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9 dmen battling for 7 spots

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Old
07-05-2009, 12:14 PM
  #1
joshjull
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9 dmen battling for 7 spots

This should be a very interesting training camp on the defensive side of things.

They currently have 9 potentials for 7 spots on defense

Tallinder, Lydman, Rivet, Montador, Sekera, Myers, Butler, Paestch and Weber.


Barring any trades Weber will have an impossible time making the roster out of camp. Since he is the only one that can still be sent down he would have to be lights out in camp to make the squad.


Then it gets trickier. Its not inconceivable that Regier holds on to Tallinder and Lydman if he doesn't get what he feels is "good value" for them. Not to mention with his conservative nature and the "gamble" with Myers. He may want to keep them in case Myers isn't ready.

If Myers shows he is ready and they still haven't moved anyone. What do they do then? Carry 8 dmen into the season and use Paestch and Montador as extra forwards when needed?

That is an interesting element to all of this, the fact that Paestch and Montador can play forward. I'm not saying it will be a big factor in deciding the roster but it may play a role.


Now if Regier does move someome out. That would seem to a be pretty straight forward situation, either Myers or Weber makes it out of camp to complete the 7 spots.

Thoughts.

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07-05-2009, 12:36 PM
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BackGroundMusic
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While those 9 are definitely the top competitors at this point, don't forget about Gragnani and the ultimate dark horse, Buravchikov. If one of those guys has an excellent showing in camp/preseason, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Nate take the 4th line forward role full-time. Of couse, I wouldn't be surprised at that in any event.

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07-05-2009, 12:59 PM
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joshjull
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BikeGiftingMan View Post
While those 9 are definitely the top competitors at this point, don't forget about Gragnani and the ultimate dark horse, Buravchikov. If one of those guys has an excellent showing in camp/preseason, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Nate take the 4th line forward role full-time. Of couse, I wouldn't be surprised at that in any event.
With those 9, I highly doubt Grags or Buravchikov have a prayer.


Last edited by joshjull: 07-05-2009 at 01:05 PM.
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07-05-2009, 01:12 PM
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jlr
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Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
That is an interesting element to all of this, the fact that Paestch and Montador can play forward. I'm not saying it will be a big factor in deciding the roster but it may play a role.
Very interesting, in that it could allow Regier to leverage the defensive depth to acquire the big scoring center so many of us have wanted for awhile.

If he were to somehow find a way to move Tallinder and Hecht, then use Paetsch as both a 4th liner and 7th dman, would that free up enough cap budget space to bring in the big scoring center we've wanted for so long? It would leave our d looking something like:

Rivet-Butler
Lydman-Myers
Montador-Sekera/Weber
Paetsch

And the forwards would look something like:

Vanek - X - Stafford
Roy - Connolly - Pominville
MacArthur - Gaustad - Kaleta
Paille - Mair - Paetsch/Mancari

Honestly, I think both of those groups have a hell of a lot more potential the the guys we've seen the last 2 seasons.

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07-05-2009, 01:26 PM
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Waive Paestch, Weber to Portland...he needs to play regularly coming off his surgery, if he's doing well down there after a month or so of solid playing time, then re-evaluate

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07-05-2009, 01:41 PM
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After they have virtually admitted a need for toughness on the back-end, Montador playing forwards would be a bad idea IMO. We really need to trade Tallinder.

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07-05-2009, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshjull View Post
With those 9, I highly doubt Grags or Buravchikov have a prayer.
I agree. Going a little O.T. with this thought, but since Gragnani has such an uphill climb to make it onto the roster with a bunch of people already ahead of him, perhaps Gragnani could be that piece to sweeten the deal for moving Hecht off the team.

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07-05-2009, 02:14 PM
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Tallinder or Lydman get moved (whoever gets you the best deal)

Paetsch goes to forward, and well likely sign or trade for 1 more d-man

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07-05-2009, 02:30 PM
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I could see Darcy holding on to both Lydman and Tallinder and using them as deadline pieces. but i guess only time will tell.


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07-05-2009, 02:45 PM
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I think Weber gets sent to Portland for two points already made: he can still be sent down, and he needs to play regularly coming off injury. This also lets Regier hold onto Tallinder/Lydman if he has to.

Montador at forward defeats the purpose of signing him: toughening the defense. But it's an option.

I like Gragnani and hope he isn't traded. Regier needs to make at least one trade to free up room, though.

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07-05-2009, 03:45 PM
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10 bodies if we add Derek Morris now.

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07-05-2009, 04:53 PM
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The likely scenario is Paestch moving to 12th/13th forward and Weber going down.

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07-05-2009, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by BuiltTagonTough View Post
10 bodies if we add Derek Morris now.



are you putting that out there as wishful thinking, or is there more to your post?

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07-05-2009, 08:39 PM
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There is nothing wrong with competition. There is also nothing wrong with being 9-10 deep in quality defensemen since they use 10 per season due to injury pretty much every year.

That said, I don't think Regier is done and they aren't going to have the same guys listed above when camp breaks in September.

Two other points -- both Montador and Paetsch can take a spin at forward. With Paetsch's deal being reasonable and his production on LD two years ago to use as a selling point, he could be a useful piece to any team looking to shuffle salary on the back end (same as Paille up front). It would be amusing if they dressed either or both at forward at times. It would hearken back to Ruff's early career.

The other point is I would not rule out Gragnani getting a look if he's good in the camps. They desperately need someone who can quarterback a powerplay (and potentially stretch defenses via the long outlet pass). He is a possible trading piece and with his offensive skills I think he'd be a quality sweetener in any deal.

