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Emery could sign for one-year @ 1.5m (post #553)

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Old
06-04-2009, 11:47 AM
  #326
GoneFullHextall
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Originally Posted by pelts35.com View Post


I hope I'm wrong, but I have a feeling this signing reaks of Billy Tibbetts all over again.
comparing Emery to a convicted felon in Tibbetts?
give me a break.

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06-04-2009, 11:52 AM
  #327
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
You're missing the point...it isn't that we could re-sign Emery, it's that we would be in the same position as far as the cap-hit we'd be talking about at that point...and with a far more volatile personality at that.
Then please Jester, tell me what you would do this off-season, rather then just criticize everything Homer does.

Do you sign Biron to a 4 year 18 mill deal?

That's stability in that you have a goalie for a few years. However, Biron's inconsistency would shine though in no time, and then people will whine that we signed him for so long or for so much. I assume you would also complain about that move and say Homer can't manage the cap.

If we sign Emery for cheap, then your on about longterm and how this can blow up in our faces due to his attitude and history.

If we sign Khabibulin, then you can say we overpaid, since he wont be cheap. More cap discussions there.

If we trade for Harding or Pavelec, then you can say we just traded for goalies who have proven NOTHING and might not be bonafide starters.

If we trade for Lehtonen, you can say he is injury prone.

So please Jester, tell me what the best option is.

I'm not trying to go after you, just trying to point out that the negativity on this board is getting to the point where I feel sick about next season. If you look for negatives all the time, then you will always have something to complain about.

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06-04-2009, 11:52 AM
  #328
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Well, this thread has really taken a change in direction... We go from how Emery plays to how Emery drives... Next we are gonna talk about his girlfriends. I like how we are bringing his personal life into this, like he should be perfect or something. Yea, that ant gonna happen. If he can stop pucks while keeping a cool head, I'll like him.
*coughs*



Sorry sacred, I couldn't resist.

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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
If you look for negatives all the time, then you will always have something to complain about.
Giddy Up!

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06-04-2009, 11:54 AM
  #329
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
I'm not trying to go after you, just trying to point out that the negativity on this board is getting to the point where I feel sick about next season. If you look for negatives all the time, then you will always have something to complain about.
THANK YOU IRISH!

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06-04-2009, 11:55 AM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Opus View Post
*coughs*



Sorry sacred, I couldn't resist.



Giddy Up!
She is HOTTT!!

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06-04-2009, 11:57 AM
  #331
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Originally Posted by Opus View Post
Off the ice, yes...he's a bit of a wild child. You can't support your argument about his goaltending though, he posts solid numbers. I do understand what you're saying...but he's proved that he's more than capable of stopping pucks.
He's had 1 good season. 1.

http://hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=50255

He paired that with a .902 and .890 SVPCT. Lets not act like Ray Emery has a strong record of elite level play in the NHL. He's done it just once.

Quote:
Again, he doesn't have 30 speeding tickets. The laws in Ontario wouldn't allow anybody to have that many speeding tickets, we run on a point system. It's more than just paying your fines...you lose your points...you lose your license.
Getting pulled over does not mean that you get a ticket. Getting pulled over as a celebrity means it's even less likely you're going to get a ticket.

You note that the Ottawa police department is noted for their corruption...you think they're above not giving an Ottawa Senator a ticket? He didn't get his license suspended until after he was off the team...if we're going to delve into conspiracy theories, lets ponder the timing of when he lost his license.

Quote:
He's had one incident of road rage, and one of losing his cool on his trainer. Fine me an article(s) where he's done either of these repeatedly.
If there's a goalie fight in the NHL next season and Ray Emery is playing in the league, and you know nothing other than a goalie fight happened...what % would you guess he was one of the goalies involved?

Does this make him a bad goalie, or a bad person...no...but the man has displayed himself to be have some anger with regularity throughout his career.

Quote:
As posted earlier in the thread...

Option A
Biron - 5 Mil over 3/4 years?
Backup -1 Mil

or...

Option B
Emery-1.2 Mil over 1 year
Backup-1 Mil
Defense - 3.5 Mil


I'll take option B given the current salary cap situation. It allows us to keep Lupul for the time being and not get fleeced in trying to unload him.
If Emery doesn't work out, then you can spend the saved money wherever you want (and, BTW, you're still going to have to move some people if you want to improve the D...) and it's not going to save this team. The level of play Emery has put forward outside of the one season is the type of stuff that takes a good team and puts them in a position where they miss the playoffs.

