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Patience: Fleury and Price

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Old
06-05-2009, 04:16 PM
  #51
MathMan
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Incidentally, can anyone tell us about the selection of Marcoux as the new goaltender coach?
I can tell you that all the parties involved have denied anything of the sort happened...

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Old
06-05-2009, 05:07 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
Fleury was taken 1st overall... Price was 5th.

Fleury is five times better than Price is.
5 years older also

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06-05-2009, 05:13 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by KovalevDeke View Post
5 years older also
Dude, he was only being sarcastic and cynical to the people who always give too much weight to draft position, when compared to potential.

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Old
06-05-2009, 05:13 PM
  #54
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Please don't compare those two? Price is already better even if he played a really bad year than Fleury who is at his best.

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06-05-2009, 05:23 PM
  #55
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Please don't compare those two? Price is already better even if he played a really bad year than Fleury who is at his best.
While I share your enthusiasm, I do think Price needs to rebound from a pretty awful second half before we discuss him at Fleury's "best." His rebound control, puck handling and positioning are right now comparable or better than Fleury's but he still needs to work on his game.

Although I do think when all is said and the marbles are picked up, We will have the All Star

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Old
06-05-2009, 06:03 PM
  #56
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Who would be willing to throw under the bus a 21 year-old goalie that won World Junior Gold and Tournment MVP in 07, and in the same year won the WHL/CHL goalie of the year award, and ended up winning the Calder Cup and Jack Butterfield trophy in 07? Not me. I cant say it enough he is a 21-year old goalie playing a difficult position to learn in a pressure cooker called Montreal. He will get better and we will be kicking ourselves if we were to trade him and see him become the top-3 goalie he can be.

Price has an incredible amount of talent and was playing very well last season before his injury, which I think bothered him for the rest of the season. I think he does need to fix his mind. He seems to be too laxidasical at times and unable to maintain his focus for an entire game. I think a new goalie coach and the fresh approach he will bring in might change this mental state. Moreover, there is only so much a goalie can do when he is playing in front of the Habs D, a team that lacks a system, and one that by the end of the year could not score. I think bringing in Martin will change the first two thereby better insulating Price so he would not have to face so many odd man rushes and tonnes of shots a game from prime scoring areas.

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Old
06-05-2009, 06:41 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Freaky Habs Fan View Post
Honestly, I think he'll turn it around. I know he's not the hardest worker, but he's a proud player and he's learning quite a few things right now. I'm sure he don't want to be part in another season like the last one. He will do what it takes to be a good pro. Changing the goaltender coach might be the best thing for his future.
How do you know he isn't a hard worker , what proof do you have , he worked his butt off playing crazy junior hockey and pro Ahl hockey , he made it to the nhl very young , with an orginisation that puts huge pressure for no god damn reason. Price's mistakes were not a result of lack of effort or work but of over hype and pressure by media and fans a like. I can honestly say you know nothing about hockey if your saying a player can make it to the nhl at 21 with no hard work or effort. He has all the tools to be a great goaltender all we need is patience something a lot of supposed habs fan lack.

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Old
06-05-2009, 08:08 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
Fleury was taken 1st overall... Price was 5th.

Fleury is five times better than Price is.
Let me ask you... would you have picked Fleury ahead of Crosby? What about Bobby Ryan? Jack Johnson? Benoit Pouliot?

Those are the guys picked ahead of Price. As you see, the gap isn't as big as you think.

In all seriousness, I truly believe that Price has all the tools to become much better than Fleury. Where I do agree with the OP is to be patient with him, give him time to mature both as a hockey player and as a man. After all, it served Fleury hasn't it?

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Old
06-06-2009, 12:15 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
Fleury was taken 1st overall... Price was 5th.

Fleury is five times better than Price is.
Wow, I didn't know the draft what that simple.

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Old
06-06-2009, 12:16 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by KovalevDeke View Post
5 years older also
No he isn't. Fleury is 24, Price is 21.

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Old
06-06-2009, 04:56 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post

They are 2 great young goalies but Price will probably never have a team like MAF in front of him.The Penguins defense isn't great but neither is the Habs one.

It's close but you gotta give Price at least another full season
We'll see, meanwhile...don't jinx our HABS!!
I'm hoping we can be as good as the Pens (soon) but in a different way (no Crosby/Malkin, but Price at his best, great dmen, great defense, 4 lines that can play with heart & desire/intelligence/hard work/discipline).
We can maybe (one day) pull what the Canes did a few years ago...

