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Sharks-Thrashers (Kovalchuk)

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Old
05-12-2009, 10:34 PM
  #26
OrrNumber4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Tavares View Post
i don't see why SJ would gut their secondary scoring for IK who has 1 year left on his deal, Marleau needs to be going the other way in a deal being made IMO

The secondary scoring failed miserably in the playoffs. Michalek has never had a good playoffs, and Clowe's attitude change in the second-half of the season makes me question his effectiveness. Marleau and Thornton at least have had good playoffs in the past.

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Old
05-13-2009, 02:59 AM
  #27
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Take out Armstrong and Lehman/Skinner and the Thrashers still don't even think about it. Atlanta is not going to trade its superstar and face of the franchise for anything but severe overpayment, they can't afford to lose him. This proposal isn't even equal value, much less overpayment.

It doesn't matter one bit whether Kovalchuk's contract runs out after next season. Things like that don't make GMs throw away players for less than market value. Not to mention that players don't automatically become UFAs just because their contract will run out, they can sign new deals you know...

Michalek and Clowe are nice players, but they aren't superstars who can carry a team or put fans in the seats, Kovalchuk can. If there is one team which has a superstar and can't afford to lose him, it's Atlanta. Anything below another superstar plus extra stuff isn't going to cut it.
Maybe if the deadline is getting closer and Kovalchuk announces that he's not interested in staying, then you could think about such a deal, but definately not this summer.

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Old
05-13-2009, 07:09 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanderson View Post
Maybe if the deadline is getting closer and Kovalchuk announces that he's not interested in staying, then you could think about such a deal, but definately not this summer.
FYI: Don Waddell has recently stated that if Ilya is not re-signed this summer, he is going to be traded before the season starts.

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Old
05-13-2009, 07:18 AM
  #29
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Ah okay, not sure if I would handle it that way, but if that's what he thinks is the best solution...

Still, I don't think that he would accept such a deal. The value is barely enough for Kovalchuk, adding Armstrong doesn't make much sense.

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Old
05-13-2009, 07:21 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Sanderson View Post
Ah okay, not sure if I would handle it that way, but if that's what he thinks is the best solution...
After watching the Hossa situation unfold, I think it is the smart move. If Ilya is unsigned it will become a huge morale issue on the team. It would be best to trade him while he has more value, and so you can get the team headed in the right direction from training camp on.

I agree with you on the value as well, adding Armstrong turns this from a good deal to a crap deal IMO.

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Old
05-13-2009, 07:31 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
San Jose sends:
Ryane Clowe
Milan Michalek
Derek Joslin
1st in 2010 (if Kovy re-signs)

for
Kovalchuk
Colby Armstrong
Scott Lehman/Brett Skinner

Atlanta gets two legit top-six forwards who are defensively capable to round out their top six core. Ryane Clowe especially could turn into a very good power forward. The obligatory first in 2010 is there if Kovy re-signs, and Derek Joslin is an eventual top-4 defenseman who is ready for NHL time right now, and could battle guys like Valabik, Exelby, and Samela for that top-four spot. Atlanta sheds a bit of salary in Lehman or Skinner. San Jose gets a dynamic goal scorer in Kovalchuk, perhaps the last thing missing from their lineup (on paper), a gritty bottom-six player, and take some salary off Atlanta's hand while getting a reserve player. San Jose probably tries to acquire the rights to Reasoner as well.
Atlanta's forward lines after this:

Michalek - White - Little
Kozlov - Peverley - Clowe

San Jose's forward lines:

Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Kovalchuk-Pavelski-Couture
Moen-Mitchell-Armstrong
If I was Atlanta I'd counter with:

San Jose sends:
Thornton
1st in 2010 (if Kovy re-signs)

for
Kovalchuk

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Old
05-13-2009, 09:29 AM
  #32
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Assuming that this block-buster doesn't go down and San Jose does not have a 1st-round pick in the upcoming draft, would the Sharks consider shedding Cheechoo's salary to Atlanta in exchange for the 34th pick in 2009?

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Old
05-13-2009, 09:37 AM
  #33
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to SJ: 34th pick,todd white
to ATL: Pavelski, Clowe


Kovy-Peverley-Clowe
Kozlov-Pavelski-Little

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Old
05-13-2009, 10:07 AM
  #34
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Quote:
to SJ: 34th pick,todd white
to ATL: Pavelski, Clowe


Kovy-Peverley-Clowe
Kozlov-Pavelski-Little
Pavelski would require a massive overpayment to get. His contract is great, he's nowhere near his potential, and the organization loves him. You could basically take Clowe out of the deal and I still wouldn't do it. Pavelski is potential team captain material at a future point.

Clowe is an RFA, if you want him you pretty much have to make an offer sheet. Shark's fan's predict 3.5-4m will be his asking price. So I doubt you want to pay 2 1sts a 2nd and a 3rd for him. (but please do!)

Really, another 2nd rounder and Todd White have almost no value to the Sharks imo.

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Old
05-13-2009, 01:36 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanderson View Post
Ah okay, not sure if I would handle it that way, but if that's what he thinks is the best solution...

Still, I don't think that he would accept such a deal. The value is barely enough for Kovalchuk, adding Armstrong doesn't make much sense.

Really? Two young top-six forwards, a first round pick, and a solid young defenseman isn't enough value? When has a superstar been traded for that much? Atlanta traded Hossa for two third-liners, a decent prospect in Esposito, and a low-first. Richards garnered a good goaltender + junk. San Jose's offer trumps those pretty clearly...

