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Old
07-15-2009, 03:35 PM
  #26
regulate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I don't know about Purcell on the 3rd line. Isn't our 3rd line the shutdown line? I agree that Purcell would add a nice dimension of offense but for our 3rd line, we need someone who has more defensive responsibility and I don't quite see Purcell being that guy.

If anything, I think Purcell's days as a king are pretty much over.
Why are so many people so quick to run Purcell out of town. He is one of top passers on the team, and has great on ice vision, something the Kings sorely lack. Yes, he is struggling to find an identity with the Kings, but I think that has as much to do with TM's style as anything. He is only 23 years old for crying out loud. Yes, he has to "compete" harder, I agree. But this kid can play. Just give a an everyday role. Put him on a wing with Handzus-Stoll-Purcell. Let them play everyday together and build some chemistry. Stop shuffling the lines every night. This line is strong on the face off, defensively responsible, yet can control the puck (see Detroit on why they are so good defensively, you can't score if the other team is in the offensive zone) and score. We need secondary scoring!

Purcell is a much better offensive player than Simmonds. Simmonds is a better high energy forechecker, but is knocked off the puck easily and is not a particularly good passer. He fits the young guy on the fourth line profile to a tee, on a team with some depth. Hopefully we have that depth this year. We will see who makes the club.

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Old
07-15-2009, 03:49 PM
  #27
Johnny Utah
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Smyth-Kopitar-Williams
Frolov-Stoll-Brown
Moller-Handzus-Simmonds
Ivanans-Lewis-Richardson/Clune

And later in the year.....

Clune-Lewis-Westgarth

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Old
07-15-2009, 03:51 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Smyth-Kopitar-Williams
Frolov-Stoll-Brown
Moller-Handzus-Simmonds
Ivanans-Lewis-Richardson/Clune

And later in the year.....

Clune-Lewis-Westgarth
That is the precise lineup I am hoping for. I am crossing my fingers that Murray somehow stumbles on it as well.

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Old
07-15-2009, 03:52 PM
  #29
The Black1963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regulate View Post
Why are so many people so quick to run Purcell out of town. He is one of top passers on the team, and has great on ice vision, something the Kings sorely lack. Yes, he is struggling to find an identity with the Kings, but I think that has as much to do with TM's style as anything. He is only 23 years old for crying out loud. Yes, he has to "compete" harder, I agree. But this kid can play. Just give a an everyday role. Put him on a wing with Handzus-Stoll-Purcell. Let them play everyday together and build some chemistry. Stop shuffling the lines every night. This line is strong on the face off, defensively responsible, yet can control the puck (see Detroit on why they are so good defensively, you can't score if the other team is in the offensive zone) and score. We need secondary scoring!

Purcell is a much better offensive player than Simmonds. Simmonds is a better high energy forechecker, but is knocked off the puck easily and is not a particularly good passer. He fits the young guy on the fourth line profile to a tee, on a team with some depth. Hopefully we have that depth this year. We will see who makes the club.
I like Purcell, he's a very skilled offensive player. However, he doesn't fit into our scheme of things here with TM and DL.

As for putting Purcell with Stoll and Zeus, that's not going to happen as Stoll will be centering the second line and Zeus centering the third most likely.

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Old
07-15-2009, 04:01 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Smyth-Kopitar-Williams
Frolov-Stoll-Brown
Moller-Handzus-Simmonds
Ivanans-Lewis-Richardson/Clune

And later in the year.....

Clune-Lewis-Westgarth
I like. Maybe Smyth plays with Stoll because there is already chemistry there. Then you add the D pairings:

Scuderi-Doughty
Johnson-Greene
O'Donnell-Hickey/Drewiskie

Murray is probably going to juggle the hell out of the lines. The D pairs might change too, Scuderi/Greene would be a great shut down pair against a top line. Then you could have Johnson/Doughty as an offensive pairing.

