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Barret Jackman to the Islanders

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:50 AM
  #1
SLAPSHOT723
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Barret Jackman to the Islanders

The Islanders need help on defense, since Witt decided not to show up this season and I don't see him being here for too much of the future.

I'm a big fan of Jackman and I see him pairing well with Mark Streit. I could see Toronto's 2nd going to St. Louis, but what other assets would St. Louis want?

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05-31-2009, 11:45 AM
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Randall Ritchey
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2nd and a prospect would do fine for me.
2nd and David Toews?
We need room on our back line. We nab a 2nd and a solid prospect.
Would NYI do that?
Blues fans, would STL?

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05-31-2009, 12:02 PM
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CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oshniak View Post
2nd and a prospect would do fine for me.
2nd and David Toews?
We need room on our back line. We nab a 2nd and a solid prospect.
Would NYI do that?
Blues fans, would STL?
How far from unrestricted free agency is Jackman?

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05-31-2009, 12:05 PM
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Randall Ritchey
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
How far from unrestricted free agency is Jackman?
Jackman is UFA in 12-13

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05-31-2009, 12:59 PM
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Hipster Doofus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oshniak View Post
2nd and a prospect would do fine for me.
2nd and David Toews?
We need room on our back line. We nab a 2nd and a solid prospect.
Would NYI do that?
Blues fans, would STL?
Which 2nd? We have three this year. Boston's, Toronto's, and ours. I'd definitely move Toronto's + Toews for that deal, more than fair considering he has a few years till UFA.

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05-31-2009, 01:15 PM
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Randall Ritchey
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Toronto's (the 37th) and David Toews for Jackman would be fine with me.

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05-31-2009, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Satchmo View Post
How about an extended deal for the Sharks first rounder?

You guys on Long Island get Barret Jackman and St.Louis' 2nd rounder, while the Blues receive the 26th overall pick and maybe low round pick (4th/ 5th round.) Just an idea which probably needs of a bit of remodeling.

The TOR 2nd + .... for Jackman sounds interesting, too. How about Jesse Joensuu + Toronto's 2nd?

No interest in St. Louis' 2nd.
Isles like Joensuu a lot.A big kid, who's willing to go hard to the net.


Last edited by CREW99AW: 05-31-2009 at 03:34 PM.
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05-31-2009, 03:10 PM
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I like Jackman, I think he would fit in and we could use him for certain. His contract is desirable too. I would want to hang onto Joensuu, though. What about the Isles 2nd (31st) and a lower level prospect, like David Ullstrom. Big young swedish forward.

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05-31-2009, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oshniak View Post
2nd and a prospect would do fine for me.
2nd and David Toews?
We need room on our back line. We nab a 2nd and a solid prospect.
Would NYI do that?
Blues fans, would STL?
What a fantastic Idea...... Lets trade our top dman from last year for a 2nd and an average prospect. Great asset management. McKee would be our only vet.... I am sure we can get to playoff again.

Stupid fing idea.

We have no idea if Brewer will play. Leaving our D very short on experience.

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05-31-2009, 03:56 PM
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Isles stink and should continue to build thru the draft. Jackman has a concussion history. In other words. You should pass. Stick to drafting and worst case scenario, you could give up nothing to a team trying to dump salary because the Isles payroll is so low.

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05-31-2009, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Frenzy1 View Post
What a fantastic Idea...... Lets trade our top dman from last year for a 2nd and an average prospect. Great asset management. McKee would be our only vet.... I am sure we can get to playoff again.

Stupid fing idea.

We have no idea if Brewer will play. Leaving our D very short on experience.
I agree. I think the days of the Blues trading their better players for picks and/or prospects are over(or at least temporarily suspended).

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05-31-2009, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by youarentobjective View Post
Isles stink and should continue to build thru the draft. Jackman has a concussion history. In other words. You should pass. Stick to drafting and worst case scenario, you could give up nothing to a team trying to dump salary because the Isles payroll is so low.
The uninformed strikes again!!!!!

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05-31-2009, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Oscar the Grouch View Post
I agree. I think the days of the Blues trading their better players for picks and/or prospects are over(or at least temporarily suspended).
+1, We dont need anymore prospects if we're giving up a veteran Dman.

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05-31-2009, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youarentobjective View Post
Isles stink and should continue to build thru the draft. Jackman has a concussion history. In other words. You should pass. Stick to drafting and worst case scenario, you could give up nothing to a team trying to dump salary because the Isles payroll is so low.
I think you need to start watching hockey and stop trien to talk about it. I have yet to read anything you post that makes sense. As for the deal I would take a 2nd and Toews.

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05-31-2009, 05:20 PM
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Randall Ritchey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youarentobjective View Post
Isles stink and should continue to build thru the draft. Jackman has a concussion history. In other words. You should pass. Stick to drafting and worst case scenario, you could give up nothing to a team trying to dump salary because the Isles payroll is so low.
I'm beginning to think you don't like the Blues.

