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Rangers looking to move up or Back per Gross

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Old
06-20-2009, 11:59 PM
  #26
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While I agree that the best player could be had if they trade up, I would alsobe in favor of trading down if it meant grabbing two players like Morin/Palmieri/Nattinen/Ferraro/etc. Although I think trading up fora player like Kassian, Glennie or Schroeder would really add a lot to this organization.

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06-21-2009, 12:11 AM
  #27
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maybe we can get that 3rd overall from COL everyones been so eager about

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06-21-2009, 12:13 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonas1235 View Post
Rangers don't need more centermen.

Josefson would probably only need another year in Sweden before he's ready for the NHL.

They should trade down and get Klingberg or Caron in late first round.
any player we take in our spot wont be playing next season anyway.

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06-21-2009, 02:20 AM
  #29
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Not trying to be an ass...but isn't this really a non story? I mean doesn't pretty much every team want to do this?
I thought the same thing. It's alot like saying a team may be interested in signing UFAs to affordable contracts. What team isn't doing this?

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06-21-2009, 07:46 AM
  #30
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These hockey articles are so boring by these writers it's amazing. Gross doesn't have a clue what the Rangers will do. Either does Brooks or any other Rangers writer. Sather never has nor will tell writers anything. Nor will anybody else in the organization.

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06-21-2009, 11:21 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonas1235 View Post
Rangers don't need more centermen.

Josefson would probably only need another year in Sweden before he's ready for the NHL.

They should trade down and get Klingberg or Caron in late first round.
LOL. Pass up on Josefson for KLINGBERG?

My God!

Because we need more Sjostroms! Let's pass up on the 65 point center for a 3rd line energy player.

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06-21-2009, 12:16 PM
  #32
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This may sound like the least of the Rangers problems but this team really could use another goal tender. It seems like we don't have enough confidence in Valiquette and Lundqvist at times, certainly appears run down. And remember what Lundqvist looked like the last time he came back from the Olympics? He was shot. Now he's going to Vancouver in 10' to try and win Sweden another Gold Medal.
So either Tortorella and Sather have to make a commitment to playing Stephen Valiquette many more than 13 or 15 games a season (especially this season) or they could go out and get another goal tender. Or, run the risk of wearing out the mvp on this team to where he's ineffective or injured. And god for bid (knock on wood) Lundqvist gets hurt, for an extended period of time we're screwed.

This is why i still disagree with the Montoya trade. He might not be the next Patrick Roy but why not let him work with Benoit Allaire, who has the reputation for being a great goal tending coach?

Or, the other thing they could have done was use the compensation pick (or the first pick in the second round) and draft a goal tender there (As Antropov is more likely signing else where anyway).

Of course this is just my opinion, and i think Lundqvist who although is a great goalie, is the type of guy who needs a bit more rest than other goal tenders. With him, It appears as if he needs some time to regain all that concentration and mental preparation. I think he focuses so hard in each and every game that he gets "psychologically burned out."

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06-21-2009, 01:14 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gravytrain6t View Post
This may sound like the least of the Rangers problems but this team really could use another goal tender. It seems like we don't have enough confidence in Valiquette and Lundqvist at times, certainly appears run down. And remember what Lundqvist looked like the last time he came back from the Olympics? He was shot. Now he's going to Vancouver in 10' to try and win Sweden another Gold Medal.
So either Tortorella and Sather have to make a commitment to playing Stephen Valiquette many more than 13 or 15 games a season (especially this season) or they could go out and get another goal tender. Or, run the risk of wearing out the mvp on this team to where he's ineffective or injured. And god for bid (knock on wood) Lundqvist gets hurt, for an extended period of time we're screwed.

This is why i still disagree with the Montoya trade. He might not be the next Patrick Roy but why not let him work with Benoit Allaire, who has the reputation for being a great goal tending coach?

Or, the other thing they could have done was use the compensation pick (or the first pick in the second round) and draft a goal tender there (As Antropov is more likely signing else where anyway).

Of course this is just my opinion, and i think Lundqvist who although is a great goalie, is the type of guy who needs a bit more rest than other goal tenders. With him, It appears as if he needs some time to regain all that concentration and mental preparation. I think he focuses so hard in each and every game that he gets "psychologically burned out."

lundqvist was also a rookie that yr.....hes much more acclimated to playing a heavy schedule now....

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06-21-2009, 01:19 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
While I agree that the best player could be had if they trade up, I would alsobe in favor of trading down if it meant grabbing two players like Morin/Palmieri/Nattinen/Ferraro/etc. Although I think trading up fora player like Kassian, Glennie or Schroeder would really add a lot to this organization.
Trading up for Kassian would be a disaster.

I was listening to NHL Radio last night, and they had on scouts and were interviewing them (one from the Detroit Red Wings), and they all agree with my sentiments on Kassian. He is big, and people confuse that with good. They say he won't score a lick in the NHL, and he is too slow of a skater as it stands now. They say "he will be a pain to play against" but so is Orr, so that's not saying much.

They also agreed with my assessment of Holland, that he is the BIGGEST boom or bust pick. They say he may NEVER make it to the NHL.