And for example, this year...IF only everyone was healthy (IF only), who knows how good/great our playoffs would have been (not to remove anything from the Bruins, just talking about our overall playoffs... injuries happen but when there are way too many, well...):

Lang
Tanguay
Markov
Schneider
Bouillon
S.Kosts

Who knows what would have happened? Maybe Conference Finals if everyone was healthy? (lose/win/lose in Eastern Finals to either Pens or Wash?). We'll never know...



Also...I'm just waiting for all of PK Subban, McDonagh, Pacioretty, Weber...to get enough NHL experience possible and then let's see how good this team can be. Dmen like Subban and McDonagh will only help Price's cause .

Can't wait for Price, PK Subban, McDonagh, Pacioretty, Weber, and Maxwell to put it all together at the same time + sign Markov to another 4-5 years (should be a dandy of a team to watch).


Last edited by Mr. Hab: 06-06-2009 at 05:51 AM.
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Old
06-06-2009, 05:24 PM
  #62
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When you say that the Habs fans have to be patient with Price........no one with any common sense would disagree.

I have 2 concerns with your posted statement.

First, in some ways the Habs organization has not been patient with Price. Arguably, Price should have spent at leat one full year in the AHL to mature both as an athlete and as a person. To me, the Habs seemed to have rushed him into not only the NHL, but into the starters job in Montreal. The fans naturally expect the starter (especially in Montreal) to be ready to perform to that level!

Secondly, I'm not sure you can compare Price to Fleury, in the respect that Fleury, from the time he entered the NHL, showed more natural athletacism than has Price (who relies more on his size and positioning in goal than athletic skills), which is why some peole question Price's upside potentail.

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Old
06-06-2009, 11:07 PM
  #63
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It took you watching the finals to figure out you need to be patient with young players? People also got to remember young players usually have difficult sophomore seasons so thats need to be taken into account when assesing them. I would suspect it's even tougher for goalies.

I guess we won't be hearing you comparing Lats to Turner Stevenson anymore or hearing how Lats didn't deserve to be on the team and was only there for other reasons, yadda yadda.
Did you have an epiphany watching the finals or what?

Lats and T Stevenson aren't the same type of players at all. Id actually compare Lats more to a Franzen type player. Same upright skating style, similar skill sets, same size. Franzen wasn't a good skater when he broke into the league but has improved alot especially over the past two seasons. Lats is 23 while Franzen is nearer to thirty and was a very late bloomer. so yeah Patience.

Flame away.
It's always been clear to me that we need to be patient with our young guys. If you go back to the 80's and before we always had a few rookies/sophs , but they were not placed in crucial roles and did time in the minors (with very few exceptions). In recent history because we haven't had a deep balanced lineup, players have been put in roles that they were not ready for and because its Montreal their flaws are magnified.

I have been hard on Lats, true, but I will stand by my assessment that he was allowed to stay on the team when time in the minors would have clearly helped his development. There were other players in the minors that easily could have filled his position and allowed Lats an opportunity to dominate and grow. Too late now. I also stand by my comparison to Stevenson. He was a big player with soft hands but no grit and Lats is a mirror image. Time will tell whether he develops into a top 6 player. It would be easier to be patient with him if his career timeline weren't as accelerated. My fear is that by the time he develops, he'll be a UFA and we won't be able to reap any benefits from that patience. Had he spent some time in the minors we'd be allowed more time to see the development. Comparing Lats to Franzen is.... laughable.... nuff said.

I started the thread to make a statement about Price and how his treatment by fans and media and how we should be patient and allow this development to take place. His situation is vastly different than Lats so don't say I'm being hypocritical. Price clearly showed he was ready for the NHL and dominated at every other level winning awards. He would stagnate in the minors. He's young and will make mistakes. I hope he goes back to playing a less careful style. His woes in the playoffs last year started with a misplay of the puck and he seemed cautious from then on. He needs to be aggressive to be effective, but with aggressiveness comes mistakes.....PATIENCE

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Old
06-06-2009, 11:36 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by habfaninvictoria View Post
It's always been clear to me that we need to be patient with our young guys. If you go back to the 80's and before we always had a few rookies/sophs , but they were not placed in crucial roles and did time in the minors (with very few exceptions). In recent history because we haven't had a deep balanced lineup, players have been put in roles that they were not ready for and because its Montreal their flaws are magnified.

