Here’s a resource that will hopefully make it easier for us to document and analyze players’ intangibles. Over the past few days, Canadiens Fan has done a great job digging up surveys of NHL coaches from the early 1970s to mid 1980s. In addition, BM67 posted a players' survey from 1981. I wanted to summarize the data and put it all in one place to make it easier to build a case for (or against) a player in future editions of the All-Time Draft and Top 100 project.
I didn't include every category in the surveys CF and BM67 posted, I was mostly interested in the categories that describe specific physical skills ("hardest shot", "fastest skater") or abilities ("best on faceoffs", "best bodychecker"). Here are the results for every player who appears in at least two categories.
If anybody can find similar surveys from this era, let me know.
I've added my thoughts on a few players. Comments are welcome.
BARCLAY PLAGER
Best bodychecker
T-1st
1971
Best bodychecker
1st
1974
BARRY BECK
Hardest hitter
1st
1981
Hardest shot
4th
1979
Toughest player
3rd
1979
BARRY PEDERSON
Best on faceoffs
3rd
1984
Best passer
2nd
1984
BILL WHITE
Best defensive defenseman
1st
1974
Best defensive defenseman
2nd
1976
BOB GAINEY
Best backchecker
1st
1981
Best bodychecker
3rd
1979
Best checker
3rd
1976
Best defensive forward
1st
1979
Best defensive forward
1st
1981
Best defensive forward
3rd
1984
Best forechecker
2nd
1981
Best penalty killer
1st
1979
Best skater
3rd
1979
BOBBY CLARKE
Best backchecker
3rd
1981
Best checker
1st
1974
Best checker
1st
1976
Best defensive forward
2nd
1981
Best forechecker
1st
1981
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1974
Best on faceoffs
1st
1976
Best on faceoffs
1st
1979
Best on faceoffs
1st
1981
Best on faceoffs
4th
1984
Best penalty killer
T-1st
1974
Best penalty killer
1st
1976
Best playmaker
3rd
1974
Best playmaker
1st
1976
First player to build team around
1st
1976
Hardest worker
1st
1971
Hardest worker
1st
1974
Hardest worker
1st
1976
Hardest worker
1st
1979
Hardest worker
2nd
1984
Smartest player
3rd
1974
Smartest player
2nd
1976
Smartest player
4th
1979
Clarke may have better intangibles than any Hall of Fame player, ever. He was routinely regarded as one of the league's smartest & hardest working players. He was an outstanding playmaker, faceoff winner, checker and penalty killer.
BOBBY HULL
Best shot
1st
1971
Hardest shot
1st
1971
BOBBY ORR
Best defensive defensemen
T-1st
1971
Best playmaker
4th
1974
Best playmaker
4th
1976
Best shot
2nd
1971
Best shot
3rd
1974
Best skater
1st
1971
Best skater
1st
1974
Best skater
1st
1976
Best stickhandler
2nd
1971
Fastest skater
3rd
1976
First player to build team around
3rd
1976
Hardest shot
2nd
1971
Hardest shot
3rd
1974
Smartest player
1st
1971
Smartest player
2nd
1974
Smartest player
3rd
1976
Keep in mind that many people voted for Orr in 1976 even though injuries limited him to just 10 games that year. I realize I'm saying nothing new, but Orr had absolutely everything -- speed, stickhandling ability, playmaking ability, shooting ability intelligence, defensive play.
