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Vinny to LA Pretty Much Done Deal???

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:09 PM
  #276
The Pucks
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Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
I realise, but if a GM is willing to get nasty, the player often has little choice in waiving his NMC. I don't think there's any doubt the Dan Boyle situation is on Lecavalier's mind.
The thing is with a NMC over a NTC, the player has hall the power. Boyle had a NTC if I am not mistaken, so the team can put him on waivers, if he clears he goes to the minors and has to ride the bus to cash his cheques.

With a NMC he cant be put on waivers, he cant be sent to the minors and as long as he shows up at the rink, he gets to cash his cheques.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:19 PM
  #277
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I was waiting for you to tell us all about honest Bob.
I don't need to. The league and those living outside the little bubble of Florida know.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:19 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
When comparing fellow university players I think it is a fair comparison.

JJ was projected to be a top 1-2 guy and special team quarterback

In the minds of kings fans is that still the case?

When I look at drafted players I use the 5 year rule.

For those who do not know what the 5 year rule is, put it mildly. It is the 5 years after a player is taken in the first round that it is time to be critical and start passing judgement. Becuase JJ came out of Uni, it is a little harder to critique his development and that is one of the reasons I used two other uni players as yard sticks. neither Greene nor Gilbert came with as much ink as JJ did and both have developed and have shown good development. JJ was hampered by injuries and that is why I then gave the Van Ryn comparison.

JJ was taken 3rd overall in the 2005 draft, so we have had 2006, 2007, 2008 and not the forth coming 2009 draft. Putting JJ on the cusp of the 5 year rule. (05-06-07-08-09) and it is time to evaluate his development. At 22 years of age he will give you an idea of just how much more he will develop.

JJ has been passed by other, less hyped University players who have come out of the same system he came out of.

Whenever I hear--oh he was injured and therefor his grade is incomplete I shake my head.

The kings have better d prospects and that is one of the reasons JJ's name is coming up more and more all the time. He was the golden boy for two seasons, but now both Quincey and Doughty have passed him on the depth chart and the job that the kings would have liked to have given to him have now gone to other d-man and JJ's role will be refined and JJ may not be the guy who the kings need in that role and a role that JJ can't do.

My biggest concern for JJ is the work in his own zone and sometimes the lack there of it.

But, everyone is entitled to their opinion--I am just giving mine--that the flags are now raised on JJ and just how good of a d-man he will be. the pts comparison in JJ's case I think is correct--becuase he was projected to be the quarterback of special teams and not a shut down d-man like Greene
Which university dmen has passed him? Jack is a 22 year old dman. Jack has never lost spot with the Kings. He has never been given an offensive spot. He got a shot at the PP for 18 games at the end of last year where he scored 10 of his points. Most Kings fans are torn as to who is the best between Doughty and Jack. Fact is that when Jack came back from injury the Kings won almost twice as much finishing the year. He has now played only two professional seasons. The 5 games that he was called up to finish the 07 season was to sell jerseys. I still can't believe the Kings blew a year of his contract for 5 games of marketing scheme.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:20 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
The thing is with a NMC over a NTC, the player has hall the power. Boyle had a NTC if I am not mistaken, so the team can put him on waivers, if he clears he goes to the minors and has to ride the bus to cash his cheques.

With a NMC he cant be put on waivers, he cant be sent to the minors and as long as he shows up at the rink, he gets to cash his cheques.
You can still waive a player even with an NMC. They just can't assign him to their AHL affiliate w/o his permission.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:25 PM
  #280
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not if this was mentioned or not, but on HNIC -hotstove, Al Strachan stated it again that VL is on his way to the Kings. http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/hock...nada/hotstove/



Take it for what it's worth.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:30 PM
  #281
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Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
I was a big fan of JJ--after watching the last few seasons, I have become concerned and think there was more hype then was needed.

I remember when JJ was in collage and people talked about him. Oilers had a collage guy named Tom Gilbert who paled in comparison to JJ.

