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Rank our players for fun and prizes! (well, for fun anyways)

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Old
04-01-2004, 02:43 PM
  #1
punchy1
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Rank our players for fun and prizes! (well, for fun anyways)

I were thinking (and no, it weren't about how Andy is the AndyChrist) about our team and next season. There have been allot of threads (great ones too) about who should stay and go and so on and after reading them all a few times, I still have allot of questions on who should be here or where they would best help the team.

Then I started thinking about our lads based on talent and reckoned I would rank them and see if everyone else would do the same. Maybe at the end we can come up with an actual balanced list of who to keep. Maybe it will be another excersize in futility. Either way, it will stop me chatting about Murray and that has to be a good thing.



The criteria is that you have to include all aspects of the players skills including heart, drive, determination, skating, scoring, defencive play, the works. Rank them top to bottom. I would ask that you try and rank them as they would best be helpful in your opinion to our teams success next year. (or this one, you know)

Here goes my list and one last thing, all players the Kings hold rights to are allowed on your lists.



The Forwards,

Ziggy Palffy
Alexander Frolov
Luc Robitialle
Trent Klatt
Sean Avery
Ian Lappy
Martin Straka
Army Armstrong
Jeff Cowan
Esa Pirnes
Scott Barney
Mike Camelerri
Dustin Brown
Josef Stumpel
Petr Kanko
Greg Hogeboom
Pavel Rosa
Eric Belanger
Anson Carter


Defencemen

Matty Norstrom
Lubomir (though my mate in LAs gay secretary calls him Lubemyrear and for some sad reason I can't remove that daft name from my head) Visnovsky
Tim Gleason
Joe Corvo
Arron Miller
Denis Grebshkov
Jason Holland
Nathan Dempsey
Tomas Zizka
Jora Modry
D Muir
A Rome
Joe Rullier
J Petiot


Goal Tenders

CRis Huet
Roman Chechmanek
M Choinard
Marsters
Zaba
Munce




When I look at my lists (obviously omitting several players that I truly hope won't be with us next year or feel will remain in Juniours/euro or college) I feel we need a top notch first line center and a true goalie to make a run at the cup.


I do think that if we moved Belanger/Miller and Zizka (maybe a mid round pick as well) that we might be able to nab a right fine young center from any number of teams that are too loaded down with good young prospects up the middle and be able to address our second line center troubles with what they return or, of course and firstly, to deal for a true top goalie.

We would have to absorb some of Millers contract ($I would say pay down to where he is earning under $2mill per season but we can afford it) if we are to move him and also that he is a great defencive defenceman who has had one bad year and if we keep him, it wouldn't break my heart either.

Belanger is good, young and cheap. (sort of a second coming of Yanik Peaureaultaeiou) There will be interest in him. Zizka is a good mid 20s puck moving defenceman with a great shot. He needs to be paired with a stay at home type but is an upgrade over defencemen like Lilja in Fla and allot of other hanger ons around the league.


Since it is no doubt in my mind that we are going to keep this circus running for one more go around and that we will very much likely see the re signing of Carter and Modry coupled with the retaining of Ziggy and with any luck Lappy, (hoorah, right?) we are going to have precious few actual spots that we CAN fill.

I don't see us going with a youth movement (and pray that we dont until we either win the cup this next season or Andy has moved along next) so if we add a true number one center, a top notch goalie and shore up the rest, we might be sitting in kippers this time next season.




YOUR TURN!!!!


One last rule, No having a piss on my suggestions now, unless you make a comprehensive list of your own, which you should.

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Old
04-01-2004, 03:12 PM
  #2
2goodtimes
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DAMN punchy, does everything you write have to be a book?


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Old
04-01-2004, 03:41 PM
  #3
punchy1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2goodtimes
DAMN punchy, does everything you write have to be a book?


I am not familliar with any of the players you listed or the style you have ranked them in mate.

Give it another go!



(or I will write another disertation on why Andy should be fired! I mean it. I will!)


