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Philadelphia-Toronto/NYI

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Old
06-14-2009, 09:53 AM
  #1
BillyShoe1721
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Philadelphia-Toronto/NYI

Draft day deal, I think it would be beneficial for the Flyers to trade out of the first round for two seconds because there is more value at the goaltending position in the second round, and this is also a deep draft.

To Philadelphia-#50, #58, #127 overall

To Toronto-#22 overall

I base these values off of this table:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft0...ory?id=2410670

It may be for the NFL, but I still find it to be pretty accurate. It equals out to be 780 for the Philly pick and 765 for the Toronto picks.

or

To Philadelphia-#37 overall, #56 overall

To NYI-#22 overall, #112 overall

Picks balance out to be 850 for the Philly picks, and 870 for the NYI picks. There was a rumor about the Isles wanting to get back into the first round IIRC.

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Old
06-14-2009, 09:55 AM
  #2
IslesRock4
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Isles do this deal.

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Old
06-14-2009, 09:56 AM
  #3
Schenn
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this table is a little off though, becuase nfl has 32 teams, and nhl only has 30, but it would still be fairly close,

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:12 AM
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The Pucks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
Draft day deal, I think it would be beneficial for the Flyers to trade out of the first round for two seconds because there is more value at the goaltending position in the second round, and this is also a deep draft.

To Philadelphia-#50, #58, #127 overall

To Toronto-#22 overall

I base these values off of this table:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft0...ory?id=2410670

It may be for the NFL, but I still find it to be pretty accurate. It equals out to be 780 for the Philly pick and 765 for the Toronto picks.

or

To Philadelphia-#37 overall, #56 overall

To NYI-#22 overall, #112 overall

Picks balance out to be 850 for the Philly picks, and 870 for the NYI picks. There was a rumor about the Isles wanting to get back into the first round IIRC.
When did Philly get Vancouvers 1st rounder? Philly has the 21st pick.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:14 AM
  #5
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those 2nd's could be packaged to move up higher from 7. Leafs won't do it because we need depth throughout the organization.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:16 AM
  #6
Chapin Landvogt
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Could be of interest to the Isles....

However, if the guys they really want are gone between 10-18, then maybe the 22 isn't all that interesting...

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:16 AM
  #7
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It actually makes sense for the Flyers to move out of the first round. They have their high end locked up long term, especially if they opt to keep Van Riemsdyk. A pair of 2nd rounders should be good enough to add one of the better goalie prospects and one more 2-way defenceman.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:29 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Pucks View Post
When did Philly get Vancouvers 1st rounder? Philly has the 21st pick.
NYR got the 17th overall as compensation for Alexei Cherepanov, so it pushes everybody picking after 16th overall down 1 spot.

I think the value is probably there, but there isn't anybody around 22nd that I would want Leafs to trade up for. I'd rather they keep their 2nds and use one of them to draft a goalie.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:31 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugotmybeef View Post
those 2nd's could be packaged to move up higher from 7. Leafs won't do it because we need depth throughout the organization.
We also need quality, I say Burke does it and drafts Zach Budish.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:32 AM
  #10
BrindamoursNose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drofnats View Post
NYR got the 17th overall as compensation for Alexei Cherepanov, so it pushes everybody picking after 16th overall down 1 spot.
Wow. That seems wildly un-fair (then again...I never agreed with them getting any compensation for Cherepanov).

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:35 AM
  #11
seanlinden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drofnats View Post
NYR got the 17th overall as compensation for Alexei Cherepanov, so it pushes everybody picking after 16th overall down 1 spot.

I think the value is probably there, but there isn't anybody around 22nd that I would want Leafs to trade up for. I'd rather they keep their 2nds and use one of them to draft a goalie.
Rangers get the 17th pick in the 2nd round

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:49 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drofnats View Post
NYR got the 17th overall as compensation for Alexei Cherepanov, so it pushes everybody picking after 16th overall down 1 spot.

I think the value is probably there, but there isn't anybody around 22nd that I would want Leafs to trade up for. I'd rather they keep their 2nds and use one of them to draft a goalie.
Not 17th overall, the 47th overall.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:50 AM
  #13
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No chance the Isles do this deal. They traded back last year to acquire more second round picks. This year in a deep draft they will take the best players available with their early picks.

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Old
06-14-2009, 10:52 AM
  #14
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Originally Posted by youarentobjective View Post
No chance the Isles do this deal. They traded back last year to acquire more second round picks. This year in a deep draft they will take the best players available with their early picks.
He has the Islanders actually trading up...not down...i think you looked at it wrong.

