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How good was Al Iafrate?

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:40 PM
  #51
BlackJack21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchausen
Who's disputing the fact Iafrate was better than Souray? Not me. Souray's a poor man Iafrate in style. I cannot find a closest thing to Iafrate in today's NHL than Souray (overall). Doesn't mean he's (or will ever be) his equal. And yes, I'm only basing it on this season's performance, so if he doesn't repeat, all is moot.
That is it...

Same style, same assets, same category...

Nobody is aguing that Souray is better than Al...
However he Might be!!!!


















Kidding you!!!!!!

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:46 PM
  #52
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[QUOTE=bleedgreen]
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO
he was playing in an era where the top dmen in the league were close to or over 100 pt seasons (like Coffey many times)... he never came close to that... he was getting 50-60 in an era when guys like Bourque were getting over 80... Coffey was over 100... MacInnis, Suter, Housley, Hatcher, Duchesne were all outscoring him at the time.

i would take iafrate as an all around d over suter, hatcher, housley, and dushesne, they may have outscored him but that doesnt make them better overall. of course he cant be called the best in a generation including bourque, coffey and guys like you mentioned. there were alot of amazing d-men in that era, its not like now. i think he would be pretty dominate in todays game, still.
Ok D-man where better at that time... I see that explane a lot of things!!!!


No more question, I now understand!

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:49 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacDaddy Version 1.3
The only way it's a good comparison is if Gary Leeman starts nailing Souray's wife.
lol :lol

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:52 PM
  #54
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Hate to break up the Montreal vs.Toronto arguement here but personnally Ed Jovanovski(sp) is the closest comparison I'd make to Al today. I'd say that Al outclasses Ed on the purely physical aspects (size, speed and shot) but not by a lot. Ed away outclasses Al in hockey sense though.

For me I'd always watch Al and think "if only he knew how to play hockey". Al had a few season where he almost put it all together but mostly he just got by on his incredible physical skills.

But if you want a comparison Ed is definitely the guy I'd go with.

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:59 PM
  #55
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I think people are overrating Iafrate just a bit here.

He had great physical tools, tremendous shot and a great skater, but not the sharpest tool in the shed.

IMO the player he most resembles in the NHL today is Andy Delmore.

Now Iafrate was better than Delmore and also more physical, but both players have great wheels, a big shot but never became nearly the player they should have become.

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:59 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJack21
Ok D-man where better at that time... I see that explane a lot of things!!!!


No more question, I now understand!

BJ21
I don't think that dmen were better during Iafrate's time... it was just a different game...

do you conclude that players in general were better because there was more scoring?? do the ed olcyzk's of the league and gary leeman's count as superstars because they were putting up 80-100 pt seasons??

today's best dmen, IMO, were as good as the best then... different styles of game.

Coffey was as good an offensive dman as there ever was, but overall, do you take Pronger or Lidstrom in their prime or Coffey in his?? they bring different things to the table, but all 3 are top notch dmen... and when it comes to helping a team win, they are all elite.

Iafrate was a good dman... maybe even very good... but he wasn't a top 3 or so in his time... not like Pronger, Lidstrom are now.

when I mentioned Souray as a comparison, I was thinking style of game... sure Iafrate is faster... even has a harder shot... but try and find a dman that's comparable in style... someone that is out there to QB your PP while being the tough defensive dman in his own zone... someone with a quality shot from the point while being a guy you want out there on our top PK unit.

Souray's style is the first one that came to my mind...

for all of those here that are laughing at the comparison... I have yet to hear a single comparable name from any of you of who you would best compare Iafrate to??

remember this isn't a guy that ever dominated the league at his position - he was very good, and usually a top 2 dman on his team... but there were always several players in his time that were considered at a higher level - including Bourque, Coffey, MacInnis even his own teammate Hatcher and in his earlier days Langway... most of these guys were either Norris winners or top contenders, unlike Iafrate.

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:05 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO
for all of those here that are laughing at the comparison... I have yet to hear a single comparable name from any of you of who you would best compare Iafrate to??
Like I said before, I do not think there is anyone comparable to him in today's NHL. That does not mean there is no one better than him, just noone that plays like him. Being big and having a good shot does not make you Al Iafrate.

