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Chuck Kobasew an odd man out in Boston?

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07-11-2009, 04:02 PM
  #1
detredWINgs
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Chuck Kobasew an odd man out in Boston?

I don't know how many people saw it in the trade rumors thread, but the Bs are supposedly keeping Kessel and are planning on re-signing him (smart move, naturally); however, they're gonna have to clear space. The Bs have 5.3M in cap space, and still need to sign a backup - assuming Rask stays in the AHL- and a 6th (Hunwick) and 7th Dman. Kessel will cost at least 4M.

According to Bs fans there are rumblings of Sturm, Ference, and/or Kobasew being on the outs. The Wings can't afford Sturm, but Sturm also has an NTC, so it might make moving him a little tougher, which means theres some credence to the idea that Kobasew could be moved.

IMO, trading for him would be a great way to make up for the loss of Hudler + Samuelsson. He had 42 points in 68 games last season, and is only 27 also being a right-handed shot (and we know how much Babs/Holland like those..) He makes 2.3M, which we could afford after trading a Dman, and is signed for 2 more years. Hes also a pretty speedy guy and isnt too small, although hes listed at 6'0 favorably, if you ask me.

Given that the Bs will have cap issues once they sign Kessel, they'd probably be looking for a pick/prospect package, and might be a favorable trading partner considering they need depth defenseman and we'll have one on the block.

Thoughts?

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07-11-2009, 04:42 PM
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not a bad idea... Good work. Faxing this on to Kenny.

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07-11-2009, 05:13 PM
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great idea
but i don't think holland would do

kindl+lebda as you suggested on the trade board

I think i read somewhere holland said he would carry all the D to training camp and will see who he will trade
(so lebda/meech/lilja is out of the question)

also i doubt that holland will package one of our best prospect for upgraded version of sammy

more likely package would be future draft pick + lower tier prospect
which boston wouldn't take unless they are having a big trouble moving the salary

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07-11-2009, 05:17 PM
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solo16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by last_sd View Post
great idea
but i don't think holland would do

kindl+lebda as you suggested on the trade board

I think i read somewhere holland said he would carry all the D to training camp and will see who he will trade
(so lebda/meech/lilja is out of the question)

also i doubt that holland will package one of our best prospect for upgraded version of sammy

more likely package would be future draft pick + lower tier prospect
which boston wouldn't take unless they are having a big trouble moving the salary
2nd+ one of lilja,meech,lebda max. Kindl isnt even in the discussion. Maybe Ritola.

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07-11-2009, 05:27 PM
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Would you guys do 2nd rounder+Lebda? I could see Boston taking that.

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07-11-2009, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Heaters not lazt View Post
Would you guys do 2nd rounder+Lebda? I could see Boston taking that.
Heck yeah I would.

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07-11-2009, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Heaters not lazt View Post
Would you guys do 2nd rounder+Lebda? I could see Boston taking that.
i would take it and run
but holland not really sure

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07-11-2009, 05:44 PM
  #8
solo16
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Originally Posted by last_sd View Post
i would take it and run
but holland not really sure
Id do it. Kobasew is worth a fair bit. 2nd rounders are valuable. Its about fair value imo.

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07-12-2009, 02:11 AM
  #9
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Any interest in Robert Nilsson? You guys would be the team to get the most out of him, and he's basically a faster version of Hudler- tremendous one-on-one ability, great vision, but little battle. However, unlike Hudler, Nilsson has a really solid defensive game. He's an absolute beast in both ends when 'on'.

His cap hit is an extremely reasonable $2M for the next two years, which is a shade less than Kobasew. However, instead of a 20-20-40 player, you'll have a 10-30-40 player at absolute minimum- and maybe a 55 or even 60-point (15-45-60) guy with lots of PP time.

The Oilers have expressed a desire to get bigger and meaner in the top nine, so we'd be looking for a gritty forward of some kind.

However, we're also in need of a solid #3 C, so maybe something based around Nilsson for Filppula could work. You'd save $1M in cap room (assuming it's a pick or two packaged with Rowbert).

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07-12-2009, 02:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post
Any interest in Robert Nilsson? You guys would be the team to get the most out of him, and he's basically a faster version of Hudler- tremendous one-on-one ability, great vision, but little battle. However, unlike Hudler, Nilsson has a really solid defensive game. He's an absolute beast in both ends when 'on'.

His cap hit is an extremely reasonable $2M for the next two years, which is a shade less than Kobasew. However, instead of a 20-20-40 player, you'll have a 10-30-40 player at absolute minimum- and maybe a 55 or even 60-point (15-45-60) guy with lots of PP time.

The Oilers have expressed a desire to get bigger and meaner in the top nine, so we'd be looking for a gritty forward of some kind.

However, we're also in need of a solid #3 C, so maybe something based around Nilsson for Filppula could work. You'd save $1M in cap room (assuming it's a pick or two packaged with Rowbert).
Theres no way Filppula is ever going to be traded by the Wings. If they trade anyone it is a d-man.