(;

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Old
04-01-2004, 03:47 PM
  #4
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The Forwards,

Ziggy Palffy
Alexander Frolov
Luc Robitaille
Trent Klatt
Derek Armstrong
Sean Avery
Martin Straka
Ian Laperriere
Scott Barney
Jeff Cowan
Esa Pirnes
Mike Cammalleri
Dustin Brown
Pavel Rosa
Jozef Stumpel
Eric Belanger
Anson Carter


Defencemen

Matty Norstrom
Lubomir Visnovsky
Tim Gleason
Nathan Dempsey
Aaron Miller
Joe Corvo
Denis Grebshkov
Jason Holland
Tomas Zizka
Jaroslav Modry

Goal Tenders

Cristobal Huet
Roman Cechmanek
Mathieu Chouinard

Obviously, I left out Hogeboom and Kanko. I haven't seen enough of them to really judge where they fit in. Also the same with Muir, Rome, Rullier and Petiot. I think maybe after training camp or rookie camp or something, then we can truly decide whether or not they're ready to join the big club.

I rated Derek Armstrong a little higher because the guy has so much heart. He has solidified himself as a number 2 center in this league, IMO. I think he's been solid considering he was labeled as a "career minor-leaguer." He deserves to be on one of the top lines.

A lot of those guys have proven they're NHL ready. Tough to rank them. I'd say Norstrom and Visnovsky are 1A and 1B. Visnovsky has been awesome. I think he's been our best d-man (when healthy of course).


Last edited by LuckyLUC20: 04-01-2004 at 03:54 PM.
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Old
04-01-2004, 04:45 PM
  #5
punchy1
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Cheers lucky.

What would your second line look like next year with Army as its center.


I tend to agree with you as he is either the second or third line center if I were putting the team together. I just don't know what I would do for the lines if he were my second line center. Big Log jam up there. I also think that Avery were more effective as a center so would have him as the third line pivot (unless Army were there and we made some solid additions that were better)

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Old
04-01-2004, 04:52 PM
  #6
LuckyLUC20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by punchy1
Cheers lucky.

What would your second line look like next year with Army as its center.


I tend to agree with you as he is either the second or third line center if I were putting the team together. I just don't know what I would do for the lines if he were my second line center. Big Log jam up there. I also think that Avery were more effective as a center so would have him as the third line pivot (unless Army were there and we made some solid additions that were better)
I don't know who Army's linemates will be. I guess it depends on whether or not we bring in some guys via Free Agency to fill in some holes left by both Allison and Deadmarsh. Assuming we re-sign Palffy (please re-sign Ziggy!), I liked the idea that TiesRLikeWins2us brought up of Primeau centering both he and Straka. That would be awesome. Armstrong can maybe play with Frolov and Trent Klatt at wing? Just a thought. Maybe someone else has something better...

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Old
04-01-2004, 05:38 PM
  #7
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I think if Anson Carter is put with the right players he can get back to his 30 goals form. Lets be realistic he's going to be a KING next year. Sorry, Punchy I want to wait and see what we do with Deader and Allison, before I start thinking to much about our line combos next year.

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Old
04-01-2004, 06:10 PM
  #8
punchy1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingz4life
I think if Anson Carter is put with the right players he can get back to his 30 goals form. Lets be realistic he's going to be a KING next year. Sorry, Punchy I want to wait and see what we do with Deader and Allison, before I start thinking to much about our line combos next year.


Thats fine mate. Don't make any line combos and simply rank our players. Anyone we have the rights to and how they are to be ranked amoung our NHLers.


The line combo thing is just in response to Luckys ideas on Army. It isn't a line combo thread thingy.



I do agree that Carter IS going to be on the Kings next year unfortunately. DT wouldn't move Aulin for a player if he meant to let him walk. As for the impact he will have, well, I reckon time will tell but, after what he has shown us for the last 14 games, i have to think he is one of the worst players to wear the crown.

A soft, perimeter robot who shows nothing to me.




Though, what do I know anyways.



How about them rankings mate, have a pop! Its all for a bit of crack anyways.

