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Eklund Warning... Phaneuf Rumour

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Old
05-07-2009, 12:10 PM
  #1
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Eklund Warning... Phaneuf Rumour

Quote:
Just following up on a rumor I am chasing that would send Dion Phaneuf to Florida for Jay Bo's rights and "3 or 4 other assets" obviously those "assets" are huge in this situation. The Canadiens continue to try and secure Jay Bo's rights as well...
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?p...4&blogger_id=1


Last edited by Snoil11: 05-07-2009 at 06:06 PM.
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05-07-2009, 12:11 PM
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I would like Jay Bo but not into getting rid of Phaneuf. I predict Phaneuf will have a great bounce back year.

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05-07-2009, 12:13 PM
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Saw that last night.

I don't know I find it really tough to see Sutter trading Phaneuf. I really don't see Phaneuf going anywhere anytime soon.

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05-07-2009, 12:14 PM
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Interesting.

What would the "3 or 4" assets be? Booth? Weiss? Ballard? Olesz? That would be the key part of the deal. What if Sutter can't sign Jay-Bo?

The only way I would like this is if the Panthers allowed Sutter to talk to Bouwmeester before the trade to see if he could get him under contract.

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05-07-2009, 12:54 PM
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Unless those "other assets" are over-the-top, I wouldn't want to see this go down. It sounds like Jay Bo might want to sign here anyway, so I'd say just try to sign him on July 1. I've never liked the idea of trading for negotiating rights anyway.

Yeah Phaneuf had a poor year by our standards, but giving up on him now would be a dumb, reactionary move.

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05-07-2009, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by CGY View Post
Interesting.

What would the "3 or 4" assets be? Booth? Weiss? Ballard? Olesz? That would be the key part of the deal. What if Sutter can't sign Jay-Bo?

The only way I would like this is if the Panthers allowed Sutter to talk to Bouwmeester before the trade to see if he could get him under contract.
If the Assets are Booth, Weiss, or Horton than i maybe do this deal. If we can dump some salary we may be able to get Bouwmeester without giving up other assets.

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05-07-2009, 02:12 PM
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To me, it makes no sense.

If he truly wants to play out west, we don't have to give up anything come July 1st. The other rumour is Montreal, again if he wants to come west they he'll come west. Montreal traded to negotiate with Sundin and got nothing out of it. I know its a completely different scenario with their being other assets coming our way unlike the Sundin deal, but I just don't get trading for rights. Altho i'd love to see us trade Cammy's rights for a pick

Wait for July 1st. If he isn't signed and we can actually get him to a reasonable deal, then put Phaneuf on the trading block. Why pick from a Florida roster when we could look at most rosters around the league and see what he fetches for a trade.

With that said, I don't see Phaneuf moving at all unless its a great package.

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05-07-2009, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Pacem View Post
To me, it makes no sense.

If he truly wants to play out west, we don't have to give up anything come July 1st. The other rumour is Montreal, again if he wants to come west they he'll come west. Montreal traded to negotiate with Sundin and got nothing out of it. I know its a completely different scenario with their being other assets coming our way unlike the Sundin deal, but I just don't get trading for rights. Altho i'd love to see us trade Cammy's rights for a pick

Wait for July 1st. If he isn't signed and we can actually get him to a reasonable deal, then put Phaneuf on the trading block. Why pick from a Florida roster when we could look at most rosters around the league and see what he fetches for a trade.

With that said, I don't see Phaneuf moving at all unless its a great package.
I agree... I think we should try to make our pff season goal number 1 to sign Jay Bo as a UFA to play on the PP WITH Phaneuf. Ahaheim is a damn good playoff team. Just look at their D and what they spend on it and the results are quite obvious.

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05-07-2009, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post
I agree... I think we should try to make our pff season goal number 1 to sign Jay Bo as a UFA to play on the PP WITH Phaneuf. Ahaheim is a damn good playoff team. Just look at their D and what they spend on it and the results are quite obvious.

Nah, for me its an either/or situation when it comes to Phaneuf and Jay Bo.

