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Prospal signs with Rangers for 1 year $1.1 million

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Old
08-16-2009, 06:23 PM
  #26
Gooch
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Originally Posted by GongShowHockeyNYR View Post
There have been rumors of him going to sign his 700k 1 year QO. He would be an RFA at end of the contract.
He'd be a very generous guy if he did that. I just wouldnt bank my cap hopes on that happening, it just seems very unlikely. Better to plan for what most likely will happen which would be he goes for his market value. I mean if he really was going to take so little why didnt he do it already?

I mean next summer if Letang isnt signed by then I am not going to cling to the belief that he is going to re-sign for 800k.. I am getting ready to be bent over with a 3ish mill dollar cap hit... and it's gonna hurt.

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08-16-2009, 06:45 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Dan Barr View Post
Agreed, but why would he rather play for the rags? Maybe he thinks he has a chance at playing center?
Torts.

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08-16-2009, 07:10 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
He'd be a very generous guy if he did that. I just wouldnt bank my cap hopes on that happening, it just seems very unlikely. Better to plan for what most likely will happen which would be he goes for his market value. I mean if he really was going to take so little why didnt he do it already?

I mean next summer if Letang isnt signed by then I am not going to cling to the belief that he is going to re-sign for 800k.. I am getting ready to be bent over with a 3ish mill dollar cap hit... and it's gonna hurt.
He has no choice. Either he signs the QO and get a good contract the following year or sit out the year. He didn't accept yet because they were trying to get a multi-year deal done. According to Brooks.

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08-16-2009, 07:19 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by GongShowHockeyNYR View Post
He has no choice. Either he signs the QO and get a good contract the following year or sit out the year. He didn't accept yet because they were trying to get a multi-year deal done. According to Brooks.
I'm guessing he's not eligible for arbitration?

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08-16-2009, 08:02 PM
  #30
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Meh, i'm still hoping we can get Tanguay even if it is a long shot at best thing.

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08-17-2009, 10:49 AM
  #31
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Meh is about right. He's a guy on the decline and does not play with a lot of fire anyway IMO. I don't think he'd fit Bylsma's system particularly well. Not that he'd be bad but I don't think he'd be a big impact player. I'd rather give one of the young guys a shot and then make a move at the deadline if we still have to.

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08-17-2009, 11:04 AM
  #32
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I don't get why people like to do moves at the deadline... you typically pay more for the same product at the deadline with less time to use it. I certainly don't want that to be the teams strategy to address needs in the future, not a good way to maximize assets.

As for Prospal, yeah he isnt as great as before but he typically works well every other year which bodes well for the rags. Looking at our current winger situation it looks a little silly to pass this up knowing that we're probably going to have a bottom 6 grinder in there instead of someone who can put the puck in.

If this deal never came shero's way then thats fine, cant blame him on that. Or if he has something else in the works, thats fine as well. But if he's comfortable with Dupuis being in our top 6... yet again then that is a problem especially with some quality FA's that are still out and likely cheap enough for us.

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08-17-2009, 11:09 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
I don't get why people like to do moves at the deadline... you typically pay more for the same product at the deadline with less time to use it. I certainly don't want that to be the teams strategy to address needs in the future, not a good way to maximize assets.
You make moves to correct weaknesses. At the deadline, you have a much better idea of what your weaknesses as a roster are.

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08-17-2009, 11:23 AM
  #34
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You make moves to correct weaknesses. At the deadline, you have a much better idea of what your weaknesses as a roster are.
Well and you pay twice as much to correct it and only get a benefit for a more limited amount of time, not to mention I think we all know what the weakness with the current roster is. You don't have to be a genius to realize there is a hole in the 2nd line wing spot.