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Old
04-01-2004, 07:06 PM
  #9
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I'd say a WHOLE LOT depends on the status of Allison & Deadmarsh next year. I'm traditionally optimistic, so I'll say they'll have a miraculous summer and a tremendous recovery culminating in healthy training camps/seasons for both. That said:



I'd like to see a top line of:

Deadmarsh/Allison/Cammalleri

Cammalleri is a scorer, but he needs size & grit on his line to be successful. And while Palffy obviously works well with these two guys (41 & 28), I don't see Cammalleri being NEARLY as successful with other linemates. Besides, Ziggy's needed on the other lines to "spread the wealth" of scoring.


Frolov/Armstrong/Klatt

I'm not sure about Army's status, but I know both Klatt & Frolov have another year each on their respective contracts. As with Camm, Frolov NEEDS grit on his line to be successful. Klatt & Army bring it. Now there are a lot of people who are automatically going to jump up and say "but Army & Klatt don't belong on the 2nd line if Ally & Deader are healthy!" Who said anything about this being the 2nd line? This could be called the 3rd line or the 4th line or the "other" 1st line. Let's not assign numerals to lines, shall we?


Avery/Lapperiere/Belanger

Could this line stay intact forever, or are Lappy & Ebay gonners over the summer? Sure, Lappy's the "heart and soul" of the franchise, but he's 30. And "heart and soul" of the franchise players typically have a higher trade value for playoff based teams. If there's a next season, look for Lappy to go at the deadline. I seriously do not believe he's in the Kings "long term" plans. He and Matty WERE, but that was in 1997. A "long term" has already come and gone. Bye bye Lappy. Ebay: we keep thinking he's going to get better and have that "breakout" 20-goal season. If that's the case, why is it that each year he keeps getting a little bit worse? The dude needs to bulk up. Seriously, without his pads in the post-game interviews, Ebay looks like a skeleton. It's obvious he works hard out there, but he needs to add 10-15 lbs. of muscle if he wants to remain a King. It's hard to maintain puck control if the opposition is constantly knocking you off it! Hey, I'm no expert, but get those personal trainers back! You know, the ones that got the Kings on that strict weight training regimine the year we knocked Wings out of the playoffs and Forsberg's spleen out of his body? Anyway, I'd forget about the Avery/Lappy/Ebay line and say hello to the Cowan/Avery/Brown line. We won't have it to start the season, but we'll finish with it.


Barney/Stumpel/Palffy

Assuming Barney can successfully make the transition to left wing, this would be an amazing line. Barney & Stumpel have already shown they work well togther and we all know how well Stump & Ziggy know one another's stlye of play. For an alternative to Barney, I'd put Luc in there. Who knows if he'll return next year? My personal prediction is that he'll play 'till he's 44, but that's only because I know astrology and the physical benefits of being born in "The Year of the Horse", LoL!


That leaves:

Carter
Straka
Pirnes
Rosa??? (LoL)


Well, Straka is effectively a Palffy clone. Same size, age, speed & very similar (though slightly less) skills. Assuming Palffy's in the lineup, there's no real reason for Straka's presence here. There's a year remaining on his contract so (again, this assumes that Ally & Deader come back and we retain Palffy) I'd package him with another player or pick in the offseason (perhaps prior to June's draft?) and try to get draft picks for him. We gave up a 2nd rounder (Anshankov) and a prospect D (Strbak) for him, so I'd like to see DT get at least a 3rd rounder in return. We won't know until a few months from now whether or not Deader & Ally will return, so it'd probably be a pick(s) in the 2005 draft.

Carter, in the same way Straka is a Palffy clone, is just a Stumpel clone. Hell, ONE Jozef Stumpel is ENOUGH, thank you very much! LoL! Another 2nd round pick was used to get him (Aulin), but this pick was assigned a 7.5 by Hockeysfuture! WTF?!?! Say it ain't so! There really should be an NHL trade clause that would reverse a trade before a 20-day period had elapsed assuming the initiating team isn't happy with who they called about to acquire. Seriously, this makes the Ronning trade look GOOD, and he was 6 years older than Carter! I'd like to say trade him, but there is the whole issue about "he's Ally's friend" and "he's black and could increase the fan base here in LA" and "he's averaged 23-goal seasons" and "we gave up a VERY good prospect for him", etc., etc...... I honestly don't know about this one. It's your call, DT.

