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Confirmed w/ link: Ehrhoff/Lukowich to VAN for P. White/D. Rahimi

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08-28-2009, 05:49 PM
  #276
Winky
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Yawn ... big yawn.

None of you can make any statement regarding how this team stacks up against last years team ... not until the season plays out.

Sure it was a crappy trade (since DW most likely could have gotten better deals from other teams), but we did need to shed salary. Furthermore, we all know talent has not been an issue with our team, its been heart. Losing Ehrhoff sucks, but if it means we can add better players on our bottom 6 (and by better I don't necessarily mean talent-wise), then its most definitely worth it.

A 2nd rounder, Rahimi, and ~4.5 million freed up isn't as bad as many here are making it out to be. It isn't great, but it isn't the end of the world.

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08-28-2009, 05:51 PM
  #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winky View Post
Yawn ... big yawn.

None of you can make any statement regarding how this team stacks up against last years team ... not until the season plays out.

Sure it was a crappy trade (since DW most likely could have gotten better deals from other teams), but we did need to shed salary. Furthermore, we all know talent has not been an issue with our team, its been heart. Losing Ehrhoff sucks, but if it means we can add better players on our bottom 6 (and by better I don't necessarily mean talent-wise), then its most definitely worth it.

A 2nd rounder, Rahimi, and ~4.5 million freed up isn't as bad as many here are making it out to be. It isn't great, but it isn't the end of the world.
Nothing in hockey is the end of the world. It's entertainment.

As far as Hockey goes, this is a worst-case scenario. Doug Wilson got taken to the cleaners. We all know it, he knows it, and there is no debate about it.

No GM worth his salt would ever allow a trade like this, ever.

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08-28-2009, 05:56 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
Nothing in hockey is the end of the world. It's entertainment.

As far as Hockey goes, this is a worst-case scenario. Doug Wilson got taken to the cleaners. We all know it, he knows it, and there is no debate about it.

No GM worth his salt would ever allow a trade like this, ever.
Worst-case scenario? Alright, believe whatever you want to. But that is a ridiculous, overly-dramatic statement.

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08-28-2009, 05:58 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post
Nothing in hockey is the end of the world. It's entertainment.

As far as Hockey goes, this is a worst-case scenario. Doug Wilson got taken to the cleaners. We all know it, he knows it, and there is no debate about it.

No GM worth his salt would ever allow a trade like this, ever.
Not even close to a worst case scenario. You act as if we lost a franchise player for a bag of pucks.

The Owen Nolan -> Alyn McCauley trade was worse than this one, easily.

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08-28-2009, 06:06 PM
  #280
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Originally Posted by DrFeelgood View Post
The Owen Nolan -> Alyn McCauley trade was worse than this one, easily.
No it wasn't. The Nolan trade was Owen Nolan for Alyn McCauley, Brad Boyes, and Toronto's 1st round pick in the 2003 NHL Entry Draft (which the Sharks used to move up to take Steve Bernier, but which they also could have used to take Getzlaf).

If the Sharks had a better scouting department and less stupid GM, that trade would have been Owen Nolan for McCauley, Boyes (40+ goals), and Getzlaf. How is that worse than today's trade by any stretch of the imagination???

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08-28-2009, 06:10 PM
  #281
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
No it wasn't. The Nolan trade was Owen Nolan for Alyn McCauley, Brad Boyes, and Toronto's 1st round pick in the 2003 NHL Entry Draft (which the Sharks used to move up to take Steve Bernier, but which they also could have used to take Getzlaf).

If the Sharks had a better scouting department and less stupid GM, that trade would have been Owen Nolan for McCauley, Boyes (40+ goals), and Getzlaf. How is that worse than today's trade by any stretch of the imagination???
I forgot about the Boyes part, even though he never did see a game in teal. Bernier hasn't turned out to be much either, other than a few nice looking goals and Rivet for 2 years.

From that trade, all that resonates with me was McCauley being hurt constantly and us trading away the face of our franchise (at that time) for a bag of pucks. Even retrospect hasn't changed that trade a whole lot for us, considering none of the guys that came our way in that trade did anything for us, or are even with us anymore.

If we had gotten Getzlaf and kept Boyes, that trade would have been fantastic. But alas, as you said, we had a stupid GM and sub-par scouts.

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08-28-2009, 06:10 PM
  #282
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I just read through this whole thread hoping somebody would be able to explain the trade. Nobody did. Canucks are laughing all the way to the bank. I think there's a good probability the Sharks wind up playing Vancouver in the playoffs... now we've made them stronger.

I understand the need to dump salary. Actually, I am glad it was Ehrhoff, not Murray, who was dealt. I think Murray brings something to the table that the team needs, more so than Ehrhoff.

But as other have stated...

