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Coyotes Financial/Ownership Situation #3

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05-06-2009, 05:33 PM
  #1
mouser
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Coyotes Financial/Ownership Situation #3

Carry on from previous thread:
http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=603349

Please stay on topic and respect your fellow HFBoards members.


Last edited by mouser: 05-20-2009 at 12:11 AM.
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Old
05-06-2009, 05:34 PM
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may I also add, lets save the arena location discussion for another place and time.

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05-06-2009, 05:37 PM
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may I also add, lets save the arena location discussion for another place and time.
Agreed.

The arena isn't going anywhere no matter how much anyone complains.

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05-06-2009, 05:48 PM
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If the Yotes move to Ontario it would be good for them but might end up being bad for other teams ...revenues will go way up , which will raise the cap - this can affect some of the poorer markets that are in trouble now ..

Also if it moves it can open the door for other people trying to strong arm the NHL

If it stays ,there is not guarantee that we won't talking about this again in a few years ..Also Jim Balsillie will be back in some form or another , whether with this team or another team

In Canada they are calling Jim Balsille the Robin Hood and Gary Bettman the Sheriff of Nottingham :} Bettman is getting slammed up here

This deal whichever way it goes I believe will be pivitol in the future of the NHL . And will have huge ramifications . The Auction supposedly opens up on Thursday and the winningbid has to beat the offer by more than 5 mil



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05-06-2009, 05:56 PM
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UPDATE:
http://www.azcentral.com/business/ar...yotes0507.html

Sheds more light

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05-06-2009, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouser View Post
Carry on from previous thread:
http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=603349

Please stay on topic and respect your fellow HFBoards members.
I don't know if I congratulated you on your promotion, mouser...

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05-06-2009, 06:06 PM
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I don't know if I congratulated you on your promotion, mouser...
Thanks. Just trying not to accidentally push any wrong buttons here

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05-06-2009, 06:22 PM
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The "Delete Post" button is never the wrong button.

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05-06-2009, 06:48 PM
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I don't know if I congratulated you on your promotion, mouser...
I'll second that.

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05-06-2009, 06:56 PM
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I've read this thread and I've read the business of hockey thread with lawyers and wannabe lawyers chiming in. Based on my readings and understandings and not much else this is how I think it will shake out.

1. The bankruptcy judge will approve the sale but will concede that the NHL B o G would still need to approve the relocation per their own by-laws and franchise agreements.

2. Balsillie will pull his offer as it is conditional on the move.

3. The Jerry Reinsdorf group will come forward with their condition free offer of somewhere between $120-$150 mill and sign a renegotiated lease with the City of Glendale. There may even be some other creative and cooperative community involvement/partnership things in there.

4. All secured creditors will still get paid in full and the biggest loser will be Moyes who will get only a small amount of the unsecured debt he has outstanding. I still feel a bit for him.

5. Balsille will grandstand more and firmly position himself as the front runner for any team that is eventually relocated or at the very least for the first expansion team to be put into Southern Ontario. Nobody will find out that he never really wanted to buy the Coyotes, that he knew his attempt would fail all along, and this positioning was his only motivation.

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05-06-2009, 06:58 PM
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I don't know if I congratulated you on your promotion, mouser...
To think, I used to like him.

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05-06-2009, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
I've read this thread and I've read the business of hockey thread with lawyers and wannabe lawyers chiming in. Based on my readings and understandings and not much else this is how I think it will shake out.

1. The bankruptcy judge will approve the sale but will concede that the NHL B o G would still need to approve the relocation per their own by-laws and franchise agreements.

2. Balsillie will pull his offer as it is conditional on the move.

3. The Jerry Reinsdorf group will come forward with their condition free offer of somewhere between $120-$150 mill and sign a renegotiated lease with the City of Glendale. There may even be some other creative and cooperative community involvement/partnership things in there.

4. All secured creditors will still get paid in full and the biggest loser will be Moyes who will get only a small amount of the unsecured debt he has outstanding. I still feel a bit for him.