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:10 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO
I don't think that dmen were better during Iafrate's time... it was just a different game...

do you conclude that players in general were better because there was more scoring?? do the ed olcyzk's of the league and gary leeman's count as superstars because they were putting up 80-100 pt seasons??

today's best dmen, IMO, were as good as the best then... different styles of game.

Coffey was as good an offensive dman as there ever was, but overall, do you take Pronger or Lidstrom in their prime or Coffey in his?? they bring different things to the table, but all 3 are top notch dmen... and when it comes to helping a team win, they are all elite.

Iafrate was a good dman... maybe even very good... but he wasn't a top 3 or so in his time... not like Pronger, Lidstrom are now.

when I mentioned Souray as a comparison, I was thinking style of game... sure Iafrate is faster... even has a harder shot... but try and find a dman that's comparable in style... someone that is out there to QB your PP while being the tough defensive dman in his own zone... someone with a quality shot from the point while being a guy you want out there on our top PK unit.

Souray's style is the first one that came to my mind...

for all of those here that are laughing at the comparison... I have yet to hear a single comparable name from any of you of who you would best compare Iafrate to??

remember this isn't a guy that ever dominated the league at his position - he was very good, and usually a top 2 dman on his team... but there were always several players in his time that were considered at a higher level - including Bourque, Coffey, MacInnis even his own teammate Hatcher and in his earlier days Langway... most of these guys were either Norris winners or top contenders, unlike Iafrate.
Absolutely agree on 95% of what you said bud!!!!

BTW I'am on your side...

I was responding to bleedgreen who was saying that Iafrate would be one of the best in todays game. (that was sarcasm )

I meant Iafrate was a top 12-20 D-men IMO in his era and would be a top 12-20 d-men in our time.

Cause nothing really changed in terms of talent or skills the game is just different and if there is a difference in skills, todays player must be better... (bigger pool of player) But I dont think so.

Maybe I was'nt clear... hopping it's now crystal!!!!

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:18 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful
one of the best point shots ever, if not the best, not just of his time.

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:19 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJack21
Absolutely agree on 95% of what you said bud!!!!

BTW I'am on your side...

I was responding to bleedgreen who was saying that Iafrate would be one of the best in todays game. (that was sarcasm )

I meant Iafrate was a top 12-20 D-men IMO in his era and would be a top 12-20 d-men in our time.

Cause nothing really changed in terms of talent or skills the game is just different and if there is a difference in skills, todays player must be better... (bigger pool of player) But I dont think so.

Maybe I was'nt clear... hopping it's now crystal!!!!


BJ21
No. Jesse Owen's Gold medal, record setting time in the 1936 Olympics wouldn't even qualify him today. On the WOMEN'S team!

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:21 PM
  #61
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Iafrate was a complete player. Probably the only player to step on the ice that shot harder than Macinnis. He had good size and held his own in the defensive zone. He also had some of the most incredible end 2 end rushes. (watch Grapevine 1/2/3 for some examples).

Does anybody remember him showing up at skills comp in cowboy boots and still firing a 98mph shot...

To answer the question, he was very good.

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:26 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf Defender
Like I said before, I do not think there is anyone comparable to him in today's NHL. That does not mean there is no one better than him, just noone that plays like him. Being big and having a good shot does not make you Al Iafrate.
yea you gotta be prone to injury too and a little wild and crazy in the head

of course there are no 2 players that are ever going to be alike...

who do you compare Coffey to?? perhaps the smoothest skating dman who had as good a hockey sense as anyone??

who do you compare Bourque to??

of course he's not Souray... but the question here isnt' about finding a duplicate player - it's who you would compare him to given their styles, of the closest match you could find... not someone who's as good, or the same in every facet... just someone who given the styles is a comparable?

and you guys do overrate Iafrate like hell... in his 13 years in the league he played in 10 seasons of 65 or more games, 6 seasons of 75 or more games, and managed 4 all-star appearances and no Norris trophies, and hasn't been among the top scoring dmen in any of the years he's played... yet he's being talked about here as being a superstar dman among the best of his time who some would rather take over Pronger or Blake - both Norris winners, and Pronger having won a Hart... yea I know that scoring isn't everything, but overall Iafrate was way too inconsistent to be considered a top dmen in the same category as Pronger is now...