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06-04-2009, 11:58 AM
  #332
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Originally Posted by Opus View Post
When Emery lost his license, he was caught going 50km/h over the speed limit. On the highway he was on, that's really nothing out of the norm.
Emery mentioned being pulled over repeatedly, in the context of being harassed by the Ottawa police, profiling. And if they knew it was his Hummer or not, they were looking to give him problems.

I was going 45 km/h over the speed limit on the QEW this morning, just keeping up with the traffic in an old van....


I acknowledge that Emery had had his personal problems, and I am sure that they've more than researched what he's like now, i.e. whether he has grown up.

If Biron is, as quoted in the paper today, looking for a long-term deal, and with a raise too, buh-bye. He's not that good an investment.

One year for Emery to prove himself is not too bad a risk, if he plays to his potential he could be a star. If he sucks, waive him and find someone else....

Stability with mediocrity is not an option.

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06-04-2009, 11:58 AM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opus
Off the ice, yes...he's a bit of a wild child. You can't support your argument about his goaltending though, he posts solid numbers. I do understand what you're saying...but he's proved that he's more than capable of stopping pucks.
Emery's numbers actually aren't all that great. He's played in 3 seasons in the NHL where he's had more than a handful of games and his SV% was 0.902, 0.918, 0.890.

Contrast that with Biron who has played 8 seasons in which he's played more than a handful of games and his SV% has been 0.909 or better in 6 of the eight. In those eight seasons, his lowest SV% was 0.903. People complain about Biron's inconsistency; Emery will have a lot of work to do to win over the hearts of the Flyers faithful.

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Old
06-04-2009, 11:59 AM
  #334
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Then please Jester, tell me what you would do this off-season, rather then just criticize everything Homer does.

Do you sign Biron to a 4 year 18 mill deal?
Yes, but preferably a 3-year deal.

I've already stated this earlier in this thread.

I also don't think Homer has made a good move since the Umberger trade, which he quickly neutralized by the Eminger trade, which led to the Carle salary cap fiasco.

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06-04-2009, 12:02 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
You really dont think there is racism in today's world? I hear about it all the time, even stuff that takes place in jersey.
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Have you ever lived in Ottawa? If not, I suggest you keep your mouth shut because the city is full of bigots and racists, especially in the OPP organization. That's nothing new. They've been accused of racial profiling and have admitting to racial profiling in the past. There's nothing dumb about that at all. Having grown up in the city, I've seen more than my share of underhanded tactics used by the police when dealing with races other than Caucasian. So, do us all a favour - keep your mouth shut because the adults here are conversing.....

Most whites just don't see it even when it's happening right in front of them unless it's blatently obvious. I have a number of black friends (yes I'm so old that I don't use the current PC name and they all know I mean no offense by it) and they can tell immediately the situation. I can tell you a ton of stories that they've told me about racism that STILL happens to them and I find it appauling but it DOES stil happen. whether this is one of Emery's problems or not I don't know and I won't comment on it because I've never sat down and talked to him about it. I definitely believe he's been the victum of it just like just about evey otehr black at some point in their life but I have no idea if he's EXTREMELY sensitive to it or if it's one of the things that triggers him to fly off the deep end.

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06-04-2009, 12:05 PM
  #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Well, if Biron wants $5mill a year and we pay Emery $1.2 for similar play, obviously there will be the risk that Emery is a locker room cancer.

However, the gamble is cheap if Biron priced himself out of Philly.

Also, it wasn't the goalie play that ended our season in the first round. Trading Lupul, dumping Jones and grabbing a solid defensemen from Free Agency or Trade will upgrade the D enough to improve the team, honestly.

Especially if we can avoid the injury bug and Briere and Giroux play lots of minutes.
But Biron is not the only option! I rather see the Flyers move Lupul, dump Jones and or Carol plus move Marty. Sign/trade a UFA Goalie and either J Bo or another blue liner like Kilnski (Sp?, from Mon)

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06-04-2009, 12:05 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
He's had 1 good season. 1.

http://hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=50255

He paired that with a .902 and .890 SVPCT. Lets not act like Ray Emery has a strong record of elite level play in the NHL. He's done it just once.
He's also 5 years younger than Biron.