5. Balsille will grandstand more and firmly position himself as the front runner for any team that is eventually relocated or at the very least for the first expansion team to be put into Southern Ontario. Nobody will find out that he never really wanted to buy the Coyotes, that he knew his attempt would fail all along, and this positioning was his only motivation.
That is a fair assessment of all the info flying around right now. I also think Moyes and Basillie really put themselves behind the 8 ball with this maneuvering. Ironically the debacle that was yesterday may ultimately be what saves the Yotes in Phoenix. It'll depend on the courts of course but they made some powerful enemies by pissing off Bettman and the BoG. I'm with TT, I'm buying a Bettman shirt if he successfully stops these *******s!

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05-06-2009, 07:08 PM
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ESPN reports:

"A successful bankruptcy filing could allow the Coyotes to avoid the $750 million penalty for breaking its 30-year lease with Glendale. But Beasley said that when the lease was forged with Moyes and Ellman it was worded with just such a possibility in mind.

"We're comfortable that we have put in the safeguards to get a very strong position out there to keep the team in the city of Glendale," Beasley said."

If that's the case, Moyes is playing a very dangerous game here. Haven't seen the contractual language at issue that Beasley relies, but if there is some type of personal guarantee, Moyes could get hit with the penalty. He hasn't filed for personal bankruptcy.

Frankly, I don't know how the city could have not have forseen the possibility of the bankruptcy by the Coyotes LLC and and taken precautions. Build a $200M arena for an undercapitalized company that has never made a dime operating in Canada or the US, and not get some type of backup protection???

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05-06-2009, 07:11 PM
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I think there's a good chance that both Moyes and the NHL show up in bankruptcy court tomorrow each claiming to be in control of the team.

Planning to attend if it's open to the public.

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05-06-2009, 07:12 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
I've read this thread and I've read the business of hockey thread with lawyers and wannabe lawyers chiming in. Based on my readings and understandings and not much else this is how I think it will shake out.

1. The bankruptcy judge will approve the sale but will concede that the NHL B o G would still need to approve the relocation per their own by-laws and franchise agreements.

2. Balsillie will pull his offer as it is conditional on the move.

3. The Jerry Reinsdorf group will come forward with their condition free offer of somewhere between $120-$150 mill and sign a renegotiated lease with the City of Glendale. There may even be some other creative and cooperative community involvement/partnership things in there.

4. All secured creditors will still get paid in full and the biggest loser will be Moyes who will get only a small amount of the unsecured debt he has outstanding. I still feel a bit for him.

5. Balsille will grandstand more and firmly position himself as the front runner for any team that is eventually relocated or at the very least for the first expansion team to be put into Southern Ontario. Nobody will find out that he never really wanted to buy the Coyotes, that he knew his attempt would fail all along, and this positioning was his only motivation.
If that happens - what a steal. Basically buying the team with a renegociated lease, zero debt, for the price Moyes paid 9 years ago, maximum cap space, a good GM and plenty of good young talent.

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05-06-2009, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
I've read this thread and I've read the business of hockey thread with lawyers and wannabe lawyers chiming in. Based on my readings and understandings and not much else this is how I think it will shake out.

1. The bankruptcy judge will approve the sale but will concede that the NHL B o G would still need to approve the relocation per their own by-laws and franchise agreements.

2. Balsillie will pull his offer as it is conditional on the move.

3. The Jerry Reinsdorf group will come forward with their condition free offer of somewhere between $120-$150 mill and sign a renegotiated lease with the City of Glendale. There may even be some other creative and cooperative community involvement/partnership things in there.

4. All secured creditors will still get paid in full and the biggest loser will be Moyes who will get only a small amount of the unsecured debt he has outstanding. I still feel a bit for him.

5. Balsille will grandstand more and firmly position himself as the front runner for any team that is eventually relocated or at the very least for the first expansion team to be put into Southern Ontario. Nobody will find out that he never really wanted to buy the Coyotes, that he knew his attempt would fail all along, and this positioning was his only motivation.
Yea the Business of Hockey thread has allowed me to drink earlier in the day now. Wow...