IMO Iafrate overall was a good dman who's a solid #2 on any team... he's got some great assets, and some drawbacks (most notably his overall hockey sense and consistency) which puts him right near where a healthy Souray would be this season IMO... of course this is only 1 season that Souray has played at this level, and he could go either way in the future... but I'm comparing Souray's year this year (injury problems and all) to Iafrate overall...

of course convincing a Leaf fan that he's not all that, is like trying to convince you guys that you don't need to set up your parade route down yonge street just yet

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:32 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO
of course convincing a Leaf fan that he's not all that, is like trying to convince you guys that you don't need to set up your parade route down yonge street just yet
This does not have anything to do with him being a Leaf. The guy was much better in every aspect of the game than Souray. Leaf or not.

Also, how does the avatar look?

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:33 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJack21

However Iafrate was a greater skater, one of the fastest of his era.
BTW he was smoking 2 packs of ciagaretts every single day!!!!

BJ21
Yep my bud use to billet Glen Murray. He came up in visited after his first year in Boston. He said there was a seperate room just for Al Iafrate to sit in during intermissions where he would just smoke cigarettes.

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:35 PM
  #65
NFITO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf Defender

Also, how does the avatar look?
the avatar would look a lot better is he wasn't wearing his helmet... oh that thick flowing head of hair he had :lol

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:36 PM
  #66
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Al had a slow start, unfortunately he played with the Leafs in the 80's, if it had been with another team he might have started a year or two later than he did. I think pressing him into the "franchise" defenseman mold really ruined him. He could have been great, and I mean top 10-20 all-time. Like a Serge Savard. He could skate like the wind, made end-to-end rushes, but lacked something. He finally rounded out into a good defenseman with the Capitals but got injured and he never fufilled his potential. He was a character off the ice, he was a DJ in washington in his off hours, spinning heavy-metal records, drinking lots and riding Harly's.

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04-01-2004, 05:36 PM
  #67
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Al "The Planet" Iafrate was....SMOKIN'!!!

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:38 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO
oh that thick flowing head of hair he had :lol
...at one time...

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:09 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db23
No. Jesse Owen's Gold medal, record setting time in the 1936 Olympics wouldn't even qualify him today. On the WOMEN'S team!
Different technique, training, diet, and doping products...

Same skils and talent imho...

BJ21

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04-01-2004, 06:12 PM
  #70
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Well if al can shoot 20 X times harder the puck than Souray can, he shooted the puck at..2048 mph, Man thats fast!

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:22 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJack21
Different technique, training, diet, and doping products...

Same skils and talent imho...

BJ21
I can see what your trying to say but technique, diet, training and even doping are all skills develloped over time. Their natural ability could be similar but not their skill or talent.

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:35 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Big P
I can see what your trying to say but technique, diet, training and even doping are all skills develloped over time. Their natural ability could be similar but not their skill or talent.
What I meant exactly is if Owens was regitered for the 2004 Olympics he would probably contend for the gold medals cause he would be trained, feed, doped with the same technique and trainer that trained Green, Boldon and cie... (I know these guys should be has been now but the only names that came to my mind )

BTW I'm talking about a 21 years old Jesse Owens... not 88 years old of course...

Some of my friens says that Guy Lafleur would'nt score 30 in todays NHL... False, he was one of the best cause he knew how to be the best and has the natural talent...

He would find the way to be the best in todays NHL too IMO!

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:39 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Big P
I can see what your trying to say but technique, diet, training and even doping are all skills develloped over time. Their natural ability could be similar but not their skill or talent.
Oh and BTW... a big % a the speed added comes from the Track and the shoes.

That have nothing to do with skills and natural talent.

No kidding...

BJ21

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:42 PM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaf Defender
Strongly disagree.

Iafrate was 20x the player Souray will ever be. The only thing they have in common is a hard shot, and even that Al did better.
no question......he had as much skill as just about anyone ever.....his skating was amazing as well.....big...fast....tough.....huge shot....just inconsistant (not terribly so....but with all his skill he should have been a HOFer)

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:45 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruinaholic
I was looking at his career numbers and he had a few 20 goal seasons and was always over 150 pims a year, i vaguely remember him on the Bruins and i recall he had an awesome playoff series vs the Habs in the early 90's.
Who would he be comparible too nowadays?
Too bad injurys cut his career short, was he he #1 Dmen?
Million dollar skills, with a 2 cent brain. He should have been a faster version of Larry Robinson, but just didn't have the cranial capacity.

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