I just don't the sense in trading Phaneuf for Jay Bo's rights and some assets when we can just try and sign Jay Bo and then trade Phaneuf. Instead of looking at Florida's roster for trade pieces for Phaneuf we could look at many more rosters across the league and make the best deal possible. Either way I don't think it happens.

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05-07-2009, 04:09 PM
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I hate to say it but I could see this happen. Florida knows J-Bo is as good as gone July 1st. With him building a house and having a girlfriend here in Calgary, they may also know that he wants to come here. To save face, the Panthers would love to get a marquee D-man in return. It makes sense.

Don't think of it as trading Phaneuf for J-Bo though, because it really isn't. It's Phaneuf for whoever else would be coming our way. I have a feeling that Booth could be a key piece as he would be the perfect replacement for Cammalleri, and exactly the type of player Sutter likes. Then what else? Maybe Matthias? Maybe Ellerby? Draft pick(s)? Who knows.

Maybe Florida would want to do this deal badly enough, that they'd even be willing to take on a little extra salary, too. Primeau, perhaps? Vandermeer?

As for J-Bo, aquiring his negotiation rights could ensure the Flames don't lose him to a team like Vancouver who just might be willing to throw the league maximum salary at him on an 8 or 10 year deal, or something like that. IF Sutter 'knows' J-Bo has Calgary picked as his first choice, then he may have interest in aquiring the early window to lock J-Bo down and avoid that chance alltogether.

The more I look at this rumor, the more it makes sense to me. But it is only listed as (e3) which means it's only coming from one source who's somehow connected to one of the two teams involved in these discussions. My ears will perk more if it goes to (e4) which is multiple sources somehow connected. Just my 2 cents.

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05-07-2009, 04:50 PM
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What about if the offer looked something like this....

-Phaneuf
-Primeau ($2m+ off the books)
-Vandermeer ($2m+ off the books)

for

-Bouwmeester negotiating rights (a formality *IF* he wants to be here anyways)
-Matthias
-Booth
-Ellerby OR a 1st round pick

*IF* Bouwmeester has Calgary as his first choice anyways, then he's not really worth much in the deal because he's of course free to do what he wants July 1st. Also, if they were to take Primeau and Vandermeer off our books, then that's roughly $4.5 mill. That's certainly worth something to us, too.

If you were Sutter and this was offered to you, would you do it?

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05-07-2009, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flames89 View Post
What about if the offer looked something like this....

-Phaneuf
-Primeau ($2m+ off the books)
-Vandermeer ($2m+ off the books)

for

-Bouwmeester negotiating rights (a formality *IF* he wants to be here anyways)
-Matthias
-Booth
-Ellerby OR a 1st round pick

*IF* Bouwmeester has Calgary as his first choice anyways, then he's not really worth much in the deal because he's of course free to do what he wants July 1st. Also, if they were to take Primeau and Vandermeer off our books, then that's roughly $4.5 mill. That's certainly worth something to us, too.

If you were Sutter and this was offered to you, would you do it?
It would be tempting:

Drop Primeau 1.4 and Vandermeer 2.3 (3.7) and pick up Matthias (0.822) Booth (RFA and more questions, will he sign) and say a first round pick. If we do trade Phaneuf and sign Jay Bo I am sure those salaries would cancel out. But the savings would be decent. What are the rules for a RFA being traded? Is this a risk for the Flames as well? Lots of questions but in a wierd way the deal makes some sense. I would really want Phaneuf to stay though, I just think he will be a franchise player for years to come.

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05-07-2009, 06:26 PM
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I hope one of the assets is Frolik, Mathias, Ellerby or even Markstrom.

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05-07-2009, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flames89 View Post
What about if the offer looked something like this....

-Phaneuf
-Primeau ($2m+ off the books)
-Vandermeer ($2m+ off the books)

for

-Bouwmeester negotiating rights (a formality *IF* he wants to be here anyways)
-Matthias
-Booth
-Ellerby OR a 1st round pick

*IF* Bouwmeester has Calgary as his first choice anyways, then he's not really worth much in the deal because he's of course free to do what he wants July 1st. Also, if they were to take Primeau and Vandermeer off our books, then that's roughly $4.5 mill. That's certainly worth something to us, too.