I'll talk about the D and the G later on. I must urinate.

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Old
04-01-2004, 09:40 PM
  #10
punchy1
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Cheers mate but I were wondering if you could also simply rank them all as their value to the team using the rating "system" (not a grand one) that I had set about.

The line combos are grand but what I were trying to do were to get an idea of what an average ranking of all of our players are by comparing our lists of rank.

Then take that information and show a top to bottom ranking of them and then try to see what is missing from the line up and who should be paired based on who we all feel we should have next year.

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Old
04-01-2004, 11:00 PM
  #11
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The Forwards,

Ziggy Palffy
Alexander Frolov
Martin Straka
Luc Robitialle
Josef Stumpel
Sean Avery
Mike Camelerri
Anson Carter
Trent Klatt
Derek Armstrong
Jeff Cowan
Scott Barney
Dustin Brown
Ian Lappy
Esa Pirnes
Petr Kanko
Eric Belanger

Defencemen

Lubomir Visnovsky
Matty Norstrom
Nathan Dempsey
Arron Miller
Tim Gleason
Denis Grebshkov
Thomas Zishka
Jaroslav Modry
Joe Corvo
Jason Holland
A Rome
J Petiot


Goal Tenders

Checkmanek
Huet

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Old
04-02-2004, 01:51 AM
  #12
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Forwards:
Palffy
Frolov
Straka
Luc
Carter-shocker. but hes proven in the past what he can do...
Stumpel
Cammalleri
Army
Klatt
lappy
Avery
Cowan
Pirnes
Brown
Barney
Belanger
Rosa-hasnt had a chance to prove himself
Kanko-hasnt had a chance to prove himself
Hogeboom-hasnt had a chance to prove himself


D-Men:
Matty Norstrom
Lubo
Miller
Grebshkov
Gleason
Nathan Dempsey
Corvo
Holland
Tomas Zizka
Modry
Muir
A Rome-hes probably higher Iv heard a lot about him
Petiot-probably higher...from what I hear
Rullier

Goalies:
Chechmanek
Huet
Munce
Choinard
Marsters
Zaba

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04-02-2004, 03:29 AM
  #13
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Palffy= Best player kings have. Really highly skilled in all aspects of the game.
Frolov= Best young player the kings have. Up-and-coming player with some of the best attributes of anyone I've seen recently. Great reach, decent speed, and excellent hand-eye coordination
Straka= Fast, highly skilled sniper. He needs to work his hardest in order to be a success. Will only be successful when he is able to be creative.
Luc= Tenure player. I think he will be less effective next season but he truely is the best LW of all time. Does a great job at finding open spots from which he snipes.
Carter= Dissapointing season. Needs to hit the gym hard and become much quicker on his feet. Speed training or something. His limited speed is one of the reasons why he is playing such a timid game.
Stumpel= He's a big centerman with pretty good skills. It is tough to find a player of his skill level. Too bad he cannot play physical consistantly. Solid 2nd line guy during his career.
Cammalleri= I think he really displayed some nice scoring touch. Needs to prove he can play in the bigs. Needs to play a consistantly hungry game and get points.
Army= I think he's been really pretty good for the kings. He's had good numbers and from what I understand he's a really stand up guy. I'm just not sure where he fits.
Klatt= Probably one of the most consistantly hard working players in the NHL. I love the way this guy plays. Working that hard it's no wonder he had such a successful season.
Lapperiere= I love the way this guy plays. Avery might be able to take over his role soon. I really think this guy will contribute most on a team like the kings. It's going to be difficult to get fair return.
Avery= Probably, the most improved player on the kings. He's got good speed, he's mean, and he's got a GREAT wrist-shot.
Cowan= He is the team's best deadline acquisition. If he works hard he'll be able to stay in the NHL and be a contributor.
Pirnes= I like his speed and quickness. He was a good pick-up from Europe and has proven to have NHL skills. He will never be a elite NHL player but when he's at his best he can create an impact.
Brown= My favorite rookie. This kid is a good skater, he's tough and best of all he is very smart with the puck. It's going to be several years but I think that he is going to be a real bright spot for the Kings in the future.
Barney= Proved he has the size and skill to play NHL hockey. He deserved to be in there during the play-off run. I think he will contribute next season. Needs a good summer.
Belanger= Great start, poor second half. Will need give the Kings a reason to keep him around. He brings decent skills and wins a lot of face-offs. Will that be enough again?
Rosa= I'm not sure. How bad does he want it at this point? What can he do?
Kanko= Manchester. How overwhelming can he be?
Hogeboom-Manchester. Do you think he might be better than Kanko?



