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Derick Brassard Signs 4 Year Extension

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Old
09-04-2009, 02:17 PM
  #51
TaketheCannoli
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Heard of the signing on 97.1 as I was headed to work. Got the numbers here.

That's about 1.3m/yr lower than my fears. Happy viqsi is happy and is doing the Happy Viqsi Dance.

Oh hon, you're already too happy. This will make you unbearable!

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09-04-2009, 02:26 PM
  #52
pete goegan
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Originally Posted by Bugg View Post
I worry more about a likely Filatov-Vermette-Voracek line. If Voracek doesn't improve from last season and Filatov (what I considered flashes of brilliance) doesn't live up to expectation, then that could mean that Vermette struggles too, and that would mean a non-threatening second line. Of course, Voracek could be eschewed in favor of RJ, so I'm still not really that worried that this either.
Much too early to worry about that, Bugg. The only way that rolls out as the second line at the start of the season is if Nikita hits the ice in two weeks looking like Gretzky in his prime! You might see it in a few months - hopefully because of player development and not injuries - but I don't see any other way that Hitch would do that without letting Filatov prove himself lower in the lineup. I'd guess RJ gets first call on that line with Jake and Vermette (and I have no problem with that trio, at all!).

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Old
09-04-2009, 02:28 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by BluejacketNut View Post
I dont think anyone would argue his skill, but my biggest concern is he's yet to play a full season of professional hockey. If he can hold up, we'll be good, but it could be pretty pricey if he only averages 40 hockey games a season.
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Originally Posted by Ar-too View Post
I don't ever like paying a guy for what you hope he'll do. I prefer some combination of paying a guy for his accomplishments and realistic potential continued contribution.
It is the way of the 'new NHL'. In cases like Brassard, where everything is all in on how good they think he can be, they do it. It is a way to manage that 2nd contract without getting killed on it and then getting killed again on the 3rd. It is just the way it works now.

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Flashes of promise do not constitute accomplishments for me. And when a guy has consistently had problems with his shoulders, that's even more troubling.
25 points in 31 games is more than 'flashes of promise'...come on...he has been an elite player his whole life. It isn't like Manny's flashes of brilliance for those dozen or so games.

Sure, it is a gamble, but aren't all signings a gamble? Anyone can get hurt at any given time, it is just reality. Brassard's other shoulder was repaired and is stronger than before. Now both shoulders are fixed. The guy had floppy shoulder sockets but they are all tightened up now. If he reinjures them, that's life as a hockey player.

This isn't an outrageous contract that will debilitate the franchise from future signings and moves. It is a mild gamble. Big deal.

As far as Modin is concerned: Who knew? He was a 20+ scorer, a veteran and a winner. It was a good contract at the time, but unfortunately it didn't work out great for us. When he has played, though, he has helped.

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Old
09-04-2009, 02:40 PM
  #54
CBJSprague24
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Crossbar Ping- I would think 62-75 wouldn't be out of the question for a full season.

Anybody know what pace he was on last year with 25 in 31 games?

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Old
09-04-2009, 02:49 PM
  #55
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Every contract matters. The one-way contracts matter more than the two-way ones and in another thread, you're arguing about the need for another defenseman. The only apparent reason we haven't signed another bona-fide defenseman is money. If not for Chimera's contract (a player everyone seems to think is superfluous at this point), we could almost certainly do whatever we want, to some extent, to address that hole.

My point is this: Any contract can become debilitating. There's no doubt that Adam Foote's contract was a bigger problem to this franchise when he was still here than Chimera's is now.

At the end of the day, I guess my major quibble is worth the word "mild". I think it's a significant gamble.

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Old
09-04-2009, 02:53 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by CBJSprague24 View Post
Anybody know what pace he was on last year with 25 in 31 games?
That'd be about 66 points in 82 games.

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:01 PM
  #57
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I like it. A lot. But I'm shocked. Does anyone else think that perhaps SH is being slick, since he's negotiating with Vermette? Setting the bar slightly lower proactively? Just a thought, and I consider it a fairly low-risk, potentially huge reward move.