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Old
07-15-2009, 04:04 PM
  #31
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Yeah I came up with my lines through Hammond and from hearing what Hextall and Lombardi have hinted at several players through out the summer...

I just don't see BOTH Purcell and Moller sticking in the show at the same time....I also see Lewis taking Boyle's spot....and Clune and Zeiler battling it out for the agitator role on the 4th line....Segal could be a mid season call up....Westgarth/Ivanans are def the enforcers. I see Kevin either beating out Raitis in the pre-season


Last edited by Johnny Utah: 07-15-2009 at 04:20 PM.
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Old
07-15-2009, 04:14 PM
  #32
regulate
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
I just don't see BOTH Purcell and Moller sticking in the show at the same time....
You might be correct on that. I hope its Purcell if that's case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Segal could be a mid season call up....
Although none of us have probably seen him play, I wouldn't write off Segal at all. He is already listed on the NHL roster now, is 26 years old, has good size, and scored as much as Lewis in the AHL last year. If he has a good camp, he is as good a bet as anyone to make the team as far as the bottom half of the roster is concerned.

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Old
07-15-2009, 04:35 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Moller did just fine playing on a third line of Handzus and Simmonds. He adds some skill and shooting ability on the checking line and has the work ethic to be responsible defensively. Putting him in the AHL after a full season in the NHL is counter productive and doesn't make any sense. He's proven he can play in the NHL, what good does it do him to play in the AHL? This isn't Teddy Purcell, Brian Boyle or Matt Moulson we're talking about. Moller's biggest weakness is his strength, that's it. Once he gets stronger, he's going to be a threat and will eventually fill Frolov's spot on the wing in the top six.
This


Also remember that Moller was hurt the second half of last season

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Old
07-15-2009, 05:24 PM
  #34
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I would love to see Moller stick, Love the kids energy, attitude, and that he will sacrifice his body to play in the corners. I am hoping that he is in the gym every day trying to get as strong as he can before training camp. At this point in time it seems that the consensus is that we have four open spots on the roster, and the way I see it if Moller can stay with the big boys it just makes it that much clearer who is a member of the team, rather that calling up and sending down players to see if anything gels.

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Old
07-15-2009, 07:03 PM
  #35
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No way Hollaway makes the team....He wasnt even good enough to stay in Manchester last year which is why he got sent to Ontario...where he did play very well

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Old
07-15-2009, 09:21 PM
  #36
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I wish the Kings would do what alot of other teams are doing, and get rid of the goon on the 4th line, and actually roll 4 lines that are capable of playing at a high level.

When we play Anaheim or a team like that, then insert one of Ivanans or Westgarth.

There is absolutely no reason to play a goon in games vs. Detroit, Calgary, Edmonton, Chicago, Vancouver or many other teams that don't use one.

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Old
07-15-2009, 09:24 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
I wish the Kings would do what alot of other teams are doing, and get rid of the goon on the 4th line, and actually roll 4 lines that are capable of playing at a high level.

When we play Anaheim or a team like that, then insert one of Ivanans or Westgarth.

There is absolutely no reason to play a goon in games vs. Detroit, Calgary, Edmonton, Chicago, Vancouver or many other teams that don't use one.
This. Two thumbs up.

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Old
07-15-2009, 09:27 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regulate View Post
Why are so many people so quick to run Purcell out of town. He is one of top passers on the team, and has great on ice vision, something the Kings sorely lack. Yes, he is struggling to find an identity with the Kings, but I think that has as much to do with TM's style as anything. He is only 23 years old for crying out loud. Yes, he has to "compete" harder, I agree. But this kid can play. Just give a an everyday role. Put him on a wing with Handzus-Stoll-Purcell. Let them play everyday together and build some chemistry. Stop shuffling the lines every night. This line is strong on the face off, defensively responsible, yet can control the puck (see Detroit on why they are so good defensively, you can't score if the other team is in the offensive zone) and score. We need secondary scoring!

