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Phaneuf to Florida Close

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Old
05-30-2009, 10:15 PM
  #76
SpezDispenser
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There's no way Horton's not a part of that deal. Phaneuf for J-Bo's rights? C'mon.

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05-30-2009, 10:18 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
There were only 5 players to play over 26 minutes a game on average...Phaneuf was one of them. He had a bad season, but not bad enough that the Flames will trade him.
I feel so dirty sticking up for one of the "Phlegms"
To the extent it says anything, doesn't that say more about why Kennan was right to be fired than why Phaneuf should be let off the hook for his consistently awful defensive play? I mean, any player can skate around for 26 minutes and play poorly. SHOULD he have been out there 26 minutes a night?

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05-30-2009, 10:30 PM
  #78
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Some of the comments in this thread literally have me "facepalming". Some people are so stupid it isn't even funny.

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05-30-2009, 10:35 PM
  #79
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heck I'd do Langkow and Phaneuf for Horton and a signed Jbo. Don't know what Florida thinks of it though.

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Old
05-30-2009, 10:38 PM
  #80
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as an oiler fan, I hope the Flames can find a way to hang on to the Dion.

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Old
05-31-2009, 12:33 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by PhilaFlyers View Post
heck I'd do Langkow and Phaneuf for Horton and a signed Jbo. Don't know what Florida thinks of it though.
Not a Dion fan at all seeing him play a lot living in the city,but that deal would be hard for FLA. to pass up seeing as Bou is a UFA. soon.

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05-31-2009, 01:46 AM
  #82
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I can't believe some are even contemplating this as rational. Unless Horton is involved, this is the worst rumour Ek has ever imagined. The entire flames org would have to eat lead paint chips for a year to be stupid enough to trade Phaneuf for Bouwmeester's rights.

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05-31-2009, 02:00 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by CapsWolverinesUSA View Post
In non-shorthanded situations, Calgary allowed 188 goals this past season. Phaneuf was on the ice for 98 of them. I understand that seeing a player night in and night out provides added perspective, but that statistic is incredibly damning to anyone trying to argue Phaneuf had any semblance of a successful defensive season.
again i reiterate he was playing with a hip injury since october and couldn't hit with his outside hip... most of those goals were off the rush where he couldnt hit and didnthave the acceleration to keep up to the player... but for the first time in his career Phaneuf was a staple on the PK and was a key reason that it was top 3 until late in the season... a player as poor defensively as people make him out to be on here would not have any kind of success on the penalty kill

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Old
05-31-2009, 05:01 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
again i reiterate he was playing with a hip injury since october and couldn't hit with his outside hip... most of those goals were off the rush where he couldnt hit and didnthave the acceleration to keep up to the player... but for the first time in his career Phaneuf was a staple on the PK and was a key reason that it was top 3 until late in the season... a player as poor defensively as people make him out to be on here would not have any kind of success on the penalty kill
Excuses. He should have had surgery or sat. All these Flames fans in the city using the injury excuse AFTER they lose in the 1st round. I did not hear the Dion injury stuff EARLIER in the year. Smug Keenan and co.

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05-31-2009, 06:06 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by andy View Post
Eklund has it has an e4. And is saying that it is every close to being done. I want buy this, why would Calgary trade Phaneuf for Jay Bouwmeester's rights. Why not wait until July . (cap issues may be a problem).
What do u all think?

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...-Tampa/1/21381
If Calgary thinks he will sign with them, why not keep Phaneuf or trade him somewhere else?

How about a Phaneuf/Spezza package or something? Maybe they will need to clear cap space so maybe a Phaneuf to the Isles for Hunter/Gervais and SJ #1/NYI #2?

Clears off 4 million...

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Old
05-31-2009, 06:14 AM
  #86
Darius Dangleaitis
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If Eklund gave me a dollar I'd check to see if it was counterfeit.
/thread

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Old
05-31-2009, 06:48 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Are we talking about his fantasy league numerical "value"...or his on-ice NHL value?

Watch the guy regularly. He's a superb player, not even hitting his prime yet.

***

For that matter, those ripping Phaneuf ought to revisit his age and NHL experience. It takes time (years) for dmen to round out their game. Guy remains immensely talented and has time on his side.