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08-17-2009, 11:38 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
Well and you pay twice as much to correct it and only get a benefit for a more limited amount of time, not to mention I think we all know what the weakness with the current roster is. You don't have to be a genius to realize there is a hole in the 2nd line wing spot.
You don't fill holes just because you think they're there on paper, though. Perceived strengths and weaknesses on paper don't always turn out that way on the ice, so waiting to add a 'final piece' makes much more sense because it allows you to better gauge exactly what type of player that should be. At the deadline, the number of players available increases tenfold and you can find a player who better fits said hole. Waiting also allows the organization to see if the hole can be filled from within. I don't see why it matters how long they're here; that's a superficial way to judge value. All I care about is that they're here and contributing for the playoffs. That's when it matters, not in the middle of December against the Islanders.

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08-17-2009, 12:33 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Jeff Goldblum View Post
You don't fill holes just because you think they're there on paper, though. Perceived strengths and weaknesses on paper don't always turn out that way on the ice, so waiting to add a 'final piece' makes much more sense because it allows you to better gauge exactly what type of player that should be. At the deadline, the number of players available increases tenfold and you can find a player who better fits said hole. Waiting also allows the organization to see if the hole can be filled from within. I don't see why it matters how long they're here; that's a superficial way to judge value. All I care about is that they're here and contributing for the playoffs. That's when it matters, not in the middle of December against the Islanders.
Typically all thats available on the trade deadline is a rental player and you have to give up future assets to obtain that player usually. It is very hit and miss whether or not that move is even something beneficial for the club. For every Bill Guerin there more Derek Morris situations. Making that the team's strategy to address weaknesses is not a sound one and you're playing against the odds and paying at a premium because of the time period you chose to buy at.

That being said this isnt an on paper weakness... this is a well known weakness. This club SHOULD know how a line will perform with Pascal Dupuis in the top 6. I'd like to hope that they don't have delusions that he'll make an effective winger anymore. But from the looks of it if he is the guy on Malkin's line then we basically lost an effective even strength line to go into the season with. That is a fairly significant problem. The regular season is important, we cant always hope to go on crazy tears after we fire a coach to correct our regular season deficiencies. We need an actual top 6 winger OR they need to go with someone like Kennedy who at least has the possibility of upside.

Judging by their past actions though I think it is more likely we'll see #9 next to Malkin rather than #48. I'd rather not wait to pay more for a rental when it's obvious what the problem is now.

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08-17-2009, 01:07 PM
  #37
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Good point. I guess he's at the point in his career where he'd put that kind of stuff above winning, as he's won the Cup already.
Not that it really matters, but he's never won a Cup. He wasn't with the Lightning when they won, if that's what you're thinking of.

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08-17-2009, 01:58 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
Typically all thats available on the trade deadline is a rental player and you have to give up future assets to obtain that player usually. It is very hit and miss whether or not that move is even something beneficial for the club. For every Bill Guerin there more Derek Morris situations. Making that the team's strategy to address weaknesses is not a sound one and you're playing against the odds and paying at a premium because of the time period you chose to buy at.

That being said this isnt an on paper weakness... this is a well known weakness. This club SHOULD know how a line will perform with Pascal Dupuis in the top 6. I'd like to hope that they don't have delusions that he'll make an effective winger anymore. But from the looks of it if he is the guy on Malkin's line then we basically lost an effective even strength line to go into the season with. That is a fairly significant problem. The regular season is important, we cant always hope to go on crazy tears after we fire a coach to correct our regular season deficiencies. We need an actual top 6 winger OR they need to go with someone like Kennedy who at least has the possibility of upside.

Judging by their past actions though I think it is more likely we'll see #9 next to Malkin rather than #48. I'd rather not wait to pay more for a rental when it's obvious what the problem is now.
possibly -- but can we at least wait until it actually happens to start complaining about it?

besides, it's more than just saving up for the trade deadline. it's about having as much flexibility during the season as possible. you don't want to get stuck in the situation the caps were in last season -- have so many nagging injuries that you literally can't afford to call someone up to replace them, which is what happened on their blueline. by the time the deadline did roll around, they had little to no room to improve the team because of the injury bug.

even worse would be ending up like the flyers, where you're actually paying college kids off the street a per diem to round out a six-man defense corps at the end of the season.

unlikely scenarios? yes. but spending the entire chunk of remaining cap space on a guy like prospal (just as an example) doesn't make much sense to me.