1) Why couldn't DW get a better return? Ehrhoff + Lukowich has to net you more than a compensatory 2nd and marginal prospects. I would think Ehrhoff alone would be worth a 1st. Reasonable salary for two more years.

2) Someone else also posted this... I am doubtful of the decision to retain Rob Blake. I am sort of down on Blake, but even so, I realize that Blake from last season > Christian Ehrhoff from last season. This upcoming season though, I expect Blake to decline even more (play + injuries). I think they'll be much closer in abilities/usefulness this year, and Ehrhoff is still $400K cheaper.

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08-28-2009, 06:10 PM
  #283
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
No it wasn't. The Nolan trade was Owen Nolan for Alyn McCauley, Brad Boyes, and Toronto's 1st round pick in the 2003 NHL Entry Draft (which the Sharks used to move up to take Steve Bernier, but which they also could have used to take Getzlaf).

If the Sharks had a better scouting department and less stupid GM, that trade would have been Owen Nolan for McCauley, Boyes (40+ goals), and Getzlaf. How is that worse than today's trade by any stretch of the imagination???
would have actually been a great move assuming we kept Boyes and Getzlaf, knowing DW....we wouldnt errrrr dont

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08-28-2009, 06:11 PM
  #284
Ninja Hertl
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The overly irrational posters from the Heatley talks have come out of the woodwork again, yay!

Patience, young grasshoppers. One trade does not a team make.

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08-28-2009, 06:13 PM
  #285
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
The overly irrational posters from the Heatley talks have come out of the woodwork again, yay!

Patience, young grasshoppers. One trade does not a team make.
But one trade a team can ruin.

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08-28-2009, 06:23 PM
  #286
Ninja Hertl
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
But one trade a team can ruin.
Yeah, let's write off our season and trade everyone for draft picks. This sport is very predictable and we will be lucky to get past the first round, so we should just look forward to next offseason.

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08-28-2009, 06:25 PM
  #287
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
The overly irrational posters from the Heatley talks have come out of the woodwork again, yay!

Patience, young grasshoppers. One trade does not a team make.
Please layout a scenario where giving up Ehrhoff for nothing makes sense. Seriously.

Heatley? Nope, don't even want him in the first place, still doesn't preclude us from getting a better return.

Kessel? Nope... We still have to dump two forward anyway to make a top 6 spot. Plus, we still could have gotten a better return.

Sharp? See above.

There is absolutely no future trade that is going to make not atleast getting a decent draft pick for Ehrhoff palatable. It was dumb.

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08-28-2009, 06:33 PM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garbage_goal View Post
I just read through this whole thread hoping somebody would be able to explain the trade. Nobody did. Canucks are laughing all the way to the bank. I think there's a good probability the Sharks wind up playing Vancouver in the playoffs... now we've made them stronger.

I understand the need to dump salary. Actually, I am glad it was Ehrhoff, not Murray, who was dealt. I think Murray brings something to the table that the team needs, more so than Ehrhoff.

But as other have stated...

1) Why couldn't DW get a better return? Ehrhoff + Lukowich has to net you more than a compensatory 2nd and marginal prospects. I would think Ehrhoff alone would be worth a 1st. Reasonable salary for two more years.

There's a lot of teams up against the cap. Adding in error would be nice and helpful but how many of them would want to give up top notch players for error. This move gives young guys a chance to play while shedding salary. Now my biggest question is why dw didn't just trade error for draft picks but I don't feel this trade was something that dw should be fired over. I think this trade means that cheechoo will be a shark and I'm thinking dw likes the idea off cheechoo staying on the team.

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08-28-2009, 06:35 PM
  #289
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
Yeah, let's write off our season and trade everyone for draft picks. This sport is very predictable and we will be lucky to get past the first round, so we should just look forward to next offseason.
I'm not saying this one trade is going to ruin the Sharks, but you're underestimating the importance of individual trades. Yes, this trade does not make the Sharks, but it does make the Sharks a whole lot worse than they were before. You do not trade away a top-4 defenseman for essentially nothing without it impacting a team. Especially when that defenseman was arguably your best player in the playoffs.

I think way too many on this board underestimate the value of role-players and focus on the just the "stars" on a team. And even more completely ignore the salary cap implications. Look at it this way:

- The signing of Huskins essentially cost the Sharks Lukowich.
- The signing of Blake has cost the Sharks Ehrhoff.
- Blake is already somewhat injury prone, and I will be shocked if he's able to play top 4 minutes next year, and somewhat surprised if he can play top 4 minutes all of this year.
- If Blake retires next year the Sharks will have only Boyle, Vlasic, Murray, and Huskins under contract. That means they will essentially need 2 Top-4 defensemen.
- As of right now they have $33.6 mil in cap space committed to next year, but they also need to re-sign (or possibly replace) Marleau, Nabby, Setoguchi, Pavelski, Joslin, Moore, and Blake at a minimum. And that ignores the lower-tier guys like Nichol, Ortmeyer, etc. If the cap drops to $54 or $53 mil, that's barely $20 million to acquire or re-sign 3 top-6 forwards, 2 top-4 defensemen, and a #1 goalie. And fill out a roster with space for injury call-ups.

