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Higgins+McDonagh for Scott Gomez - Pt.II (All trade Related Posts Here)

View Poll Results: Did you like the trade?
Yes 41 18.47%
No 125 56.31%
We'll see 56 25.23%
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Old
07-01-2009, 07:49 AM
  #326
Whitesnake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ho...ott_gomez.html

For those that say Gomez is not happy to come here ..

Gomez learned of the deal while on a fishing boat in his native Alaska. "It stings a little," he said, "but ending up in the Mecca of hockey, how can I not be excited?"
Let just say that reading him looks much more interesting than hearing him.....I guess he was surprised but he didn't sound too excited. Though how can you be? It's not like he has any idea with who he is gonna play.

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Old
07-01-2009, 07:51 AM
  #327
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Sorry forgot the Kovalev deal, the first good move Bob made, Rivet was the second.

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Old
07-01-2009, 07:52 AM
  #328
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Let just say that reading him looks much more interesting than hearing him.....I guess he was surprised but he didn't sound too excited. Though how can you be? It's not like he has any idea with who he is gonna play.
Yeah I know what you mean my friend .. I am not happy with the trade either and the only way I'll feel better is if we land 1-2 major coups today.

But hey, the guy is a Montreal Canadiens now, we have to try to look at the bright side, lol ... stay positive and hope we get 84 point Gomez who has 2 Stanley CUps.

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Old
07-01-2009, 07:53 AM
  #329
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One thing is sure.....with all the Koivu fans around this board (not saying I'm not one of those, I just prefer to be the fan of the team than of individuals..), this has to be taken into consideration. Not only you are getting a player that is known for inconsistant efforts, but you are also losing a nice prospect AND you might be losing Koivu because of that.

The only way this trade can be soften is by trading Plekanec instead and keeping Koivu....But then it also depends of the return. If you trade Plekanec for Commodore, I am not sure it will be well taken.

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Old
07-01-2009, 07:54 AM
  #330
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McDonagh

after thinking about it for a little while with regards to McDonagh, I've ended up thinking about something else. McDonagh, while he could be great, we still don't know, and secondly at his NCAA team he's not even on the first pairing of the defense, what does that tell us about his development. We may have given away a solid shut down blue liner, but we may also have given away a bust.

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Old
07-01-2009, 07:56 AM
  #331
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
Yeah I know what you mean my friend .. I am not happy with the trade either and the only way I'll feel better is if we land 1-2 major coups today.

But hey, the guy is a Montreal Canadiens now, we have to try to look at the bright side, lol ... stay positive and hope we get 84 point Gomez who has 2 Stanley CUps.
Well you know that most of us will be able to forget it once the camp starts. Is the schedule out yet? 'Cause I believe the pressure will already be on Gomez as soon as it starts. I hope for him he has some away games before he comes home. If not, I hope he performs during the preseason games....

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Old
07-01-2009, 08:13 AM
  #332
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i'd rather have koivu,habs are one of my fav teams he's the captain and your trying to replace him with gomez a player not nearly as good,not captain worthy and with a bigger contract while trading away 2 good prospects? I do not like this trade at all, they should of kept koivu i know he would like to stay in montreal

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Old
07-01-2009, 08:14 AM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACCIDENT View Post
after thinking about it for a little while with regards to McDonagh, I've ended up thinking about something else. McDonagh, while he could be great, we still don't know, and secondly at his NCAA team he's not even on the first pairing of the defense, what does that tell us about his development. We may have given away a solid shut down blue liner, but we may also have given away a bust.
Yeah...why on earth we're bawling over Ryan McDonagh is beyond me. We drafted him, and he continued to at best, not develop. Seriously...I wasn't exited about RM. Now, Subban that's another story...a guy that is actually taking his play to higher levels every year.

Boy do we have the worst overreactors on HF or what? We just acquired a high level, Stanley Cup winning center, for 3 unknown/unproven mediocre prospects and a decent journeyman winger. The only part of this that is a negative, is the contract...but hey...nothing is easy in the NHL anymore.

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Old
07-01-2009, 08:16 AM
  #334
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Trading McDonaugh shows we have no real long term strategy. I dont blame Gainey entirely but its just the way the game is now.

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Old
07-01-2009, 08:17 AM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Quagmier View Post
I said giving a player like that a contract like that prevents a team from being a POWERHOUSE...which the Rangers, even with a top 3 NHL goalie, were never going to be with Gomez.

"Still finding ways to win" is a far cry from being a powerhouse if you ask me.

Sure we may surprise a year or 2. Hell we may even fluke out the conference again, who knows. All I know is that you cannot stand here in good conscience and say that after this trade we are better off. We needed size, grit and goalscoring at the center position...we got none of that.
But we are better off. The trade boils down to Higgins for Gomez. Gomez is a better player, a #1 centre. No he is not big but he's difficult to knock off the puck. No he doesn't shoot first, but that's what Kostitsyn is for.

The fact of the matter is the team is better today than it was yesterday. Let the other moves pan out then criticize.