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08-17-2009, 02:14 PM
  #39
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Not that it really matters, but he's never won a Cup. He wasn't with the Lightning when they won, if that's what you're thinking of.
Haha, you know, as I was typing that, I thought, "Maybe I should check and see if he was on that team... Nah." I take back what I said then.

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08-17-2009, 03:03 PM
  #40
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possibly -- but can we at least wait until it actually happens to start complaining about it?

besides, it's more than just saving up for the trade deadline. it's about having as much flexibility during the season as possible. you don't want to get stuck in the situation the caps were in last season -- have so many nagging injuries that you literally can't afford to call someone up to replace them, which is what happened on their blueline. by the time the deadline did roll around, they had little to no room to improve the team because of the injury bug.

even worse would be ending up like the flyers, where you're actually paying college kids off the street a per diem to round out a six-man defense corps at the end of the season.

unlikely scenarios? yes. but spending the entire chunk of remaining cap space on a guy like prospal (just as an example) doesn't make much sense to me.
The cap crunch also killed the Flames in April. Were banged up but didn't have any cap space to call up replacements. So they limped to the goal line, played their last weekend with only 15 skaters, lost their division title to Vancouver that weekend - and were eliminated in the 1st round by Chicago instead of finishing 3rd and getting St. Louis.

I say we hand out some invitations to training camp to some of the better remaining UFA wingers and decide in late September whether or not we still need to sign someone.

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08-17-2009, 04:52 PM
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Not a big Prospal fan. He's more playmaker than scorer, for one thing. Secondly, he's lost a few steps. Thirdly, he hasn't looked inspired for quite some time. Fourthly, I like the idea of having an opening roster spot for the kids to compete for. Lastly, I don't think Prospal is a better top-six candidate than Max Talbot at this point, and Max will be back at some point.

We have enough bodies. If we do anything, it should be a clear-cut upgrade.

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08-17-2009, 04:57 PM
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Does anyone here think Prospal is slower than Guerin?

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08-17-2009, 05:00 PM
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Does anyone here think Prospal is slower than Guerin?
Without question, he is. And he doesn't drive the net at all, which Guerin still does well. And Guerin also shoots a lot and has a very good shot.

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08-17-2009, 05:19 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
I don't get why people like to do moves at the deadline... you typically pay more for the same product at the deadline with less time to use it.

I'm not for it in all situations but this one I would be. I think we can do better with an acquisition is the long and short of it, and if that means we can only pay him for 30 games or whatever prior to the playoffs, then so be it. I also think in this particular case that Tangradi is going to be something special and so in that respect might warrant the ice time early on that would otherwise go to an OK player like Prospal.

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08-17-2009, 05:55 PM
  #45
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What would be nice is if we could just once go into the deadline being as good as we should be instead of doing our typical second half hot streak to make the playoffs. I mean we do it every year. It's getting a bit ridiculous.


06-07: We had that ridiculous streak of 20 games or whatever with a point.
07-08: Middling a bit then Conks gets red hot when Fleury is hurt and we rocket up the standings.
08-09: Suck even harder than we usually do in the first half, but somehow go on yet *another* great streak to get into the playoffs.


I'd like to think it won't happen again this year since we played so well under Bylsma, but even with this team looking stronger on paper right now(as in not post-deadline) than any of those teams were(08-09 would be stronger on paper with Hossa arguably, but as you all know Hossa wasn't on them to start the season)I am hoping we can start and stay strong enough to hold onto a top 5 seed for the whole year.