Trading Ehrhoff makes it easier cap-wise this year, but it's very likely they won't find another top-4 defenseman at his price. Either this year or next.

Add in all the other stupid moves DW has made, and while this specific trade hasn't ruined the Sharks, it's yet another step along the road to ruin that DW has had the team on for several years now.

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08-28-2009, 06:36 PM
  #290
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Was worried when Ehrhoff's name kept coming up in our off-season discussions, and now my worst fears have been realized. Didn't want him traded away regardless, but to ship him out for next to nothing is downright embarrassing.

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08-28-2009, 06:36 PM
  #291
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God damn it, I spend one ****ing day away from the computer, and I come back to this ********. Great idea, trade one of the few players who steps up in the playoffs for prospects who will never play in the NHL. You know what would have been a better way to save 3.5 mil? Don't sign ****ing Rob Blake. Jesus Christ, there's no way Ehrhoff couldn't have pulled in a better prospect or pick than this! I'm wondering if Wilson actually knows what it takes to win in the playoffs, because this teams post-season chances just got worse imo, and even if we can get a new 4 mil forward it's not gonna help. Vlasic better ****ing learn to not suck balls in the post-season this year. ****, now I need a new season avatar too. ****!

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08-28-2009, 06:40 PM
  #292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post

- The signing of Huskins essentially cost the Sharks Lukowich.
- The signing of Blake has cost the Sharks Ehrhoff.
- Blake is already somewhat injury prone, and I will be shocked if he's able to play top 4 minutes next year, and somewhat surprised if he can play top 4 minutes all of this year.
- If Blake retires next year the Sharks will have only Boyle, Vlasic, Murray, and Huskins under contract. That means they will essentially need 2 Top-4 defensemen.
It's nice to know that this makes the team worse in both the short AND long term

Seriously does anyone think Blake is more valuable than Ehrhoff? Or Huskins more than Lukowich for that matter...

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08-28-2009, 06:40 PM
  #293
Vaasa
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Originally Posted by yadadaimhollaing View Post
There's a lot of teams up against the cap. Adding in error would be nice and helpful but how many of them would want to give up top notch players for error. This move gives young guys a chance to play while shedding salary. Now my biggest question is why dw didn't just trade error for draft picks but I don't feel this trade was something that dw should be fired over. I think this trade means that cheechoo will be a shark and I'm thinking dw likes the idea off cheechoo staying on the team.
Who said top-notch players. Even just "good" prospects would be an improvement over what DW got. Draft picks would also have been good. There are other teams that were nowhere near the cap who could have used Ehrhoff. Colorado, Columbus, Nashville (who have wealth of defensive prospects we could have used), and Florida just off the top of my head.

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08-28-2009, 06:49 PM
  #294
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
Who said top-notch players. Even just "good" prospects would be an improvement over what DW got. Draft picks would also have been good. There are other teams that were nowhere near the cap who could have used Ehrhoff. Colorado, Columbus, Nashville (who have wealth of defensive prospects we could have used), and Florida just off the top of my head.
To add to that, if we make the playoffs, there's a fair chance we play Vancouver...


We would've been better off if we just waived both Error and Luko. At least then they wouldn't have gone to a contender.

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08-28-2009, 06:57 PM
  #295
TheGooooch
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I am mad because of this trade.......and drunk and I have a canker sore that I keep poking with my tongue but that isn't helping it

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08-28-2009, 06:58 PM
  #296
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This move is a salary dump and gets rid of the most inconsistent Sharks Defenseman of all time. I like it.

Not too happy about losing Lukowich though.

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Old
08-28-2009, 06:58 PM
  #297
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Seriously does anyone think Blake is more valuable than Ehrhoff? Or Huskins more than Lukowich for that matter...
For strictly this year, I would say yes on both.

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08-28-2009, 06:59 PM
  #298
DrFeelgood
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I am mad because of this trade.......and drunk and I have a canker sore that I keep poking with my tongue but that isn't helping it
Dig at it with a toothpick, that will do the job.

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08-28-2009, 07:01 PM
  #299
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I am mad because of this trade.......and drunk and I have a canker sore that I keep poking with my tongue but that isn't helping it
Go punch DW in the face. Might make you feel better.

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08-28-2009, 07:03 PM
  #300
Vaasa
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Ehrhoff conference call from the Canucks board, if anyone is interested:

http://canucks.nhl.com/club/podcastp...=114&iid=15028

Also nice for him that he can now walk to the Olympics when he plays for Germany.

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