BORJE SALMING
Best defensive defenseman
2nd
1974
Best defensive defenseman
3rd
1979
Best passer
4th
1979
Best playmaker
4th
1979
Best skater
2nd
1979
Most natural ability
4th
1979
BRIAN SUTTER
Hardest worker
6th
1984
Toughest player
1st
1984
BRYAN TROTTIER
Best defensive forward
5th
1984
Best on faceoffs
1st
1984
Best passer
1st
1979
Best playmaker
1st
1979
Best stickhandler
2nd
1979
First player to build team around
2nd
1979
First player to build team around
3rd
1981
Hardest worker
5th
1984
Smartest player
2nd
1979
Smartest player
4th
1984
CLARK GILLIES
First player to build team around
4th
1979
Hardest hitter
3rd
1981
CRAIG RAMSAY
Best checker
4th
1976
Best defensive forward
3rd
1979
Best defensive forward
2nd
1984
Best penalty killer
T-1st
1974
Best penalty killer
3rd
1976
Best penalty killer
2nd
1979
DAVE BURROWS
Best defensive defenseman
5th
1974
Best defensive defenseman
4th
1976
DAVE KEON
Best checker
T-1st
1971
Best penalty killer
2nd
1971
Best skater
2nd
1971
DAVE "TIGER" WILLIAMS
Toughest player
2nd
1979
Toughest player
3rd
1984
DENIS POTVIN
Best bodychecker
3rd
1976
Best bodychecker
1st
1979
Best bodychecker
2nd
1984
Best defensive defenseman
3rd
1976
Best wrist-shot
2nd
1981
First player to build team around
2nd
1976
First player to build team around
3rd
1979
Hardest hitter
2nd
1981
Hardest shot
5th
1979
Most natural ability
3rd
1979
DENIS SAVARD
Best skater
2nd
1984
Best stickhandler
3rd
1984
Fastest skater
3rd
1984
Most natural ability
3rd
1984
DENNIS HULL
Hardest shot
1st
1974
Hardest shot
1st
1976
It runs in the family.
DEREK SANDERSON
Best on faceoffs
1st
1971
Best penalty killer
1st
1971
DON LUCE
Best checker
5th
1976
Best penalty killer
2nd
1976
DON MARCOTTE
Best defensive forward
2nd
1979
Best penalty killer
3rd
1979
DOUG JARVIS
Best bodychecker
4th
1974
Best defensive forward
1st
1984
Best on faceoffs
3rd
1976
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1979
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1981
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1984
Best penalty killer
4th
1979
Best penalty killer
1st
1984
ED WESTFALL
Best checker
3rd
1974
Best penalty killer
4th
1976
GILBERT PERREAULT
Best skater
2nd
1976
Best skater
5th
1984
Best stickhandler
2nd
1976
Best stickhandler
3rd
1979
Best stickhandler
1st
1981
Fastest skater
4th
1976
Most natural ability
2nd
1979
Most natural talent
2nd
1981
GUY LAFLEUR
Best passer
2nd
1979
Best playmaker
2nd
1979
Best shot
3rd
1976
Best shot
1st
1979
Best skater
1st
1979
Best slapshot
3rd
1981
Best stickhandler
4th
1976
Best stickhandler
1st
1979
Best stickhandler
3rd
1981
Fastest skater
1st
1979
First player to build team around
1st
1979
First player to build team around
2nd
1981
Most dangerous near goal
3rd
1976
Most dangerous near goal
3rd
1979
Most natural ability
1st
1979
Most natural talent
3rd
1981
Smartest player
4th
1976
Smartest player
1st
1979
JARI KURRI
Best defensive forward
6th
1984
Best shot
3rd
1984
Smartest player
6th
1984
JEAN RATELLE
Best playmaker
5th
1974
Smartest player
3rd
1979
JIM ROBERTS
Best checker
2nd
1974
Hardest worker
2nd
1971
Hardest worker
3rd
1976
LANNY MACDONALD
Best shot
3rd
1979
Hardest shot
1st
1979
Best wrist-shot
1st
1981
LARRY ROBINSON
Best bodychecker
2nd
1976
Best defensive defenseman
1st
1976
Best defensive defenseman
1st
1979
Best defensive defenseman
1st
1981
Best slapshot
2nd
1981
It's interesting that Robinson was named the league's best defensive blueliner three times. The consensus here seems to be that Savard was a bit better defensively. Perhaps that perception should change?