I saw Gilbert play and I was shocked how good he was, when I look at JJ I do not see the same type of hockey sense that Gilbert has and I am concerned that JJ is going to Mike Van Ryn mock II.

I re-read a few of Van Ryn's scouting reports and many of them look similier to that of JJ.

It may just be me, but I think there is some concern over JJ's future.
This has nothing to do with JJ's father and the reports of other stuff going.

I know kings fans wont like the comparison, but that is my view as someone who is an outsider
Please post these scouting reports. Van Ryn and JJ's reports are not even close, nor is their games.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:36 PM
  #282
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Originally Posted by hkyplyr16 View Post
This in my opinion is the fairest deal for both sides

TO TAMPA

Jack Johnson
Ted Purcell
Jarrett Stoll
2009 1st

To Kings

Lecavalier
LOL@ Teddy Purcell. That guy is highly overrated.

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Old
05-23-2009, 10:43 PM
  #283
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Originally Posted by FireStevensDotCom View Post
LOL@ Teddy Purcell. That guy is highly overrated.
How so? I'm curious. I'm not saying he's going to be a star but he has shown enough to be part of a trade proposal.

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:20 PM
  #284
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I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:23 PM
  #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:28 PM
  #286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
not so good, al

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:29 PM
  #287
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Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
That made me spit out the beer I was sipping!

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:46 PM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
I just vomited a little in my mouth! That has got to be the biggest overpayment of a deal I have ever seen.

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:47 PM
  #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
and cue keyboard cat

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:49 PM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Brooklyndevil View Post
If Tampa was to get JJ, would that mean they draft Duchene over Hedman?
Brian Lawton at the podium:
"With the second pick in the 2009 Entry Draft, the Tampa Bay Lightning are proud to select, John Tavares."
.
.
"With the fifth pick in the 2009 Entry Draft, the Tampa Bay Lightning select, Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson."

Lawton post draft interview:
"JT and MPS were the BPA. Together with SS, our group of forwards will be dynamic. We also think the recent addition of JJ (22) is a strong fit with our young blueline core of Paul Ranger (24), Andrej Meszaros (23), Matt Lashoff (22), Matt Smaby (24). We feel very encouraged by the development of younger d-men, Wishart (21) and Mihalik (22) as well."

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Old
05-23-2009, 11:58 PM
  #291
CloutierForVezina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
I think Tampa needs to their second and third '09 and LA needs to add a salary dump in Brown and Frolov and its a fair deal imo

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:07 AM
  #292
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Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
I think Tampa needs to their second and third '09 and LA needs to add a salary dump in Brown and Frolov and its a fair deal imo
That's even WORSE. Salary dump Brown, haha...oh wait you were serious.

Kurrilino is going to come in soon and step on your head!

Oh wait, looking at your screen name, perhaps this is all just in farce.

- R

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:13 AM
  #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
unfortunately, no one else will......

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:18 AM
  #294
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Originally Posted by BrokeBearMountain View Post
Not really, they don't have to trade him. Your package though is pretty nice. I really like Boyle, Hickey, Moller i'm on the fence about and the 5th is excellent. I'd pull the trigger.
Just a note to TB fans, if you guys want to replace Johnson in these proposals with any defenseman in the system other than Doughty, I think most Kings fans would be quite happy about that.

The recent discussions (or rather speculation) about Johnson's attitude and father and such combined with his performance in this past injury-riddled season have clouded everyone's perception of his true worth (including Kings fans').

If I'm Tampa, if Johnson isn't included in a deal with Lecavalier, I walk away from the table.

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:30 AM
  #295
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After reading nearly a dozen pages, a few things seem to jump out at me that I feel needs pointing out for both the Tampa and LA fans.