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Old
07-01-2009, 08:47 AM
  #336
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
But we are better off. The trade boils down to Higgins for Gomez. Gomez is a better player, a #1 centre. No he is not big but he's difficult to knock off the puck. No he doesn't shoot first, but that's what Kostitsyn is for.

The fact of the matter is the team is better today than it was yesterday. Let the other moves pan out then criticize.
Completely disagree.

First of all, although I understand what you mean, you can't boil down the trade to Higgins VS Gomez. That's just not what the deal was.

Secondly, part of assessing what shape your team is at this point of the year is not only your roster but your cap situation. Gainey has just pursued his tradition of collecting overpaid players, which will prevent him from adding assets somewhere down the line. Gomez had little to no value, except for a desperate/clueless GM. So even if it was a straight Higgins for Gomez trade, it would be a highly suspect trade for Gainey and a huge gamble that handcuffs him.

And last, no trade should be judged in a vacuum. Regardless of money and talent, there's also the fact this trade doesn't really address what the Habs need. Why exactly does this team acquires another smallish playmaker?

The Habs needs size, power, character and leadership. I'm at a loss to understand why Gainey (who ironically used to be such an amazing player in great part because he possessed many of these characteristics to an unreal level) doesn't ever address any of this.

Those of us not living in a cave have known for years that Koivu's leadership was not enough. The guy is courageous as hell but needed a better character surrounding. What have they done instead? They've pushed away the veterans who cared and failed to replace them. Now, this year, there is a risk both Komisarek and Koivu will be lost.

More size, character, grit and leadership gone. Replaced by Gomez, a guy whose career is going downhill amost as fast as Gainey's GM skills.

I'm checking out the options for captaincy if Koivu leaves and it's bleak. And at the same time, acquiring Gomez has made keeping Koivu a much more difficult decision because of the team composition.

Horrible

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:02 AM
  #337
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At first I was like wow WTF, we just traded 2 awesome players for another small centre.. I really like Higgins, hes one of my favorite players with Kostitsyn bros and
Plekanec. I would be even more pissed if we traded Plekanec or Kost Bros.

But still Gomez is one of the best centre in the east if you think about it..
Still the best center we will have for years..
I can't wait to see Gomez if we can get Havlat/Hossa/Gaborik to play with him.

Unless Higgins pulls a Ryder, it's not that bad.
We have to give players if we want a centre, maybe Gomez was the only Centre available at that time. Id rather have Gomez than Briere.. but thats a close one

Mcdonagh have protential , we all know it but he didnt play 1 game in the NHL yet.
I dont really care about Valetenko, we have other good D prospects..

I think BG is doing his best to get the best Centre available and Gomez was probably the only one available.. Welcome to the Habs Gomez !

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:03 AM
  #338
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I think most of us agree this deal was just awful. I like Gomez very much, but he's not the power forward 1st line center we were looking for. He's scored 16. 16, and 13 goals the past three seasons respectively. We were actually better with Koivu with those totals. Add to that the >5< year committment at 7.6 Million dollars and the loss of McDonaugh... our #1 prospect in the farm and this deal just blows chunks.

Can you imagine.... paying 7.6 million dollars locked in at 5 years, for a guy scoring 16 goals a season ???? And for the privelege we lost our #1 prospect. What was Gainey smoking here ???

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:04 AM
  #339
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Originally Posted by silver321 View Post
I think BG is doing his best to get the best Centre available and Gomez was probably the only one available.. Welcome to the Habs Gomez !
Umm.... HELLO????

Today the UFA season starts opening the door to a BUNCH of UFA's. There was absolutely no reason to do this at this time! On top of everything else now the Rangers free up cap space to compete with us for that big 1st line center. It was absolutely retarded.

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:09 AM
  #340
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lets be realistic for a moment

given our huge holes down the middle, that package yesterday would of landed us

zilch in return. Unless Ryan turns into an impact D,we gave up nada.

But if he turns into Leopold, Carle, a decent top 4 but no difference maker , we

did ok . Carle was moved several times , do you honestly think we gave up a home run for a desperate deal ?

Is Edmonton going to give you Cogliano, are you getting Kopitar, do you want
Bouchard who maybe resgressed last year ?

Are you getting Towes or Richards, dream on fans.

Bob tried all possible teams ,this was the best he could do for a top 2 center .

He will be great on the PP,the best playmaker we had in years,

the asking price for Thornton or Vinny (if available ) would of made you cry.

Folks these centers dont grow on trees , free agency had none of them
for us , neither was getting a washed Nylander , or any other 30+ has been.

We get one more stud upfront , and if the kids emerge we wont be that bad , THE CORE HAD TO CHANGE UPFRONT

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:11 AM
  #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler View Post
Completely disagree.

First of all, although I understand what you mean, you can't boil down the trade to Higgins VS Gomez. That's just not what the deal was.

Secondly, part of assessing what shape your team is at this point of the year is not only your roster but your cap situation. Gainey has just pursued his tradition of collecting overpaid players, which will prevent him from adding assets somewhere down the line. Gomez had little to no value, except for a desperate/clueless GM. So even if it was a straight Higgins for Gomez trade, it would be a highly suspect trade for Gainey and a huge gamble that handcuffs him.