If you were Sutter and this was offered to you, would you do it?

Love Dion but Done, no way Florida does the deal, but i sure as hell would. Personally i would love to just go out and sign Bouwmeester, like someone mentioned:

Phaneuf/J-Bo=Pronger/Niedermayer

Throw in Sarich, Regehr, Pelech and Giordano We would be set on Defense.

(pelech and Giordano to off set the lack of speed with Regehr and Sarich).

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05-07-2009, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post

What are the rules for a RFA being traded? Is this a risk for the Flames as well?
Unless I'm mistaken, RFA's can be treded just like everyone else. It doesn't change the RFA status at all.

And good catch on Primeaus salary at $1.4 mill. For some reason I thought he was over $2 mill. My bad.

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05-07-2009, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by superhakan View Post
Love Dion but Done, no way Florida does the deal, but i sure as hell would.
I know it looks lopsided but remember, they wouldn't really be getting much at all in return for J-Bo *IF* they new he was planning to come here anyways. It's more of a formality in that instance that they could use to open the door to a deal to get a true, young, cornerstone Defenseman and marquee player that they can sell to their fans.

How about if we added Mitch Wahl to offset a bit of the young talent they'd be giving up? Closer?

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05-07-2009, 06:54 PM
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Assuming the following trade
To Florida:
Phaneuf – Primeau – Vandermeer
To Calgary:
Jay Bo’s rights, Booth, Matthias

Other Assumptions:
1: Trade Langkow for a first rounder and ideally a second rounder (space for Backlund)
2: Sign Clemmenson (G), Jay Bouwmeester (D), Booth (RFA as of July 1), Derek Morris (D)
3: Bring up Backlund & Pelech.
4: Extend Pardy, Boyd and Lundmark.

This would give us a killer team something like the following (many numbers are guesses)
Borque (1.3) – Jokinen (5.25) – Iginla (7.0)
Booth (4.0) - Backlund (1.3) – Moss (1.3)
Lundmark (0.75) – Matthias (0.82) – Glencross (1.3)
Nystrom (0.686) – Conroy (1.05) – Boyd (0.9)

Bouwmeester (6.5) – Morris (3.5)
Regehr (4.0) – Sarich (3.6)
Giordano (0.892) – Pardy (0.85)
Pelech (0.85)

Kiprusoff (5.833)
Clemmenson (1.5)

Total Cap Hit: 53,841,667
Cap Space: 2,858,333 (if no changes)

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05-07-2009, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post
Assuming the following trade
To Florida:
Phaneuf – Primeau – Vandermeer
To Calgary:
Jay Bo’s rights, Booth, Matthias
im not sure if florida would take that deal. the simple reason is because way to much salary is going back (more than 10mil!). also, quantity does not equate to quality. booth is a soon to be #1 forward and matthias is a potential top 6 centre. you're trying to get those players for an overpaid top 6 dman and a injury prone botton 6 forward. imo, the flames do not have the assets to get all of those listed players.

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05-07-2009, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post
Assuming the following trade
To Florida:
Phaneuf – Primeau – Vandermeer
To Calgary:
Jay Bo’s rights, Booth, Matthias

Other Assumptions:
1: Trade Langkow for a first rounder and ideally a second rounder (space for Backlund)
2: Sign Clemmenson (G), Jay Bouwmeester (D), Booth (RFA as of July 1), Derek Morris (D)
3: Bring up Backlund & Pelech.
4: Extend Pardy, Boyd and Lundmark.
I still think we could get a 1st in the deal, even if we had to add say, Mitch Wahl to offset the them losing a couple very good young players.

As for trading Langkow, I would want Jokinen extended at least 2 years at his current rate first. Then I agree, trade Langkow freeing up even more cash and a 1st is what I'd be looking for. If we can get a 2nd or even a 3rd too, great.

I'd love for Clemmenson to be hear as Kippers back-up. That would be great. I'm not very confident in McElhinney. And Morris would be great too. Or even Beauchemin. Then we'd have Bouwmeester and Beauchemin. OOOooooo! Bo-Bo defense.

