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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Jordan Staal to Toronto.

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Old
05-31-2009, 03:41 PM
  #51
is the answer jesus
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Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
Yes, it is. Just like your assertion that nobody with a top 10 draft pick would trade it straight up for J Staal is just one man's opinion.

And when it comes to evaluating NHL talent I'll value the opinion of someone whose job involves dealing with the NHL on a daily basis over a fan who just likes posting on message boards.
I don't value the opinion of someone who says that they would take Jordan Staal over Evgeni Malkin. Although I think you would deft. find someone willing to give a top 10 pick for him. Hell R.J. Umberger got a 19th overall pick in the 2008 draft. With that said I think Pens fans tend to overhype him a bit especially when someone like Dustin Brown is brought up as someone they could potentially trade him for.

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05-31-2009, 03:41 PM
  #52
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[QUOTE=Cleatus;19748389]He's not going to trade a 4th overall pick for Staal. A trade revolving around the 4th overall pick could get you someone alot better.

I never said he's terrible, I just said that his value is nowhere near as high as you're implying. Honestly, propose a straight-up trade of Staal for either one of Atlanta's 4th overall pick, Phoenix' 5th overall pick, LA's 6th overall pick, and Toronto's 7th overall pick (make a new topic).[/QUOTE]


Good thing fans don't make actual trades isn't it?

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05-31-2009, 03:42 PM
  #53
CloutierForVezina
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Originally Posted by Cleatus View Post
That trade for Weight was a big rip-off.
It won't actually let me post a new thread. Mind making a thread with the title "Pittsburgh - Atlanta" and make your post "Trade Offer Below"?

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05-31-2009, 03:44 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by is the answer jesus View Post
I don't value the opinion of someone who says that they would take Jordan Staal over Evgeni Malkin. Although I think you would deft. find someone willing to give a top 10 pick for him. Hell R.J. Umberger got a 19th overall pick in the 2008 draft. With that said I think Pens fans tend to overhype him a bit especially when someone like Dustin Brown is brought up as someone they could potentially trade him for.
Malkin's done a lot to redeem himself this year, but there was absolutely no excuse for the disappearing act he pulled last year in the finals. I can see someone being skeptical of his ability to bring it when it counts (Ala Jumbo Joe).

Right now I would take Malkin over Jordan Staal but if the NYR-Wash series proved anything, a defensive team with a pop gun offense can create fits for offensive oriented teams. Even ones with "the best player in the game", "the best offensive defenseman in the game" and 2 players near or above 1 PPG

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05-31-2009, 03:48 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Cleatus View Post
That offer for Weight was a big rip-off.
Teams thinking they're going to make a deep playoff run or just trying to make the playoffs,are most likely to overpay at the trade deadline.

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05-31-2009, 03:48 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
Will do. But I'm curious, who do you think he could land for the 4th overall that's "alot better" than J Staal?
It depends on who's on the market. You may have to add more to it (depending on the player), but that pick could get you a player like Lecavalier, Briere, Cammalleri, Marleau, etc. However, instead of trading for one player, Atlanta should try to get a big package of picks and high level prospects in return (and they could).

I also think that Atlanta should trade Kovalchuk. The return will be huge.

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05-31-2009, 03:52 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Cleatus View Post
It depends on who's on the market. You may have to add more to it (depending on the player), but that pick could get you a player like Lecavalier, Briere, Cammalleri, Marleau, etc. However, instead of trading for one player, Atlanta should try to get a big package of picks and high level prospects in return (and they could).

I also think that Atlanta should trade Kovalchuk. The return will be huge.
If someone took Briere from Philly for peanuts, they would be estatic.

Briere has a gigantic albatross of a contract that will throw a massive wrench into their team's salary cap and impair their ability to resign Jeff Carter (Which they will, even if it means moving everyone else not named Mike Richards, Giroux, JVR and Sbisa).

I really can't believe you'd value a soft, one dimensional forward with a massive contract that will bring a 6.5 million cap hit when he's 38 over a young 22 year old who is amazing defensively and hasn't even begun to hit his prime.

