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Coyotes trade Enver Lisin for Lauri Korpikoski

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Old
07-14-2009, 03:30 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
Forgot Olli Jokinen.

Anyway, his goal totals in the limited games he played indicate a twenty goal scorer. Enver may or may not actually get there. I assume he will given the advancements in his game in his young career(already scored eighteen in his FIRST seventy eight games in the NHL).

Korpikoski is just a checker...

Purely as a checking line Pker, a guy like Matthias Tjarnqvist is probably better and probably cheaper than a guy like Korpikoski.

...a vet with experience. Why rely on a kid with limited upside when you can have a vet that's been around the block, knows the checking game better, has equally limited upside, and will probably cost a lot less than a recent first round pick making first round money?

Give me Tjarnqvist over Korpikoski and give me Enver Lisin over either. I think this is a dumb move. Even if Enver bolts and becomes a KHL star and "Korpedo" sticks around and becomes a typical fourth line checker, it still was not worth the roll of the dice. It's a sucker bet. Every time.

Juice ain't worth the squeeze. Juice ain't worth the squeeze. Why waste the calories?
Yes, I FORGOT OLLI JOKINEN!. So Lisin was 7th, 43 seconds behind Boedker.
As for Korpedo, time will tell. At 23 with one full season in the NHL, I think you're a bit too quick to relegate him to a career checking line PK'er.

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07-14-2009, 03:33 AM
  #77
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I want YOU to be head coach. Honestly, this post makes you more qualified than the retards we have now.

If the coaching staff isn't gone, next season, we're doomed. It's the worst the league has seen in my memory.

Also...
I honestly think that any Coyotes fans that like this deal are the types that like ANY deal the team makes. By the same token, I honestly think that any Rangers fans that don't like this deal, just don't know enough about Lisin.

Sather bent Maloney over, here. Stupid, stupid trade on Phoenix's part. The Rangers CANNOT lose.
I'm also much less expensive . Honestly, I don't mean to gang up on the coaches, but what exactly do they do well? We could find a flaw for every player on the team, and use it as an excuse for why they suck, but then what are we playing Gretzy a gugillion dollars a year for? That's why it doesn't work for me to argue that Lisin's defensive problems are all his fault. It's highly unlikely that all our players are uncoachable. Enver could very likely be just another victim of crappy organization.

Lisin scores without effort, and he's cheap as hell. Why not make the effort to fix the problems instead of trading them away?

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07-14-2009, 03:36 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
I want YOU to be head coach. Honestly, this post makes you more qualified than the retards we have now.

If the coaching staff isn't gone, next season, we're doomed. It's the worst the league has seen in my memory.

Also...
I honestly think that any Coyotes fans that like this deal are the types that like ANY deal the team makes. By the same token, I honestly think that any Rangers fans that don't like this deal, just don't know enough about Lisin.

Sather bent Maloney over, here. Stupid, stupid trade on Phoenix's part. The Rangers CANNOT lose.
That's just a dumb statement, RT. Any chance you're ever wrong?

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07-14-2009, 03:37 AM
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Korpikoski is just a checker...

Purely as a checking line Pker, a guy like Matthias Tjarnqvist is probably better and probably cheaper than a guy like Korpikoski.
I don't want to facepalm someone on their own board but I remember you being upset about the Prucha trade as well.

Korpikoski is not just a checker, get that through your head. You are just drinking the cool aid of the Ranger fans that have not commented on his offensive ability because he was on a 4th line occasionally with Betts, Orr, and Sjostrom. He has offensive potential, and quite a decent bit. Lisin might be the better goal scorer but if Korpikoski played the same ice time it would probably be clear to everyone who is the better over all player.

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07-14-2009, 03:37 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by RousselRising View Post
Yes, I FORGOT OLLI JOKINEN!. So Lisin was 7th, 43 seconds behind Boedker.
As for Korpedo, time will tell. At 23 with one full season in the NHL, I think you're a bit too quick to relegate him to a career checking line PK'er.
In games he actually played. Extrapolate that to 82 games. Or, admit that he's going to improve, AT THE SAME AGE AS KORPIKOSKI, and realize he's at LEAST a twenty goal scorer in all likelyhood.

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07-14-2009, 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
I don't want to facepalm someone on their own board but I remember you being upset about the Prucha trade as well.

