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Canucks Officially Sign Mathieu Schneider

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Old
08-26-2009, 09:20 AM
  #201
nibbles
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I'm not sure why everyone seems to have hot dog pencilled in as a #5/6 defenseman with O'brien..

If he isn't top 4, I have no idea why we even signed him.

Putting him with O'brutal is like putting Kovalchuk with Hordichuk and Johson.. what's the point?

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08-26-2009, 09:23 AM
  #202
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Because he is old, slow and sucks at defence.

Edler, Bieksa, Mitchell, and Salo are all better. We signed Schneider because we needed a #5 guy who could preferably play the PP.

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08-26-2009, 09:29 AM
  #203
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Blind opinions.. Wait till you see what hot dog can do..

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08-26-2009, 10:24 AM
  #204
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Blind opinions.. Wait till you see what hot dog can do..
I've seen what "hot dog" can do - actually have followed him since the start of his career, and he's just not the same defender he used to be in his early 30s... he's slowed down a lot now as expected at his age... and Salo, Mitchell, Bieksa and Edler are all better defenders.

Schneider is a solid PPQB and that's the role he will play... but those 4 will all get more minutes - especially since Schneider is now 41 YO and shouldn't be expected to play 20+ minutes - every one of those top 4 guys here will play 20+ mins, like they have in the past.

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08-26-2009, 10:33 AM
  #205
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
I've seen what "hot dog" can do - actually have followed him since the start of his career, and he's just not the same defender he used to be in his early 30s... he's slowed down a lot now as expected at his age... and Salo, Mitchell, Bieksa and Edler are all better defenders.

Schneider is a solid PPQB and that's the role he will play... but those 4 will all get more minutes - especially since Schneider is now 41 YO and shouldn't be expected to play 20+ minutes - every one of those top 4 guys here will play 20+ mins, like they have in the past.
This.
We know that Schneids averaged 20:56 of ice time with the Habs last year, but he isn't competing with Gorges, Bouillion and O'Byrne for icetime out here...
He will be on the 1st PP unit and the third pairing at even strength.

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08-26-2009, 11:24 AM
  #206
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right

the only stat that matters with regards to what pairing a guy is on is icetime

Likely Schneider will be behind Salo, Mitchell, Bieksa and Edler; that makes him by definition a #5. PP time is an added bonus that will push up his minutes and make this all the more valuable a signing, if the reported $1.5M is accurate.

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08-26-2009, 11:32 AM
  #207
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
I've seen what "hot dog" can do - actually have followed him since the start of his career, and he's just not the same defender he used to be in his early 30s... he's slowed down a lot now as expected at his age... and Salo, Mitchell, Bieksa and Edler are all better defenders.

Schneider is a solid PPQB and that's the role he will play... but those 4 will all get more minutes - especially since Schneider is now 41 YO and shouldn't be expected to play 20+ minutes - every one of those top 4 guys here will play 20+ mins, like they have in the past.
I'd agree.

Schneider was fantastic in his role in Montreal prior to his injury, which was caused (as you said) by the fact you're playing a 40 year old guy ~20 minutes per game.

If we're able to limit Schneider to softer even strength minutes, and loads of PP time (say 15-18 minutes per game) I don't see it as totally ridiculous to expect him to play 70+ games next year.

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08-26-2009, 11:38 AM
  #208
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I don't see it as totally ridiculous to expect him to play 70+ games next year.
He hasn't played a full season in eons.

I guess that Vancouver's defence has such an injury free history recently, it isn't "totally ridiculous to expect him to play 70 games"

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08-26-2009, 11:44 AM
  #209
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I'd agree.

Schneider was fantastic in his role in Montreal prior to his injury, which was caused (as you said) by the fact you're playing a 40 year old guy ~20 minutes per game.

If we're able to limit Schneider to softer even strength minutes, and loads of PP time (say 15-18 minutes per game) I don't see it as totally ridiculous to expect him to play 70+ games next year.
Come to think of it, will we be able to give Schneider easy even strength minutes? Is Kevin Bieksa better in his own end than Schneider? I'd say they're pretty close.

When you look at our defense with Schneider we have 4 guy's that can be an adventure in their own end in O'Brien, Bieksa, Schneider and Edler. It might make some sense to bring in an accomplished defensive defenseman to replace O'Brien if one can be found at the right price.

Are the Canucks top 6 blueliners good enough defensively? Could they stop the Hawks in a 7 game series?

