach got the players to do...
I have to disagree a great deal with that. Who exactly in the WC missed the playoffs and had a better roster than us? St. Louis has an inferior roster and passed us.

I wouldn't say that we achieved over our heads this year.

I'll eliminate Dallas from the competition since with Richards they IMO probably do have a better roster.

Please note that this is not an Anti-Hitch... this roster is a playoff team in the WC.

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04-24-2009, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Ar-too View Post
FYI all - if you linger over hashmarks' username with your pointer, some interesting information is presented.
Old news, you way late to that party. You might want to consider responding on topic though. Otherwise some might think you're just trolling.

Directed at Hashmark's comments.

With the flaws we still have in the roster. With injuries to key players. With the lack of depth at skill posistions. I can go on. We did pretty well with this roster.

We lost our franchise goalie and our top center for the year. We lost Modin and Klesla for long periods of time. Even though we have more depth, we still aren't as deep as other teams. Those losses are pretty devistating for a team built like ours.

It was going to be a struggle to get in with the cards we were dealt over the coarse of the season. Props to the players, the coaching staff, and front office.

And for the record, I don't consider the Blues roster inferior.

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04-24-2009, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by blahblah View Post
Old news, you way late to that party. You might want to consider responding on topic though. Otherwise some might think you're just trolling.
Fair enough. Nobody told me, so I figured it was worth mentioning.

Regarding what Hitch said:

Riding Mason was the wrong thing to do. He was clearly showing signs of the wear and tear. Whoever made that decision, whether it was one person or ten, should take ownership of it and admit the mistake. Nobody deserves to be fired for it or anything, but hindsight's 20/20 and all that...

I don't think Rick Nash should be the linchpin of this offseason. I disagree with Hitch that that's more important than putting better players around him. On one hand, putting better players around him is a good goal in itself. On the other hand, it would make it easier to deal with him leaving, if that's what happens.

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04-24-2009, 02:15 PM
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Riding Mason was the wrong thing to do. He was clearly showing signs of the wear and tear. Whoever made that decision, whether it was one person or ten, should take ownership of it and admit the mistake. Nobody deserves to be fired for it or anything, but hindsight's 20/20 and all that...

I don't think Rick Nash should be the linchpin of this offseason. I disagree with Hitch that that's more important than putting better players around him. On one hand, putting better players around him is a good goal in itself. On the other hand, it would make it easier to deal with him leaving, if that's what happens.
Hitch has his goals, Howson has his. They may not mesh. And I can see some disagreement from the fans on the Nash issue.

As far as Mason goes, in the long run I think it helps this team. Mason knows now what to expect. Even with a good backup, depending on how close the race is, Mason could still get a nice 20-30 game start in a row. It's not unheard of in the NHL for premiere goalies to be able to do that sucessfully and still take all the games in the playoffs. I think we're all hoping Mason can. When the playoffs hit, and your trying to go deep, your goalie has to be able to go 20+ games in a row.

It's easy to talk about walls, it's another to experience it. I think he's and we are better off for it.

In the end we only made it by a couple of points. I'd rather have had Mason run out of gas in his first season then to not make it again.

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04-24-2009, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Ar-too View Post
I don't think Rick Nash should be the linchpin of this offseason. I disagree with Hitch that that's more important than putting better players around him. On one hand, putting better players around him is a good goal in itself. On the other hand, it would make it easier to deal with him leaving, if that's what happens.
We'll know on July 2nd if this is the case, and if it is, let the upgrades fly - we're committed to less than 25 mil for the 2010-11 season.

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04-24-2009, 03:34 PM
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I recall saying it was hard to blame Hitch for riding Mason, though I would have encouraged giving Wade more of a shot.
You wouldn't have if you had seen him in practice.

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That being said, I doubt very much the choice to continuously play Mason was an equal decision between Howson and Hitchcock. Hitchcock is the first to say that Howson's business is Howson's business, and I'm sure Howson would be the first to say that about Hitchcock. The final call comes from the coach. Riding Mason is very much an "I," or at least a "we," if he's feeling generous to his coaching staff.
The final decision was about doing whatever they felt they needed to do to win..that was an organizational decision. Mason was their guy and they were going to win together or lose together, period. There clearly wasn't any trust in Dubie to get any job done.

Do you think for 2 seconds that Hitchcock didn't understand the risks in riding Mason the way he did? Heck people all around these parts were all over Hitch for monitoring Jake and Brassard's ice time at the start of the year.

The jackets goaltending situation was in a bad way, and Mason was the guy they felt they could trust. He flat out takes responsibility for putting Mason in the net night in and night out. If Dubie was a guy who they felt they could have gotten points with, without a doubt he would have seen time.

Dubie at his best, is what we saw out of Mason in the final hour.