Quote:
Getting pulled over does not mean that you get a ticket. Getting pulled over as a celebrity means it's even less likely you're going to get a ticket.
As said by himself, he's been pulled over 30 times...not been given 30 various traffic tickets. Again, so what?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Emery

Quote:
You note that the Ottawa police department is noted for their corruption...you think they're above not giving an Ottawa Senator a ticket? He didn't get his license suspended until after he was off the team...if we're going to delve into conspiracy theories, lets ponder the timing of when he lost his license.
That's just a fact. I have an old friend that was a member of the Ottawa Police Department, he left because of the BS and is now working in construction.

Quote:
If there's a goalie fight in the NHL next season and Ray Emery is playing in the league, and you know nothing other than a goalie fight happened...what % would you guess he was one of the goalies involved?
50%, and who cares. Hasek and Roy have been in goalie fights, what's that have to do with the price of potatos?

Quote:
Does this make him a bad goalie, or a bad person...no...but the man has displayed himself to be have some anger with regularity throughout his career.
Angry? I don't know, he's actually a very personable man. I'd say he plays with edge and piss and vinegar. Much like Hextall did, and no...I'm not comparing their goaltending abilities, more so their personalities.

Quote:
If Emery doesn't work out, then you can spend the saved money wherever you want (and, BTW, you're still going to have to move some people if you want to improve the D...) and it's not going to save this team. The level of play Emery has put forward outside of the one season is the type of stuff that takes a good team and puts them in a position where they miss the playoffs.
Yes, you do, but not as urgently.

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Old
06-04-2009, 12:09 PM
  #338
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Yes, you do, but not as urgently.
No, it's just as urgent...because you need to do it this summer if you want it to matter next year. Once the season starts it's nearly impossible to significantly change teams because of the way the salary cap has ossified trading cap space.

If you want our D to actually be different next year, the time to make the deals will be at the draft and through free agency...so, this summer.

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06-04-2009, 12:15 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
Emery's numbers actually aren't all that great. He's played in 3 seasons in the NHL where he's had more than a handful of games and his SV% was 0.902, 0.918, 0.890.

Contrast that with Biron who has played 8 seasons in which he's played more than a handful of games and his SV% has been 0.909 or better in 6 of the eight. In those eight seasons, his lowest SV% was 0.903. People complain about Biron's inconsistency; Emery will have a lot of work to do to win over the hearts of the Flyers faithful.
I'm not huge on save percentage but I see where you're coming from. I think Emery is very capable of replacing (attitude question marks aside) Biron in net and the difference would be a wash.

Not that I'm in favour of this, as I'm very skeptical (as voted in the other thread) but the cap freedom is definitely intrigueing.

I do agree, like Carcillo...Emery would have to win the hearts of the Flyers faithful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli View Post
But Biron is not the only option! I rather see the Flyers move Lupul, dump Jones and or Carol plus move Marty. Sign/trade a UFA Goalie and either J Bo or another blue liner like Kilnski (Sp?, from Mon)
You're crazy if you think the Flyers are going to move those players without taking salary back. It's not going to happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
No, it's just as urgent...because you need to do it this summer if you want it to matter next year. Once the season starts it's nearly impossible to significantly change teams because of the way the salary cap has ossified trading cap space.

If you want our D to actually be different next year, the time to make the deals will be at the draft and through free agency...so, this summer.
Sorry, misunderstood. I was talking Lupul more than the defense. As for as making the trade/dump on D, I agree...it would have to be at the draft this summer.

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06-04-2009, 12:20 PM
  #340
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You're crazy if you think the Flyers are going to move those players without taking salary back. It's not going to happen. .
Marty and Lupol have value and I don't the Flyers taking a big salary hit to move them. A do agree however that Homer would have to get creative to move Jones and Carol but he did turn Zitnik into Coburn.