Purcell is a much better offensive player than Simmonds. Simmonds is a better high energy forechecker, but is knocked off the puck easily and is not a particularly good passer. He fits the young guy on the fourth line profile to a tee, on a team with some depth. Hopefully we have that depth this year. We will see who makes the club.
I have to agree with this. Although I think Moller deserves to be in the lineup more at this point, he won't be as effective as we want until he puts on a little more weight. I don't mind keep him in Manchester and having him focus on his strength, then make a mid-season appearance. Purcell is more physically mature and can really boost our powerplay. He made many great passes and could really see the ice well to slow things down on the man advantage. Give him 15 minutes a night and he might surprise most of us this year.

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Old
07-15-2009, 09:29 PM
  #39
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Raitis gets traded somewhere back east. Richardson and Segal are down in Manchester with Moller, helping the Monarchs make the playoffs.

Clune/Zeiler-Lewis-Westgarth

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Old
07-15-2009, 09:59 PM
  #40
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at is the big question...who plays the LW with Handzus-Simmonds...The top 6 are decided...Kopitar, Frolov, Brown, Smyth, Stoll and Williams....

One of Purcell and Moller is headed to the AHL because whoever doesn't end up with Simmonds-Zeus will be on the 4th line and I don't think the Kings want either of those guys on that line.
I don't think that is necessarily the case. Handzus & Simmonds could easily be placed in any sort of combination with the other 6 forwards. Line combinations don't adhere to a neat hierarchy and chemistry will dictate how they meld together.

My suspicion is the following 'base' combos:

Smyth - Kopitar - Brown
Purcell - Stoll - Williams
Frolov - Handzus - Simmonds

With all 3 lines receiving similar ES ice.

I'd put the early favourite for 4th line as :

Ivanans - Lewis - Richardson

With Westgarth & Zeiler as 13th & 14th forwards. Moller starting the season in Manch.

Harrold also figures in as a 14th forward/8th dman.

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Old
07-15-2009, 10:07 PM
  #41
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I am sure someone has mentioned this and I don't want to read the entire thread, but doesn't the make up of the 4th line depend entirely on what Murray envisions as its role?

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Old
07-15-2009, 10:12 PM
  #42
Ziggy Stardust
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There is absolutely no way Purcell wins a roster spot over Moller. He doesn't skate as well as Moller, doesn't compete as hard, doesn't go to the dirty areas and isn't gritty enough, doesn't have as good of a shot, etc, etc. As stated previously, all Oscar needs work on is his strength. Once he gets stronger (and he will), he'll fill in on the top six. As far as next season goes, he should be the other forward on the line with Handzus and Simmonds.

Just as we saw Detroit use Hudler and Filppula as checking line forwards, Moller should be used in a similar role learning the intricacies of the game before being moved up to a top six role. He should also see some ice time on the second powerplay unit as well. Purcell has to outplay and outwork Moller in camp and during the preseason and I don't see that happening.

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Old
07-15-2009, 10:20 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
I wish the Kings would do what alot of other teams are doing, and get rid of the goon on the 4th line, and actually roll 4 lines that are capable of playing at a high level.

When we play Anaheim or a team like that, then insert one of Ivanans or Westgarth.

There is absolutely no reason to play a goon in games vs. Detroit, Calgary, Edmonton, Chicago, Vancouver or many other teams that don't use one.



so true we need a 4th liner to play more then 6 mins 22 secs a game

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Old
07-15-2009, 10:32 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Moller did just fine playing on a third line of Handzus and Simmonds. He adds some skill and shooting ability on the checking line and has the work ethic to be responsible defensively. Putting him in the AHL after a full season in the NHL is counter productive and doesn't make any sense. He's proven he can play in the NHL, what good does it do him to play in the AHL? This isn't Teddy Purcell, Brian Boyle or Matt Moulson we're talking about. Moller's biggest weakness is his strength, that's it. Once he gets stronger, he's going to be a threat and will eventually fill Frolov's spot on the wing in the top six.
It's not about whether or not he'd do fine.. it's more based on development. If he can't check in with top 6 minutes at his age and status, might as well give him 20 mins/night in the AHL till a top 6 guy goes down with an injury.