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08-26-2009, 11:51 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Drop the Sopel View Post
Come to think of it, will we be able to give Schneider easy even strength minutes? Is Kevin Bieksa better in his own end than Schneider? I'd say they're pretty close.

When you look at our defense with Schneider we have 4 guy's that can be an adventure in their own end in O'Brien, Bieksa, Schneider and Edler. It might make some sense to bring in an accomplished defensive defenseman to replace O'Brien if one can be found at the right price.

Are the Canucks top 6 blueliners good enough defensively? Could they stop the Hawks in a 7 game series?
Edler and O'Brien quite simply have to improve in that regard.

I think it's established that Bieksa will always be somewhat unreliable in his own zone, though it has to be said he has played admirably on the shutdown pairing with Mitchell for significant stretches. Like I was saying, even if you assume Schneider and Bieksa are roughly comparable defensively you just have to give the ice time to Bieksa based on age, and likelihood of injury.

I think we have the players to give Schneider fairly sheltered even strength minutes. I mentioned in another thread, but that place we're really going to miss Ohlund is on the PK as he was a regular there along with Mitchell last season. Somebody has to step up and help Salo and Mitchell with the penalty killing side of the game.

Schneider will fill Ohlund's PP time (and then some), but we need one of the younger guys to improve their penalty killing.

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08-26-2009, 11:52 AM
  #211
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
I've seen what "hot dog" can do - actually have followed him since the start of his career, and he's just not the same defender he used to be in his early 30s... he's slowed down a lot now as expected at his age... and Salo, Mitchell, Bieksa and Edler are all better defenders.

Schneider is a solid PPQB and that's the role he will play... but those 4 will all get more minutes - especially since Schneider is now 41 YO and shouldn't be expected to play 20+ minutes - every one of those top 4 guys here will play 20+ mins, like they have in the past.
Hmmm.

I agree completely with your first paragraph.

As for your second paragraph, calling Schneider a PPQB is a misnomer, imo. Following M. Schneider since he broke into the league as a Canadien, I've always seen him as more of a shooter on the PP.

I think if people are expecting him to predominantly a distributor on the PP are sadly mistaken. He is a shooter.

We have four cannons on the point and no one to load guns.

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08-26-2009, 11:57 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by nibbles View Post
I'm not sure why everyone seems to have hot dog pencilled in as a #5/6 defenseman with O'brien..

If he isn't top 4, I have no idea why we even signed him.

Putting him with O'brutal is like putting Kovalchuk with Hordichuk and Johson.. what's the point?
Yeeaahh.. I'm pretty sure defensive pairings don't work that way.

They go top-to-bottom from defensive/all-around ability, and aren't better utilized when their paired with similarly offensive defensemen. And it's not like the bottom pairings always play with the bottom lines and the top pairings always play with the top lines or anything. Schneider isn't really a top 4 defensemen anymore, although he does still put up points.

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08-26-2009, 11:58 AM
  #213
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
We have four cannons on the point and no one to load guns.
Edler, Salo and Bieksa are all good passers. Not powerplay quarterbacks, but they are capable. Plus we have the Sedins, Demitra, and Wellwood upfront who are all great passers.

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08-26-2009, 12:01 PM
  #214
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Edler, Salo and Bieksa are all good passers. Not powerplay quarterbacks, but they are capable. Plus we have the Sedins, Demitra, and Wellwood upfront who are all great passers.
Awesome, we should have a ****ing sweet powerplay then, judging by your optimism.

Top 6 in the NHL?

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08-26-2009, 12:02 PM
  #215
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Edler, Salo and Bieksa are all good passers. Not powerplay quarterbacks, but they are capable. Plus we have the Sedins, Demitra, and Wellwood upfront who are all great passers.
Yeah...but the point was that Schnieder isn't a PPQB as nifto was alleging to. I think that is a correct analysis.

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08-26-2009, 12:23 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
Awesome, we should have a ****ing sweet powerplay then, judging by your optimism.

Top 6 in the NHL?
I don't know about top 6, but I think we have the talent to be in the top 10... they were very inconsistent last year (finishing 17th in the league), but were the 3rd best PP in the playoffs last year.

I think Samuelsson will help out there, and if Schneider is signed, he'll be a good addition to the PP as well... I don't think top 10 is out of reach for this team next year.

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08-26-2009, 12:41 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
Hmmm.

I agree completely with your first paragraph.

As for your second paragraph, calling Schneider a PPQB is a misnomer, imo. Following M. Schneider since he broke into the league as a Canadien, I've always seen him as more of a shooter on the PP.