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06-04-2009, 12:21 PM
  #341
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Well guys, I've tried to stay out of this argument but I think both sides are being a little close minded. We need to actually look a 2 year plan and design the team around it. This year the cap will be right around 55 mil. I feel we should try and design the team around a max cap hit of about 54 mil, that leaves us a little wiggle room for injuries and we don't get ourselves into trouble and be forced to trade someone and get ***** in the deal like we did with Upshall last year. Next, we MUST plan for the 2010/11 season too because all indications are that the cap will drop to about 50 mil. Flat out we CAN'T take on another long term, expensive contract at this point because we will be in serious trouble in 2 years. We CAN'T sign Biron to a 3 year, 5 mil deal, we CAN'T sign J-bo/Komi/or another high priced dman. We simply won't have the cap space and we will have to take peanuts for them or have 2/3rd of the team be AHL players.

With the money we have committed to other players we are pretty much FORCED to go cheap on goal tending again whether any of us like it or not. I think that means we sign Emery for this year and wit and see for the next year. We may try to get Harding now but he's probably not any better than Biron long term (if even THAT good). We may wait a year and see how Schneider pans out and then pay a premium for him if Van resigns Luongo. Pavelec and Halak may be available by then. Backlund may become a quality starter. Because of the cap money we have committed right now and because of where the cap is likely heading in 2 years we simply don't have the money to spend on goalie and we DO have optins for ow and the future. They aren't great options and we are still playing russian roulett but it's the best we can do now after our "we don't know what rebuilding is" quick fix after the 07 season.

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06-04-2009, 12:23 PM
  #342
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Awwww Opie I was just fooling around with Jester. I dont think he would have mind that comment

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06-04-2009, 12:24 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli View Post
Marty and Lupol have value and I don't the Flyers taking a big salary hit to move them. A do agree however that Homer would have to get creative to move Jones and Carol but he did turn Zitnik into Coburn.
Sorry, Marty who?

Lupul has value, to some teams...but to think that no salary would be coming back is a pipe dream and not realistic. Even if minimal, salary would surely being come back.

I don't think both Jones and Carle will be gone. Again, a pipe dream.

Those were different economic times, trades are harder to come by these days, as is moving extensive salary. Unfortunately.

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Awwww Opie I was just fooling around with Jester. I dont think he would have mind that comment
No problem, I'm just here to keep the peace. *looks at avatar and laughs in hysterics*

Intentionally or not, I don't people pissing others off.

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06-04-2009, 12:33 PM
  #344
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Dumping Jones is not even a consideration in clearing up some cap space for now and the future, that's just dumb. Jones is injured right now and nobody is going to want him. He played last season injured and he looked bad, there's no way to sugar coat this. We'd actually have to PAY somebody to take him off our hands ala JR. The ONLY way we trade Randy Jones if he's included in a trade for a more expensive player also with a contract that expires after this coming season (like Pronger, but the asking price may be too great for him). Remember that Coburn and Parent will be RFA's after the end of the 09/10 season, they will need new contracts and raises and the cap is expected to fall to 50 mil. We will need to plan for a lower cap in 2 years and plan for the raises needed by certain players at that time.

The pont is that Jones shouldn't be a concern at this point. He's really a non factor in our cap management. Even if the cap DOESN'T drop to 50 mil in 2 years we can still use his expiring cap maoney to resign Coburn and Parent.

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06-04-2009, 12:35 PM
  #345
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Originally Posted by Opus View Post
Sorry, Marty who?
Sorry Danny. I do that all the time......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Opus View Post
Lupul has value, to some teams...but to think that no salary would be coming back is a pipe dream and not realistic. Even if minimal, salary would surely being come back.
If the Flyers give up his 4.5 mil for a player who makes 2.5 or less for a shorted time period, ill do it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Opus View Post

I don't think both Jones and Carle will be gone. Again, a pipe dream.
Either or would be good.

and please refrain from calling people's comments "pipe dreams" The is offense and can be construed as an attack....and we don't do that on this board.


Also these are my suggests and IMO would rather see attempted then signing Ray E

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06-04-2009, 12:41 PM
  #346
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Originally Posted by Opus View Post
Sorry, Marty who?

Lupul has value, to some teams...but to think that no salary would be coming back is a pipe dream and not realistic. Even if minimal, salary would surely being come back.

I don't think both Jones and Carle will be gone. Again, a pipe dream.

