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4 questions I pose about Henrik Lundqvist

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Old
09-10-2009, 01:56 PM
  #26
Bluenote13
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Originally Posted by Richters Girl View Post
Inferno, i completely agree with you. Barring something awful happening to him i'm sure he will surpass Richter...etc.

But i have to disagree that Richter had better teams in front of him then Lundqvist has the past few years. In the early 2000's, the Rangers were the worst group of players i have ever seen, at least the past few years they have had actual chances to get somewhere and they had heart. Go back and watch some of the games from late 90's or early 2000's if you want to see some terrible teams.
Pre 2000 Richter was having consistency issues. He was still good, but not consistently one of the top 5 netminders like Henke has been since he's gotten here.

Henke's the most talented goalie i've seen play on the Rangers, thats no slight to Richter or his accomplishments.

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09-10-2009, 02:25 PM
  #27
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Just to throw some numbers out there at you...

Rangers all time record for games played by a goalie:
Mike Richter:666
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 265. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 33 (6 more years)

Rangers all time record for wins by a goalie:
Mike Richter:301
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 142. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 32 (5 more years) counting shootouts. Ignoring shootouts You can probably add 1-2 more years to that number.

Rangers all time record for shutouts by a goalie:
Eddie Giacomin:49
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 20. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 33 (6 more years)



I think Henrik probably will be able to play at a high level till he is at least 35-37...if not older.

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09-10-2009, 02:26 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Lundqvisnt should not be ranked above Richter, or Giacomin, etc...but he will be when all things are finished. Odds are he will hold just about every statistical record for a goalie by the Rangers, which is remarkable...but he needs to stay healthy, and he probably needs to win a cup or 2.
Accomplishment wise, I agree, Henk has a way to go (though Henk has certainly making some noise since entering the league).

As far as pure ability goes? Lundqvist I think has the edge.

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09-10-2009, 02:32 PM
  #29
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Accomplishment wise, I agree, Henk has a way to go (though Henk has certainly making some noise since entering the league).

As far as pure ability goes? Lundqvist I think has the edge.
hmm....maybe. Richter was a pretty amazing goalie in his prime though....i never saw Giacomin.

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09-10-2009, 03:03 PM
  #30
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... 1) Do you think Henrik is overworked ? If not why? And If so how many games would you like see him play this upcoming season in order to be more productive ?

2) Do you think Lundqvist experience winning a gold medal for Sweden factors into his ability to help the Rangers win a Stanley Cup ?

3) Henrik gets paid a ton of Cash almost 7 million per year, could the Rangers be better served with a 3 million dollar goalie and the 4 million spent elsewhere ?

4) Put the following Ranger goaltenders in order on pure ability. Give brief explanations why ?
Sorry if I suck at keeping things short. If you want to read anything written, feel free to cut out some parts. It's quite clear I found the first question the most interesting one.

1) To begin with, I've followed Lundqvist a long time. I think he played his best hockey I've seen him perform yet in his career last season. The consensus seems to be he had an off-year because of his slightly worse stats, while his play on the ice was very consistent, probably more consistent than ever before in a Rangers jersey. The games he didn't give the Rangers a chance to win the game were very few and practically never in cold stretches. The team was terrible though, they certainly set a new standard for what can be considered "humiliatingly bad". A goalie can only have as shiny stats during the course of a season as his team allows him. There's a reason Lundqvist is in the top of basically every statistical chart that has goalie save percentages where quality scoring chances are calculated into the equation.

He was the reason we even reached the playoffs. Everybody talks about Lundqvist's famous "november dip", while no one takes a look at the huge increase in quality scoring chances allowed that basically triples (in november). But to answer the question: Yes. Physically, Henrik is fit enough to handle 70 games and the playoffs, but mentally, on this team, it's too much.

We're not good enough to let him play that much and maximize his performance, because of the immense pressure of a non-relieving offense and the bombardment of too many quality scoring chances. Compare Lundqvist's situation with Nabokov for example, playing for a (regular season) monster team in San Jose. A weak - or any - goal allowed by our goalie can and probably will cost us at least a point, so the pressure is immense every game. Around 60 games played could be helpful, but the problem is, we won't get into the playoffs if we don't ride our best player. We are too weak and can't afford to rest Lundqvist, just like every year.