D-Men=
Norstrom= Best D-man Kings have. Totally Solid.
Visnovsky= Brightest Kings defenseman. He's got great quickness and hockey sense. He will never be a physical force.
Miller= Another really solid NHL defenseman. Although his puck skills arn't above average he can punish the opposition.
Grebshkov= We shall see. I like his patience and sense for the game. I think his skills are great too. I bet he gets a serious crack at the line-up next season.
Gleason= Really one of the most exciting Kings prospects. He's pretty good at both ends of the rink. He's got great offensive instincts and can really punish opponents.
Nathan Dempsey= He's NHL competent. He's got good skills and can contibute to the PP. He'll be here if Grebeshkov or Zizka or Gleason arn't ready.
Corvo= He's posted some nice numbers. I'm not sure if I want him around because I'm not sold on his game. Something about his skating and stick-handling bothers me.
Holland= Proved he can belong. He's not very good at anything but he can play because he's decent at everything.
Zizka= He looked good when he was called up. Pinches in a bit too much for my liking. He needs a good off season to prove he can play in the NHL if he wants to make it.
Modry= Hey I like him. You just need to use him right. He is a dangerous offensive player. He's got a great shot and is good a making nice long passes. His defense sometimes leaves a lot to be desired. He wants to be an excellent 5th defenseman.
Muir= Career Journeyman.
Rome= Won't make the team but needs to be signed. We've all heard good things.
Petiot= Haven't heard anything but good news. But I've also heard things about Jason Crain in the past.
Rullier= See Petiot

Goalies:
Cechmanek= He has the entire off season to get in to NHL shape physically and mentally. Needs to be able to skate and perform athletically at the NHL level. Can't lose focus during games even if he lets in a soft goal. Needs to be more determined. If by next year he hasn't shown any consistantcy the Kings need to look elsewhere.
Huet= Back-up for now. There's no bright future but he has improved hasnt' he?
Munce= I have no idea. Just know he was highly thought of last season.
Choinard= I heard he is a big kid who can play.
Marsters= Another big kid. I've never seen him play.
Zaba= Impressed with CC. Still years away.


I wouldn't sweat it. Kings had a decent year all things considered.

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Old
04-02-2004, 05:31 AM
  #14
GKJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Daleks
Deadmarsh/Allison/Cammalleri

Cammalleri is a scorer, but he needs size & grit on his line to be successful. And while Palffy obviously works well with these two guys (41 & 28), I don't see Cammalleri being NEARLY as successful with other linemates. Besides, Ziggy's needed on the other lines to "spread the wealth" of scoring.

they all have to get in the lineup first.

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Old
04-02-2004, 09:49 AM
  #15
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We really have some fans with blinders on or just maybe too many .
Palffy
Fro
Straka
Luc
Klatt
Army
Stumple
Avery
Lappy
Pirnes
Cowen
Barney
Camms
Brown (in2 years he'll be ranked higher)
Ebel
Carter (wishful thinking for some , the guy is just not good)
The rest are kids that won't be back Rosa or have yet to play an ahl game so I can't rank them.

DDDDD
Norstrom
Lubo
Gleason
Miller
Dempsey
Grebs
Holland
Modry
Corvo

Goalie
Chech
Huet ( if there is a work stopage he will play in France and we'll lose him)

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