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05-31-2009, 04:12 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Cleatus View Post
Here's another thing... In a scoring role, Stajan put up 50 points. He's also very good at face-offs. If Pittsburgh were to move Stajan to the second line, they'd have one crazy elite line (Crosby and Malkin together), along with a good second line.

Stajan is not a natural goal-scorer, but he's a good playmaker, and he's starting to come into his own in that department. With the right linemates, he's easily a 50-60 point player.
Basicly:

2010 1st (probably top 15).
2009 2nd
Matt Stajan

For Jordan Staal.


I would NEVER do this.

You said it yourself. Stajan can easily be a 50-60 point producer...(which he already is).

Staals potential is probably a 60-65 point producer (but much better defencively and all that).

So we're trading a 1st and 2nd for a player that could get about 10-15 more points, and is a better defender?

Thats a bit much IMO.

Maybe Tlusty and Stajan. Nothing more IMO... otherwise it doesn't make much sense for the leafs.

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05-31-2009, 04:14 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by grabo84 View Post
If those deals were on the table, Snow was unbelievably negligent in turning them down. Which makes me think that they were never really on the table. How is it that a team was offering a second round pick for Weight, but Snow only got a conditional 3rd for Guerin? Why would a team offer a 2nd and a fourth for a defenceman, in Witt, who just completed the worst season of his entire career?

Not trying to argue for the sake of it, but where was this reported? Botta? If so, put me down as skeptical.
Weight was injured just a couple weeks before the trade deadline.That nixed his potential trade.I don't know if it was Newsday or one of the out of town papers that had the comment from the other team's exec.


The nixed Witt trade was reported on Botta's blog, just a few days before the trade deadline.You can be as skeptical as you like.Botta's been a very credible source for nyi fans this season,come out with a lot of info that proven true.Botta reported that Snow was holding out for more then the 2nd+4th for Witt.

Also,the slow-footed Witt struggled most of the yr in Gordon's aggressive forechecking system.It wasn't until Gordon made adjustments to his system that Witt started playing better.A playoff team not playing a system like Gordon's,wouldn't have been concerned about Witt struggling in Gordon's system.

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05-31-2009, 04:34 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
If someone took Briere from Philly for peanuts, they would be estatic.

Briere has a gigantic albatross of a contract that will throw a massive wrench into their team's salary cap and impair their ability to resign Jeff Carter (Which they will, even if it means moving everyone else not named Mike Richards, Giroux, JVR and Sbisa).

I really can't believe you'd value a soft, one dimensional forward with a massive contract that will bring a 6.5 million cap hit when he's 38 over a young 22 year old who is amazing defensively and hasn't even begun to hit his prime.
Staal's 20

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05-31-2009, 05:14 PM
  #61
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I don't think this is a good idea for the Leafs. Staal is a good young player, but does this help us now? This is the stats for this year

Stajan had 55 pts this year with average 22 shifts/gm and 16:55mins/gm
Staal had 49 pts this year with average 24.8 shifts/gm and 19:50mins/gm

Staal is playing on a better team and has a better plus minus but Stajan is more productive for the TOI. Stajan also played 6 less games then Staal as well. I know that Staal is 5 years younger but he only played 2 years less then Stajan. Stajan has really come into his own this year and could possibly put up 60 points next year. I'd rather take my chances paying $2M to a player thats good on the FO and a decent playmaker. Oh and Staal is a -6 this year in the playoffs...OUCH!

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05-31-2009, 05:51 PM
  #62
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i dont think Toronto would make this deal. or at least i dont think i would if i was burke.

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05-31-2009, 05:56 PM
  #63
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Why do all the leafs fans continue to put Staal down, yet continue to make proposals for him?

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05-31-2009, 05:59 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by StrakaLangKovy View Post
Why do all the leafs fans continue to put Staal down, yet continue to make proposals for him?
I don't think Leaf fans are bringing him down. We are just saying Staal isn't worth that package for us, right now.

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05-31-2009, 07:04 PM
  #65
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Id trade the #7 pick straight up for Staal although Pits would have to add a pick or a prospect.