Those were different economic times, trades are harder to come by these days, as is moving extensive salary. Unfortunately.[/SIZE]
I'm not sure I buy that we would have to take back salary, as it would very much matter who the trading partner was. For some teams, they would need to clear some cap space to make the deal work for them...for others, they would not and likely be happy not to lose a roster player in such a deal. The problem with trading Lupul is that it isn't a deal where you would get any real value back.

I agree that we aren't going to see both Jones and Carle gone...I just hope they move one of them.

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Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
Dumping Jones is not even a consideration in clearing up some cap space for now and the future, that's just dumb. Jones is injured right now and nobody is going to want him. He played last season injured and he looked bad, there's no way to sugar coat this. We'd actually have to PAY somebody to take him off our hands ala JR. The ONLY way we trade Randy Jones if he's included in a trade for a more expensive player also with a contract that expires after this coming season (like Pronger, but the asking price may be too great for him). Remember that Coburn and Parent will be RFA's after the end of the 09/10 season, they will need new contracts and raises and the cap is expected to fall to 50 mil. We will need to plan for a lower cap in 2 years and plan for the raises needed by certain players at that time.
You can waive Jones tomorrow and he's gone from the cap one way or another. They clearly should have put him back on LTIR at the end of the season and kept Upshall, because Jones was barely able to skate at the end. Holmgren mismanged the situation with Jones' injury badly there.

Quote:
The pont is that Jones shouldn't be a concern at this point. He's really a non factor in our cap management. Even if the cap DOESN'T drop to 50 mil in 2 years we can still use his expiring cap maoney to resign Coburn and Parent.
Jones is a concern at this point. We are so tight to to the cap that every dollar matters both short-term and long-term. They clearly need to be dealing with long-term fixes right now, but they also need to make some moves to improve this team going into next season as well.

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06-04-2009, 12:42 PM
  #347
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If you wonder why so many Senator fans are coming in here and speaking Emery's case, it's because so many of us feel that he was given a bad rap by the media and was treated unfairly. I found the way he was depicted in the media as rather disgraceful and the fact that people ate it up just makes me ashamed of how little our organization did to stick up for him. He was thrown under the bus in every sense of the word.

And Clarke does have a point about the police here... I don't think it was because he was black but it had everything to do with the vehicle he was driving. I've known people who drive Jeeps, Muscle cars, and other flashy vehicles and they get pulled over consistently whenever they drive them on the road. If they drive your run of the mill economy car or minivan, nada. I don't find getting pulled over in his white hummer is surprising at all.

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06-04-2009, 12:48 PM
  #348
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not sure what the big deal is if the Flyers gave Emery a 1 year deal at around 1.25 million.
It gives him a chance to prove himself he belongs back in the NHL. If it doesnt work out then hes on his way back to Russia,Sweden or Ireland or wherever he wants to play.
Again I will say I want Biron back, I am just not willing to give him 4.5-5 million. he isnt worth that kind of money.
Nothing wrong with at least expoloring all options which right now is what the Flyers are doing.

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06-04-2009, 12:49 PM
  #349
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Originally Posted by FireStevensDotCom View Post
not sure what the big deal is if the Flyers gave Emery a 1 year deal at around 1.25 million.
It gives him a chance to prove himself he belongs back in the NHL. If it doesnt work out then hes on his way back to Russia,Sweden or Ireland or wherever he wants to play.
At what cost to the 2009-10 Flyers, though?

Quote:
Again I will say I want Biron back, I am just not willing to give him 4.5-5 million. he isnt worth that kind of money.
Nothing wrong with at least expoloring all options which right now is what the Flyers are doing.
Well, that's not what this report is saying...it's saying there is a deal in place and he'll sign it on July 1st.

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06-04-2009, 12:51 PM
  #350
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Originally Posted by FireStevensDotCom View Post
not sure what the big deal is if the Flyers gave Emery a 1 year deal at around 1.25 million.
It gives him a chance to prove himself he belongs back in the NHL
. If it doesnt work out then hes on his way back to Russia,Sweden or Ireland or wherever he wants to play.
Again I will say I want Biron back, I am just not willing to give him 4.5-5 million. he isnt worth that kind of money.
Nothing wrong with at least expoloring all options which right now is what the Flyers are doing.


I was mortified when I heard Homer had been speaking to Emery's agent. At this price(if correct) it's hard not to be a fan of the deal though. If he ****s up...bury him on the Phantoms.

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