To Tampa and non-LA fans -
1) There are very, very few teams bidding for Lecavalier, like four or less due to his cap hit. We aren't lowballing his value as a player. But in the cap age, you have to figure in current and future contract cap hit number along with talent. And there are very few teams that can not only fit Vinny in, but also have the goods to offer too that Tampa should want. LA is possibly the premier team in that regard with prospects, young players and the high draft pick, and a willingness to move those assets. If Tampa wants to get rid of that contract, they will have to settle a bit on the offers. They aren't going to get back what they would have before the lockout.

2) LA's greatest need is LW, not Center. We can use a center but we aren't going to trade you Frolov, Doughty, Brown or Kopitar to get him. We're not trying to spin our wheels here and trading those NHL guys that fill key roster spots to get another player to fill a roster spot is exactly that.

3) Preissing is going to have to go to Tampa as part of the switching of salaries or TB will have to eat a chunk of VC's contract for the future. I'm pretty sure getting Preissing and waiting out his short contract is much more appealing.


To LA Fans
1) The point of getting Lecavalier is to not only get that 1A center with Kopitar being 1B, but also to help ensure that a talented UFA winger will want to sign here and play with a top center. HF boarders don't think about this much but I'm sure NHL players think heavily about their team mates, coaches and organizations they go to. Remember when Gomez, Drury AND Briere all said no to LA and we had to settle for Nagy and Calder?

2) Until we know for a fact that Johnson wants out, we shouldn't offer him up so easily. He can play in the NHL, which is still unknown about Hickey, Voynov, Martinez and Teubert. And his value is super-low right now. The #5 pick's value, especially to Tampa, is very high right now.


Basically I think Lombardi only pulls the trigger on this if he feels he knows he will get a Hossa or Gaborik to handshake promise to come to LA if he gets Lecavalier. How he gets all that to fit under the cap should be interesting while re-signing Frolov and Johnson but we probably have enough to do it. I seriously doubt either of those guys will get that much money considering how much DL emphasizes that players who haven't contributed much to the team's success shouldn't get paid much, like he did with Cammalleri. And the Kings have had zero success lately.

- R

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:42 AM
  #296
CloutierForVezina
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That's even WORSE. Salary dump Brown, haha...oh wait you were serious.

Kurrilino is going to come in soon and step on your head!

Oh wait, looking at your screen name, perhaps this is all just in farce.

- R
But Brown has no upside! He regressed from scoring 33 goals last year to 24 this year, so he'll probably go down to 15 next year, 4 the year after and get 5 own goals the year after that. Trust me when I say tampa is doing LA a favour by taking him off your hands. Heck, why not just send him to Vancouver packaged with your 1st and we'll give you the rights to Ohlund and call it even.

I can even promise you that Burrows will pull the hair of any man who makes fun of Brown's lisp. Watch out Avery!


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Old
05-24-2009, 01:35 AM
  #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
I can see the riot in LA that will occur if this happens... It will make the Rodney King riot look like a peace rally...

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Old
05-24-2009, 01:36 AM
  #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
"Ah yes, I remember my first beer..."

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Old
05-24-2009, 01:39 AM
  #299
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Originally Posted by Geno12 View Post
Vinny is going to Los Angeles. . or Montreal. . . or Columbus. . .or maybe Boston. . possibly. . .Florida. . . could be Vancouver . ..or Nashville. . don't forget about Phoenix. . . St.Louis is also a front runner. .. .. . ok i'm done.
Don't forget Toronto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
I heard about it during tonight's game, Lecavlier to the Kings makes sense to me, here's how I would work such a deal:

To Tampa Bay

Anze Kopitar
Drew Doughty
L.A.'s 1st Round Pick
A top FW or D prospect from L.A.

To Los Angeles

Vincent Lecavlier
They let spec ed out early, or did you trip and fall and hit your head on the sidewalk when leaving Harvard University ?

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Old
05-24-2009, 05:57 AM
  #300
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Who would they trade for him? Id be stoked at Vinnt in LA.

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