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05-07-2009, 07:15 PM
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im not sure if florida would take that deal. the simple reason is because way to much salary is going back (more than 10mil!). also, quantity does not equate to quality. booth is a soon to be #1 forward and matthias is a potential top 6 centre. you're trying to get those players for an overpaid top 6 dman and a injury prone botton 6 forward. imo, the flames do not have the assets to get all of those listed players.
If they want to pry Phaneuf from us, they'll have to overpay because we don't have to 'move him or lose him'. And their strong desire to give the fans a suitable replacement for losing Bouwmeester for (otherwise) nothing, could make them very willing to overpay a bit. They were willing to give J-Bo at least $6.5 mill anyways, so really they're only taking on about $3mill or so in extra salary in this deal.

Also, defensemen of this caliber are worth a lot more than forwards with top 6 potential. He's already been a Norris finalist and I beleive he's destined to become a rock solid top 5 in the NHL defenseman. If Florida disagrees, then there really isn't anything to talk about because I think we have a great shot at signing J-Bo anyways, while they must know that they have none. This is their only chance to land a Phaneuf (or J-Bo) level D-man in return. And Phaneuf's signed for 5 more years. They gotta love that.

As for "Quantity does not equate to quality", I'm really not sure what you mean by that. We're giving up 3 guys and getting back 3 or 4, in my origional proposal.


Last edited by Gold Pads*: 05-07-2009 at 08:49 PM.
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05-07-2009, 07:26 PM
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*Phaneuf+/Jay Bo rights swap has gained a ton of momentum today wth one NHL source telling me he believes there is a 80% chance that Jay Bo ends up in Calgary
An update. Still don't know if this makes it much clearer but, take it for what it's worth, I guess.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...o-more/1/21100

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05-07-2009, 08:55 PM
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What about this then?

-Phaneuf
-Primeau
-Vandermeer
-Wahl

for

-Bouwmeesters rights (remember, not worth *too much*)
-Booth
-Matthias
-1st round pick (their choice '09 or '10)*OR* Ellerby (still their choice)

Any better? Could this get it done, in your opinion? If I'm the GM of the Flames, I'd do this.


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05-07-2009, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by flames89 View Post
What about this then?

-Phaneuf
-Primeau
-Vandermeer
-Wahl

for

-Bouwmeesters rights (remember, not worth *too much*)
-Booth
-Matthias
-1st round pick (their choice '09 or '10)*OR* Ellerby (still their choice)

Any better? Could this get it done, in your opinion? If I'm the GM of the Flames, I'd do this.


Sure but how exactly does contacting a UFA work again. I assume Sutter or any other GM can not contact JB's agent befire July 1 right? If I were Sutter is it possible to talk to JB through Jacques Martin or something there to get some sense of guarantee... I am terrified of trading Phaneuf and JB not signing.

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05-07-2009, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post
Sure but how exactly does contacting a UFA work again. I assume Sutter or any other GM can not contact JB's agent befire July 1 right? If I were Sutter is it possible to talk to JB through Jacques Martin or something there to get some sense of guarantee... I am terrified of trading Phaneuf and JB not signing.
Agreed about needing a guarantee. But I'm sure that if the Panthers give the Flames exclusive rights to talk to J-Bo and/or his agent, then it's all good. And I'm pretty sure that if one deal is contingent on the other, (ie; We'll only make the trade if Bouwmeester signs.....), then the NHL can execute both deals at the same time, or neither if either falls through.

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05-07-2009, 10:43 PM
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Agreed about needing a guarantee. But I'm sure that if the Panthers give the Flames exclusive rights to talk to J-Bo and/or his agent, then it's all good. And I'm pretty sure that if one deal is contingent on the other, (ie; We'll only make the trade if Bouwmeester signs.....), then the NHL can execute both deals at the same time, or neither if either falls through.
If that is the case (a contingent deal) and these are accepted by the league I would do it. I dig Phaneuf tons but we get a paralell replacement in JB and dump salary in return for great young players to help Florida save face to their fans. Florida must be nervous watching the happenings in Phoenix as well on a side note. If you want hockey in places like that you need to be competitive.

This deal is a no brainer IMO

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