This board ought to be renamed: hockeysabsurdrushtojudgement.com
The problem is Dion took a step backwards this past year. Yes, I know about the injury but if it was really bad enough to affect his decision making defensively then he should have been sitting out. Also he is being paid 6.5 for the rest of eternity, it's one thing if a guy has a long contract like that who is really good and might improve to great (Bouw fits this category), but Phaneuf is terrible and might improve to anywhere from just okay to great.

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Old
05-31-2009, 07:20 AM
  #88
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So, basically, Phaneuf to Florida is 100% not happening. Cool.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:45 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by CanadianPantherFan View Post
Excuses. He should have had surgery or sat. All these Flames fans in the city using the injury excuse AFTER they lose in the 1st round. I did not hear the Dion injury stuff EARLIER in the year. Smug Keenan and co.
Why would they release the fact that Phaneuf had a big hip problem? Teams would target that hip all season long.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:51 AM
  #90
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Bouw should rather go to Van. Their defensive system is a much better fit for him. It'll make him look better than he is, just like Luongo. On top of it, it's not that far from Calgary, no major cap issues like on Flames team, and a better chance to win a cup. Alternatively, he could go to the Oilers. But we'll need to move someone to fit Bouw under the cap.

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05-31-2009, 10:41 AM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianPantherFan View Post
Excuses. He should have had surgery or sat. All these Flames fans in the city using the injury excuse AFTER they lose in the 1st round. I did not hear the Dion injury stuff EARLIER in the year. Smug Keenan and co.
That's because they didn't confirm it until after the Chicago series was over.

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:53 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by CanadianPantherFan View Post
Excuses. He should have had surgery or sat. All these Flames fans in the city using the injury excuse AFTER they lose in the 1st round. I did not hear the Dion injury stuff EARLIER in the year. Smug Keenan and co.
actually Flames have fans been speculating for a long time he had a serious injury... most thought it was his shoulder not his hip though

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:14 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by CanadianPantherFan View Post
Excuses. He should have had surgery or sat. All these Flames fans in the city using the injury excuse AFTER they lose in the 1st round. I did not hear the Dion injury stuff EARLIER in the year. Smug Keenan and co.
Really? If a player had an injury significant enough to limit that said player's ability why would it be wise to publish this fact to mass media and in turn the other 29 teams in the league? That'd be simply idiotic.

Should he have sat and got the surgery? Perhaps, but I don't believe that was an option that was ever really contemplated, he played on some nights like he had lost a step. There's two reasons he may have done this, either he was injured, or he took a step backwards. Flames confirmed it was an injury, Phaneuf is 24 years old, I have a hard time believing that he is regressing defensively as a player getting 26 minutes of ice and playing on the same team as one of the league's better defensive stalwart's in Robyn Regehr.

You say, excuses excuses, well no, I don't think anyone is coming out here and saying the Flames would have won the Cup if they were not injured. Or Phaneuf would have easily won the Norris if healthy. They aren't saying "but if..." or the Flames "would have...", they are simply saying that Phaneuf's injury is a probable factor for his perceived step backwards defensively this year, and that I think is a viable and realistic perception. It'd be silly to say that if he did indeed have a significant hip injury that required surgery that it had no negative consequences on his play this year.

No one is looking for excuses, but face the facts, a hip injury in general to any player at this level would limit their ability to play to the best of their ability, even more so to a player who's style is tailored to being physical and requiring mobility.

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:15 AM
  #94
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. . . ok Eklund. . . . get back in your cage. .

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:58 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by JT 91 NYI View Post
If Calgary thinks he will sign with them, why not keep Phaneuf or trade him somewhere else?

How about a Phaneuf/Spezza package or something? Maybe they will need to clear cap space so maybe a Phaneuf to the Isles for Hunter/Gervais and SJ #1/NYI #2?

Clears off 4 million...
The issue as I see it is that you can't trade Phaneuf before acquiring J-Bo's rights and sign him to an extension, and as soon as you do that, Phaneuf's value goes down because CAL likely has to move him for cap reasons.

People are looking at the players value in a vaccuum without taking into account the salary cap. If (and it's a HUGE IF) Sutter thinks that CAL is better off with J-Bo than Dion, and he able to get something good with J-Bo's negotiating rights (FLA 1st round DP in 2009), I don't know why it's a bad deal, except for the opportunity cost of getting more for DP after signing JB, which has significant risks. Ask Tallon how hard it was to move Bulin after signing Huet.