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04-24-2009, 03:47 PM
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I have to disagree a great deal with that. Who exactly in the WC missed the playoffs and had a better roster than us? St. Louis has an inferior roster and passed us.
How do you figure St. Louis has an inferior roster? They had 10 guys in double digits in scoring and 2 of those guys in the 30's? They were far more competitive to a man each and every night than our boys. Once their goaltending got on par with ours, they ploughed right over us.

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I wouldn't say that we achieved over our heads this year.
That's fine, but you tell me who could have realistically been better?

Nash-career year
RJ-career year
Huselius--right on par with where he normally is
Tyutin-career year
Hejda--career year
Commodore-near career year
Chimmer-on pace for career year until injury
Manny--career year
Voracek--very good rookie year
Brassard--on pace for rookie of the year until injured
Torres--6 GWG and on pace for a good scoring year based on games played
Murray--career year
Russell--career year
Methot--decent rookie year
Mason--oustanding rookie season
Williams--scored 12 for us, 19 on season--career year was 21.
Vermette--13 points in 17 game for us.

So, out of Modin, Peca, Boll, Dorsett, Novotny, Picard--where were we realistically going to get more? Modin and Peca are both on their last legs, and Dorsett, Boll, Novotny and Picard are who they are.

Were there a few games that we let get away earlier in the year? No doubt, but tell me what team doesn't have those?

Come on, we flat maxed out--there is just no denying it, the stats show it.


Last edited by hashmarks: 04-24-2009 at 04:02 PM.
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04-24-2009, 04:15 PM
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How do you figure St. Louis has an inferior roster? They had 10 guys in double digits in scoring and 2 of those guys in the 30's? They were far more competitive to a man each and every night than our boys. Once their goaltending got on par with ours, they ploughed right over us.
I guess I'm confused are we talking about talent or stats? Because I do not think that talent = stats. I guess I never really go number crazy because with team roles, and systems these things vary. I look player for player. Is Washington the third most talented team in the league? Um no. I've been criticizing them all year long and all their holes are being exposed.

In my opinion Murray had less talent and got a lot more. That seems to point to Murray doing an outstanding job this year. He did it with a lot of young players, who all would I assume have career years too. He got numbers out of players nobody would have ever expected such as David Backes, Brad Winchester and Patrick Berglund. I can't say we had any players like that.

In any event we did have 10 players with 9+ goals scored this year.

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04-24-2009, 04:30 PM
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I agree that we maxed out our talent, that's why changes will made in our roster over the summer. Depending on how the season goes we will further the changes at the trade deadline.

One things clear though, Mason is rookie goalie who not only needs more time to reach his potential but he also also needs a veteran backup goalie who not only can play for him but mentor him as well.

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04-24-2009, 04:47 PM
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I agree that we maxed out our talent, that's why changes will made in our roster over the summer. Depending on how the season goes we will further the changes at the trade deadline.

One things clear though, Mason is rookie goalie who not only needs more time to reach his potential but he also also needs a veteran backup goalie who not only can play for him but mentor him as well.
Hopefully a good goaltender coach as well, something that was missing for long stretches this season. Nothing against Elderbroom, but he wasnt permanent.

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04-24-2009, 09:07 PM
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Hopefully a good goaltender coach as well, something that was missing for long stretches this season. Nothing against Elderbroom, but he wasnt permanent.
Not only was he not permanent, he was a consultant.


I think the consensus here is that Hitch rode Mason because the other options weren't desirable. Lesson learned, The Maseiah will collect his hardware, rest up, and be the goalie that dazzled us next season.

With a full-time goalie coach and a veteran backup.

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04-24-2009, 09:16 PM
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I guess I'm confused are we talking about talent or stats? Because I do not think that talent = stats. I guess I never really go number crazy because with team roles, and systems these things vary. I look player for player. Is Washington the third most talented team in the league? Um no. I've been criticizing them all year long and all their holes are being exposed.

In my opinion Murray had less talent and got a lot more. That seems to point to Murray doing an outstanding job this year. He did it with a lot of young players, who all would I assume have career years too. He got numbers out of players nobody would have ever expected such as David Backes, Brad Winchester and Patrick Berglund. I can't say we had any players like that.

In any event we did have 10 players with 9+ goals scored this year.
No, we didn't have players like that--which is why he had more than what we had. What more evidence do you need to convince you that our roster, for the most part, all had career years and it STILL was barely enough? If that isn't maxing out, what is?

Man for man the Blues forwards were far more competitive than our players--their numbers are one indicator, watching them play often was another, watching them steamroll us was, but another.

Each and every night we couldn't rely on which Chimmer would show up, which Peca, which Huselius, which Nash even, etc.. If we could count on our forwards like we could our d in terms of competitivness, we would have been fine, but we couldn't.