I get this question comes from Tort's statements where he said he think Lundqvist's performance in the Washington series dropped, because of fatigue. But hey, you don't win many game 7's when your team musters 1(!) shot on goal in the last period and is outworked and outperformed 7 games out of 7. Lundqvist was inhuman in 4 games out of 7, which should've been enough to win a series. We were simply the clearly inferior team. Our PP was laughable, our offense brutal, our defense questionable, our penalty killing best in the league and our goaltending game winning. That's how things have looked for a very long time now.

2) Lundqvist is good enough - and has the experience - to bring a cup to his team and be a team anchor. He proved he has both the skills and the mental strength to get gold when things matter. The problem is the rest of the team, more so our heavy contracts with names that don't need to be mentioned. They underperform and their contracts constrict us from affording to bring in the firepower necessary to form a cup contender. Some players are paid to carry the team, but they can't even carry their line, barely themselves for that matter.

3) $7 million for a top 3 goaltender is a fair deal, as long as you don't (want to) use the cap loophole (Luongo, Hossa, Pronger, etc.). There is one player that is on the ice 60 minutes each game: the goalie. The equivalent of a quarterback or a pitcher. The trick in todays game when it comes to cap management is an obvious one: to get the most bang out of your bucks and have as many underpaid players as possible. The management ($ather) has proven over and over that underpaying isn't their prime characteristic. This Rangers team with a $3m goalie and an extra $4 million to spend on some overrated UFA would look for a good draft pick and can forget about a playoff spot.

4)It all depends what criteria you use to sort them. Career? Skill? Favouritism? To be honest, I haven't watched enough of Richter and Vanbiesbrouck to judge them fairly, I'm 29 and live in Sweden after all. Hockey streams didn't start popping up for real until 2006/2007. I take the easy way out and judge them by favouritism.

Lundqvist - World class lateral movement, great reflexes, hates to lose. He has the tools to be a true franchise player and probably already is.
Richter - He brought a cup to the team, had amazing agility and made timely saves at the right moments. Enough said.
Vanbiesbrouck - No knack for coming third, the guy had a Vezina and an impressive career. If I had seen him play more... well... I've seen pictures of this guy in a Devils jersey. And an Islanders jersey. And a Flyers jersey. Wait, why shouldn't this guy be third? What a mercenary. I can see he wanted to stay in the area though, before any Vanbiesbrouck fans start lynching me.


Last edited by Chimp: 09-10-2009 at 04:08 PM.
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09-10-2009, 03:27 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Dagoon44 View Post
I will save my answers for my call this will get people talking
If you are going to attack Lundqvist for soft goals, I just hope you show some consistency and point out Richter's softies throughout his career as well. His low shutout totals alone show his knack for losing focus.

Richter was one of the best big game goalies around, but he was just above average when it came to the 'day-to-day' action. I see alot of that in Lundqvist.

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09-10-2009, 04:01 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
hmm....maybe. Richter was a pretty amazing goalie in his prime though....i never saw Giacomin.
It is incredibly difficult to compare players from different eras. Different equipment, rules, player pool, conditioning etc,.

Let's just say that within his era, Giacomin was arguably as good as any other goalie in the game.

Thinking back to those days, the game was for the most part a bit slower but on the other hand you had guys altering their sticks so that their slap shots would go airborne quicker and the shots would often dip unbelievably. Sort of like a top-notch baseball sinker pitch.

When one of the Hull brothers wound up, even they didn't know where the puck was headed and add in the now unbelievable notion, that there were no masks and you have to marvel at the goalies from that particular era.

Dennis actually had a harder shot than his brother Bobby but was far less accurate. I once saw Dennis take a shot that deflected off a dman's stick and it ended up in the blue seats. I've never seen that since.

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09-10-2009, 04:22 PM
  #33
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[QUOTE=Richters Girl;21038907]I am a first time poster here....when i read the replies to #4 i felt like i needed to chip in.