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Old
05-31-2009, 01:13 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Beukeboom Fan View Post
Ask Tallon how hard it was to move Bulin after signing Huet.
How can you even compare thw two situations??

One is an early 20s, #1 D who can play on your team for the next decade plus, the other is a very old #1 goalie whose future is unkown.

If Phaneuf becomes available, 29 other teams are interested.

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Old
05-31-2009, 01:28 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Patrick - Flames Fan View Post
How can you even compare thw two situations??

One is an early 20s, #1 D who can play on your team for the next decade plus, the other is a very old #1 goalie whose future is unkown.

If Phaneuf becomes available, 29 other teams are interested.

I'm just comparing them because Tallon supposedly had a deal done for Bulin before signing Huet, but the other party backed out after Huet was a Hawk. I realize that DP's got very significant value, but IMO that value is impacted if Calgary is able to sign J-Bo, and now would like to clear some salary. Just like how Khabibulin had very little value before Huet was signed, but it was even less when the Hawks were looking at having $13M tied up in goaltending. Other teams see that and use that leverage to send less value in a deal going the other way.

The way I see it:
1) DP doesn't get traded before J-Bo rights are acquired & signed LT.
2) If CAL is allowed to talk w/ J-Bo's agent prior to draft day, and come to a long term agreement, doesn't some sort of deal make sense?
3) If CAL feels J-Bo is a better long term fit than DP, some sort of J-Bo's rights (assuming pre-agreement on a long term deal) + FLA's 1st round draft pick for Phanuef MIGHT make sense. It all depends on what kind of value DP has if the Flames are in a cap situation after a J-Bo signing.

I agree that it's not likely, but I think there are a couple of scenarios on how a deal MIGHT play out. Just IMO.

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Old
05-31-2009, 02:04 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Beukeboom Fan View Post
...People are looking at the players value in a vaccuum without taking into account the salary cap. If (and it's a HUGE IF) Sutter thinks that CAL is better off with J-Bo than Dion, and he able to get something good with J-Bo's negotiating rights (FLA 1st round DP in 2009), I don't know why it's a bad deal, except for the opportunity cost of getting more for DP after signing JB, which has significant risks. Ask Tallon how hard it was to move Bulin after signing Huet.
Agreed. According to Bettman's comments yesterday the cap for the 2009-2010 season will either decrease by 5% or remain flat depending upon whether the players decide in June to exercise their 5% escalator. This means that the cap for 2009-10 will be somewhere in the $53-56 million dollar range. It is expected to decline the following season to around $50 million.

As a Panthers fan, I have already come to the conclusion that J-Bo is not worth $6.5 million per season. No doubt some team will pay him that much, after all that is basically what the Rangers agreed to pay Wayne Redden. But, that is just a function of the greater fool theory.

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Old
05-31-2009, 02:17 PM
  #99
s7ark
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Bouw should rather go to Van. Their defensive system is a much better fit for him. It'll make him look better than he is, just like Luongo. On top of it, it's not that far from Calgary, no major cap issues like on Flames team, and a better chance to win a cup. Alternatively, he could go to the Oilers. But we'll need to move someone to fit Bouw under the cap.
We can move people or bury them in the minors. If Bouw wants to come home, we'd have to make room somehow. After all, here he wouldn't have to be "the guy" right now as we have Souray and Lubo as vet leaders on the D. Plus all of his friends and family are already here and he summers here anyways. He just wouldn't have to move at the end of the summer.

And as a side benefit for the Oilers, having a Bouwmeester, Souray, Visnovsky, one of Gilbert/Grebs top 4 puts their D in contention with any in the league, outside of Detroit.

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Old
05-31-2009, 05:12 PM
  #100
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So saying all that...why would a team want to take a chance on Dion? I don't buy it was all injury related. He has BIG holes in his game right now. Enough that he is dropped off the 2010 Canadian Olympic team rankings. He has a lot to prove...banged up or not. Everyone laughs and drops their jaw when he knocks someone silly. I did not see the same when he got stood up by a Hawks player. Dion's style will not last like Bou's style. Dion= short shelve life. I would not want to trade for him and invest in that contract.

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