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Old
06-14-2009, 11:16 AM
  #15
Chapin Landvogt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drofnats View Post
NYR got the 17th overall as compensation for Alexei Cherepanov, so it pushes everybody picking after 16th overall down 1 spot.
The Rangers have the 47th pick as compensation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_NHL_Entry_Draft

I'm still not sure folks are down with that, technicality this or that....

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Old
06-14-2009, 12:14 PM
  #16
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I do both deals from a Philly perspective, I think trading down is the best for move for them considering their lack of picks and the real positions of need within the organization. No value at goaltender in the first round.

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Old
06-14-2009, 12:25 PM
  #17
BillyShoe1721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schenn29 View Post
this table is a little off though, becuase nfl has 32 teams, and nhl only has 30, but it would still be fairly close,
It goes by pick number, so they may be a bit off, but I still think it's a good indicator.

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Old
06-14-2009, 12:58 PM
  #18
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If your gonna try doing that proposal heres a link that lists all of the picks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_NHL_Entry_Draft

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Old
06-14-2009, 01:01 PM
  #19
BillyShoe1721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyFan850 View Post
If your gonna try doing that proposal heres a link that lists all of the picks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_NHL_Entry_Draft
Yeah, that's the site I've been using...

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Old
06-14-2009, 01:20 PM
  #20
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I'd do the trade up.

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Old
06-14-2009, 01:35 PM
  #21
phlocky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
Draft day deal, I think it would be beneficial for the Flyers to trade out of the first round for two seconds because there is more value at the goaltending position in the second round, and this is also a deep draft.

To Philadelphia-#50, #58, #127 overall

To Toronto-#22 overall

I base these values off of this table:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft0...ory?id=2410670

It may be for the NFL, but I still find it to be pretty accurate. It equals out to be 780 for the Philly pick and 765 for the Toronto picks.

or

To Philadelphia-#37 overall, #56 overall

To NYI-#22 overall, #112 overall

Picks balance out to be 850 for the Philly picks, and 870 for the NYI picks. There was a rumor about the Isles wanting to get back into the first round IIRC.

Umm, that's some computer geeks "statistical" value of picks, not what ACTUAL GM's see as fair value. Just look at last year when I believe it was NJD who traded down in the draft. They gave up their first to move down about 8 spots and added a mid 2nd or something. That's a TON more than what this geeks "table" would rate the Flyers 22nd pick as value-wise. For the 22nd pick we could probably get a pick right aorund 30 and one in the late 30's.

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Old
06-14-2009, 01:43 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
Umm, that's some computer geeks "statistical" value of picks, not what ACTUAL GM's see as fair value. Just look at last year when I believe it was NJD who traded down in the draft. They gave up their first to move down about 8 spots and added a mid 2nd or something. That's a TON more than what this geeks "table" would rate the Flyers 22nd pick as value-wise. For the 22nd pick we could probably get a pick right aorund 30 and one in the late 30's.
not in a deep draft as this one..... your overall premise is correct though. in a draft as deep as this there are legit 1st rounders into the mid 2nd. As an Isles fan I would not even think of moving 26. 31 or 37

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Old
06-14-2009, 01:51 PM
  #23
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I dunno man i think i would do it as the Leafs...if we can then move up to 5th overall and take Schenn with it, then take Glennie if he's still at #22, then this draft would be a smashing success for us

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Old
06-14-2009, 02:00 PM
  #24
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The Leafs are not moving up to 5th overall. Burke explictly said he had contacted all of the top five GMs and found nobody willing to deal.

As to the OP, you can't really talk about pick-for-pick deals at this point in time because the value of moving is going to be determined at the draft. On an absolute level, I see little to no motivation for the Isles to move from 26th to 22nd. Four spots at that end of the draft is going to accomplish that much UNLESS there is some player the ISles want availabe at 22nd who they expect to be gone at 26th.

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Old
06-14-2009, 02:03 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Darth Milbury View Post
The Leafs are not moving up to 5th overall. Burke explictly said he had contacted all of the top five GMs and found nobody willing to deal.

As to the OP, you can't really talk about pick-for-pick deals at this point in time because the value of moving is going to be determined at the draft. On an absolute level, I see little to no motivation for the Isles to move from 26th to 22nd. Four spots at that end of the draft is going to accomplish that much UNLESS there is some player the ISles want availabe at 22nd who they expect to be gone at 26th.
Immediately following which he said that most deals are formed closed to draft day and that he'd keep trying.

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