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07-12-2009, 03:14 AM
  #11
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Kobasew, not a bad idea. He can score 20-30 goals while working very hard.

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07-12-2009, 11:40 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post
Any interest in Robert Nilsson? You guys would be the team to get the most out of him, and he's basically a faster version of Hudler- tremendous one-on-one ability, great vision, but little battle. However, unlike Hudler, Nilsson has a really solid defensive game. He's an absolute beast in both ends when 'on'.

His cap hit is an extremely reasonable $2M for the next two years, which is a shade less than Kobasew. However, instead of a 20-20-40 player, you'll have a 10-30-40 player at absolute minimum- and maybe a 55 or even 60-point (15-45-60) guy with lots of PP time.

The Oilers have expressed a desire to get bigger and meaner in the top nine, so we'd be looking for a gritty forward of some kind.

However, we're also in need of a solid #3 C, so maybe something based around Nilsson for Filppula could work. You'd save $1M in cap room (assuming it's a pick or two packaged with Rowbert).
Seriously, I'm a Flip-critic AND a swede and there's no way I'd do that. Robert Nilsson only got into the NHL because of his dad, and while he's a great guy and a good player "when on", he's "on" way too rarely to make up for the times when he isn't. No way we'd do that especially since Flip's value to the team increased with Hudler leaving.

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07-12-2009, 06:20 PM
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detredWINgs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by last_sd View Post
great idea
but i don't think holland would do

kindl+lebda as you suggested on the trade board

I think i read somewhere holland said he would carry all the D to training camp and will see who he will trade
(so lebda/meech/lilja is out of the question)

also i doubt that holland will package one of our best prospect for upgraded version of sammy

more likely package would be future draft pick + lower tier prospect
which boston wouldn't take unless they are having a big trouble moving the salary
Yeah, I'm not high on Kindl at all. I'm expecting him to be a bust, but obviously I'm not an NHL scout.

Regardless of Kindl, I think we have the assets to work with in regards to Boston. They need defensive depth, and we need to get rid of it. Throw in the non-monetary assets and it makes sense.

Also, I think Kenny changes his mind about waiting til training camp to trade Meech/Lebda/Lilja if Chiarelli were to ask for one of them as part of the package in exchange for Kobasew. Meech and Lebda especially arent particularly crucial to our system, and adding a guy like Kobasew would make a lot of sense given the losses we've suffered.

Kobasew just seems like a guy that would fit in the Wings system.

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07-12-2009, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
Yeah, I'm not high on Kindl at all. I'm expecting him to be a bust, but obviously I'm not an NHL scout.

Regardless of Kindl, I think we have the assets to work with in regards to Boston. They need defensive depth, and we need to get rid of it. Throw in the non-monetary assets and it makes sense.

Also, I think Kenny changes his mind about waiting til training camp to trade Meech/Lebda/Lilja if Chiarelli were to ask for one of them as part of the package in exchange for Kobasew. Meech and Lebda especially arent particularly crucial to our system, and adding a guy like Kobasew would make a lot of sense given the losses we've suffered.

Kobasew just seems like a guy that would fit in the Wings system.
Yeah, I agree, and finally someone who dosen't adore Kindl

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07-12-2009, 06:49 PM
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I don't want to just agree with every idea thrown out there but this one I do like considering his reasonable price tag and I was surprised to see he's just 27. Add to that...he's a right hand shot. He'd make sense on the right side on the third line or maybe second line in a pinch and he could be used on the power play as well.

They have plenty of depth on defense so trading Lebda wouldn't break my heart. He's better than most of the guys still available and he probably will be cheaper. My biggest hang-up with him would be his health...check his injury history on TSN.

http://tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?id=2470

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07-12-2009, 06:55 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
Yeah, I'm not high on Kindl at all. I'm expecting him to be a bust, but obviously I'm not an NHL scout.
From everything I've read (since I've never seen him play) Kindl has NHL level (sub) elite offensive skills for a defesemen and has NHL level physicality. He can skate at the NHL level but he's bad defensively.

That isn't a bad combination for a player in the right spot with the right partner. Granted the -50billion at the AHL level is disconcerting but while Brett Lebda isn't the greatest person to compare Kindl to Lebda didn't look very good at the AHL level at all but at the NHL level he's at least capable.

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07-12-2009, 07:08 PM
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solo16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
Yeah, I'm not high on Kindl at all. I'm expecting him to be a bust, but obviously I'm not an NHL scout.

Regardless of Kindl, I think we have the assets to work with in regards to Boston. They need defensive depth, and we need to get rid of it. Throw in the non-monetary assets and it makes sense.

Also, I think Kenny changes his mind about waiting til training camp to trade Meech/Lebda/Lilja if Chiarelli were to ask for one of them as part of the package in exchange for Kobasew. Meech and Lebda especially arent particularly crucial to our system, and adding a guy like Kobasew would make a lot of sense given the losses we've suffered.

