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Detroit to offer Hossa long term deal (4 million dollar cap hit)

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Old
06-15-2009, 05:59 AM
  #26
Fourier
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dado View Post
In that scenario, salary can only drop by $3M/year. This will get you to $4M hit, but it's a seven year deal.

6-6-6-5-2-1-1 => 4.0/yr

Yeah okay you can buy all these guys out if they don't voluntarily retire, but there are enough of these contracts out there now that it will have meaningful negative impact against future cap space.
Buyouts don't help much on the tail end of a long term deal heavily fron t loaded deal. If the last three years of this deal was bought the cap hit for those years would be $2.67M $3.67M and $3.67M respectively.

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06-15-2009, 07:22 AM
  #27
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Holland is making a HUGE mistake if he re-signs Hossa. He's going to handicap his team for at least the next two years, if not longer.

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Old
06-15-2009, 07:45 AM
  #28
Mr Sakich
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just out of curiosity - what is the league rules regarding these type of contracts? I have heard they would never approve some contract that pay players into their 40's but they seem to approve the Detroit ones. Is there a special rule for Detroit?

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Old
06-15-2009, 07:52 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Mr Sakich View Post
just out of curiosity - what is the league rules regarding these type of contracts? I have heard they would never approve some contract that pay players into their 40's but they seem to approve the Detroit ones. Is there a special rule for Detroit?
There is no official rule, except the broad-based rule in the CBA that gives to the league office sweeping powers to determine what deals break the 'spirit' of the CBA, and refuse to record any contracts it sees fit. By leaving it deliberately vague, the league gets around the question of loopholes. It can claim that virtually any action it chooses breaks the spirit of the deal, should it choose to do so.

The key worth noting, though, is that contrary to the generally-held belief, the Detroit contracts don't pay guys deep into their 40s. No teams in the NHL have yet tried to pay a guy deep into his 40s, both because just about everyone expects the league to cry foul if they should do so, and because few clubs (if any) are eager to have elder players under contract that late into their careers, so far down the line.

Now while teams are happy to pay guys into their 40s, after they show they still have it, they do so on one- and two-year deals. No one has yet wanted to sign a guy substantially past 40, at a time when he's 35 or under. There is no precedent for any team trying to sign a guy for very long term, in a deal that takes a player deep into his 40s. Rather, such deals seem to end at 40 or earlier.

For example, Johan Franzen is 29 years old, born in December 1979. His 11 year deal takes him to age 40. That seems to be the cutoff point beyond which, both teams are wary of going, and the league is believed to have set an unofficial age cap on long-term deals.

Really, though, this is all speculation until someone tests the league on this one. There is to date no test case.

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Old
06-15-2009, 08:15 AM
  #30
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Hossa for 4 mil/year? Hard to go wrong with that... I think Miro freaking Satan is making like 3.5.

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06-15-2009, 08:22 AM
  #31
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If Det pulls this off the wings are going to suck in 6-8 years when all their players are 40 years old and still have a fairly high cap hit.

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Old
06-15-2009, 08:48 AM
  #32
kyle evs48
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Maybe he'll get his head out of his ass and realize that it's not yet time to panic about winning a cup.

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Old
06-15-2009, 08:49 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
How about this:
8-8-8-8-6-6-4-2-2-1-.5-.5-.5-.5-.5 = 3.7 cap hit. Hossa retires after he reachs age 40. He gets paid quite fairly for the years preceding his retirement and Detroit saves cap space allowing them to field a better team.
a 15 year dea?

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Old
06-15-2009, 08:51 AM
  #34
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a 15 year dea?
Nice lol Hossa will be 45 years old when that one expires!

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:16 AM
  #35
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So does this mean no Ville Leino?

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:19 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenatorArmy View Post
I think Hossa wants to go to a future contender. I don't think he considers Detroit that team. They may have a crack at it next year, but once LIdstrom retires & some of Detroits other vets, there's a big question mark about their ability to compete at that same level. I'm not sure what team he thinks will be that contender, but Pittsburgh springs to mind Maybe he signs with a team like Chicago, Or San Jose or Boston or who knows
Right.... just like Detroit was going to suck when they lost Yzerman.... Detroit will figure out a way to win without Lidstrom. They have been drafting a surplus of Goaltenders and Defensemen as of late so by the time he retires we hope we don't miss him too much. But besides Lidstrom most of the Vets on Detroit are liabilities not assets. If you have watched Draper or Maltby or Chelios this season you would be wondering why they are still in the NHL. Once Draper is replaced with Helm and Malbty with Abdelkader Detroit will be even better offensively.