Armstrong isn't a top six player. I can't see him being a deal-breaker.

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Old
05-13-2009, 01:38 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btn View Post
After watching the Hossa situation unfold, I think it is the smart move. If Ilya is unsigned it will become a huge morale issue on the team. It would be best to trade him while he has more value, and so you can get the team headed in the right direction from training camp on.

I agree with you on the value as well, adding Armstrong turns this from a good deal to a crap deal IMO.
I have a hard time believing Armstrong alone is responsible for such a difference. Despite his value to the fanbase as a fan favorite, the addition of Armstrong isn't preventing Waddel from pulling the trigger...

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Old
05-13-2009, 02:54 PM
  #37
Rhodes 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
I have a hard time believing Armstrong alone is responsible for such a difference. Despite his value to the fanbase as a fan favorite, the addition of Armstrong isn't preventing Waddel from pulling the trigger...
armstrong is an alternate captain, scored 22 goals, and is a heart and soul kinda guy to the team. he has a lot more value to the thrashers than he does to the sharks therefore it would require overpayment from a sharks point of view to get him

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Old
05-13-2009, 02:57 PM
  #38
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Not a good trade.

The Sharks have some serious issues with their leadership group. Obviously their early exits haven't been the coaches fault and this year only proved that. Thornton has ZERO heart, all the skill in the world, but no heart. I wouldn't trade away their emerging core. Sharks need to start thinking about overhauling their leadership group or this team will continue their early exits. That's just my take after watching them falter year after year after year.

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Old
05-13-2009, 03:18 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
San Jose sends:
Ryane Clowe
Milan Michalek
Derek Joslin
1st in 2010 (if Kovy re-signs)

for
Kovalchuk
Colby Armstrong
Scott Lehman/Brett Skinner

Atlanta gets two legit top-six forwards who are defensively capable to round out their top six core. Ryane Clowe especially could turn into a very good power forward. The obligatory first in 2010 is there if Kovy re-signs, and Derek Joslin is an eventual top-4 defenseman who is ready for NHL time right now, and could battle guys like Valabik, Exelby, and Samela for that top-four spot. Atlanta sheds a bit of salary in Lehman or Skinner. San Jose gets a dynamic goal scorer in Kovalchuk, perhaps the last thing missing from their lineup (on paper), a gritty bottom-six player, and take some salary off Atlanta's hand while getting a reserve player. San Jose probably tries to acquire the rights to Reasoner as well.
Atlanta's forward lines after this:

Michalek - White - Little
Kozlov - Peverley - Clowe

San Jose's forward lines:

Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Kovalchuk-Pavelski-Couture
Moen-Mitchell-Armstrong
Not even close. In fact, maybe the most one sided trade I've seen on this board. Phillips Arena calls in an attempted robbery after a phone call like this.

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Old
05-13-2009, 04:31 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by JT 91 NYI View Post
Not even close. In fact, maybe the most one sided trade I've seen on this board. Phillips Arena calls in an attempted robbery after a phone call like this.
Oh believe me, there is worse. MUCH worse.

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Old
05-13-2009, 04:34 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by JT 91 NYI View Post
Not even close. In fact, maybe the most one sided trade I've seen on this board. Phillips Arena calls in an attempted robbery after a phone call like this.
Thats a lie.

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Old
05-13-2009, 04:44 PM
  #42
Rhodes 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JT 91 NYI View Post
Not even close. In fact, maybe the most one sided trade I've seen on this board. Phillips Arena calls in an attempted robbery after a phone call like this.
i've seen much worse, although the more i think about it, the more this trade looks like a bad one

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Old
05-13-2009, 05:11 PM
  #43
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Kovalchuk 2nd LINE LOL FUNNY just gonna make him choke (dont go to sj)

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Old
05-13-2009, 10:26 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13goleafsgo13 View Post
Kovalchuk 2nd LINE LOL FUNNY just gonna make him choke (dont go to sj)
that was a great post, thank you so much for that......

I would love SJ to get Kovy but I just don't see it happening.

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Old
05-13-2009, 10:28 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by 13goleafsgo13 View Post
Kovalchuk 2nd LINE LOL FUNNY just gonna make him choke (dont go to sj)
LOL MAPLE LEAFS

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Old
05-13-2009, 11:46 PM
  #46
OrrNumber4
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Originally Posted by 13goleafsgo13 View Post
Kovalchuk 2nd LINE LOL FUNNY just gonna make him choke (dont go to sj)
You know some teams have more than one good line...some even have 1a and 1b lines...but I guess you wouldn't know about that being a Leafs fan.

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Old
05-14-2009, 12:00 AM
  #47
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Totally lopsided deal IMO

Waddell might take it though - considering that guy's track record

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Old
05-14-2009, 12:34 AM
  #48
OrrNumber4
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To all of those calling it a bad deal, show me a deal in recent history where a star player garnered more than this return. Throw in the fact that Kovalchuk doesn't want to be in Atlanta, that he only has a year left on his contract, and that he isn't really playoff-tested.

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Old
05-14-2009, 03:02 AM
  #49
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If the Sharks are interested in Kovalchuk, it starts with either Marleau or Vlasic

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Old
05-14-2009, 03:07 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
If the Sharks are interested in Kovalchuk, it starts with either Marleau or Vlasic
Even though I would miss him, if Marleau agreed to waive his NTC, I would make him the centerpiece of a Kovalchuk deal for sure.

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