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Who are your finalists for the Hart?

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Old
03-24-2004, 08:51 PM
  #26
EastonBlues22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rye&ginger
Most Valueable to his Team? Luongo is the only legit candidate. Iginla and Theodore the other 2 choices. The rest arent the only piece on their team.
Being the "only piece" on their team isn't, and has never been, a requisite for receiving the award. The MVP usually goes to a great player on a playoff team having a monster year. Usually, the team is one which has been considered to "overachieve." Teams rarely overachieve noticeably, or make the playoffs, simply because one player was incredible for a year. That's why it's a team game.

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Old
03-24-2004, 08:51 PM
  #27
ajs
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Martin St. Louis
Marty Turco
Jerome Iginla

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Old
03-24-2004, 09:03 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rye&ginger
Most Valueable to his Team? Luongo is the only legit candidate. Iginla and Theodore the other 2 choices. The rest arent the only piece on their team.
I'll just cut and paste this from a post I made last night, so if it looks familiar, that's why.

I disagree with the idea that Luongo is a candidate or the "only" candidate (and not for the reason you might think). If he is, the NHL has a very short memory.

Khabibulin was stellar two seasons ago, and pretty much the only reason Tampa managed to win much at all, especially after the whole Vinny-misses-camp fiasco and Modin & St. Louis getting hurt. He was far and away the MVP for his team, and you could make an argument for him being the most valuable contributor to his team in the league. As far as I know, he didn't come very close in the Hart voting, definitely wasn't a finalist. I see a similar situation here, even their numbers will end up being very similar (which surprised me when I looked them up).

Khabibulin (01-02) 24 wins 2.36GAA .92SV% 7SO
Luongo (03-04) 24 wins 2.35GAA .933SV% 7SO (incomplete, of course)

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Old
03-24-2004, 09:13 PM
  #29
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Kovalchuk
Kiprusoff
Sakic

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Old
03-24-2004, 09:17 PM
  #30
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Turco


St.Louis
Iginla

To me it's not close, Turco carried a mediocre team on his back through the first 60 games this season and now that mediocre team looks the the Dallas Stars of old.

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Old
03-24-2004, 09:27 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RallyKiller
Turco


St.Louis
Iginla

To me it's not close, Turco carried a mediocre team on his back through the first 60 games this season and now that mediocre team looks the the Dallas Stars of old.

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Old
03-24-2004, 09:32 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
How can Brodeur and Vokoun get consideration? It has already been proven Brodeur is not the team mvp, he is at best 3rd on his team, and Vokoun just simply isn't good enough.
How is the best goaltender in the game not considered (and don't give me that: it's the system stuff, he's got 400 wins, 3 cups and untill someone proves it in the playoffs, he's the man to beat.)

bye the way, this is coming from a ranger fan.

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Old
03-24-2004, 10:25 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Vinnie
Really? Where exactly is this "proof"?
The one season brodeur actually had to carry the team, he failed. not his fault, as he has been playing alright, but but you can't honestly say he has been mor eimportant than Elias or Stevens.

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Old
03-24-2004, 10:29 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
The one season brodeur actually had to carry the team, he failed. not his fault, as he has been playing alright, but but you can't honestly say he has been mor eimportant than Elias or Stevens.
how has he failed?

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Old
03-24-2004, 10:36 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walknucklers
how has he failed?
By his team plummeting through the standings.

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Old
03-24-2004, 10:39 PM
  #36
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1. Don Cherry -he is all heart (no brains sadly).
2. Ron McClean -able to sit through Cherry's ranting without trying to kill Grapes
3. CBC -stubbornly stands behind Coach's Corner despite the fact that Cherry has become public enemy #1 in most of French Canada.

*Note I still love Coach's Corner as it remains very funny in my books.

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Old
03-24-2004, 10:45 PM
  #37
Owen Wilson
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St. Louis is a lock to win it, it doesn't really matter who else gets nominated because some just as deserving players will get snubbed.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:03 PM
  #38
Higgy4
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I say Turco too, even with his stupid highsticking penalty tonight that will probably cost him a few games, if not the remaining regular season games.

Turco
Iginla
St. Louis

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:16 PM
  #39
Sotnos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
By his team plummeting through the standings.
Not like they fell out of the playoffs. He has 35 wins! I want my goalies to sink my team like that, I really do.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:31 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sotnos
Not like they fell out of the playoffs. He has 35 wins! I want my goalies to sink my team like that, I really do.
I'm not faulting him for the slide. Its clearly a team slide, but if he was the team mvp, he would have been able to stop the slide. If he was truly the mvp of his team, they wouldn't miss a beat with the loss of Stevens. That's all I'm trying to say. if he deserved the hart trophy, they would still be gunning it out for first place, instead, they are desperatly holding off the habs for 6th.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:38 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles
Excuse the obvious bias for a moment but I think Mark Recchi is worthy of some attention even though I know he won't be named among the finalists. He has held this team together all season with the various injuries and is among the league leaders in scoring.