Detroit will always be atop the standings as long as Holland and Co. are still their.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupca View Post
If Det pulls this off the wings are going to suck in 6-8 years when all their players are 40 years old and still have a fairly high cap hit.
Well in 7ish years the cap is hopefully going to rise quite a bit that the hit won't be very much. Besides having players like Datsyuk Zetterberg Franzen and Hossa on your 3rd and 4th line is great because they will be killing penalties and can still score. Besides their veteran presence and experience is invaluable to younger in the organization.

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:20 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by GongShowHockeyNYR View Post
So does this mean no Ville Leino?
Probably not.. More like no Hudler and Samuelsson..

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:20 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Bubbles View Post
Yeah, it won't happen. You can kiss Hossa goodbye. No freaking way that he signs for 4 mil a year, cap wise.
Why should Hossa care what the cap hit is? He gets paid. The extra years with lower salary are irrelevant; he doesn't even have to play out the contract. Why should he care how the Wings manage the cap? As long as he makes his money, what difference does it make?


As for 6x6M and than 1M, I was under the impression your pay couldn't decline by more than 50% in one year.


And as for Hossa taking the deal maybe he really liked playing in Detroit or maybe he's determined to prove that he's not a choker (won't change my opinion... not for a while anyways) to the teammates that he let down when he did his vanishing act in the playoffs.

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:21 AM
  #39
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The replacement for Lidstrom will probably be in the 7th round of the 2009 or 2010 draft

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:22 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgupca View Post
If Det pulls this off the wings are going to suck in 6-8 years when all their players are 40 years old and still have a fairly high cap hit.
Except they'll retire (likely before 40) and since they signed their deals before 35 there won't be any cap hit, so... they won't be.

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:26 AM
  #41
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Kick Holland out, I have the greatest idea in the world:

Hossa leaves, we sign Bouwmeester for a long term contract with low hit.
When Lidstrom retires, we sign Rick Nash or Ilya Kovalchuk.

FRICKIN GENIUS I AM - TROPHY NOW.

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Old
06-15-2009, 09:29 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by albo23 View Post
Kick Holland out, I have the greatest idea in the world:

Hossa leaves, we sign Bouwmeester for a long term contract with low hit.
When Lidstrom retires, we sign Rick Nash or Ilya Kovalchuk.

FRICKIN GENIUS I AM - TROPHY NOW.
Only the NHL could stop the Wings from winning the Cup. Wait didn't that just happen?

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Old
06-15-2009, 10:21 AM
  #43
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If Holland can get this deal done, it would be ridiculous. Hossa would actually get a raise for next year and $32 million over the next five years.

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Old
06-15-2009, 10:27 AM
  #44
Burlington Bomb 26
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Originally Posted by Redwingsfan View Post
Probably not.. More like no Hudler and Samuelsson..
Damn.

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Old
06-15-2009, 10:28 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by The Vagabond View Post
a 15 year dea?
With these extremely long term deals given to Zetterberg and Franzen, they haven't extended them past 40 years old. A 15 year deal for 30 year old Hossa would certainly draw cries of foul play from other teams, so I don't think the Red Wings would do that. A 10 year deal is probably about as far as they'd go. There has to be a chance that the player would finish the contract, and there is no chance that Hossa will play 15 more years. That contract would be nullified, I'm pretty certain.

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Old
06-15-2009, 10:28 AM
  #46
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As much as Hossa wants to win, I can't see him leaving that much money in his career on the table.

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06-15-2009, 10:32 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by jfried View Post
As much as Hossa wants to win, I can't see him leaving that much money in his career on the table.

What if a big fat Stanley Cup bonus is added to his contract? Would that affect his cap hit?

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Old
06-15-2009, 10:40 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by TR3V0R View Post
What if a big fat Stanley Cup bonus is added to his contract? Would that affect his cap hit?
Only entry level contracts can have bonuses, IIRC..

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Old
06-15-2009, 11:39 AM
  #49
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10-10-8-7-4-2-1-1-1-1 = 45M, 35M in 4 years (avg 8.75M for those years)

cap hit = 4.5M

or, a new highest salary?: 15-10-5-5-4-2-1-1-1-1 = 45M, 25M in two years (new high, i believe) and the same 35M in 4 years.

dont discount the effect of up front money. Invested properly, that's worth a ton of extra money over the term of the contract. If detroit's coffers are full right now, why not spend it?

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Old
06-15-2009, 11:44 AM
  #50
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Hossa for 4 mil sounds reasonable, but any higher than that is bs for him right now. And even if we sign him for 4 mil, then for sure we have to get rid of Samuelsson, Hudler and someone else.

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