The Blues played mean and tough all year long--before the second half of the season when they started to win, I couldn't understand why their record was as poor as it was. Once they finally got their goaltending and 5 on 5 squared away, they played fierce--something that we couldn't count on night in and night out.

Just because the Blues aren't loaded with 'name' players, doesn't mean they weren't talented. Their group of forwards were/are as deep as anything in the west save Detroit.

Hitch got the most out of what he had without question--I see you are seemingly having a difficult time putting your finger on where he could have gotten more. Had we more health, then things may have been different for us as well, but to think that there was more left in the tank at the end of the season is mistaken.

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04-24-2009, 09:21 PM
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Not only was he not permanent, he was a consultant.
Which is the same thing Malarchuk is and MOST goaltending coaches in the league.

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04-25-2009, 11:26 AM
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The hypocrisy of him NOT playing Filatov while playing Mason is laughable.

People wanted him to 'ice the best team possible' by playing Filatov in the playoffs, yet when he rode the ONLY goalie who gave them a chance to get them there, he gets criticized.

Get it straight people, because you are making yourselves look foolish with the hypocrisy.
Its apples and oranges. We're talking about the difference between overplaying Mason and not playing Filatov AT ALL. Even when it was down to one game and it would have hurt nothing to give the kid a try and give the kid real playoff experience.

Ken Hitchcock made marginal improvement with a team that was vastly better than the one he had the year before. And even with the improved talent he allowed his power play to fall to shambles for more than half a season before personally stepping in...and not doing much better. Not exactly Jack Adams worthy.

Its time for Hitchcock to analyze his ridiculous theories about "pairs vs. lines" and the importance of power play vs. penalty kill. The teams still in the playoffs seem to subscribe to a different philosophy on these issues. Maybe its time adapt to the league instead of thinking its going to adapt to you.

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04-25-2009, 11:53 AM
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Its apples and oranges. We're talking about the difference between overplaying Mason and not playing Filatov AT ALL. Even when it was down to one game and it would have hurt nothing to give the kid a try and give the kid real playoff experience.

Ken Hitchcock made marginal improvement with a team that was vastly better than the one he had the year before. And even with the improved talent he allowed his power play to fall to shambles for more than half a season before personally stepping in...and not doing much better. Not exactly Jack Adams worthy.

Its time for Hitchcock to analyze his ridiculous theories about "pairs vs. lines" and the importance of power play vs. penalty kill. The teams still in the playoffs seem to subscribe to a different philosophy on these issues. Maybe its time adapt to the league instead of thinking its going to adapt to you.
Power play rankings of Hitchcock's teams during a given season
95-96 -- 23rd of 26
96-97 -- 18th of 26
97-98 -- 1st of 26
98-99 -- 6th of 27
99-00 -- 19th of 28
00-01 -- 6th of 30

02-03 -- 21st of 30
03-04 -- 2nd of 30
05-06 -- 16th of 30

07-08 -- 26th of 30
08-09 -- 30th of 30

And the penalty kill
95-96 -- 20th of 26
96-97 -- 14th of 26
97-98 -- 2nd of 26
98-99 -- 6th of 27
99-00 -- 1st of 28
00-01 -- 4th of 30

02-03 -- 9th of 30
03-04 -- 21st of 30
05-06 -- 27th of 30

07-08 -- 9th of 30
08-09 -- 13th of 30

The obvious issues tend to relate to lack of actual talent to play good special teams. In Dallas, the penalty kill followed the career path of Jere Lehtinen from a fourth-liner into a defensive-minded first-liner; the power play tracked with the acquisition of Sergei Zubov from Pittsburgh. That's to say nothing of getting Ed Belfour in net over a rapidly aging Andy Moog.

Hitchcock and Howson both know the needs of this team. But to make the blanket statement that they'll be satisfied with mediocre special teams while hoping the league adapts to them is crazy talk.

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04-25-2009, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnCornelius View Post
Its apples and oranges. We're talking about the difference between overplaying Mason and not playing Filatov AT ALL. Even when it was down to one game and it would have hurt nothing to give the kid a try and give the kid real playoff experience.

Ken Hitchcock made marginal improvement with a team that was vastly better than the one he had the year before. And even with the improved talent he allowed his power play to fall to shambles for more than half a season before personally stepping in...and not doing much better. Not exactly Jack Adams worthy.

Its time for Hitchcock to analyze his ridiculous theories about "pairs vs. lines" and the importance of power play vs. penalty kill. The teams still in the playoffs seem to subscribe to a different philosophy on these issues. Maybe its time adapt to the league instead of thinking its going to adapt to you.
After their loss last night Tortorella made an interesting comment, paraphrase, the power play is a microcosm of the team situation. If so we have a lot of work to do.

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