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Toronto Sun: Maple Leafs hire two new pro scouts

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:15 AM
  #1
hockeywiz542
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Toronto Sun: Maple Leafs hire two new pro scouts

http://www.torontosun.com/sports/hoc.../10859076.html

Quote:
The Leafs announced today that former Boston Bruin Steve Kasper has joined the pro scouting staff along with ex-L.A. King Rob Cowie. They join Mike Penny and Tom Watt.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:17 AM
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Number13
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Solely to watch Phill Kessel and his everyday activities and movements.

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09-12-2009, 11:17 AM
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Tonka
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Give them a year off. Our first, second and third are good as gone.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka View Post
Give them a year off. Our first, second and third are good as gone.
hahahahhahahahahah

thats why they hired them to look for late round gems

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09-12-2009, 11:22 AM
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blah blah... scouting staff is the same as the late 90s... isn't that what certain members have been trying to tell us?

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09-12-2009, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka View Post
Give them a year off. Our first, second and third are good as gone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joepeps View Post
hahahahhahahahahah

thats why they hired them to look for late round gems
These are pro scouts, not amateur scouts.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:23 AM
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kilgro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka View Post
Give them a year off. Our first, second and third are good as gone.
Correct me if i am wrong but i don't believe a pro scout would scout amateur players who are going to be drafted. a pro scout is someone who would keep track of players at a professional level such as the NHL or AHL.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilgro View Post
Correct me if i am wrong but i don't believe a pro scout would scout amateur players who are going to be drafted. a pro scout is someone who would keep track of players at a professional level such as the NHL or AHL.
Nothing to correct there.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:26 AM
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They only had 2? Wow you would think they would have thrown some money in that area when the cap came in. Why not have 10 pro scouts.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:32 AM
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looks like Burke has some more wheeling and dealing planned for this season...

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka View Post
Give them a year off. Our first, second and third are good as gone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joepeps View Post
hahahahhahahahahah

thats why they hired them to look for late round gems
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starpainter View Post
These are pro scouts, not amateur scouts.
Boom, roasted.

These guys are going to be important pickups this season, I think Burke is going to finish shedding the rest of the dead weight this year.

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09-12-2009, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by crump View Post
They only had 2? Wow you would think they would have thrown some money in that area when the cap came in. Why not have 10 pro scouts.
The "too many cooks spoil the broth" saying comes to mind. Almost every game is available on satellite to augment actual scouts.

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Old
09-12-2009, 11:54 AM
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why more scouts ? just ride the coat tails of E.J. McGuire & Central Scouting !!!

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Old
09-12-2009, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by cupcrazyman View Post
why more scouts ? just ride the coat tails of E.J. McGuire & Central Scouting !!!
Did you read the other posts at all? They aren't amteur scouts.

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Old
09-12-2009, 12:22 PM
  #15
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The Leafs pro scouting has been suspect for a while now. Let's hope that they turn the corner with these hirings. Considering that most NHL rosters are often more than half populated with other team's draft picks, pro scouting is at least equal in importance to amateur scouting.

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09-12-2009, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilgro View Post
Correct me if i am wrong but i don't believe a pro scout would scout amateur players who are going to be drafted. a pro scout is someone who would keep track of players at a professional level such as the NHL or AHL.

My bad

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Old
09-12-2009, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by LeafsInSeven View Post
The Leafs pro scouting has been suspect for a while now. Let's hope that they turn the corner with these hirings. Considering that most NHL rosters are often more than half populated with other team's draft picks, pro scouting is at least equal in importance to amateur scouting.
I am still waiting for Burke to start bring in more amateur scouts because they might not even be equal to but more important than your pro scouts. Your GM Burke, your Coach Wilson your management assistants Cliff Fletcher, Dave Poulin, Jeff Jackson all are extensions of your pro scouting team and resources at the disposal of the GM when making trades or signing UFA professional players to solicit qualified opinions from.

Your amateur scouting staff though that provides talent to the prospect pool though the draft is vital to your long-term success of your NHL team and Leafs based on previous track record needs a real boost in improvement. Here the GM, Coach and other Management people are not a very big asset in this process as they seldom have the time nor have the desire to sit around in hockey rinks all over the World watching undrafted players that may or may not become future Leafs.

It Leafs amateur drafting was better you would see less comfortability with the thought of tossing away many and high draft picks year after year for instant success for your rebuild, if you trusted your scouts to deliver at the draft similarly.

Leafs have missed the playoffs 4 consecutive years and the Hockey News (the bible of hockey ) has placed the Leafs 29 out of 30 teams when ranking current prospect pools strength, when assisted by qualified people helping in the assessment process.. That should send up a huge RED FLAG to Burke that this is an area that needs improvement.


Last edited by Mess: 09-12-2009 at 01:28 PM.
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Old
09-12-2009, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeafsInSeven View Post
The Leafs pro scouting has been suspect for a while now. Let's hope that they turn the corner with these hirings. Considering that most NHL rosters are often more than half populated with other team's draft picks, pro scouting is at least equal in importance to amateur scouting.
I don't know.. if the Stempniak, Hollweg, and Mayers trades are any indicators, we're fine.

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Old
09-12-2009, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Leafs have missed the playoffs 4 consecutive years and the Hockey News (the bible of hockey ) has placed the Leafs 29 out of 30 teams when ranking current prospect pools strength, when assisted by qualified people helping in the assessment process.. That should send up a huge RED FLAG to Burke that this is an area that needs improvement.
It is a little concerning that while missing 4 playoffs in a row, we haven't gotten many great pick ups in the draft. We have a few very good ones, Schenn, Kadri (hopefully), but the majority of our depth relies on the FA signings of the past year, which isn't something you can bank on doing all the time.