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08-17-2009, 06:40 PM
  #46
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I'm not for it in all situations but this one I would be. I think we can do better with an acquisition is the long and short of it, and if that means we can only pay him for 30 games or whatever prior to the playoffs, then so be it. I also think in this particular case that Tangradi is going to be something special and so in that respect might warrant the ice time early on that would otherwise go to an OK player like Prospal.
I'd much rather trade away Dupuis for late picks and just sign a guy like Bertuzzi etc without having to give up any assets rather than going into the deadline giving up some draft picks for a rental that will most likely wont do much at all for the team.

The odds are against us getting as good as a deal as the Guerin deal so we can't all be thinking that is how trade deadline moves are going to be. So basically why pay for something you can get for free now. Seems silly when we all know what the current hole/problem is before the season is even underway..

again this is moot if they in fact are going to go with Kennedy like I hope but man they always find a way to force Dupuis back into that top 6....

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08-17-2009, 09:09 PM
  #47
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I'd much rather trade away Dupuis for late picks and just sign a guy like Bertuzzi etc without having to give up any assets rather than going into the deadline giving up some draft picks for a rental that will most likely wont do much at all for the team.

The odds are against us getting as good as a deal as the Guerin deal so we can't all be thinking that is how trade deadline moves are going to be. So basically why pay for something you can get for free now. Seems silly when we all know what the current hole/problem is before the season is even underway..

again this is moot if they in fact are going to go with Kennedy like I hope but man they always find a way to force Dupuis back into that top 6....
Who are you talking to?

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08-17-2009, 09:20 PM
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Who are you talking to?
You mean other than the person I quoted? Or is this some petty attempt at an insult?

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08-17-2009, 09:23 PM
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I'd much rather trade away Dupuis for late picks and just sign a guy like Bertuzzi etc without having to give up any assets rather than going into the deadline giving up some draft picks for a rental that will most likely wont do much at all for the team.

The odds are against us getting as good as a deal as the Guerin deal so we can't all be thinking that is how trade deadline moves are going to be. So basically why pay for something you can get for free now. Seems silly when we all know what the current hole/problem is before the season is even underway..

again this is moot if they in fact are going to go with Kennedy like I hope but man they always find a way to force Dupuis back into that top 6....
I don't think it'll be Kennedy. I think it'll be one of the kids that'll get a shot at Malkin's line. At least until Talbot returns. Fedotenko will move to RW. If one of the kids (probably either Caputi or Tangradi) pans out, Dupuis will be fighting for fourth-line minutes with Rupp, Adams and Godard.

Kunitz-Crosby-Guerin
prospect-Malkin-Fedotenko
Cooke-Staal-Kennedy
Adams/Dupuis-Rupp-Godard/Adams

That is how I see the season starting, without Talbot. I don't believe we will need to make another deadline deal this coming season, since by then I would hope one of the kids will have made a leap forward. However, we never know what might occur.

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08-17-2009, 09:30 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I don't think it'll be Kennedy. I think it'll be one of the kids that'll get a shot at Malkin's line. At least until Talbot returns. Fedotenko will move to RW. If one of the kids (probably either Caputi or Tangradi) pans out, Dupuis will be fighting for fourth-line minutes with Rupp, Adams and Godard.

Kunitz-Crosby-Guerin
prospect-Malkin-Fedotenko
Cooke-Staal-Kennedy
Adams/Dupuis-Rupp-Godard/Adams

That is how I see the season starting, without Talbot. I don't believe we will need to make another deadline deal this coming season, since by then I would hope one of the kids will have made a leap forward. However, we never know what might occur.
I'd like to see it happen your way. Though I think Kennedy could perform in that spot. There are many times he just showed he had a ton of talent that was not being put to full use. He's easily a 20 goal scorer if he can get some more minutes.

I wish we could do a Vcash bet on who the 2nd line mystery winger is going to be. I'd bet my wad that they'll have Dupuis there, they just always seem to think he belongs in the top 6. He just keeps sneaking back in.

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