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Line Predictions (2009/10 Season)

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Old
07-28-2009, 11:30 AM
  #426
mikedifr
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Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
I like Briere, but he definitely has struggled at even strength for the majority of his career. The one great even strength year Briere had in Buffalo was an exception to Briere's regular even strength play, not proof that he can be consistently good at even strength.

Briere was waived from a sub-par Coyotes team, in part, because of his horrible defensive zone play and his lazy back-checking. His being moved to the wing mutes his defensive deficiencies, a sign that his defensive game hasn't improved sufficiently over the years.

'Better system' or not, Briere will have to work much harder to be a responsible defensive player.... if he wants to. I just take him for what he is: a one-dimensional, high-end offensive talent. Not everyone can be a great two-way player.
First off, Briere was never waived....He was traded to Buffalo.....We can speculate on the reasons he was trade all we want, but we never know 100% why....Plus, that was the heart of the clutch and grab era where players like him were not as effective......

Look we all know he is never going to be a good defensive player....It isnt the type of player he is, was or is ever going to be. That doesnt mean you cant "limit" his ineffectiveness or "compensate" for his ineffectiveness...You surround him with players that are very good defensive players and you have a system in place that will hide his deficiencies.

Plus, if you want to say he had one good even strength year....I will counter with he only had 1 bad one until he got here to Philly, and that was the year he was traded.

Once he got to Buffalo he improved greatly....and then after the lockout he became a more than a PPG player, again until he got here. Yes, Buffalo's style had something to do with that....but we just let our forwards go out and do whatever the want....

Briere doesnt need to play in a run and gun system, he showed that with Prospal. He is a great "half-court" offensive player....A better system where the forwards stay back, the defenders can actually get the puck out of the zone and into the offensive zone where he and other forwards that actually complement him (unlike the idiot here who kept trying to put Knuble with him regardless of how bad it was) can work their magic and he is instantly less of a liability.

Now stick someone out there and tell him to go play pond hockey and he is going to look beyond brutal

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07-28-2009, 11:31 AM
  #427
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Briere was waived at one point and cleared I think

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07-28-2009, 11:35 AM
  #428
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
First off, Briere was never waived....He was traded to Buffalo.....
Actually i think you will find that briere was waived. Twice. He was then traded to buffalo for chris gratton and draft picks.

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07-28-2009, 11:38 AM
  #429
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Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Briere was waived at one point and cleared I think
There is no record of him being waived on tsn's website where they list transactions but perhaps since he cleared they didn't list it or they just never put it down which is possible.

edit: http://tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?id=1748

apparently he was suspended for high sticking against Brian Leetch though


Last edited by ilovetheflyers8: 07-28-2009 at 11:44 AM.
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Old
07-28-2009, 11:42 AM
  #430
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Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Briere was waived at one point and cleared I think
Hm... I havent found anything also regarding him being waved. Wiki (I know it isnt the best source for information) doesnt have him being waved at all.

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07-28-2009, 11:48 AM
  #431
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If he was that is my mistake....I didnt even look at TSN, not sure what that says...

Either way, doesnt change the fact that:

1) It was near the beginning of his career
2) It was in the clutch/grab era where no one wanted pure offensive players
3) It was the Phoenix Coyotes we are talking about
4) Since the lockout, he has been a PPG player (better than that with the Sabres) and has been a stud in the playoffs when it counts....
5) Before coming here he had one horrible +/- year, even his partial years and one full season before the year he was traded he was fine.....Something just went terribly wrong that year....it happens.

Its also quite possible that his issue that year was the same as we had, he didnt fit with their style of play, the coach didnt know how to use him or compensate for him, he wasnt playing with the right players....You never know.


Again, the guy is never going to be a good defensive player.....Doesnt mean he isnt effective and that we dont need him.

Pairing him with Giroux and another defensively responsible winger that can do the dirty work would be perfect for him.....IF we actually implement some kind of system

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07-28-2009, 11:52 AM
  #432
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Hm... I havent found anything also regarding him being waved. Wiki (I know it isnt the best source for information) doesnt have him being waved at all.
Me neither...And the year he was traded he played in 82 games, and 78 in the year before...I googled it and the only mention I see of him being waived is in his first couple partial seasons

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07-28-2009, 11:57 AM
  #433
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Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
First off, Briere was never waived....He was traded to Buffalo.....We can speculate on the reasons he was trade all we want, but we never know 100% why....Plus, that was the heart of the clutch and grab era where players like him were not as effective......

Look we all know he is never going to be a good defensive player....It isnt the type of player he is, was or is ever going to be. That doesnt mean you cant "limit" his ineffectiveness or "compensate" for his ineffectiveness...You surround him with players that are very good defensive players and you have a system in place that will hide his deficiencies.

