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Dreger: Redden, Staal, Dubinsky for Kaberle, Stralman, Leafs 1st

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:24 AM
  #51
grabo84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
On top of that, while an hefty price, you are getting a guy that still can be in any top 6 while Kaberle could be out of New York in 1 year.

Sorry, don't see the problem as far as the Leafs are concerned.
Kaberle is signed for two more years. Maybe look that up before spouting off next time?

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:24 AM
  #52
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Please understand. There is NO WAY we take on the salary from Redden unless we get something special. Dubinsky and Staal are that, but to give up 1st, Kaberle and Stralman? no way in hell

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05-24-2009, 11:27 AM
  #53
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if they took out the redden contract and torontos 1st, then yes.
Otherwise it would cost NYR more to get rid of that atrocious contract.

Hell, at least take blake or stempniak or something....that deal is ********.

my counter;
kaberle for redden, dubinsky, staal, late 1st
that is how terrible redden is.

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:27 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
right, a guy that is actually still injured with a torn acl will be better than staal. staal has also maxed out his potential at the age of 22.
hahahaha what does this even mean?

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:30 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by dubey View Post
hahahaha what does this even mean?
u seriously dont understand what that means?

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:35 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Kaberle is probably on his way out next year. Stralman's is still an unproven prospect that could go either way. The 7th is the most interesting thing here since it could one of MSP, Schenn or any other at that point. But for the price of 1 great prospect and 1 unproven kid, you are getting 2 proven young kids. So how the heck do you lose when Toronto is still ready to not be a cup contender next year? Do you really need the final year of Kaberle to make a difference? You are in a rebuilding mode and clearly getting Dubinsky and Staal speeds up the recovery. Stralman is by far not Marc Staal. And Dubinsky for the next 2 years easily will be better than the prospect that you'll have with your 7th pick. On top of that, while an hefty price, you are getting a guy that still can be in any top 6 while Kaberle could be out of New York in 1 year.

Sorry, don't see the problem as far as the Leafs are concerned.
Actually Kaberle has two years left on his contract, and Stralman isn't unproven... he's got 88 games of NHL experience under his belt, but we had a crowded blueline and unlike others he didn't have to clear waivers.

The way I see the trade breaking down:

7th Overall = Staal
Kaberle > Dubinsky
Stralman > Redden

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05-24-2009, 11:43 AM
  #57
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I have to say I think Leaf fans are being pretty thick headed on this.

There is no way in hell Staal is only worth the 7th overall pick. It's simple taking a proven top player over an unproven pick. There are so many examples of player's picked at 7 that didn't make it. Would you trade Mark Staal for Manny Maholtra, Lars Jonsson or Kris Beech.

The fact that here on futures people over value picks is obvious, but this one is simply stupid. The best case scenario for TOR with the 7th pick is getting a guy as good as Staal, but it is in no way a given.

I actually find it funny that in one thread people are trading the moon for Jack Johnson and in this thread Staal is only worth the 7th pick. JJ is a huge step down from Staal imo.

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05-24-2009, 11:44 AM
  #58
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The thing for me is that none of Staal, Dubie, or Redden make me want to give up the 7th pick. Remember we're trying to rebuild and probably move up in the draft, not move down.

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05-24-2009, 11:46 AM
  #59
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Looks like both team's fans don't like the deal so it could be for real...

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05-24-2009, 11:46 AM
  #60
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Kaberle, Blake, and 7th

for

Redden, Staal, and Dubinsky

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:48 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kshahdoo View Post
Looks like both team's fans don't like the deal so it could be for real...
those are the deals I love

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05-24-2009, 11:49 AM
  #62
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I could see the Rangers giving up a lot just to get rid of Redden. I guess this deal is possible.

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05-24-2009, 11:49 AM
  #63
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Really this trade makes no sense from either side. No way should the Rangers be interested in trading away Staal, no way the Leafs should be interested in trading away the 7th overall (unless to move up in the draft), and NO WAY SHOULD THE LEAFS BE INTERESTED IN PICKING UP REDDEN'S CONTRACT.

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:49 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffleafsfan91 View Post
Kaberle, Blake, and 7th

for

Redden, Staal, and Dubinsky
thats worse for us than the original rumor. to us staal has a lot more value than the 7th. dubinsky has a lot more value than blake. kaberle has a lot more value than redden but getting kaberle and blake does not make us a contender now and cripples us in the future if the 7th doesnt pan out.

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05-24-2009, 11:51 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace88 View Post
take out redden and Leafs first, add Del Zotto and one of the Leafs 2nds, and i'd do it. Otherwise no chance in hell. I actually facepalmed irl when i read that.
lol.

Dubinsky, Staal and Del Zotto for Kaberle, Stralman and a 2nd? \

Please pass whatever you are smoking this way. Kaberle isn't worth near as much as you think.

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:52 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JT 91 NYI View Post
I could see the Rangers giving up a lot just to get rid of Redden. I guess this deal is possible.
As much as I would like to get rid of Redden's contract, there's no way I would give away 2 good young players to do it.

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05-24-2009, 11:54 AM
  #67
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At first, I saw Staal and Toronto and thought of Staal and Schenn together and that would almost be enough to make me a leafs fan. But then I seen garbage like Redden, who has no value at all.

There's no way the leafs are moving up for Tavares, so maybe work around something like the 7th for Staal.

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:56 AM
  #68
ecemleafs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
lol.