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05-31-2009, 07:15 PM
  #66
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Id trade the #7 pick straight up for Staal although Pits would have to add a pick or a prospect.
Well, then its not "straight up", now is it.

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05-31-2009, 07:24 PM
  #67
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If I'm Shero I don't except anything less than Schenn +Mid level pick prospect or Kulemin and 2009 1st.

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05-31-2009, 07:31 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
If someone took Briere from Philly for peanuts, they would be estatic.

Briere has a gigantic albatross of a contract that will throw a massive wrench into their team's salary cap and impair their ability to resign Jeff Carter (Which they will, even if it means moving everyone else not named Mike Richards, Giroux, JVR and Sbisa).

I really can't believe you'd value a soft, one dimensional forward with a massive contract that will bring a 6.5 million cap hit when he's 38 over a young 22 year old who is amazing defensively and hasn't even begun to hit his prime.
Despite his contract, he still has trade value. He may be streaky and one dimensional, but he's very good on offense, and is a proven playoff performer (however, he was kinda' weak in this year's playoff).

I actually think Atlanta should trade Lehtonen for Briere. Lehtonen hasn't panned out in Atlanta (due to injuries), but Philly could use a potential #1 starter. I also think that Briere and Kovalchuk would work well together.

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05-31-2009, 07:34 PM
  #69
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Oh, and I added Hagman to the trade, with return salary coming back to Toronto.

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05-31-2009, 07:39 PM
  #70
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Well, then its not "straight up", now is it.
W-e, 1 pick or prospect doesn't really change the trade. Unless its a special one.

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05-31-2009, 07:39 PM
  #71
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If I'm Shero I don't except anything less than Schenn +Mid level pick prospect or Kulemin and 2009 1st.
Well, a deal has no chance of happening if thats the price. And I'm a huge fan of Staal's.

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05-31-2009, 07:57 PM
  #72
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Toronto should just export their line of Kulemin-Grabovski-Ponikarovsky to some team that needs secondary scoring and would like to just quickly and rapidly upgrade in that area. That line has been absolute dynamite but I don't see it as part of Toronto's long-term rebuild. Something like KGP for Wisniewski, Salcido and the Ducks 1st rounder. **** if I know.

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05-31-2009, 07:58 PM
  #73
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I don't think Leaf fans are bringing him down. We are just saying Staal isn't worth that package for us, right now.
Every Pens fan will be waiting with bated breath for Matt Stajan, a TBD first rounder, and the ever-powerful 2nd to be put back on the table.

Please, non-playoff team, with all your leverage, take pity on a poor reigning two-time Eastern Conference champ and send us your mediocre center who put up numbers because he was the de facto #1 on a cruddy roster and your anonymous future draft picks for our playoff-proven young two-way pivot.

We hate winning, and this proposal will do plenty to help rid us of the nasty habit.

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05-31-2009, 08:09 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by StrakaLangKovy View Post
Why do all the leafs fans continue to put Staal down, yet continue to make proposals for him?
"All" the Leaf fans are not making proposals for Staal. A few are. I personally don't like him that much, and I wouldn't pay this price for him. Staal isn't turning this team around, and theres a good chance we'll be giving up a top-5 or top-10 draft pick for him.

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05-31-2009, 08:11 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Champagne Wishes View Post
Every Pens fan will be waiting with bated breath for Matt Stajan, a TBD first rounder, and the ever-powerful 2nd to be put back on the table.

Please, non-playoff team, with all your leverage, take pity on a poor reigning two-time Eastern Conference champ and send us your mediocre center who put up numbers because he was the de facto #1 on a cruddy roster and your anonymous future draft picks for our playoff-proven young two-way pivot.

We hate winning, and this proposal will do plenty to help rid us of the nasty habit.
I dont think i could stomach losing for so long, and picking up top 5 draft picks year after year.......so i think its legit for you to "hate winning" when you took home the best players in each draft for how many years??...its sad when a team can tank for sooo long, and still have fans...to rag on other teams

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