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:06 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ar-too View Post
Every contract matters. The one-way contracts matter more than the two-way ones and in another thread, you're arguing about the need for another defenseman. The only apparent reason we haven't signed another bona-fide defenseman is money. If not for Chimera's contract (a player everyone seems to think is superfluous at this point), we could almost certainly do whatever we want, to some extent, to address that hole.

My point is this: Any contract can become debilitating. There's no doubt that Adam Foote's contract was a bigger problem to this franchise when he was still here than Chimera's is now.

At the end of the day, I guess my major quibble is worth the word "mild". I think it's a significant gamble.
You can make the argument about EVERY contract. Without 'x's contract, we could sign _________. This is a gamble on a player who scored 25 points in 31 games and has shown nothing but upside as a player. He is young, eager and willing to do what it takes in a position where we are desperatly in need of a guy of his calibre.

I guess Howson could have let it go all season and then when he scored 80 points and we have to give him 5 million bucks you would have felt better?

How about when Howson has to sign Russell, Dorsett, Boll...and then Voracek, Filatov and Mason? This isn't all about Brassard, it is about fitting all our youth into our future.

This is a mild gamble and a gamble worth taking.

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09-04-2009, 03:06 PM
  #59
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Risky.

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:12 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by JF Omalycat View Post
Risky.
Quite frankly, I like that Howson is being perceived as a risk taker or a gambler with this signing. People seem to see him as a guy who doesn't have the brass to pull off any big deals, but so far, he has shown a willingness to make moves that he deems helpful for the team.

What GM has ALL his moves work out all the time? This is a calculated risk and I agree with it.

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:37 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hashmarks View Post
You can make the argument about EVERY contract. Without 'x's contract, we could sign _________. This is a gamble on a player who scored 25 points in 31 games and has shown nothing but upside as a player. He is young, eager and willing to do what it takes in a position where we are desperatly in need of a guy of his calibre.

I guess Howson could have let it go all season and then when he scored 80 points and we have to give him 5 million bucks you would have felt better?

How about when Howson has to sign Russell, Dorsett, Boll...and then Voracek, Filatov and Mason? This isn't all about Brassard, it is about fitting all our youth into our future.

This is a mild gamble and a gamble worth taking.
I agree with you on most of this. But still... 48 games.

Put it this way, all things being equal and the CBA notwithstanding; if this was a UFA with Brassard's injury history and stats, would you be okay with Howson signing him to this contract?

EDIT: I understand that the CBA precipitated this contract to some extent and it's smart in that regard, but still...


Last edited by Ar-too: 09-04-2009 at 03:39 PM. Reason: something occured to me
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Old
09-04-2009, 03:37 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by JF Omalycat View Post
Risky.
Is it not risky to wait till next year? He could put up 70-80 points and ask for a $5m cap hit. Is that not risky?

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:39 PM
  #63
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This is a great move.

Would you rather pay for the past on a player on the decline or pay for the future for a player on the rise?

Yeah, Adam Foote was a 4 million dollar player.... sure. You see vets all the time getting huge dollars for their past years, when nature takes its toll. Heck look at Freddy for a quick example.

Brassard will be a player. He is hungry and incredibly skilled. This will be one of the best deals in the NHL and we may find that out by December.

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:41 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDriesenUD View Post
Is it not risky to wait till next year? He could put up 70-80 points and ask for a $5m cap hit. Is that not risky?
If that happened, then at least we'd know he's worth it.

By the same token (and I think this is just as likely), what if he plays 26 games this year, injures his shoulder and doesn't play again?

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:45 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Bugg View Post
An annual cap hit of 3.2 is not bad at all. Modin coming off the books next year already pays his contract.

His injuries don't worry me too horribly much. Hopefully he has learned not to fight, and it's hard to sustain getting an injury like that by just getting hit, as the arm has to be in a certain position moving in a certain direction.

I also don't think he merely displayed "flashes" of brilliance. For nearly half the season, until he was injured that is, Brassard was leading Nash in points. Of course anything could have happened with his play the latter half, but I think this is a win.