Please, give me some info on Jackman's concussion history.

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05-31-2009, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youarentobjective View Post
Isles stink and should continue to build thru the draft. Jackman has a concussion history. In other words. You should pass. Stick to drafting and worst case scenario, you could give up nothing to a team trying to dump salary because the Isles payroll is so low.
Did the Blues piss in your cornflakes or something?

Sheesh...

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05-31-2009, 06:04 PM
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Joensuu for Jackman?

A plodding forward yet to prove worthy of regular time beyond the AHL...for a proven, in-his prime Dman?

Snow does that in a nanosecond. Davidson/Pleau laugh.

On arguably the thinnest D corp in the league, Jackman becomes NYI's top minutes dman in all defensive situations (and a #2 overall).

Only thing worse that fans overrating their players are fans of lousy teams overrating their players.

Younger and cheaper (and home grown ) does not necessarily = better.

Sorry. One Isles fan calling it as he sees it.

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Old
05-31-2009, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Joensuu for Jackman?

A plodding forward yet to prove worthy of regular time beyond the AHL...for a proven, in-his prime Dman?

Snow does that in a nanosecond. Davidson/Pleau laugh.

On arguably the thinnest D corp in the league, Jackman becomes NYI's top minutes dman in all defensive situations (and a #2 overall).

Only thing worse that fans overrating their players are fans of lousy teams overrating their players.

Younger and cheaper (and home grown ) does not necessarily = better.

Sorry. One Isles fan calling it as he sees it.
Part of your point is very well taken and you have to give if you wish to receive and the Islanders require NHL ready talent for obvious reasons and NHL ready defensemen in their prime are obviously costly to acquire. That said Jackman being our #2 overall in our absence of other legitimate alternatives is not something to write home about.

On the other side of your equation...From what I've seen there was nothing plodding about Joensuu when he was up here. There's no reason to believe that his 72 AHL games and 7 NHL games combined are enough to quantify him so easily as you have done above simply because we're in need of defense.

We're also in need of forwards with size that can score goals as well who don't skate like they're carrying around bricks in their pants. Joensuu to me is the closest option from within to attempt to fill this need, perhaps Ullstrom follows soon thereafter.

Until we actually attempt to play the free agent market I do not have a strong desire to trade our close-to-ready prospects as it seems counterproductive. Indeed prospects here are overvalued at HF but removing one that seems likely to make an impact lessens the replacement value of the incoming player (unless we turn around another player as well.)

We need scorers (especially from the left side.) We need wingers with size and speed. We need defense. We need a 1a goalie. Our needs are many and our assets will only begin to look decent as a whole after this coming draft. Let's try and add assets without subtracting first, and then trade as an alternative as the dust begins to settle a little bit (if Jackman is truly available I see us more likely to trade for such an asset after this coming season...not before it unless we're in the playoff hunt nearing the deadline.)

I hope this doesn't appear like I'm jumping too far down your post Trottier because quite frankly I'm not saying I wouldn't do Joensuu + for Jackman and I'm not entirely disagreeing with your basic sentiment. I'm just saying it's not a trade I feel desperate to make at this time when I would like to see how Joensuu will contribute to this team next season and I believe we would be better off attempting to add a guy like Scuderi during UFA while aiming for a Jackman type acquisition at a later date depending on how the season progresses and as our most pressing needs become more clearly identified in the not-so-distant future (obviously, other UFA acquisitions will make an impact as well as prospects making the right out of the gate.)

I think I could have summed all of that up with "now is not really the time to trade Joensuu if there is an alternative."

,
Mitch

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05-31-2009, 08:21 PM
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On the other side of your equation...From what I've seen there was nothing plodding about Joensuu when he was up here.
Let's just say we'll file separate scouting reports. Guess Tomas Holmstrom is a speed burner, eh?

Quote:
We're also in need of forwards with size that can score goals as well who don't skate like they're carrying around bricks in their pants. Joensuu to me is the closest option from within to attempt to fill this need, perhaps Ullstrom follows soon thereafter.
I cannot draw my conclusions based on a smaller sample size...but you can draw this one? Hard convincing needed that this guy is a goal scorer of note. Even harder to suggest he is a proficient skater. But that's me.

Quote:
Until we actually attempt to play the free agent market I do not have a strong desire to trade our close-to-ready prospects as it seems counterproductive.
Nor do I. But absolutism is misguided.

Nothing personal Mitchy. I wish to get better by whatever means. Some among our brethren (not saying you) will settle for nothing less than 20 cheap homegrown players. Thus we see passing up a bonafide top 4, younger dmen for a middling prospect. No, let's instead wait for Hamonic and Ness. See you in 2015.

But it's been so long since this fanbase has seen any quality, it's not much surprise.

This NYI fan (admittedly belatedly) bought into building this team the proper way. Would be nice if the chronic rebuilders could buy into winning in our lifetimes...and adding young proven QUALITY at a position of greatest need whenever possible.