Kobasew just seems like a guy that would fit in the Wings system.
I wasnt a fan of Kindl until this year. I saw him live and started to follow him a bit more closely. I think he just has trouble with defensive pairs. I think he will look better in the NHL than AHL.

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07-12-2009, 07:24 PM
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No interest in Kobasew - dead wood IMO. Sure, he's got some scoring touch, and he's right handed, but his effort is spotty, and he's not very good defensively. Some here have called him a hard worker, I have to disagree. Once in awhile he goes into a corner, and he certainly has some edge to his game (sort of a mean streak, he'll play a little dirty and likes to bump others), but he doesn't seem to want to be bumped himself to make a play.

Bottom line - not a good fit for a team that wants to fight for the Cup.

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07-12-2009, 09:37 PM
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detredWINgs
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Originally Posted by solo16 View Post
I wasnt a fan of Kindl until this year. I saw him live and started to follow him a bit more closely. I think he just has trouble with defensive pairs. I think he will look better in the NHL than AHL.
I haven't seen much of him in this year in particular, but I've seen him a fair amount live in GR over the past 2 seasons and to me he looked like a tougher version of Marc-Andre Bergeron, or a poor, poor mans Kronwall, instead of the next Kronwall as many have projected him to be. The biggest issue I have with the kid is his hockey sense, and thats not something you can change.

Like I said, I'm no expert on prospects obviously, but he just looks like one of those players who has plenty of tools but can't put them all together.

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07-12-2009, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
I haven't seen much of him in this year in particular, but I've seen him a fair amount live in GR over the past 2 seasons and to me he looked like a tougher version of Marc-Andre Bergeron, or a poor, poor mans Kronwall, instead of the next Kronwall as many have projected him to be. The biggest issue I have with the kid is his hockey sense, and thats not something you can change.

Like I said, I'm no expert on prospects obviously, but he just looks like one of those players who has plenty of tools but can't put them all together.
Im not positive but im starting to think the lack of hockey sense is from one of two things.

1. He is trying to cover for his sub par pair mates. When out of position compensating he just isn't a strong enough defender.

2. He doesn't compensate at all and lets his pair mates mistakes be exposed while he stands by and watches.

Just a theory I been starting to favor. Stick him with a fundementally sound pair mate and I think he may really shine. I think he is kind of a cross between Ericsson and Kronwall.

Hes got a way to go still but hes very intriguing. Last year I was all for trading him. This year id rather trade smith if it comes to it. I dont think Smith is going to be all that much better than a taller version of Meech. Im missing that something special from him. He still has a few years to fill out and develop some toughness to change my opinion.

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07-12-2009, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by solo16 View Post
Im not positive but im starting to think the lack of hockey sense is from one of two things.

1. He is trying to cover for his sub par pair mates. When out of position compensating he just isn't a strong enough defender.

2. He doesn't compensate at all and lets his pair mates mistakes be exposed while he stands by and watches.
I don't know a whole lot about GR and what the lines looked like but I had kind of assumed Kindl would be playing with Ericsson most of the time, of course the fact that they are both big men could mean it didn't happen.

And admittedly, while I would like to see Ericsson grow into a good 2nd line D-man I did notice some big positioning problems in his NHL games.

Basically I'm a bit surprised he would have such a bad line mate(s) when my impression was there were alot more exceptional (that is at or near NHL levels) defenseman in GR than forwards.

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07-13-2009, 08:05 AM
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I don't know a whole lot about GR and what the lines looked like but I had kind of assumed Kindl would be playing with Ericsson most of the time, of course the fact that they are both big men could mean it didn't happen.

And admittedly, while I would like to see Ericsson grow into a good 2nd line D-man I did notice some big positioning problems in his NHL games.

Basically I'm a bit surprised he would have such a bad line mate(s) when my impression was there were alot more exceptional (that is at or near NHL levels) defenseman in GR than forwards.
He never played with Ericsson. Like absolutely never.

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07-13-2009, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Drunkspleen View Post
I don't know a whole lot about GR and what the lines looked like but I had kind of assumed Kindl would be playing with Ericsson most of the time, of course the fact that they are both big men could mean it didn't happen.

And admittedly, while I would like to see Ericsson grow into a good 2nd line D-man I did notice some big positioning problems in his NHL games.

Basically I'm a bit surprised he would have such a bad line mate(s) when my impression was there were alot more exceptional (that is at or near NHL levels) defenseman in GR than forwards.
Ericsson is going to be a first pairing D-man... He's our future #1 ...

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07-13-2009, 12:00 PM
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Ericsson is going to be a first pairing D-man... He's our future #1 ...
Are you serious? Maybe I'm missing something, but between Filppula and Hudler (both drafted the same year as Ericsson) he seems to be developing fairly slowly, and still have some pretty major flaws in his game, maybe he still has alot of upside and it's just taken him longer to get going, he was admittedly a late draft pick.

I just personally did not see the defensive ability that I would hope to see in a future first liner this year in his NHL games.

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07-13-2009, 12:22 PM
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Heck yeah I would.
+1 for me

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