To the people that are saying that Richter had this great team in front of him...yes, in 1994 he did but in all the 14 or some odd years that he was with the Rangers, that was the ONLY year he had a good team in front of him. Richter was left out to dry so much more than any Ranger goalie it is ridiculous. Plus, when he was playing most teams were not playing the defensive game they are playing now so there were much more odd man rushes and offensive threats. Also, jump to 1997 where Richter carried that team through the regular season and the playoffs, (with the exception of only Gretzky). I can't believe that some people are saying that Lundqvist should already be ranked higher than Richter. Lundqivst hasn't proven anything yet. He has shown unbelievable skill that drops my jaw sometimes, but the fact that he can never be consistent with it is a big problem.
I love Lundqvist and I hope he can surpass Richter one day but to say that now, i think is way off base.[/QUOTE]

Richter DID NOT carry the 96'-97' NY Rangers in the regular season and the playoffs. Gretzky did lead the team with 97pts. Messier had 84pts. Leetch had 78pts. Graves had 61pts. All 4 of these players had more points then the Rangers top point getter last season. Zherdev and Gomez were tied with 58pts. Naslund lead the team in goals with 24. In 96'-97' our 5th and 6th leaders in points had 24 goals. Sundstrom and Robitaille both were tied.
Looking at these regular season stats, do you think Richter had maybe just a little more offensive help than Lundqvist did this past year? Richter had sooo much more help offensively. Last year is a much more effective example of a goal tender carrying a team than the 96'-97' season. I don't know how you came up with the "Richter carrying the team conclusion for that year" but it simply was not true. He had plenty of help.


The comment about Lundqvist having not accomplished anything is also false. No other goal tender in history has come into the league and won 30+ games 4 years in a row. I would say that's an achievement and a milestone.
He won a Gold Medal in 2006 to help give Sweden their second Olympic Gold Medal victory. That's not showing he has proven something (I'm talking about on a personal level which i thought this was all about. Not just what the two have done for the Rangers)?
He's been nominated a finalist for the Vezina Trophy all 4 years he's been in the league.
Henrik Lundqvist is the first Rangers goal tender to record 10 shutouts in a season since 1928. How can one say he hasn't accomplished anything.
Lundqvist and Giacomin are the only two Ranger goal tenders to lead the team in wins 3 years in a row.

IDK how anyone can think Richter would have been capable of doing a better job than Lundqvist for this team since the post lockout.
"Hank" practically on his own, took the Rangers to 7 games versus a much superior offensive team. I thought the winner of the Capitals/Pens series would win the Cup.

He and Messier are the only 2 Rangers to have been voted MVP of the team for 2 years in a row according to the Professional Hockey Writers Association (Messier in 93'-94' and 94'-95'. And Lundqvist in 06'-07 and 07'-08'). I think when the voting is done for the 08'-09' season, Lundqvist will break the record.

Eddie Giacomin and Curtis Joseph never won Stanley Cups. But does that mean they haven't accomplished anything. Giacomin is in the Hall of Fame and Joseph racked up 454 wins. Clarify what you mean by "proving something." It cannot be based on Stanley Cups because both of these goal tenders were better than Mike Richter. Richter imo, was better than Tom Barrasso. But was Barrasso better in net because he won more Cups?

Statistically. So far Richter has never had a lower GAA than Lundqvist (of course the lower the better but in baseball it's the most significant stat fans look for when evaluating a pitcher. Except the abbreviation is ERA).The closest Richter came was the Cup year where his GAA was 2.57. GAA and ERA are the same thing, just a different sport.

Richter was still a great goal tender though and deserves to be in U.S.A's Hockey Hall of fame. The Rangers could not have won the Stanley Cup without him. Although I think Lundvist is the better goal tender, I'm thankful for the memories and being able to watch the greatest American Goal Tender ever. And he represented my team. Richter was also a very hard worker on and off the ice. New Yorkers always appreciate that. He's a great story out of Philadelphia. His #35 forever deserves to be hanging from the Rafters.