I have been hard on Lats, true, but I will stand by my assessment that he was allowed to stay on the team when time in the minors would have clearly helped his development. There were other players in the minors that easily could have filled his position and allowed Lats an opportunity to dominate and grow. Too late now. I also stand by my comparison to Stevenson. He was a big player with soft hands but no grit and Lats is a mirror image. Time will tell whether he develops into a top 6 player. It would be easier to be patient with him if his career timeline weren't as accelerated. My fear is that by the time he develops, he'll be a UFA and we won't be able to reap any benefits from that patience. Had he spent some time in the minors we'd be allowed more time to see the development. Comparing Lats to Franzen is.... laughable.... nuff said.

I started the thread to make a statement about Price and how his treatment by fans and media and how we should be patient and allow this development to take place. His situation is vastly different than Lats so don't say I'm being hypocritical. Price clearly showed he was ready for the NHL and dominated at every other level winning awards. He would stagnate in the minors. He's young and will make mistakes. I hope he goes back to playing a less careful style. His woes in the playoffs last year started with a misplay of the puck and he seemed cautious from then on. He needs to be aggressive to be effective, but with aggressiveness comes mistakes.....PATIENCE
For starters Lats couldn't be sent to the minors only back to juniors. Sticky that somewhere maybe get a tattoo on your fore head or something so you and others can remember that fact.

Turner Stevenson had soft hands? now thats laughable. Did you ever see the guy play seriously? Turner Stevenson had no grit... thats about all he had ,but you should know that if you actually saw him play. Maybe your mixing Turner Stevenson with someone else.. I really hope so. nuff said.

Do you remember Franzen at 23? do you even remember Franzen at 26? no of course you don't. In fact Franzen didn't really break out till his late 20's. He hadn't scored more than 12 goals as a pro until two seasons ago.

anyhow im not gonna debate anything with someone who thinks turner stevenson has no grit.

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Old
06-06-2009, 11:51 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
For starters Lats couldn't be sent to the minors only back to juniors. Sticky that somewhere maybe get a tattoo on your fore head or something so you and others can remember that fact.

Turner Stevenson had soft hands? now thats laughable. Did you ever see the guy play seriously? Turner Stevenson had no grit... thats about all he had ,but you should know that if you actually saw him play. Maybe your mixing Turner Stevenson with someone else.. I really hope so. nuff said.

Do you remember Franzen at 23? do you even remember Franzen at 26? no of course you don't. In fact Franzen didn't really break out till his late 20's. He hadn't scored more than 12 goals as a pro until two seasons ago.

anyhow im not gonna debate anything with someone who thinks turner stevenson has no grit.
We disagree about Turner Stevenson.... that's ok.... Yes I saw him play, I have a stick signed by him, Andrew Cassels (It's Cassels stick), Courtnall and Odie. I stand by my assessment.

Lats couldn't go back to the AHL in his rookie season, but he could have gone there in year 2... which has been my point the whole time. I'm not a Lats hater, I just hate the way he's been used.

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Old
06-07-2009, 12:09 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by habfaninvictoria View Post
We disagree about Turner Stevenson.... that's ok.... Yes I saw him play, I have a stick signed by him, Andrew Cassels (It's Cassels stick), Courtnall and Odie. I stand by my assessment.

Lats couldn't go back to the AHL in his rookie season, but he could have gone there in year 2... which has been my point the whole time. I'm not a Lats hater, I just hate the way he's been used.
Well your assement is beyond wrong. I'm sure anyone else who watched Stevenson play would concur. I have stuff signed by Gretzky, but i gave it away to a friend who was a huge Gretzky fan cause he'd appreciate it more than i could ever but what does stuff getting signed by such and such have to do with this conversation.

your preaching patience so start practicing it and i have indeed considered you a Lats hater. the thing about Lats is he seems like a kid who has his head screwed on straight and seems like he's more than willing to work on his deficiencies. I agree he needs to be more assertive on the ice but thats about all I agree with.

way off topic but people are way too obsessed with skating in terms of prospects. They should be focusing on things that you can't really teach or be improved upon and skating isn't one of them.

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Old
06-07-2009, 01:18 AM
  #67
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Could the Habs be promoting their young talent prematurely out of overoptimism, if not of sheer desperation?

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Old
06-07-2009, 02:15 AM
  #68
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Please don't compare those two? Price is already better even if he played a really bad year than Fleury who is at his best.
Seriously ?

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Could the Habs be promoting their young talent prematurely out of overoptimism, if not of sheer desperation?
The more you make sense, the less people will listen to you.

In reality,this is a possibility, but ultimately, no one is sure. There's a typical "Sophomore slump" that rookies go through. On top of that all the injuries and the team as a whole sucking for long periods...

We should see the focus, calm and cool Carey Price next year.

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