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Originally Posted by jcbeze View Post
are you putting that out there as wishful thinking, or is there more to your post?
It's an Eklund thing.

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07-05-2009, 09:23 PM
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It really depends on how the rest of the offseason shakes out.

Ideally, we trade Tallinder or Lydman for some cap space and flexibility, and we go Rivet, Butler, Sekera, Montador, Myers, the leftover of Lydman/Tallinder, and Paetsch has the 7th spot.

If we keep everyone as is, I think you find Tallinder, Montador, and Myers rotating in and out of the lineup based on performance, Paetsch kept up here simply due to versatility but always in the press box unless the forward corps is decimated by injuries.

All in all, it kind of sucks to be Weber right now. Unless he storms out of the gate and stakes his claim (tough to do in either of the aforementioned scenario's), it's another year in Portland for him.

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07-05-2009, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
The other point is I would not rule out Gragnani getting a look if he's good in the camps. They desperately need someone who can quarterback a powerplay (and potentially stretch defenses via the long outlet pass).
Exactly why I like him as a player. He is really the only current/potentially NHL ready defenseman we have with that skillset.

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07-05-2009, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jBuds View Post
All in all, it kind of sucks to be Weber right now. Unless he storms out of the gate and stakes his claim (tough to do in either of the aforementioned scenario's), it's another year in Portland for him.
He just needs to be patient.

Worst case: Lydman and Tallinder don't get traded, both of them and Paetsch leave as UFA's, and he's part of the top 6 next year by default.

Next best case: he's up after the trade deadline after Lydman/Tallinder are traded.

Best case: trades clear a spot for him now.

And... if injuries set in, he's first out of the bullpen.

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07-05-2009, 10:32 PM
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I think Weber will come out hitting in the preseason and make this discussion even more interesting.

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07-05-2009, 11:03 PM
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I would not be surprised if we went into the season with 8 D-men on the 23-man roster. Weber would be sent down because he can, and him in the press box makes no sense.

Then if Myers stays up Paetsch gets moved to forward, or someone is traded, or Paetsch is possibly passed through waivers in an attempt to send him to Portland.

If Myers is sent back after the 9 games, then it leaves the 7 guys there.

Of course, this is assuming everyone is healthy. A true Sabres fan knows that we will not have 9 healthy D-men fighting for these spots, so this discussion is moot.

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07-06-2009, 01:26 AM
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1 d-man needs to go and a physical C/F must be added

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07-06-2009, 08:02 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
The other point is I would not rule out Gragnani getting a look if he's good in the camps. They desperately need someone who can quarterback a powerplay (and potentially stretch defenses via the long outlet pass). He is a possible trading piece and with his offensive skills I think he'd be a quality sweetener in any deal.
They seem to be higher on him than most people here too. I think he is given just as much of a shot as Myers, Weber or Paetsch.

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07-06-2009, 08:28 AM
  #22
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Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
I think Weber will come out hitting in the preseason and make this discussion even more interesting.
The competition is the best part of having so many young defensemen. Weber, Myers, Gragnani, Paetsch, etc. are probably all working hard to get better and make the club.

Win-win for the Sabres.

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07-06-2009, 08:49 AM
  #23
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They seem to be higher on him than most people here too. I think he is given just as much of a shot as Myers, Weber or Paetsch.
I have noticed this. Obviously, I think he's a good player and should be given as much of a chance as anyone to make the club. As Der Jaeger noted, I think he has a skill set that the other young defensemen either do not have or have not yet developed as fully as Gragnani. I don't share the worry of some others that he is a forward stuck at defense.

His defense still needs work, that much I don't contest. He got burned pretty bad on one play in that blowout against Edmonton, though he was much steadier for the remainder of his stay. I was surprisingly pleased with how well he totes the puck and his breakout passes were very nice. I think he would be successful paired with a stay-at-home, veteran-type like Rivet or Lydman. His role may always be bottom-pairing, PP specialist but some people make a career out of that.

I think this week may determine whether Buffalo pursues a 2nd/3rd tier offensive defenseman (Morris, MA Bergeron) or if they think they have enough offense from the back end already in-house.

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07-06-2009, 09:17 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip15 View Post
I have noticed this. Obviously, I think he's a good player and should be given as much of a chance as anyone to make the club. As Der Jaeger noted, I think he has a skill set that the other young defensemen either do not have or have not yet developed as fully as Gragnani. I don't share the worry of some others that he is a forward stuck at defense.

His defense still needs work, that much I don't contest. He got burned pretty bad on one play in that blowout against Edmonton, though he was much steadier for the remainder of his stay. I was surprisingly pleased with how well he totes the puck and his breakout passes were very nice. I think he would be successful paired with a stay-at-home, veteran-type like Rivet or Lydman. His role may always be bottom-pairing, PP specialist but some people make a career out of that.

I think this week may determine whether Buffalo pursues a 2nd/3rd tier offensive defenseman (Morris, MA Bergeron) or if they think they have enough offense from the back end already in-house.
I had no feelings on him at all before his call up last year. But I thought he played his roll in that call-up very well and showed some glimpses of a good offensive player.

Let's hope for a Mark Streit upside

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07-06-2009, 09:46 AM
  #25
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I happen to think Grags' wheels are overrated. While I won't lie to you all and say I watched every Pirate game with intense eyes, I do believe I noticed his speed and sability drop off with the puck on his stick.

The best PPQB's maintain themselves - puck on stick or not - based on a textbook stride. I don't see Gragnani as anything more than a nice utility for the Pirates. Just me...
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