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07-15-2009, 10:40 PM
  #45
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FYI, Hudler in his rookie year had 25 points in 76 games. Moller had 15 points in 40 games. Had Moller remained healthy and maintained the same scoring pace, he would have had 30+ points in his rookie year while averaging third line minutes.

This past season, Moller's avg. ice time was 13:22. Hudler's avg. ice time in his third pro season was 13:39, and he scored 57 points. He will continue to get better in all aspects of the game even if utilized on the third line. I don't see Moller benefiting from playing at a lower level where he can easily dominate the AHL.

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Old
07-15-2009, 10:54 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
FYI, Hudler in his rookie year had 25 points in 76 games. Moller had 15 points in 40 games. Had Moller remained healthy and maintained the same scoring pace, he would have had 30+ points in his rookie year while averaging third line minutes.

This past season, Moller's avg. ice time was 13:22. Hudler's avg. ice time in his third pro season was 13:39, and he scored 57 points. He will continue to get better in all aspects of the game even if utilized on the third line. I don't see Moller benefiting from playing at a lower level where he can easily dominate the AHL.
Confidence.

Also some euro's don't stick around to play AHL so maybe they do play it safe and keep him there. But not all players respond to an early NHL career the same way. Moller can handle the NHL no problem, i agree with that, i just think if you have a guy who can play top 6 as a 19, 20 year old but there are no top 6 spots then give him more development time. Make sure with these guys don't force the issue. Some guys have major sophmore slumps too so this may be something to watch. I think we agree on alot of things here, except how to push a top 6 player who's under 21.

I say if he beats Williams outright for the 2nd line spot, he stays out of camp, if not i'd send him to the AHL untill someone slumps, or gets injured and he recieves a top 6 role. His time int he AHL would be temporary either way.

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Old
07-15-2009, 11:06 PM
  #47
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I think we should go with fro-kopi-williams
smyth-stoll-purcell
brown-zeus-simmonds
ivanis-lewis-moller/richarson

kopi,purcell and brown make plays and can score
smyth,williams,fro are finishers
stoll,zeus and lewis are checking centers and faceoff men

brown and zeus had some chemistry together killing penalties
somewhat balanced top nine ?

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Old
07-16-2009, 03:11 PM
  #48
The Black1963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
I wish the Kings would do what alot of other teams are doing, and get rid of the goon on the 4th line, and actually roll 4 lines that are capable of playing at a high level.

When we play Anaheim or a team like that, then insert one of Ivanans or Westgarth.

There is absolutely no reason to play a goon in games vs. Detroit, Calgary, Edmonton, Chicago, Vancouver or many other teams that don't use one.
Yeah, I had brought up that exact idea on another board last year.

We'll be a much better team with this lineup:

Kopi/Williams/Fro
Stoll/Brownie/Smyth
Zeus/Simmie/Moller or Parse
Lewis/Purcell, Moller or Segal/Parse or Clune

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Old
07-16-2009, 03:14 PM
  #49
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RH63, you have a pic of Laraque as your icon yet you fail to include Westgarth and Ivanans on the roster....Shame on you....

Raitis has a one way deal and Westgarth signed a 3 year deal...you will be seeing one if not both of those guys before Parse, Segal or any other smuck from Manchester.

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Old
07-16-2009, 03:16 PM
  #50
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ill go with

Smyth / Kopitar / Brown
Frolov / Stoll / Williams
Moller / Handzus / Simmonds
Clune / Lewis / Westgarth

Scuderi / Doughty
Johnson / Greene
O'Donnell / Hickey

Quick
Ersberg

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