Burke and Nonis did a great job locking up the 3 out of 4 big name college and Swedish FA's last year, but you can't rely on that. You should put importance on the draft because the player cannot choose where he goes, unless he pulls a Lindros.

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Old
09-12-2009, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
I am still waiting for Burke to start bring in more amateur scouts because they might not even be equal to but more important than your pro scouts. Your GM Burke, your Coach Wilson your management assistants Cliff Fletcher, Dave Poulin, Jeff Jackson all are extensions of your pro scouting team and resources at the disposal of the GM when making trades or signing UFA professional players to solicit qualified opinions from.

Your amateur scouting staff though that provides talent to the prospect pool though the draft is vital to your long-term success of your NHL team and Leafs based on previous track record needs a real boost in improvement. Here the GM, Coach and other Management people are not a very big asset in this process as they seldom have the time nor have the desire to sit around in hockey rinks all over the World watching undrafted players that may or may not become future Leafs.

It Leafs amateur drafting was better you would see less comfortability with the thought of tossing away many and high draft picks year after year for instant success for your rebuild, if you trusted your scouts to deliver at the draft similarly.

Leafs have missed the playoffs 4 consecutive years and the Hockey News (the bible of hockey ) has placed the Leafs 29 out of 30 teams when ranking current prospect pools strength, when assisted by qualified people helping in the assessment process.. That should send up a huge RED FLAG to Burke that this is an area that needs improvement.
So your saying we should be trading as many draft picks away possible to get a 21 year old player?

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Old
09-12-2009, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
I am still waiting for Burke to start bring in more amateur scouts because they might not even be equal to but more important than your pro scouts. Your GM Burke, your Coach Wilson your management assistants Cliff Fletcher, Dave Poulin, Jeff Jackson all are extensions of your pro scouting team and resources at the disposal of the GM when making trades or signing UFA professional players to solicit qualified opinions from.

Your amateur scouting staff though that provides talent to the prospect pool though the draft is vital to your long-term success of your NHL team and Leafs based on previous track record needs a real boost in improvement. Here the GM, Coach and other Management people are not a very big asset in this process as they seldom have the time nor have the desire to sit around in hockey rinks all over the World watching undrafted players that may or may not become future Leafs.

It Leafs amateur drafting was better you would see less comfortability with the thought of tossing away many and high draft picks year after year for instant success for your rebuild, if you trusted your scouts to deliver at the draft similarly.

Leafs have missed the playoffs 4 consecutive years and the Hockey News (the bible of hockey ) has placed the Leafs 29 out of 30 teams when ranking current prospect pools strength, when assisted by qualified people helping in the assessment process.. That should send up a huge RED FLAG to Burke that this is an area that needs improvement.
Maybe Burke has the 2002 Hockey News issue that lists Rostislav Klesla as the best prospect in the world.

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Old
09-12-2009, 03:46 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by Woodman19 View Post
So your saying we should be trading as many draft picks away possible to get a 21 year old player?
Actually I spoke too soon above, and should have realized that Burke was fully aware already without me telling him about the the weakness of the Leafs amateur scouting department, as he in fact addressed it at the same time as his pro scouts..

Here is the most recent TSN report from today.

Quote:
Cliff Fletcher has signed a contract extension with the Toronto Maple Leafs and will remain with the team for three more years in his role as Senior Advisor.

As well, the Maple Leafs announced several additions to the team's scouting and administrative staff.

Former NHLers Steve Kasper and Rob Cowie will join Mike Penny and Tom Watt in the clubs' professional scouting department, while Scott Carter, John McMorrow, Frank Neal, Pierre Rioux, Roy Stasiuk, Dave Starman have been added to the team's North American amateur scouting staff. Joe Gibbs has been appointed to the Maple Leafs' European scouting staff.

Jim Hughes, former assistant coach for most of the past three seasons with the Toronto Marlies of the American Hockey League, has been appointed Director of Player Development.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=290819
Burke just added 7 new additional amateur scouts today also to address the weak draft results of the previous group.

Now it will be interesting to see if these new scouts are in addition to or now some of the former will be heading out the door.

In regards to your point here above .. If a team just doubled its amateur scouting staff, does that lead one to believe an offer sheet is coming that would trade away most of those high picks for next season?


Last edited by Mess: 09-12-2009 at 03:57 PM.
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Old
09-12-2009, 03:55 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Actually I spoke to soon above and should have realized the Burke was fully aware of the weakness of the amateur scouting department and in fact addressed it at the same time..

Here is the most recent TSN report



Burke just added 7 new additional amateur scouts today also to address the weak draft results of the previous group.

Now it will be interesting to see if these new scouts are in addition to or now some of the former will be heading out the door.

In regards to your point here .. If a team just doubled its amateur scouting staff, does that lead one to believe an offer sheet is coming that would trade away most of those high picks next season?
I certainly hope not

Lets keep them coming though, we are the big blue. we should spend as much as we can. In this case, on scouting.

It would certainly be nice to have every region on this planet tapped for our personal use.

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Old
09-12-2009, 03:56 PM
  #24
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keep hiring, BB - keep hiring.

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:26 AM
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Wow, a new overseer and now 7 new amateur scouts.

Yup, Burke clearly is keeping Ferguson's scouting exactly the same because it was so awesome.

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