Korpikoski is not just a checker, get that through your head. You are just drinking the cool aid of the Ranger fans that have not commented on his offensive ability because he was on a 4th line occasionally with Betts, Orr, and Sjostrom. He has offensive potential, and quite a decent bit. Lisin might be the better goal scorer but if Korpikoski played the same ice time it would probably be clear to everyone who is the better over all player.
Facepalm all you want, dude. None of us know a thing. That's why we're *****ing on the internet at all hours of the morning(especially you on the East coast) likely drunk(at least me). Derek Morris is clearly the better hockey player than Petr Prucha. I like Prucha just fine. For the salaries, it's more or less a wash. I HOPE you are right. I'd LOVE Korpikoski to prove me wrong. Honestly, I'm talking out of my ass on this. I don't really know anything about Korpikoski. I all know is how these types of trades tend to work out. I know that I doubt the Rangers organization would give up on a kid like Korpikoski if they saw the same upside you do. Of course the same could be said about Lisin. However, I really worry(and with good reason, in my opinion) about the shortsightedness of my favorite team, in particular.

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07-14-2009, 03:44 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
Lisin might be the better goal scorer.
Just what we need to get rid of from a team that cant score. We have enough 3rd line guys. Lisin is going to be good.

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07-14-2009, 03:45 AM
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That's just a dumb statement, RT. Any chance you're ever wrong?
Search my post history. I'm almost ALWAYS wrong about just about EVERYTHING. Go to trade deadlines past, I'm HILARIOUSLY wrong, on just about all of my rants. I was furious about Comrie, and furious about Mike Johnson and furious about Oleg Saprykin. Hell, I was pissed about Jamie Lundmark. At the same time, every once and a while, I'm dead-on. It's few and far between, but it happens.

I'm the Eklund of *****ing.

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07-14-2009, 03:48 AM
  #84
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In games he actually played. Extrapolate that to 82 games. Or, admit that he's going to improve, AT THE SAME AGE AS KORPIKOSKI, and realize he's at LEAST a twenty goal scorer in all likelyhood.
I've never said Lisin isn't likely going to develop into a 20-goal scorer. And I can't "admit" that he's going to improve, anymore more than you can. Time will tell on that.

I just don't see why, when the coaches and Maloney have decided Lisin isn't in their future plans, everyone is going so ballistic! Of course I'd rather still have him here but if he's going to be gone I'd prefer we get something for him. They weren't going to sign him. He was going to walk.

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07-14-2009, 03:49 AM
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Facepalm all you want, dude. None of us know a thing. That's why we're *****ing on the internet at all hours of the morning(especially you on the East coast) likely drunk(at least me). Derek Morris is clearly the better hockey player than Petr Prucha. I like Prucha just fine. For the salaries, it's more or less a wash. I HOPE you are right. I'd LOVE Korpikoski to prove me wrong. Honestly, I'm talking out of my ass on this. I don't really know anything about Korpikoski. I all know is how these types of trades tend to work out. I know that I doubt the Rangers organization would give up on a kid like Korpikoski if they saw the same upside you do. Of course the same could be said about Lisin. However, I really worry(and with good reason, in my opinion) about the shortsightedness of my favorite team, in particular.
Morris was UFA bait, Lisin was about his wits about being in Phoenix.

It's called asset management. Obviously Morris > Prucha.

Korpikoski has not been able to fit into our line up. He has the talent but our top 6 are pretty much all figured out, and we are trying to move in talent from the AHL and OHL in Anisimov and Grachev. Same scenario that happened with Prucha is happening with Korpikoski.

NOT A HELPLESS PLAYER, just the odd man out. The 5th wheel so to speak.

Korpedo I personally felt was rushed into the NHL and when put on a line... Was put on the PK and 4th with other players who had no offensive ability too them. Korpikoski has creativity to his play and usually never wastes the puck. All season if he ran out of options, he put the puck on net and created chances for the team.

I understand the type of player you guys lost, but realize that it seems that the Coach/GM didn't have the heart to wait for his potential, and that the player you are getting back gives total effort on both sides of the ice. There is not doubt to me that Korpikoski will put up a lot better numbers on the team if not regulated to the PK exclusively and not played with linemates that are offensively challenged.

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07-14-2009, 03:52 AM
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Search my post history. I'm almost ALWAYS wrong about just about EVERYTHING. Go to trade deadlines past, I'm HILARIOUSLY wrong, on just about all of my rants. I was furious about Comrie, and furious about Mike Johnson and furious about Oleg Saprykin. Hell, I was pissed about Jamie Lundmark. At the same time, every once and a while, I'm dead-on. It's few and far between, but it happens.