And last, no trade should be judged in a vacuum. Regardless of money and talent, there's also the fact this trade doesn't really address what the Habs need. Why exactly does this team acquires another smallish playmaker?

The Habs needs size, power, character and leadership. I'm at a loss to understand why Gainey (who ironically used to be such an amazing player in great part because he possessed many of these characteristics to an unreal level) doesn't ever address any of this.

Those of us not living in a cave have known for years that Koivu's leadership was not enough. The guy is courageous as hell but needed a better character surrounding. What have they done instead? They've pushed away the veterans who cared and failed to replace them. Now, this year, there is a risk both Komisarek and Koivu will be lost.

More size, character, grit and leadership gone. Replaced by Gomez, a guy whose career is going downhill amost as fast as Gainey's GM skills.

I'm checking out the options for captaincy if Koivu leaves and it's bleak. And at the same time, acquiring Gomez has made keeping Koivu a much more difficult decision because of the team composition.

Horrible
But what gritty, big centre is available out there? Vinny was just too expensive cap wise and in terms of assets needed to give up. Marleau is big but not gritty and Gomez is better than him. I assume Jokinen is not available. There are just no other options out there.

Like I said, judge the entire team after Gainey is done moving players. Clearly he is not finished. Maybe the team will get bigger and grittier in the end, who knows? What we do know is that we have a 1st line centre finally.

And the deal is Higgins for Gomez because neither McDonagh or Valentenko have ever stepped foot in the NHL nor do we know they ever will. Yes cap space is involved, but Vinny makes $7.7 million a year for 11 years and Marleau makes $6.2 million a year. Either way a lot of cap space would have to be sacrificed.

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:14 AM
  #342
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I actually like this deal.

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07-01-2009, 09:15 AM
  #343
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terrible deal for mtl, gomez isn't the same anymore. Without Mcdonaugh it's a bad deal.... The rangers are also now swimming in cap space, so they become front runners for a lot of the big fish UFAs out there.

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:18 AM
  #344
Vlad The Impaler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
Umm.... HELLO????

Today the UFA season starts opening the door to a BUNCH of UFA's. There was absolutely no reason to do this at this time! On top of everything else now the Rangers free up cap space to compete with us for that big 1st line center. It was absolutely retarded.
Yes, you are totally right. The timing aspect is puzzling.

I could understand this deal if:

A) Gomez fit EVERY characteristics this team needs
B) It was the deadline and the team was looking like cup material with one piece missing

I'd tell myself: "Ugh, this is a lot to give for a player with such a contract but let's bite the bullet and roll the dice!"

But as you said, it's not the case here. Free agency has not even begun! Not only does this hinder Gainey as far as cap room to acquire players but it also complicates the situation as far as keeping important players who are at risk of being lost.

Another Gainey failure.

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:19 AM
  #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabus View Post
Umm.... HELLO????

Today the UFA season starts opening the door to a BUNCH of UFA's. There was absolutely no reason to do this at this time! On top of everything else now the Rangers free up cap space to compete with us for that big 1st line center. It was absolutely retarded.
Yes good luck luring a big 1st line center in MONTREAL
Other teams too are looking for a big 1st line center..

Most UFAs dont want to sign in Montreal, media and too much pressure
Only 25% of all UFAs want to sign in Montreal, that leave us with nothing

Keep dreaming, in what city do you live exactly ? Montreal or Phoenix ?


Last edited by silver321: 07-01-2009 at 09:26 AM.
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Old
07-01-2009, 09:19 AM
  #346
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Let's be realistic..

We gave up three valuable pieces for a salary dump. You don't do that. Never.

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07-01-2009, 09:21 AM
  #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler View Post
Yes, you are totally right. The timing aspect is puzzling.

I could understand this deal if:

A) Gomez fit EVERY characteristics this team needs
B) It was the deadline and the team was looking like cup material with one piece missing

I'd tell myself: "Ugh, this is a lot to give for a player with such a contract but let's bite the bullet and roll the dice!"

But as you said, it's not the case here. Free agency has not even begun! Not only does this hinder Gainey as far as cap room to acquire players but it also complicates the situation as far as keeping important players who are at risk of being lost.

Another Gainey failure.
there's tons of cap room available and now there's a player of better quality than Koivu/Plekanec to entice a high profile player to come play in Montreal.

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07-01-2009, 09:21 AM
  #348
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Let's be realistic. You sign Saku Koivu - the hole is mostly filled and you keep your assets and cap space. Plus you have somebody left on the roster actually suitable to be a captain.

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:22 AM
  #349
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Yes, but if McDonagh is shutting down Pacioretty, Kostitsyn, Leblanc and other in playof series to come, you will see fans cry more than the price Lawton asked for Lecavalier.

I still think that Gainey is going to go after Hossa, Havlat or Gaborik to wing Gomez!

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Old
07-01-2009, 09:26 AM
  #350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
there's tons of cap room available and now there's a player of better quality than Koivu/Plekanec to entice a high profile player to come play in Montreal.
Yeah..
"Oh look, they have Gomez and lost 10 players to free agency, plus a roster player.. I'm going there!"

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