MARCEL DIONNE
Best hockey sense
2nd
1981
Best passer
3rd
1979
Best playmaker
2nd
1976
Best playmaker
3rd
1979
Best stickhandler
6th
1976
Best stickhandler
2nd
1981
Fastest skater
2nd
1976
Most dangerous near goal
4th
1976
Most dangerous near goal
2nd
1979
Smartest player
5th
1979
MICKEY REDMOND
Best shot
4th
1974
Best shot
4th
1976
Hardest shot
2nd
1974
MIKE BOSSY
Best shot
2nd
1979
Best shot
1st
1984
Most dangerous near goal
1st
1979
Most dangerous near goal
2nd
1984
Smartest player
3rd
1984
MIKE GARTNER
Best skater
4th
1984
Fastest skater
2nd
1984
PAUL COFFEY
Best skater
1st
1984
Most natural ability
5th
1984
PETE MAHOVLICH
Best penalty killer
T-1st
1974
Best stickhandler
5th
1976
PETER STASTNY
Best passer
3rd
1984
Smartest player
2nd
1984
PHIL ESPOSITO
Best on faceoffs
3rd
1974
Best on faceoffs
3rd
1981
Best shot
3rd
1971
Best shot
T-1st
1974
Best stickhandler
1st
1971
Most dangerous near goal
1st
1971
Most dangerous near goal
1st
1974
Most dangerous near goal
2nd
1976
Smartest player
2nd
1971
Smartest player
4th
1974
PIERRE LAROUCHE
Best playmaker
5th
1976
Best stickhandler
3rd
1976
REED LARSON
Best slapshot
1st
1981
Hardest shot
3rd
1979
Hardest shot
1st
1984
RICK MARTIN
Best shot
T-1st
1974
Best shot
1st
1976
Hardest shot
4th
1974
Hardest shot
2nd
1976
Most dangerous near goal
2nd
1974
Most dangerous near goal
1st
1976
Martin suffered a knee injury in 1980, lost his incredible speed, and never recovered. He was a surefire Hall of Famer, I think. From his rookie season until 1980 he was 4th in the league (behind only Esposito, Dionne and Lafleur) in goal-scoring.
RICK MIDDLETON
Best defensive forward
4th
1984
Best penalty killer
2nd
1984
Best skater
3rd
1984
Best stickhandler
2nd
1984
Most dangerous near goal
3rd
1984
Most natural ability
4th
1984
Smartest player
5th
1984
Middleton was an underrated and under-appreciated complete player.
ROD LANGWAY
Best bodychecker
5th
1984
Best defensive defenseman
1st
1984
SCOTT STEVENS
Best bodychecker
1st
1984
Toughest player
2nd
1984
SERGE SAVARD
Best defensive defenseman
2nd
1979
Best defensive defenseman
2nd
1981
STAN MIKITA
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1971
Best on faceoffs
1st
1974
Best on faceoffs
2nd
1976
Best on faceoffs
3rd
1979
Best playmaker
1st
1974
Best playmaker
3rd
1976
Best stickhandler
1st
1976
Smartest player
1st
1974
Smartest player
1st
1976
TERRY O'REILLY
Best bodychecker
4th
1979
Hardest worker
2nd
1979
Hardest worker
3rd
1984
Toughest player
1st
1979
Toughest player
4th
1984
WALT TKACZUK
Best defensive forward
3rd
1981
Best penalty killer
T-1st
1974
Hardest worker
2nd
1974
WAYNE GRETZKY
Best passer
1st
1984
Best hockey sense
1st
1981
Best penalty killer
3rd
1984
Best playmaker
1st
1984
Best shot
2nd
1984
Best stickhandler
1st
1984
First player to build team around
1st
1981
First player to build team around
1st
1984
Hardest worker
4th
1984
Most dangerous near goal
1st
1984
Most natural ability
1st
1984
Most natural talent
1st
1981
Smartest player
1st
1984
Nobody should be surprised to hear the Gretzky was smart and a great playmaker. I find it interesting that the coaches consider Gretzky an elite penalty killer and a hard worker. This is a good argument against the idiotic (but unfortunately common) suggestion that Gretzky was a one-dimensional floater.