I think your assessment is thought provoking. At this point, I'm hoping Moyes loses his shirt. I really do. The guy is nothing but a piece of garbage and a worthless human being. The guy's trucking business is also tanking, so kudos to the economy for that.

I hope that Balsillie is just bluffing. If not, then we have a real problem on our hands. If he is indeed serious about buying and relocating the team, he just might be able to do it. I think we need to look up what the by-laws are of the NHL and go from there. I think we also need a fair assessment on how the other owners are reacting to this. If they are in step with the NHLPA, we're more than screwed. So basically it all comes down to him balking in the end. I just don't feel comfortable with that at all.

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05-06-2009, 07:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mouser View Post
I think there's a good chance that both Moyes and the NHL show up in bankruptcy court tomorrow each claiming to be in control of the team.

Planning to attend if it's open to the public.
According to the U.S. Court's website it should be barring any kind of noting from the judge to not have it public.

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05-06-2009, 07:14 PM
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If that's the case, Moyes is playing a very dangerous game here.
The more I read about this, the more Moyes look like a very desperate man.

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05-06-2009, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mouser View Post
I think there's a good chance that both Moyes and the NHL show up in bankruptcy court tomorrow each claiming to be in control of the team.

Planning to attend if it's open to the public.
Any guess as to when that information will be known?

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05-06-2009, 07:22 PM
  #20
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At this point, I'm hoping Moyes loses his shirt. I really do. The guy is nothing but a piece of garbage and a worthless human being. The guy's trucking business is also tanking, so kudos to the economy for that.
I really can't agree with you here. The guy has made a desperate move to try to recover the $90 or whatever million he has as unsecured debt to the company. I don't blame him for that, he's lost over $200 million trying to make the team work in Phoenix. He has the most into trying to make the team work and he will lose the most, by far, no matter how this ends up. It's not that he didn't really want it to succeed, he just didn't know how to do it and his fatal mistake was not being able to hire anyone that could help him.

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05-06-2009, 07:30 PM
  #21
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The more I read about this, the more Moyes look like a very desperate man.
I do feel sorry for him a bit, he's in bad shape and I think ultimately Basillie is going to **** him over even worse.

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05-06-2009, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta Yote View Post
I've read this thread and I've read the business of hockey thread with lawyers and wannabe lawyers chiming in. Based on my readings and understandings and not much else this is how I think it will shake out.
I don't know enough about the bankruptcy laws to say, but what you outline is certainly how I hope this plays out. Moyes and Balsillie are clearly trying to run an end-around on the NHL and if the NHL is correct they are also trying to abuse the bankruptcy proceedings in order to do it. They are turning this into some sort of game and what Moyes may not realize is that he has become a pawn.

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05-06-2009, 07:47 PM
  #23
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Any guess as to when that information will be known?
I want to go as well.

Fact: The hearing is 1,30p (been reported in a couple places)
Fact: It's at the federal court house downtown. 230 N 1st Ave
Phoenix, AZ 85003 - court room will be either on the 6th or 7th floor.

Not Known is where and what room? I doubt Moyes physically shows, if he does I will give him a polite piece of my mind.

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05-06-2009, 07:53 PM
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I think, no matter how this turns out, a lot of people are going to feel stupid about how they've been played by Balsillie. Honestly, I kind of admire his ambition. Just not if it involves taking my team. He's a smart smart man, he just doesn't understand that to get what you want, sometimes you have to follow the rules.

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05-06-2009, 07:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamTurris View Post
I want to go as well.

Fact: The hearing is 1,30p (been reported in a couple places)
Fact: It's at the federal court house downtown. 230 N 1st Ave
Phoenix, AZ 85003 - court room will be either on the 6th or 7th floor.

Not Known is where and what room? I doubt Moyes physically shows, if he does I will give him a polite piece of my mind.
FACT: David Hale does not know what a defense attorney is. Because that would involve learning the concept of defense.

I know that a defense attorney wouldn't be involved in a case like this, but I just couldn't resist.

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