I'm the Eklund of *****ing.
Well, I'm usually wrong, too. Guess that means both guys will blow for their new teams and we just wasted time arguing about two worthless pieces of ****!

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07-14-2009, 03:52 AM
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At first, you could color me as "WTF" and disappointed at this trade.

After some time though I think I've already gotten over the loss of Lisin. I take this as a sign that GM had some trouble negotiating with Enver. So dump his ass and get someone you're familiar with, same age, plays defense, isn't soft and will most likely have a better NHL career.

Sure, Lisin has the potential to be a star, but he was in his 11th hour already, considering the KHL offer. We have lots of prospects with the "boom or bust/homerun" label. This draft I wanted to see us go with some more safe picks. Although I can't that entirely happened, we do get one now at the expense of Lisin. We get a guy who already knows positioning, physical play and can bury some given the chance. I'm sure he's eager for more playing time and could probably use it more wisely than Enver ever did. I know everyone was enamored by Lisin and his potential but right now we have players who, at the time Lisin was 19, are far beyond Enver was at the time in terms of their all around game. Not to mention with arguably just as much offensive potential as Lisin along with a greater chance to reach that potential.

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07-14-2009, 03:54 AM
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
and not played with linemates that are offensively challenged.
That will likely still be an issue around here. He may play with offensive minded guys, but at the NHL level many of them are still challenged.

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07-14-2009, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by RousselRising View Post
I just don't see why, when the coaches and Maloney have decided Lisin isn't in their future plans, everyone is going so ballistic!
Lisin the hockey player > Gretzky the coach.
Quote:
He was going to walk.
Perhaps. If so, you're right. Too bad we couldn't **** can the garbage staff we have sooner. Enver wasn't getting his fair shake. If he wanted to move on, and made that clear, we probably got as good a return as we could've hoped for. If that's the case, I've got no argument against you, and good for Enver.

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07-14-2009, 03:57 AM
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Well, I'm usually wrong, too. Guess that means both guys will blow for their new teams and we just wasted time arguing about two worthless pieces of ****!
Honestly, with deals like this, that's the most likely scenario, I think. Probably Korpikoski will be Sjostrom V.2.0 and Lisin will be a KHL star. That's just how it always seems to go.

P.S.

I don't mean to be so absolute, all the time. It's a combo of my poor writing ability and my love for lots and lots of beer. I'm much better at talking about hockey than writing about it.

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07-14-2009, 03:58 AM
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Count me in as another whose unhappy with this trade. Like others have said, this team needs scoring, not more 3rd-4th line defensive minded players. I can see Lisin scoring 40 goals someday. The Coyotes need a player like that. Who else has that kind of potential? Turris? Mueller? Boedker? I doubt it.

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07-14-2009, 03:59 AM
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Lisin the hockey player > Gretzky the coach.

Perhaps. If so, you're right. Too bad we couldn't **** can the garbage staff we have sooner. Enver wasn't getting his fair shake. If he wanted to move on, and made that clear, we probably got as good a return as we could've hoped for. If that's the case, I've got no argument against you, and good for Enver.
Your avatar > Gretzky the Coach.

And amen to ****-canning our garbage coaching staff ASAP, brother.

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07-14-2009, 04:05 AM
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Is GMDM aware that there 27 other teams out there to trade with besides the Rangers and the Flames?

This is just more of a sign to me that the coaching staff has got to go. I'm amongst the many who feel like we don't develop our young players very well.

I've been happy enough with all of the other off-season moves to overlook this one move that I don't like very much. It's not like "Korpedo" is going to be straight up useless if he's not producing offensively.

I don't buy the whole argument for not having enough room for Korpikoski to get top 6 minutes in New York though. If Enver Lisin can't get top 6 minutes in Phoenix, I don't see how a guy who appears to be a PK specialist is going to.

And for the record, I think Korpedo is a god-awful nickname.

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07-14-2009, 04:05 AM
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No offense to the Upshall/Lombardi/Prucha line that did well late last year, I was hoping for a Upshall/Lombardi/Lisin pure speed line.

...and can we trade w/anyone besides NY and Calgary. Its getting a little monotonous. I first read the caption on tsn and I immediately thought, hummm, must be someone on the Rangers. Bingo!