Dubinsky, Staal and Del Zotto for Kaberle, Stralman and a 2nd? \

Please pass whatever you are smoking this way. Kaberle isn't worth near as much as you think.
del zotto, staal, sanguinetti, callahan, dubinsky, grachev, anisimov, 1st 09, 1st 2010

for

kaberle
5th rounder

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05-24-2009, 11:58 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Kaberle is probably on his way out next year.
Doesn't mean his value is less just because he is slated to be traded .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Stralman's is still an unproven prospect that could go either way. The 7th is the most interesting thing here since it could one of MSP, Schenn or any other at that point. But for the price of 1 great prospect and 1 unproven kid, you are getting 2 proven young kids. So how the heck do you lose when Toronto is still ready to not be a cup contender next year?
Proven or not proven , this is all about potential . Dubinsky is 23 and has hit barely the 40 point mark over his past 2 seasons . We have those in the mold of Stajan , Grabovsky , etc . We also have a Tyler Bozak . At this point , if we trade the 7th pick AND Anton Stralman , we want a 1st line player now or for the future . And a good one at that .

Marc Staal is great and all , but Tomas Kaberle is good for a 1st round pick + mid-to-top level prospect .


Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Do you really need the final year of Kaberle to make a difference?
Don't know where you are getting this , because Tomas Kaberle is signed through the 2010-2011 NHL season at a VERY friendly cap hit at $4,250,000 .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
You are in a rebuilding mode and clearly getting Dubinsky and Staal speeds up the recovery.
Yeah but Burke won't complete a trade that doesn't make sense at all , for the sake of getting proven youngsters to Toronto .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Stralman is by far not Marc Staal. And Dubinsky for the next 2 years easily will be better than the prospect that you'll have with your 7th pick. On top of that, while an hefty price, you are getting a guy that still can be in any top 6 while Kaberle could be out of New York in 1 year.
The 7th overall pick will get us an elite NHL prospect . I would be surprised if that prospect is not MUCH more valuable to any NHL team than what Dubinsky is at the age of 23 . I can even see a guy like Jared Cowen , who was slated to be #3 in the draft by the majority of scouts for the majority of the hockey season until the injury , to be just as good maybe even better than Marc Staal .

Wade Redden is signed to an albatross of a contract . $6,500,000 cap hit for the next 5 seasons . Famous due to his offensive game , he scored just 3 goals and 26 points in 81 games this past season . NO THANKS !

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Old
05-24-2009, 11:59 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Chayos View Post
I have to say I think Leaf fans are being pretty thick headed on this.

There is no way in hell Staal is only worth the 7th overall pick. It's simple taking a proven top player over an unproven pick. There are so many examples of player's picked at 7 that didn't make it. Would you trade Mark Staal for Manny Maholtra, Lars Jonsson or Kris Beech.
Most Leaf fans would probably deal Staal for the 7th. The problem lies with giving away Kaberle and his replacement, Stralman, for the biggest albatross contract in the league and Dubinsky, who is potentially a very decent second line centre. Like I said, if Redden becomes Roszival, this deal becomes a bit more palatable.

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05-24-2009, 11:59 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by drofnats View Post
Actually Kaberle has two years left on his contract, and Stralman isn't unproven... he's got 88 games of NHL experience under his belt, but we had a crowded blueline and unlike others he didn't have to clear waivers.

The way I see the trade breaking down:

7th Overall = Staal
Kaberle > Dubinsky
Stralman > Redden
An unknown player that has never played in the NHL is equal to a 22 yo shutdown dman? If the Rangers offered Staal for Kaberle straight up the leafs would take it and run.

I can't wait for the day when Kaberle actually gets traded. Leaf fans are going to be sorely disappointed with the return.

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:00 PM
  #72
TheLeastOfTheBunch
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Quote:
Stralman > Redden
It's funny that Anton Stralman was on pace for more points this season than what Redden had at the end of the NHL regular season .

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:01 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
lol.

Dubinsky, Staal and Del Zotto for Kaberle, Stralman and a 2nd? \

Please pass whatever you are smoking this way. Kaberle isn't worth near as much as you think.
KAberle = Staal more or less
Stralman = Del Zotto
Dubinsky would not get more than a 2nd round pick in a trade.

not to mention we already have like 3 2nd-line centres so Dubinsky isn't worth that much to us. There's no way you can argue that Del Z is better than Stralman, so the deciding factor is Staal's age vs Kaberle's age. However as has been bandied about way too much, Kabs is on a good contract and can help you win now, which you need, so i dont see a problem with this trade. Sather might not budge though if Redden isn't involved. Then again, he's a total moron so maybe he does.

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:06 PM
  #74
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That's an interesting rumor. But clearly a deal that favors the Rangers:

Redden <<< Kaberle
Staal = 7th overall
Dubinsky > Stralman

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Old
05-24-2009, 12:07 PM
  #75
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Counter Offer:
To New York Rangers: Tomas Kaberle, Matt Stajan, Jiri Tlusty
To Toronto: Marc Staal, Brandon Dubinsky, Dale Weise, 2nd 2010.

Kaberle=Marc Staal <---- Kaberle is a lot better right now, but Staal has much more upside.

Jiri Tlusty=Dubinsky <---- Tlusty lit it up in the AHL this year. He has major potential... but might not reach it. DUbinsky will likely be a solid 2nd line centerman.

Stajan=Weise and 2nd 2010 <---- Stajan is extremely underrated, and would be a great addition behind Gomez and Drury. He can compete for 1st/2nd line minutes, and would do a good job filling the 1st/2nd line roles if Drury or Gomez get injured.

Thoughts?

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