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09-10-2009, 04:25 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
Sorry if I suck at keeping things short. If you want to read anything written, feel free to cut out some parts. It's quite clear I found the first question the most interesting one.

1) To begin with, I've followed Lundqvist a long time. I think he played his best hockey I've seen him perform yet in his career last season. The consensus seems to be he had an off-year because of his slightly worse stats, while his play on the ice was very consistent, probably more consistent than ever before in a Rangers jersey. The games he didn't give the Rangers a chance to win the game were very few and practically never in cold stretches. The team was terrible though, they certainly set a new standard for what can be considered "humiliatingly bad". A goalie can only have as shiny stats during the course of a season as his team allows him. There's a reason Lundqvist is in the top of basically every statistical chart that has goalie save percentages where quality scoring chances are calculated into the equation.

He was the reason we even reached the playoffs. Everybody talks about Lundqvist's famous "november dip", while no one takes a look at the huge increase in quality scoring chances allowed that basically triples (in november). But to answer the question: Yes. Physically, Henrik is fit enough to handle 70 games and the playoffs, but mentally, on this team, it's too much.

We're not good enough to let him play that much and maximize his performance, because of the immense pressure of a non-relieving offense and the bombardment of too many quality scoring chances. Compare Lundqvist's situation with Nabokov for example, playing for a (regular season) monster team in San Jose. A weak - or any - goal allowed by our goalie can and probably will cost us at least a point, so the pressure is immense every game. Around 60 games played could be helpful, but the problem is, we won't get into the playoffs if we don't ride our best player. We are too weak and can't afford to rest Lundqvist, just like every year.

I get this question comes from Tort's statements where he said he think Lundqvist's performance in the Washington series dropped, because of fatigue. But hey, you don't win many game 7's when your team musters 1(!) shot on goal in the last period and is outworked and outperformed 7 games out of 7. Lundqvist was inhuman in 4 games out of 7, which should've been enough to win a series. We were simply the clearly inferior team. Our PP was laughable, our offense brutal, our defense questionable, our penalty killing best in the league and our goaltending game winning. That's how things have looked for a very long time now.

2) Lundqvist is good enough - and has the experience - to bring a cup to his team and be a team anchor. He proved he has both the skills and the mental strength to get gold when things matter. The problem is the rest of the team, more so our heavy contracts with names that don't need to be mentioned. They underperform and their contracts constrict us from affording to bring in the firepower necessary to form a cup contender. Some players are paid to carry the team, but they can't even carry their line, barely themselves for that matter.

3) $7 million for a top 3 goaltender is a fair deal, as long as you don't (want to) use the cap loophole (Luongo, Hossa, Pronger, etc.). There is one player that is on the ice 60 minutes each game: the goalie. The equivalent of a quarterback or a pitcher. The trick in todays game when it comes to cap management is an obvious one: to get the most bang out of your bucks and have as many underpaid players as possible. The management ($ather) has proven over and over that underpaying isn't their prime characteristic. This Rangers team with a $3m goalie and an extra $4 million to spend on some overrated UFA would look for a good draft pick and can forget about a playoff spot.

4)It all depends what criteria you use to sort them. Career? Skill? Favouritism? To be honest, I haven't watched enough of Richter and Vanbiesbrouck to judge them fairly, I'm 29 and live in Sweden after all. Hockey streams didn't start popping up for real until 2006/2007. I take the easy way out and judge them by favouritism.

Lundqvist - World class lateral movement, great reflexes, hates to lose. He has the tools to be a true franchise player and probably already is.
Richter - He brought a cup to the team, had amazing agility and made timely saves at the right moments. Enough said.
Vanbiesbrouck - No knack for coming third, the guy had a Vezina and an impressive career. If I had seen him play more... well... I've seen pictures of this guy in a Devils jersey. And an Islanders jersey. And a Flyers jersey. Wait, why shouldn't this guy be third? What a mercenary. I can see he wanted to stay in the area though, before any Vanbiesbrouck fans start lynching me.
totally agree with almost everything you wrote here.

really man, great post.