I think if people are expecting him to predominantly a distributor on the PP are sadly mistaken. He is a shooter.

We have four cannons on the point and no one to load guns.
No one to load guns?

The Sedins are both pass 1st players and they're constantly looking to feed the pointmen. Wellwood and Demitra as well will look to get the puck to Schneider.

Having 2 RH shots in Bieksa and Salo and 2 LH shots in Edler and Schneider give the Canucks 4 good shooting options from the backend. Edler, Salo and Schneider give the team 3 guy's that can shoot the puck as well as any blueliners in the league, save Souray.

Add in a couple more guy's that can shoot the puck in Samuelsson and Hodgson and we've got a much better collection of shooters than I've seen in a very long time. We now have the triggermen to compliment the playmakers.

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08-26-2009, 12:50 PM
  #218
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle1264463/

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On defence, the Canucks lost stalwart Mattias Ohlund to the Tampa Bay Lightning in free agency, while signing Aaron Rome, who played eight games for the Columbus Blue Jackets last season. Should the team arrive at terms with Schneider, Gillis said he would feel comfortable with the teamís depth on the blueline.
There you have it. MS was right, if Schneider is signed, that should be it. Sounds like the team is also confident that Rome will get the 7th spot as well.

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08-26-2009, 12:52 PM
  #219
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Originally Posted by vancityluongo View Post
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...rticle1264463/



There you have it. MS was right, if Schneider is signed, that should be it. Sounds like the team is also confident that Rome will get the 7th spot as well.
Rome must be better then we think.

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08-26-2009, 01:08 PM
  #220
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Rome must be better then we think.
No kidding. I was hoping that another one of the "veteran players" Gillis alluded to would be a defenseman.

Looks like we could also probably put a rest to the "rumours" of moving Hansen/Raymond/Grabner/etc. for a Cody Franson type. For now.

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08-26-2009, 01:36 PM
  #221
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No kidding. I was hoping that another one of the "veteran players" Gillis alluded to would be a defenseman.

Looks like we could also probably put a rest to the "rumours" of moving Hansen/Raymond/Grabner/etc. for a Cody Franson type. For now.
Not necessarily. Being satisfied simply means another move doesn't need to happen. It doesn't mean another move won't happen.

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08-26-2009, 01:40 PM
  #222
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Not necessarily. Being satisfied simply means another move doesn't need to happen. It doesn't mean another move won't happen.
Well, of course injuries could happen and then hopefully Gillis would act accordingly. I guess you might be right, but while a move doesn't need to happen, I think it should. (something like Raymond for a young defenseman, probably a guy that would be in the AHL this year, and can be called up)..

However, it does likely mean (IMO) that there won't be any defenseman equivalent of a Scatchard at camp, which I would've also liked.

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08-26-2009, 01:43 PM
  #223
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No one to load guns?

The Sedins are both pass 1st players and they're constantly looking to feed the pointmen. Wellwood and Demitra as well will look to get the puck to Schneider.

Having 2 RH shots in Bieksa and Salo and 2 LH shots in Edler and Schneider give the Canucks 4 good shooting options from the backend. Edler, Salo and Schneider give the team 3 guy's that can shoot the puck as well as any blueliners in the league, save Souray.

Add in a couple more guy's that can shoot the puck in Samuelsson and Hodgson and we've got a much better collection of shooters than I've seen in a very long time. We now have the triggermen to compliment the playmakers.
Another optimist , even more so than the last guy.

Judging by this post you think the Canucks should be a top 5 pp?

Lots of optimism. I like that.

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08-26-2009, 01:51 PM
  #224
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Holy crap, I just checked out his stats and in his 1 million NHL seasons, he's never played a full 82 game schedule

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08-26-2009, 01:53 PM
  #225
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
Hmmm.

I agree completely with your first paragraph.

As for your second paragraph, calling Schneider a PPQB is a misnomer, imo. Following M. Schneider since he broke into the league as a Canadien, I've always seen him as more of a shooter on the PP.

I think if people are expecting him to predominantly a distributor on the PP are sadly mistaken. He is a shooter.

We have four cannons on the point and no one to load guns.
I expect the twins will continue to be the QBs on the first unit and we'll see who steps up to QB the second unit.

While Schneider may be a shooter and not a classical puck distributor the reason he has been successful as a shooter is because he knows when to take the shot, how to open up the passing lane so he can get the opportunity to take that shot, he knows when to dish the puck, and he knows how to get a shot through by changing the angle that tiny little bit. Those are 4 things....4 things that Edler and Bieksa need to learn something about.

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