While we're at it, why don't we trade coaching staffs...I'll take Torts over TGO anyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

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07-14-2009, 04:07 AM
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Is GMDM aware that there 27 other teams out there to trade with besides the Rangers and the Flames?

This is just more of a sign to me that the coaching staff has got to go. I'm amongst the many who feel like we don't develop our young players very well.

I've been happy enough with all of the other off-season moves to overlook this one move that I don't like very much. It's not like "Korpedo" is going to be straight up useless if he's not producing offensively.

I don't buy the whole argument for not having enough room for Korpikoski to get top 6 minutes in New York though. If Enver Lisin can't get top 6 minutes in Phoenix, I don't see how a guy who appears to be a PK specialist is going to.

And for the record, I think Korpedo is a god-awful nickname.
Good for LOL and for points. Maybe the best post in weeks.

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07-14-2009, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
Morris was UFA bait, Lisin was about his wits about being in Phoenix.

It's called asset management. Obviously Morris > Prucha.

Korpikoski has not been able to fit into our line up. He has the talent but our top 6 are pretty much all figured out, and we are trying to move in talent from the AHL and OHL in Anisimov and Grachev. Same scenario that happened with Prucha is happening with Korpikoski.

NOT A HELPLESS PLAYER, just the odd man out. The 5th wheel so to speak.

Korpedo I personally felt was rushed into the NHL and when put on a line... Was put on the PK and 4th with other players who had no offensive ability too them. Korpikoski has creativity to his play and usually never wastes the puck. All season if he ran out of options, he put the puck on net and created chances for the team.

I understand the type of player you guys lost, but realize that it seems that the Coach/GM didn't have the heart to wait for his potential, and that the player you are getting back gives total effort on both sides of the ice. There is not doubt to me that Korpikoski will put up a lot better numbers on the team if not regulated to the PK exclusively and not played with linemates that are offensively challenged.
Thanks for coming by and sharing your knowledge. I'm sure not all of us have seen much of Korpikoski. Good to hear from other fans.

I for one have always liked Korpikoski's game. Down right impressed me in games I've seen him in. I feel like a lot of people are already unfairly labeling him strictly a bottom 6 kind of guy. I personally see much more potential in him than just PK duties. Someone mentioned Jere Lehtinen earlier in the thread(PhoPhan?). I kind of see that as a good comparison with more speed out of Korpikoski. Obviously it's potential and we already have a plethora of potential.

Good Luck in NY Lisin.

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07-14-2009, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
I'm not happy. I think this maybe Lisin for a younger version of Freddy Sjostrom. I'll have to wait and see, though.
As a fan of Sjooey, what's so great about that statement? Sjostrom was a good Ranger but couldn't finish to save his life. The Coyotes so won that deal. Watch Montoya now develop into a No.1.

Korp has great wheels and instincts. He is a solid penalty killer and can play both center and wing. Give him third line duty and see how he does. He didn't get a fair shake. Neither did Prucha or Dawes from a franchise that lacks patience.


Best of luck to Korpedo!

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07-14-2009, 06:04 AM
  #98
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I can see Lisin scoring 40 goals someday. The Coyotes need a player like that. Who else has that kind of potential? Turris? Mueller? Boedker? I doubt it.
Actually yes. I think they do. If not, then 30 certainly. Although I don't see 40 in Enver's future either.

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07-14-2009, 08:29 AM
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Sather bent Maloney over, here. Stupid, stupid trade on Phoenix's part. The Rangers CANNOT lose.
Oh man. You're not being coherehent.

I was going to type a long-winded response to this, but let's just summarize in two sentences.

Without a one-way deal, Lisin was going to bolt. Maloney got something for what was going to be nothing.

EDIT: I'm breaking my own rule. Read Dave King's "King of Russia" sometime if you want some insight into the kind of player Enver Lisin is. Pay particular attention to the section on Stanislav Chistov.

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07-14-2009, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Art.Vandelay View Post
Count me in as another whose unhappy with this trade. Like others have said, this team needs scoring, not more 3rd-4th line defensive minded players. I can see Lisin scoring 40 goals someday. The Coyotes need a player like that. Who else has that kind of potential? Turris? Mueller? Boedker? I doubt it.
I believe all three of those guys have more potential than Lisin.

My opinion, while not thrilled with the trade it seemed Lisin's future with the Coyotes was pretty limited, and while he obviously had major input I'm not prepared to blame that solely on Gretzky.

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