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09-10-2009, 04:29 PM
  #35
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[QUOTE=gravytrain6t;21041868]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richters Girl View Post
I am a first time poster here....when i read the replies to #4 i felt like i needed to chip in.

To the people that are saying that Richter had this great team in front of him...yes, in 1994 he did but in all the 14 or some odd years that he was with the Rangers, that was the ONLY year he had a good team in front of him. Richter was left out to dry so much more than any Ranger goalie it is ridiculous. Plus, when he was playing most teams were not playing the defensive game they are playing now so there were much more odd man rushes and offensive threats. Also, jump to 1997 where Richter carried that team through the regular season and the playoffs, (with the exception of only Gretzky). I can't believe that some people are saying that Lundqvist should already be ranked higher than Richter. Lundqivst hasn't proven anything yet. He has shown unbelievable skill that drops my jaw sometimes, but the fact that he can never be consistent with it is a big problem.
I love Lundqvist and I hope he can surpass Richter one day but to say that now, i think is way off base.[/QUOTE]

Richter DID NOT carry the 96'-97' NY Rangers in the regular season and the playoffs. Gretzky did lead the team with 97pts. Messier had 84pts. Leetch had 78pts. Graves had 61pts. All 4 of these players had more points then the Rangers top point getter last season. Zherdev and Gomez were tied with 58pts. Naslund lead the team in goals with 24. In 96'-97' our 5th and 6th leaders in points had 24 goals. Sundstrom and Robitaille both were tied.
Looking at these regular season stats, do you think Richter had maybe just a little more offensive help than Lundqvist did this past year? Richter had sooo much more help offensively. Last year is a much more effective example of a goal tender carrying a team than the 96'-97' season. I don't know how you came up with the "Richter carrying the team conclusion for that year" but it simply was not true. He had plenty of help.


The comment about Lundqvist having not accomplished anything is also false. No other goal tender in history has come into the league and won 30+ games 4 years in a row. I would say that's an achievement and a milestone.
He won a Gold Medal in 2006 to help give Sweden their second Olympic Gold Medal victory. That's not showing he has proven something (I'm talking about on a personal level which i thought this was all about. Not just what the two have done for the Rangers)?
He's been nominated a finalist for the Vezina Trophy all 4 years he's been in the league.
Henrik Lundqvist is the first Rangers goal tender to record 10 shutouts in a season since 1928. How can one say he hasn't accomplished anything.
Lundqvist and Giacomin are the only two Ranger goal tenders to lead the team in wins 3 years in a row.

IDK how anyone can think Richter would have been capable of doing a better job than Lundqvist for this team since the post lockout.
"Hank" practically on his own, took the Rangers to 7 games versus a much superior offensive team. I thought the winner of the Capitals/Pens series would win the Cup.

He and Messier are the only 2 Rangers to have been voted MVP of the team for 2 years in a row according to the Professional Hockey Writers Association (Messier in 93'-94' and 94'-95'. And Lundqvist in 06'-07 and 07'-08'). I think when the voting is done for the 08'-09' season, Lundqvist will break the record.

Eddie Giacomin and Curtis Joseph never won Stanley Cups. But does that mean they haven't accomplished anything. Giacomin is in the Hall of Fame and Joseph racked up 454 wins. Clarify what you mean by "proving something." It cannot be based on Stanley Cups because both of these goal tenders were better than Mike Richter. Richter imo, was better than Tom Barrasso. But was Barrasso better in net because he won more Cups?

Statistically. So far Richter has never had a lower GAA than Lundqvist (of course the lower the better but in baseball it's the most significant stat fans look for when evaluating a pitcher. Except the abbreviation is ERA).The closest Richter came was the Cup year where his GAA was 2.57. GAA and ERA are the same thing, just a different sport.

Richter was still a great goal tender though and deserves to be in U.S.A's Hockey Hall of fame. The Rangers could not have won the Stanley Cup without him. Although I think Lundvist is the better goal tender, I'm thankful for the memories and being able to watch the greatest American Goal Tender ever. And he represented my team. Richter was also a very hard worker on and off the ice. New Yorkers always appreciate that. He's a great story out of Philadelphia. His #35 forever deserves to be hanging from the Rafters.
other than the vezina nomination mistake...another great post.