Stay away from those two like the plague.

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06-21-2009, 02:20 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Trading up for Kassian would be a disaster.

I was listening to NHL Radio last night, and they had on scouts and were interviewing them (one from the Detroit Red Wings), and they all agree with my sentiments on Kassian. He is big, and people confuse that with good. They say he won't score a lick in the NHL, and he is too slow of a skater as it stands now. They say "he will be a pain to play against" but so is Orr, so that's not saying much.

They also agreed with my assessment of Holland, that he is the BIGGEST boom or bust pick. They say he may NEVER make it to the NHL.

Stay away from those two like the plague.
I disagree, Kassian does have to work on his skating and while he doesnt have the best scoring touch he is the type of player who wil drive the net hard and score goals from in close. I could see him being something like a Vanek with more grit and a little less goal scoring ability of he is brought along right.

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06-21-2009, 02:27 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
I disagree, Kassian does have to work on his skating and while he doesnt have the best scoring touch he is the type of player who wil drive the net hard and score goals from in close. I could see him being something like a Vanek with more grit and a little less goal scoring ability of he is brought along right.
He wouldn't be a bad pickup later on but we need a pure sniper

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06-21-2009, 02:58 PM
  #37
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DO NOT WANT KASSIAN!!!!

If Kassian as at the board at 19 and Glennie and Palmeiri aren't, I'll trade down.

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06-21-2009, 07:23 PM
  #38
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Seems like a non-story to me.

Saying we may move up or we may move down is a pretty vanilla commnet.

While I don't think it's a very deep draft, I don't think that means it lacks talent.

Personally, I see the 15-40 picks being about the same and the 41-60 picks being about the same.

The drop comes when you start getting into the third round and beyond.

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06-21-2009, 07:32 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
Seems like a non-story to me.

Saying we may move up or we may move down is a pretty vanilla commnet.

While I don't think it's a very deep draft, I don't think that means it lacks talent.

Personally, I see the 15-40 picks being about the same and the 41-60 picks being about the same.

The drop comes when you start getting into the third round and beyond.
I agree 100% with both of those statements.

****, check my rankings, Edge, in the draft thread to see just how much of an equal spread I think there is in those ranges.

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06-21-2009, 07:56 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
DO NOT WANT KASSIAN!!!!

If Kassian as at the board at 19 and Glennie and Palmeiri aren't, I'll trade down.
wow, that strong of a feeling? I'm gonna guess I don't know as much about the kid than you. Can you elaborate or link me to where you have already elaborated on this? From my research he's a PpG power forward. he fights. he shoots. he passes. I don't know who claimed he only scored garbage goals. that in itself is garbage. Of course he also goes into those dirty areas to screen, deflect, and dig for garbage which is something I think this team could use more of. His big knock is his skating which may be an issue in Torts system but I would never not draft a player just because I didn't think his flaws made him incompatible with our system (coaches and systems change after all) and if Colton Orr could turn from a player with one skate into the skating forechecker his has become, I don't doubt an high energy forward like Kassian couldn't one up Orr's progress. And check out that last goal. coast to coast. follows up on his own rebound twice. If his balance is solid, you don't have to be the fastest skater to just come down the ice, lean on someone and bull your way to the net.


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06-21-2009, 08:12 PM
  #41
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lundqvist was also a rookie that yr.....hes much more acclimated to playing a heavy schedule now....
I also thought the Montoya trade was dumb. He had one off season. In exchange we got that Leneveau kid who just walked on us and was crap anyways making for a big hole in our prospect depth and especially this year with the Olympics, we are gonna need the backup goalie to take some serious load off of Henke. He needs to be in top condition going into the playoffs. If we have to right Lundqvist hard just to qualify for the playoffs, he'll have no gas left in the tank to pull off those big performances we all know he is capable of playing during the important PO games.

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06-21-2009, 08:51 PM
  #42
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I also thought the Montoya trade was dumb. He had one off season. In exchange we got that Leneveau kid who just walked on us and was crap anyways making for a big hole in our prospect depth and especially this year with the Olympics, we are gonna need the backup goalie to take some serious load off of Henke. He needs to be in top condition going into the playoffs. If we have to right Lundqvist hard just to qualify for the playoffs, he'll have no gas left in the tank to pull off those big performances we all know he is capable of playing during the important PO games.
Thank you. I thought i was losing my mind. I just put up a long post about that. And if he god for bid was injured (I knocked on wood before too), we have Vally in net with Tortorella's system? Kid better be ready. That's why when you look back at the Antropov trade, it's a bad trade. We should have the 2 picks in the second round and we could have used one on a goal tender. And I really don't see too many teams going after goal tenders in the first round. Maybe we could have snagged a good one.

I just can't believe Sather is (if he is) approaching this offseason by moving the farm for Ken Hodge again.

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06-21-2009, 09:04 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by gravytrain6t View Post
Thank you. I thought i was losing my mind. I just put up a long post about that. And if he god for bid was injured (I knocked on wood before too), we have Vally in net with Tortorella's system? Kid better be ready. That's why when you look back at the Antropov trade, it's a bad trade. We should have the 2 picks in the second round and we could have used one on a goal tender. And I really don't see too many teams going after goal tenders in the first round. Maybe we could have snagged a good one.