The Flyers have an outside shot at winning the Presidents Trophy and a more than decent shot at winning their division. Yet, more than likely, they won't have any finalists for any trophy. Prior to getting the concussion, Primeau was a probable candidate for the Selke; otherwise, I think Hitchcock (Coach) and Pitkanen (R.O.Y) are outsiders for those respective awards.
Well thats all legitimate reasoning, but as a wings fan I could make the same argument for Datsyuk (Hart). Datsyuk essentially made up for 75% of the gap Fedorov left behind. The thing about Datsyuk though is that while he is a good player, we still could've won without him. Datsyuk is more the Hart winner for the Red Wings, as is Recchi for the Flyers, not for the NHL.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:39 PM
  #42
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I think people have a short term memory. In the past 3 months Brodeur has been a key factor in all the Devils wins just like Turco was a major factor in carrying the team in the first 3 months.

Turco in the first 3 months:
16-14-6
2.06 GAA
.913 save %

Brodeur in last 3 months:
17-16-4
2.35 GAA
.909 GAA %

Now Turco's numbers look better. But I think to say Brodeur is helping the Devils plummet in the standings is like saying Turco was doing the same when the Stars weren't playing that hot

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:44 PM
  #43
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Turco - The reason Dallas is where they are
St. Louis- The main reason Tampa is where they are
Naslund - When Naslund slumps, the Canucks slump, plain and simple. He is the heart of the team.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:44 PM
  #44
detredWINgs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Owen Wilson
St. Louis is a lock to win it, it doesn't really matter who else gets nominated because some just as deserving players will get snubbed.
I disagree. Kiprusoff, Turco are both more deserving. St. Louis isn't running away with the team lead. Look at Iginla. I'd pick him over St. Louis. Its not just St. Louis-theres also Richards, Lecavalier, Modin, and Stillman, all who could easily pick up the slack if St. Louis weren't around. Iginla is running away with the team lead. Hes tied for the league lead in goals and has a 24 pt edge over the next highest scorer on his team. Not to mention I'd put Kiprusoff way over St. Louis also. Hes essentially the reason the Flames are in it.

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Old
03-24-2004, 11:51 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklez
Naslund - When Naslund slumps, the Canucks slump, plain and simple. He is the heart of the team.
That is flawed logic. He has played his worst hockey when it mattered most. Yes, the team slumps when he does, but the fact that he slumped for a quarter of a season, when his team needed him most, should remove him from any hart talk.

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Old
03-25-2004, 12:29 AM
  #46
Owen Wilson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detredWINgs
I disagree. Kiprusoff, Turco are both more deserving. St. Louis isn't running away with the team lead. Look at Iginla. I'd pick him over St. Louis. Its not just St. Louis-theres also Richards, Lecavalier, Modin, and Stillman, all who could easily pick up the slack if St. Louis weren't around. Iginla is running away with the team lead. Hes tied for the league lead in goals and has a 24 pt edge over the next highest scorer on his team. Not to mention I'd put Kiprusoff way over St. Louis also. Hes essentially the reason the Flames are in it.
That may be true, but when St. Louis isn't scoring Tampa isn't winning ie their recent little slide. You also have to factor in all the numbers as well, St. Louis is top pretty much Top 5 in every offensive category.

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Old
03-25-2004, 12:59 AM
  #47
Knucklez
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
That is flawed logic. He has played his worst hockey when it mattered most. Yes, the team slumps when he does, but the fact that he slumped for a quarter of a season, when his team needed him most, should remove him from any hart talk.
A quarter of the season? What quarter was that? He's been slumping the last, maybe 7 games. A quarter of the season? What the hell are you talking about?

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Old
03-25-2004, 01:01 AM
  #48
Enoch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand
That is flawed logic. He has played his worst hockey when it mattered most. Yes, the team slumps when he does, but the fact that he slumped for a quarter of a season, when his team needed him most, should remove him from any hart talk.
So did Turco....

My candidates:

Pronger (yeah, no one will agree with me, but who cares )
St. Louis
Turco

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Old
03-25-2004, 01:02 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorPoet
Being the "only piece" on their team isn't, and has never been, a requisite for receiving the award. The MVP usually goes to a great player on a playoff team having a monster year. Usually, the team is one which has been considered to "overachieve." Teams rarely overachieve noticeably, or make the playoffs, simply because one player was incredible for a year. That's why it's a team game.

Well the MVP is an individual award to the 'most valueable player to his team'

Its not just who the best player in the NHL is. Those were MY picks, as requested. I dont expect Luongo to win because Florida is a bad team. He is the player ranked top to fit the definition of that award, and I dont think there is debate about that. Maybe Raycroft is the most deserving out of the playoff teams. Where would Boston be without him? Fighting for a playoff sport rather than leading their division most likely.


Last edited by rye&ginger: 03-25-2004 at 01:06 AM.
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Old
03-25-2004, 01:05 AM
  #50
Fish on The Sand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklez
A quarter of the season? What quarter was that? He's been slumping the last, maybe 7 games. A quarter of the season? What the hell are you talking about?
2 goals in his last 20 games. Quarter of the season.

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