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09-10-2009, 04:42 PM
  #36
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1)At his age, he's fine, let the young stud run, thats why he gets the big bucks.

2)Gold medal & his Swedish championship tells you alot about his ability, focus and competitive drive, all pluses in my book.

3)Look at the Flyers playing it cheap with their goalies the last 15 years, hows that workin for them?

4)Lundqvist, Richter, Vanbies. Richter and Vanbies both gave the team the chance to win almost every night. Henke was the first NYR goalie I felt could win games on his own, dominating.
Lol nice call on the flyers

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09-10-2009, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Just to throw some numbers out there at you...

Rangers all time record for games played by a goalie:
Mike Richter:666
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 265. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 33 (6 more years)

Rangers all time record for wins by a goalie:
Mike Richter:301
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 142. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 32 (5 more years) counting shootouts. Ignoring shootouts You can probably add 1-2 more years to that number.

Rangers all time record for shutouts by a goalie:
Eddie Giacomin:49
Henrik Lundqvist is currently at: 20. He should break this record, barring any major injuries by the time he hits the ripe old age of 33 (6 more years)



I think Henrik probably will be able to play at a high level till he is at least 35-37...if not older.
he has only 5 more years before he is UFA. And I get the feeling that may be it for him with the Rangers. Of course this is barring major injuries, but I also think it is a bit optimistic. We may have playoff missing teams in those years.

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09-10-2009, 05:31 PM
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he has only 5 more years before he is UFA. And I get the feeling that may be it for him with the Rangers. Of course this is barring major injuries, but I also think it is a bit optimistic. We may have playoff missing teams in those years.
It's way too early to assume that. It depends on how our prospects turn out and what moves are made in the offseason. In 5 years, Drury, Rozy, and Redden will be off the books, if not traded before then. If the Rangers can't put a decent team in front of Lundqvist in the next 5 years, then there's a chance he may bail, but who knows what may happen in the next 5 years?

Also, Henke has repeatedly stated that he loves NY and enjoys the lifestyle here. Last night he was at the US Open sitting in Robin Soderling's box to cheer on his fellow countryman, in what other city would he even have an opportunity to do that? It would take a lot to pry Henke out of NY, and I think management will do everything it takes to retain him. He IS the New York Rangers.

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09-10-2009, 05:38 PM
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I agree OverTheCap. Much to the chagrin of Dagoon, I think Hank will stay here unless the team becomes completely and utterly indifferent before he becomes a UFA. Then again, Sather does have the power to trade him, but I doubt he'll do that.

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09-10-2009, 06:14 PM
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I could NEVER picture Lundqvist leaving NY, personally. I think he loves this city (from stories I've heard when he back in Sweden during the offseason his family says that he's always anxious to get back home (NY)). I think he thrives off the pressure of playing in NY and I think he wants to, more than any other player, experience the feeling of winning in NY.

Unless the team becomes utterly atrocious I can't percieve him wanting to leave, I think he just loves the city too much.

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09-10-2009, 06:44 PM
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I agree OverTheCap. Much to the chagrin of Dagoon, I think Hank will stay here unless the team becomes completely and utterly indifferent before he becomes a UFA. Then again, Sather does have the power to trade him, but I doubt he'll do that.
Thirdeye don't put words in my mouth. I never said once that I want him out of NY, I did say he is flawed and hasn't put one full season together but i guess you only hear what you want to hear. Listen to the show later I will be calling in

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Old
09-11-2009, 11:25 AM
  #42
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[QUOTE=gravytrain6t;21041868]
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Originally Posted by Richters Girl View Post
I am a first time poster here....when i read the replies to #4 i felt like i needed to chip in.