I just can't believe Sather is (if he is) approaching this offseason by moving the farm for Ken Hodge again.
Drafting a goalie in the second round would have been a waste...goaltending is the one thing this draft is not strong in. The last goalie NYR drafted in the 2nd round was Antoine Lafleur and he has been awful. No need to waste picks on goalies you could probably get later.

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06-21-2009, 09:25 PM
  #44
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There are only 2 goalies in this draft who I feel are 2nd round quality, anyway, and both are at the very tail end of being 2nd round quality.

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06-21-2009, 10:06 PM
  #45
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And even if we can't get a "pure sniper" in the draft doesn't mean we cannot make good use of the 1st round pick. Keep it at all costs. More than a sniper we need to build a team with chemistry. There i go using that word again but I think it's the most important attribute any hockey team must have.

I mean, for example, look at the 90', 91', 92' and 93' St. Louis Blues. They had Curtis Joseph in net, and not one but two 50+ goal scorers with two hall of fame players (Hull, and Shanahan). Actually in 90' Shanny wasn't much of a factor but Hull notched 86 goals!! In 91' Shanahan took away some of his scoring thunder by notching 33 goals but Hull still was able to put up 70+ goals. It also helped they had 2 top of the line asisst men in Craig Janney and Adam Oates.

IDK how they ever one a Cup and I'm sure that's an exception but still. I was trying to prove a point that with those early to mid 90's Blues teams, something still missing was missing. Was it the fact they were missing Scott Stevens on defense while this "tank" was just entering his prime? Not sure.

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06-21-2009, 10:33 PM
  #46
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And even if we can't get a "pure sniper" in the draft doesn't mean we cannot make good use of the 1st round pick. Keep it at all costs. More than a sniper we need to build a team with chemistry. There i go using that word again but I think it's the most important attribute any hockey team must have.

I mean, for example, look at the 90', 91', 92' and 93' St. Louis Blues. They had Curtis Joseph in net, and not one but two 50+ goal scorers with two hall of fame players (Hull, and Shanahan). Actually in 90' Shanny wasn't much of a factor but Hull notched 86 goals!! In 91' Shanahan took away some of his scoring thunder by notching 33 goals but Hull still was able to put up 70+ goals. It also helped they had 2 top of the line asisst men in Craig Janney and Adam Oates.

IDK how they ever one a Cup and I'm sure that's an exception but still. I was trying to prove a point that with those early to mid 90's Blues teams, something still missing was missing. Was it the fact they were missing Scott Stevens on defense while this "tank" was just entering his prime? Not sure.


The 1990's Blues teams were certainly enigmas. I think coaching is what killed them. They had some pretty decent defensemen (Brown, Zombo, Cavallini, Butcher) and lots of depth but they just couldnt get over the hump.

Trading Oates for janney and then trading Hedican and brown just to get janney back were two head scratchers IMO.

But I agree with what you say about chemistry. Having a guy klike Kovy or Gaborik doesnt guarantee squat if they are miserable or have no chemistry.

I kinda want this team to start leaning towards "character" guys and build depth with muckers and grinders. Eventually, two or three will develop into more.

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06-21-2009, 10:48 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Scipio Africanus View Post
The 1990's Blues teams were certainly enigmas. I think coaching is what killed them. They had some pretty decent defensemen (Brown, Zombo, Cavallini, Butcher) and lots of depth but they just couldnt get over the hump.

Trading Oates for janney and then trading Hedican and brown just to get janney back were two head scratchers IMO.

But I agree with what you say about chemistry. Having a guy klike Kovy or Gaborik doesnt guarantee squat if they are miserable or have no chemistry.

I kinda want this team to start leaning towards "character" guys and build depth with muckers and grinders. Eventually, two or three will develop into more.
That's what we did for the two previous drafts prior to last years.

We have enough 3rd liners.

We don't have enough high end prospects.

We need to draft for boom. Not for the 3rd line.

It's why I don't understand why some of you guys are all on the Klingberg train. Or the Nattinen train. Two players that will never, ever be impact players in the NHL.

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06-22-2009, 12:35 AM
  #48
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That's what we did for the two previous drafts prior to last years.

We have enough 3rd liners.

We don't have enough high end prospects.

We need to draft for boom. Not for the 3rd line.

It's why I don't understand why some of you guys are all on the Klingberg train. Or the Nattinen train. Two players that will never, ever be impact players in the NHL.
Boom Kadri!

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06-22-2009, 01:03 AM
  #49
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Hugh jessimen and Elite in the same sentence........
are you drinking again? where are you seeing the comment about Jessiman?

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06-22-2009, 01:05 AM
  #50
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That's what we did for the two previous drafts prior to last years.

We have enough 3rd liners.

We don't have enough high end prospects.

We need to draft for boom. Not for the 3rd line.

It's why I don't understand why some of you guys are all on the Klingberg train. Or the Nattinen train. Two players that will never, ever be impact players in the NHL.
Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

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