Plus, if you want to say he had one good even strength year....I will counter with he only had 1 bad one until he got here to Philly, and that was the year he was traded.

Once he got to Buffalo he improved greatly....and then after the lockout he became a more than a PPG player, again until he got here. Yes, Buffalo's style had something to do with that....but we just let our forwards go out and do whatever the want....

Briere doesnt need to play in a run and gun system, he showed that with Prospal. He is a great "half-court" offensive player....A better system where the forwards stay back, the defenders can actually get the puck out of the zone and into the offensive zone where he and other forwards that actually complement him (unlike the idiot here who kept trying to put Knuble with him regardless of how bad it was) can work their magic and he is instantly less of a liability.

Now stick someone out there and tell him to go play pond hockey and he is going to look beyond brutal
Yeah, he was waived. Ask Coyotes' fans, if this link isn't proof enough:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2922605

Quote:
The new deal is a big step up for Briere, who earlier in his career was knocked for his slight 5-foot-9, 177-pound frame. At one point, he was placed on waivers by the Phoenix Coyotes.

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Old
07-28-2009, 01:11 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
Yeah, he was waived. Ask Coyotes' fans, if this link isn't proof enough:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2922605
Thats fine...Its the first proof we have seen of that....When did it happen?

And your quote is complete proof of why this is irrelevant now....Teams are much more willing to look at guys his size these days, back then they werent.

Plus, he became a star after that....

Its like pointing out that Michael Jordan was cut from his high school team.

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07-28-2009, 01:34 PM
  #435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Thats fine...Its the first proof we have seen of that....When did it happen?

And your quote is complete proof of why this is irrelevant now....Teams are much more willing to look at guys his size these days, back then they werent.

Plus, he became a star after that....

Its like pointing out that Michael Jordan was cut from his high school team.
He was waived in 2001, I think. If not 2001, then it was 2002.

(Found a link to a Sabres' article: it was in 2001: http://www.letsgosabres.com/pressbox...p?newsid=10141)

It wasn't just his size, though it obviously was more of a problem in the clutch-and-grab era. He has become an offensive star at the NHL level. My original point for quoting you still stands, though: he's not strong defensively and the adjustments the Flyers have made, by shifting him to the wing, reinforce that. He's more of a liability at even strength than you have noticed, in my opinion.

The Jordan comparison is laughable. Briere was a superstar in the Q, a first round draft pick and had several years of professional hockey experience before he was waived by the Coyotes.

I'm a big Briere supporter but it sure doesn't show in the last few posts.

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07-28-2009, 01:40 PM
  #436
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Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
He was waived in 2001, I think. If not 2001, then it was 2002.

(Found a link to a Sabres' article: it was in 2001: http://www.letsgosabres.com/pressbox...p?newsid=10141)

It wasn't just his size, though it obviously was more of a problem in the clutch-and-grab era. He has become an offensive star at the NHL level. My original point for quoting you still stands, though: he's not strong defensively and the adjustments the Flyers have made, by shifting him to the wing, reinforce that. He's more of a liability at even strength than you have noticed, in my opinion.

The Jordan comparison is laughable. Briere was a superstar in the Q, a first round draft pick and had several years of professional hockey experience before he was waived by the Coyotes.

I'm a big Briere supporter but it sure doesn't show in the last few posts.
Its not worth debating whether he is strong defensively or not, he never was, isnt and never will be.....He is not that kind of player. The point that CAN be debated and discussed is if a better coach and a different system would limit his ineffectiveness....And it has been proven time and time again that good coaches can accomplish this

The Flyers havent made any adjustments at all over the past couple years, related to Briere or not.....other than putting him on the wing....And the short time he played on the wing with Richards and Gagne last year, he was perfectly fine....The issue there was we had no one else scoring so they had to be broken up.

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Old
07-29-2009, 10:30 PM
  #437
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Hey, I'm a habs fan using the Flyers for a GM game, but I need to know what their line-up is. I want to use the top 6 of

Gagne - Richards - Briere
Hartnell - Carter - Giroux

But I need to know what the bottom 6 is going to look like. If you want to do the defense, go ahead. I tried looking in here, but a lot of mixed answers because of what people want, as opposed to what is probably going to happen.

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07-30-2009, 10:12 AM
  #438
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You mother ****ers just NEVER quit with your bull **** do you?

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07-30-2009, 12:41 PM
  #439
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From what I recall, Briere actually said being waived and passed over by 29 other teams was a huge wakeup call at the time. Briere was one of those naturally skilled guys but wasn't exactly giving 100% all the time. Credit to Briere for rebounding where most guys in his situation sulk and become journeymen.