To the people that are saying that Richter had this great team in front of him...yes, in 1994 he did but in all the 14 or some odd years that he was with the Rangers, that was the ONLY year he had a good team in front of him. Richter was left out to dry so much more than any Ranger goalie it is ridiculous. Plus, when he was playing most teams were not playing the defensive game they are playing now so there were much more odd man rushes and offensive threats. Also, jump to 1997 where Richter carried that team through the regular season and the playoffs, (with the exception of only Gretzky). I can't believe that some people are saying that Lundqvist should already be ranked higher than Richter. Lundqivst hasn't proven anything yet. He has shown unbelievable skill that drops my jaw sometimes, but the fact that he can never be consistent with it is a big problem.
I love Lundqvist and I hope he can surpass Richter one day but to say that now, i think is way off base.[/QUOTE]

Richter DID NOT carry the 96'-97' NY Rangers in the regular season and the playoffs. Gretzky did lead the team with 97pts. Messier had 84pts. Leetch had 78pts. Graves had 61pts. All 4 of these players had more points then the Rangers top point getter last season. Zherdev and Gomez were tied with 58pts. Naslund lead the team in goals with 24. In 96'-97' our 5th and 6th leaders in points had 24 goals. Sundstrom and Robitaille both were tied.
Looking at these regular season stats, do you think Richter had maybe just a little more offensive help than Lundqvist did this past year? Richter had sooo much more help offensively. Last year is a much more effective example of a goal tender carrying a team than the 96'-97' season. I don't know how you came up with the "Richter carrying the team conclusion for that year" but it simply was not true. He had plenty of help.


The comment about Lundqvist having not accomplished anything is also false. No other goal tender in history has come into the league and won 30+ games 4 years in a row. I would say that's an achievement and a milestone.
He won a Gold Medal in 2006 to help give Sweden their second Olympic Gold Medal victory. That's not showing he has proven something (I'm talking about on a personal level which i thought this was all about. Not just what the two have done for the Rangers)?
He's been nominated a finalist for the Vezina Trophy all 4 years he's been in the league.
Henrik Lundqvist is the first Rangers goal tender to record 10 shutouts in a season since 1928. How can one say he hasn't accomplished anything.
Lundqvist and Giacomin are the only two Ranger goal tenders to lead the team in wins 3 years in a row.

IDK how anyone can think Richter would have been capable of doing a better job than Lundqvist for this team since the post lockout.
"Hank" practically on his own, took the Rangers to 7 games versus a much superior offensive team. I thought the winner of the Capitals/Pens series would win the Cup.

He and Messier are the only 2 Rangers to have been voted MVP of the team for 2 years in a row according to the Professional Hockey Writers Association (Messier in 93'-94' and 94'-95'. And Lundqvist in 06'-07 and 07'-08'). I think when the voting is done for the 08'-09' season, Lundqvist will break the record.

Eddie Giacomin and Curtis Joseph never won Stanley Cups. But does that mean they haven't accomplished anything. Giacomin is in the Hall of Fame and Joseph racked up 454 wins. Clarify what you mean by "proving something." It cannot be based on Stanley Cups because both of these goal tenders were better than Mike Richter. Richter imo, was better than Tom Barrasso. But was Barrasso better in net because he won more Cups?

Statistically. So far Richter has never had a lower GAA than Lundqvist (of course the lower the better but in baseball it's the most significant stat fans look for when evaluating a pitcher. Except the abbreviation is ERA).The closest Richter came was the Cup year where his GAA was 2.57. GAA and ERA are the same thing, just a different sport.

Richter was still a great goal tender though and deserves to be in U.S.A's Hockey Hall of fame. The Rangers could not have won the Stanley Cup without him. Although I think Lundvist is the better goal tender, I'm thankful for the memories and being able to watch the greatest American Goal Tender ever. And he represented my team. Richter was also a very hard worker on and off the ice. New Yorkers always appreciate that. He's a great story out of Philadelphia. His #35 forever deserves to be hanging from the Rafters.


First of all I NEVER said Lundqvist has not accomplished anything, I am not taking anything away from him AT ALL. He is the heart of the team right now and I know that. He definitely has a lot of holes in his game that need to be worked on, such as not being so deep in the net all the time, not going down on his knees so easily, his glove hand...etc. All goalies have their flaws nad i'm not complaining about Lundqvists cause without him this team would be lost.