I worry more about a likely Filatov-Vermette-Voracek line. If Voracek doesn't improve from last season and Filatov (what I considered flashes of brilliance) doesn't live up to expectation, then that could mean that Vermette struggles too, and that would mean a non-threatening second line. Of course, Voracek could be eschewed in favor of RJ, so I'm still not really that worried that this either.
No need to worry about this line because it won't happen until late in the season - if at all - because Umberger and Vermette will be the pair. they'll likely be matched with Voracek early and possible Filatov at times depending on match ups. If that ends up beign the line it means all three are kicking ass!

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Old
09-04-2009, 03:58 PM
  #66
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Personally I think it's absolute Crap that we would sign Brassard to this contract. I mean shouldn't we have spent what we had on guys like Gaborik or traded for J-Bo or Heatley. This just pisses me off that we didn't spend this future money elsewhere.







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09-04-2009, 04:06 PM
  #67
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Pretty good. A slight gamble, but well worth it.

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Old
09-04-2009, 04:09 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by CBJSlash View Post

Brassard will be a player. He is hungry and incredibly skilled. This will be one of the best deals in the NHL and we may find that out by December.
Could it have waited until December? I don't see why it couldn't.

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09-04-2009, 04:12 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by leek View Post
Oh hon, you're already too happy. This will make you unbearable!
You haven't seen me in the Business Of Hockey forums, have you?

(I used to be able to talk about my blemish-free record until I reached that place. )

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09-04-2009, 04:12 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by RDriesenUD View Post
Is it not risky to wait till next year? He could put up 70-80 points and ask for a $5m cap hit. Is that not risky?
An 80 point player with a $5 million cap hit isn't a problem. (heck we got a 70 point player at $7.8 and we LOVE it. )

A 30 game player with a $3.1 million hit is.

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09-04-2009, 04:15 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
Could it have waited until December? I don't see why it couldn't.
It's possible that the price would have gone up once we had more assurance.

It's possible that there was an agreement on the table and folks decided to go with it.

Heck, it's possible that Brassard saw Good Things and insisted on an Early Bird Discount so that he could stick around. There's really no way to know at this point.

All I know is that it's done, it's a gamble I'd take (and I hate gambling), and I is happy viqsi.

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Old
09-04-2009, 04:46 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe View Post
An 80 point player with a $5 million cap hit isn't a problem. (heck we got a 70 point player at $7.8 and we LOVE it. )

A 30 game player with a $3.1 million hit is.
So, are you saying he will only become an 80pt player if we hadn't signed him?

Why can he not be an 80pt player making $3.2?

Which is better.

80pt player making $5 or an 80pt player making $3.2

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09-04-2009, 04:50 PM
  #73
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If that happened, then at least we'd know he's worth it.

By the same token (and I think this is just as likely), what if he plays 26 games this year, injures his shoulder and doesn't play again?
I just don't get some of you.

So, let's say we wait. Brassard puts up 70-80pts. We sign him to a $5m deal.

How much is Mason then going to want?

Voracek?

Filatov?


Or we can sign him for $3.2 and set the bar for what the others will sign for at a MUCH lower amount


Let's say Brassard puts up 50pts. How much is he going to get? Just look at what other players have gotten for putting up similar pt totals.

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09-04-2009, 04:56 PM
  #74
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That's the problem. We CAN'T do that. Mason, Voracek, and Filatov are still going to say "Brassard only took that deal before he started to really perform and prove that he's not injury prone afterall, so you should pay me MORE because I've never been injury prone!"

This deal is irrelevant to theirs because he's only proven that he's got talent, not durability.

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Old
09-04-2009, 05:11 PM
  #75
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That's the problem. We CAN'T do that. Mason, Voracek, and Filatov are still going to say "Brassard only took that deal before he started to really perform and prove that he's not injury prone afterall, so you should pay me MORE because I've never been injury prone!"

This deal is irrelevant to theirs because he's only proven that he's got talent, not durability.
Absolutely.

Look, I like Brass and I like Howson, but I can't shake the fact that half of the defenders of this deal would be KILLING it and facepalming if this were Glen Sather or Brian Burke.

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