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07-30-2009, 02:08 PM
  #440
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As the top six, I would like to see

Gagne-Richards-Briere
Hartnell-Carter-Giroux

Gagne and Richards have strong chemistry and good size/defensive ability, all three guys can set up or finish. The second line has balance, too, but as a whole more so than having evenly talented player. I like Giroux as a pass-first winger playing with Carter, a shoot-first player, and Hartnell who can get messy down low and score gritty goals.

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Old
08-01-2009, 05:19 PM
  #441
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I know I already asked, but I'm going to ask again because I need to know for the GM game I'm in. What is Philly's bottom six going to look like? And I think I know the Defense, but if somebody wanted to post that also in case I'm wrong, that would be great.

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08-01-2009, 05:31 PM
  #442
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habsman56 View Post
I know I already asked, but I'm going to ask again because I need to know for the GM game I'm in. What is Philly's bottom six going to look like? And I think I know the Defense, but if somebody wanted to post that also in case I'm wrong, that would be great.
The bottom six is anyone's guess. I'd say the locks for bottom six spots are Powe, Asham, Laperriere, and Carcillo. Then either one of JVR or Maroon could take a spot, and the other spot or spots(if JVR or Maroon don't make it) is/are for one of Pyorala, Cote, Ward, Kaspar, Ross, or Kolanos. If it was up to me, with no more signings, I would go with:

Carcillo-Laperriere-Asham
Pyorala-Powe-Kaspar

Then with the defense, it depends on what you do with Jones. If you want to keep him, then use OK Tollefsen as the 7th defenseman, but if you dump Jones, which I would strongly suggest I'd go with

Pronger-Parent
Timonen-Coburn
Carle-Tollefensen

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Old
08-01-2009, 05:43 PM
  #443
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Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
The bottom six is anyone's guess. I'd say the locks for bottom six spots are Powe, Asham, Laperriere, and Carcillo. Then either one of JVR or Maroon could take a spot, and the other spot or spots(if JVR or Maroon don't make it) is/are for one of Pyorala, Cote, Ward, Kaspar, Ross, or Kolanos. If it was up to me, with no more signings, I would go with:

Carcillo-Laperriere-Asham
Pyorala-Powe-Kaspar

Then with the defense, it depends on what you do with Jones. If you want to keep him, then use OK Tollefsen as the 7th defenseman, but if you dump Jones, which I would strongly suggest I'd go with

Pronger-Parent
Timonen-Coburn
Carle-Tollefensen
Thanks, I'm going to use that, as I think you know what you're talking about, and for the defense, with that defense, who would be the 7th D-man, if I do dump Jones?

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08-01-2009, 06:00 PM
  #444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habsman56 View Post
Thanks, I'm going to use that, as I think you know what you're talking about, and for the defense, with that defense, who would be the 7th D-man, if I do dump Jones?
Syvret probably

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08-01-2009, 06:03 PM
  #445
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Syvret probably
Thanks

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Old
08-01-2009, 06:27 PM
  #446
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all i know is that our PP is going to be disgusting!

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Old
08-01-2009, 06:36 PM
  #447
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all i know is that our PP is going to be disgusting!
on paper, sure

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Old
08-11-2009, 02:56 PM
  #448
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lines i would like to see (given a shot!)

Line 1 Gagne Giroux Carter (sniper, playmaker/wizard, Sniper)


this line would have INCREDIBLE speed between carter/gagne, both of who have a CANNON!

i think there could be real potential in putting giroux between those two!
this is the NEW legion of DOOM IMO

Line A Harnell Richards Briere
(both of these lines are very talented and would be hard to call "line 1 and line 2" lol


this is more of a "3 good forwards left, lets put them together" :/




pros:
1) carter/giroux/gags would be unstoppable, and could score against ANY other line.
2) puts richards/briere against a second line, which could mean good production
3) we can give our 6 best more ice time each.
4) we still have the depth to fill the 3rd line with players (riemsdyke, maroon, ross, powe, carcillo, cote...etc)


cons:
a bit less spread out from last year.

cool 3rd line: carcillo + asham + free-agent

4th:cote + powe + lappeirre

IMO: i dont think we will see JVR or Maroon until the post-season (holmgren will let them develop until we absolutely NEED them)


Last edited by tuckrr: 08-11-2009 at 03:07 PM.
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Old
08-11-2009, 03:03 PM
  #449
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Listen, I dont wanna sound like a dick. But i stopped reading when I saw Carter on the RW

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08-11-2009, 03:06 PM
  #450
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This post should be in the "line predictions" thread.

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