Also, Yes, Lundqvist has had 4 seasons winning 30+ games in a row but c'mon, you cannot compare that to anything pre shoot-out days. Lundqvist has a lot of shootout wins. I think Richter would have been able to do the same thing how the game is now.

Please don't take any of this as me putting down Lundvist in any way...I know he the most important player on this team and he is extremely talented, I just think its tough to say that he is a better goalie than Richter was. Game 7 of the stanley cup finals, I get the choice between Richter in his prime or Lundqvist, I go Richter every time. But maybe thats just me.

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09-11-2009, 11:38 AM
  #43
The Mouth
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Just wanted to apologize for not reading most of your answers last night on the show. We had technical problems about an hour into the program with the broadcast service provider and live streaming was cut off and the whole show went off into bizzaro land.

Rick Middleton was a great guest. Next week we are gonna have on HF's own Leslie Treff who will tell us all about Traverse City and Rangers camp.

Thanks Again Guys.

Ranger Crisis Radio #10

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Old
09-11-2009, 11:50 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by The Mouth View Post
Just wanted to apologize for not reading most of your answers last night on the show. We had technical problems about an hour into the program with the broadcast service provider and live streaming was cut off and the whole show went off into bizzaro land.

Rick Middleton was a great guest. Next week we are gonna have on HF's own Leslie Treff who will tell us all about Traverse City and Rangers camp.

Thanks Again Guys.

Ranger Crisis Radio #10
Ahh, so that explains it.

Looking forward to hearing Leslie.

Good work as always, Mouth.

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Old
09-11-2009, 11:56 AM
  #45
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[QUOTE=Richters Girl;21052365]
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Originally Posted by gravytrain6t View Post



First of all I NEVER said Lundqvist has not accomplished anything, I am not taking anything away from him AT ALL. He is the heart of the team right now and I know that. He definitely has a lot of holes in his game that need to be worked on, such as not being so deep in the net all the time, not going down on his knees so easily, his glove hand...etc. All goalies have their flaws nad i'm not complaining about Lundqvists cause without him this team would be lost.

Also, Yes, Lundqvist has had 4 seasons winning 30+ games in a row but c'mon, you cannot compare that to anything pre shoot-out days. Lundqvist has a lot of shootout wins. I think Richter would have been able to do the same thing how the game is now.

Please don't take any of this as me putting down Lundvist in any way...I know he the most important player on this team and he is extremely talented, I just think its tough to say that he is a better goalie than Richter was. Game 7 of the stanley cup finals, I get the choice between Richter in his prime or Lundqvist, I go Richter every time. But maybe thats just me.
You do realize that Richter was the 2nd best goalie in that series.

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Old
09-11-2009, 12:47 PM
  #46
vipernsx
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1) Do you think Henrik is overworked ? If not why? And If so how many games would you like see him play this upcoming season in order to be more productive ?
No he's not. Henke wants to play every game and I'd be fine with him starting every game and only sit on nights when there are back to back games. The greatest goaltenders thrive under higher workloads. Richter did when the Rangers won the cup and Brodeur has for many years.

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2) Do you think Lundqvist experience winning a gold medal for Sweden factors into his ability to help the Rangers win a Stanley Cup ?
Absolutely. Learning what it takes to be successful is absolutely a beneficial experience.

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Originally Posted by The Mouth View Post
3) Henrik gets paid a ton of Cash almost 7 million per year, could the Rangers be better served with a 3 million dollar goalie and the 4 million spent elsewhere ?
So would I rather have Rolosson and Demitra over Henke? Is that a serious question? I'll answer it in a clearer way, quantity doesn't equal quality.

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4) Put the following Ranger goaltenders in order on pure ability. Give brief explanations why ?

Mike Richter
John Vanbiesbrouck
Henrik Lundqvist
1) Henke 2) Richter 3) Beezer
Henke first because he has been consistently great year after year.

Richter second, because he has had phenomenal years and some other years where he was just average. Henke, has never been just average.

Beezer third, like Richter he's had some great years and some years where he was average. Unlike Richter, he's never been good enough to stop an elite talent like Pavel Bure during a 7 game series en route to a Stanley Cup Championship.

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