As opposed to over-valuing and grasping onto with all their might every prospect in the system....including the very ordinary ones.

That's how I see it.

PS - I think our friendly disagreement stems from a difference of priorities. This moribund franchise needs everything. However, I think it starts with defense and speed/mobility. Others, think it's scoring and size. So it goes...


Last edited by Trottier: 05-31-2009 at 08:32 PM.
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05-31-2009, 08:33 PM
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CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Joensuu for Jackman?

A plodding forward yet to prove worthy of regular time beyond the AHL...for a proven, in-his prime Dman?

Snow does that in a nanosecond. Davidson/Pleau laugh.

On arguably the thinnest D corp in the league, Jackman becomes NYI's top minutes dman in all defensive situations (and a #2 overall).

Only thing worse that fans overrating their players are fans of lousy teams overrating their players.

Younger and cheaper (and home grown ) does not necessarily = better.

Sorry. One Isles fan calling it as he sees it.
This was Joensuu's 1st yr in NA,first yr in the AHL.How dare he not stick in the nhl straight from the SEL

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05-31-2009, 08:35 PM
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Keep deluding yourself about NYI's glorious organizational kiddies, Crew.

JJ makes a slow, plodding roster even slower.

But he's younnnnng and more than 5 years away from free agency...so we must keep him!

St. Louis would hang up the phone...and they should.


Last edited by Trottier: 05-31-2009 at 08:43 PM.
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05-31-2009, 08:52 PM
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The Islanders need help on defense, since Witt decided not to show up this season and I don't see him being here for too much of the future.

I'm a big fan of Jackman and I see him pairing well with Mark Streit. I could see Toronto's 2nd going to St. Louis, but what other assets would St. Louis want?
A bag of pucks? Honestly, I can't see any GM in their right mind trading a 2nd round pick for Jackman with his contract. Say what you want about who he was matched up against, but statistically, Jackman was horrible at keeping the puck out of his own net, and brings nothing to the table offensively either other than being able to pinch in and keep the puck in the offensive zone occasionally (but beware, he can also get burned for odd man rushes). Jackman is simply not worth the amount of his contract. You would be better signing a run of the mill free agent defenseman and keeping your 2nd round pick.

Also, JD and company seem to like Jackman (their ability to evaluate defensemen is seriously called into question with the contracts they've handed out to McKee, Brewer, and Jackman), and probably won't trade him with all the young inexperience they will probably have on the blueline next season coupled with the fact that Brewer's future (who is also equally inept) is in question. The Isle would probably have to overpay to pry Jackman away from the Blues, and given his bad contract, why would they do that? As much as it pains me to say it, Jackman will probably stay with the Blues till the end of his contract unless some team give us something really good back (which I seriously doubt).

Also, I'm not certain, but there was some question as to whether or not Jackman had a NTC on his contract.

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05-31-2009, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Keep deluding yourself about NYI's glorious organizational kiddies, Crew.

JJ makes a slow, plodding roster even slower.

But he's younnnnng and more than 5 years away from free agency...so we must keep him!

St. Louis would hang up the phone...and they should.
I'm not deluding myself about the isles prospects.I'm saying Joensuu's a kid they are high on,so why not continue to develop him to see what they have.

Isn't that what careful drafting and patiently developing the prospects is supposed to be about?Hasn't the organization's impatience been a major knock against the front office?

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05-31-2009, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jmwc95 View Post
A bag of pucks? Honestly, I can't see any GM in their right mind trading a 2nd round pick for Jackman with his contract. Say what you want about who he was matched up against, but statistically, Jackman was horrible at keeping the puck out of his own net, and brings nothing to the table offensively either other than being able to pinch in and keep the puck in the offensive zone occasionally (but beware, he can also get burned for odd man rushes). Jackman is simply not worth the amount of his contract. You would be better signing a run of the mill free agent defenseman and keeping your 2nd round pick.

Also, JD and company seem to like Jackman (their ability to evaluate defensemen is seriously called into question with the contracts they've handed out to McKee, Brewer, and Jackman), and probably won't trade him with all the young inexperience they will probably have on the blueline next season coupled with the fact that Brewer's future (who is also equally inept) is in question. The Isle would probably have to overpay to pry Jackman away from the Blues, and given his bad contract, why would they do that? As much as it pains me to say it, Jackman will probably stay with the Blues till the end of his contract unless some team give us something really good back (which I seriously doubt).

Also, I'm not certain, but there was some question as to whether or not Jackman had a NTC on his contract.

Ah come on,he's gonna be the NYI's top minutes dman in all defensive situations (and a #2 overall).

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05-31-2009, 09:00 PM
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Islanders traded down in last year's draft strictly to restock the cabinet and get enough pieces to make a trade like this.

Toronto's 2nd and Toews for Jackman? In a heartbeat. This isn't Jonathan we're trading here, folks.

Toronto's 2nd and Joensuu for Jackman? I like Joensuu, but he's far from a sure-thing prospect. Still pull the deal without question.

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