YVAN COURNOYER
Best shot
4th
1971
Best skater
2nd
1974
Fastest skater
1st
1976
Last edited by seventieslord: 02-17-2012 at 01:14 PM.
21 of 24 coaches took part. Coaches were instructed to consider the current season only, and could not vote for their own players.
Best Player: Mario Lemieux (17), Chris Chelios (1), Teemu Selanne (1), Ray Bourque (1), Pavel Bure (1)
Best Defensive Defenceman: Chris Chelios (9), Ray Bourque (7), Scott Stevens (2), Steve Smith (1), Igor Kravchuk (1), Mark Tinordi (1)
Best Stickhandler: Mario Lemieux (14), Pavel Bure (3), Pat LaFontaine (1), Teemu Selanne (1), Jeremy Roenick (1), Wayne Gretzky (1)
Best Goalie: Ed Belfour (9), Kirk McLean (5), Tom Barrasso (2), Patrick Roy (2), Ron Hextall (1), Felix Potvin (1), Mike Vernon (1)
Best pure scorer: Mario Lemieux (10), Alexander Mogilny (3), Pavel Bure (3), Brett Hull (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Luc Robitaille (1), Geoff Courtnall (1)
Best Offensive Defenceman: Phil Housley (6), Ray Bourque (4), Chris Chelios (4), Paul Coffey (2), Brian Leetch (2), Steve Duchesne (1), Kevin Hatcher (1), Al MacInnis (1)
Smartest Player: Mario Lemieux (11), Ray Bourque (2), Adam Oates (2), Doug Gilmour (2), Wayne Gretzky (2), Chris Chelios (1), Pavel Bure (1)
Best Playmaker: Adam Oates (11), Mario Lemieux (9), Doug Gilmour (1)
Best Defensive Forward: Doug Gilmour (6), Joel Otto (5), Ron Francis (3), Dirk Graham (2), Brent Sutter (2), Murray Craven (1), Guy Carbonneau (1), Kelly Miller (1)
Best Penalty Killer: Dave Poulin (4), Doug Gilmour (2), Mario Lemieux (2), Pavel Bure (2), Dirk Graham (2), Sergei Fedorov (2), Mike Ridley (2), Gaetan Duchesne (1), Neil Broten (1), Craig MacTavish (1), Guy Carbonneau (1), Ron Wilson (1)
Best Faceoff Man: Joel Otto (4), Peter Stastny (3), Ron Francis (3), Doug Gilmour (2), Adam Oates (2), Peter Zezel (1), Mark Messier (1), Mario Lemieux (1), Steve Yzerman (1), Jari Kurri (1), Dale Hunter (1), Brent Sutter (1)
Best Skater: Pavel Bure (8), Mike Gartner (4), Paul Coffey (3), Sergei Fedorov (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Pat Lafontaine (1), Chris Chelios (1)
Hardest Worker: Doug Gilmour (6), Jeremy Roenick (5), Craig MacTavish (3), Kirk Muller (3), Kelly Miller (1), Pat Lafontaine (1), Ray Bourque (1), Joel Otto (1)
Most Infuriating: Chris Chelios (3), Claude Lemieux (2), Darius Kasparaitis (2), Dino Ciccarelli (2), Jeremy Roenick (2), Tony Granato (2), Dale Hunter (1), Doug Gilmour (1), Bryan Marchment (1), Jocelyn Lemieux (1), Rob Pearson (1), Marty McSorley (1), Kevin Dineen (1), Paul Broten (1)
Most Underrated: Larry Murphy (3), Kelly Buchberger (2), Ron Francis (2), Steve Larmer (2), Doug Gilmour (1), Adam Oates (1), Steve Chiasson (1), Kevin Stevens (1), Jeremy Roenick (1), Pierre Turgeon (1), Rod Brind’Amour (1), Kirk Muller (1), Joe Juneau (1), Tony Granato (1), Mark Recchi (1)
Toughest Player: Chris Chelios (7), Gary Roberts (4), Rick Tocchet (3), Jeremy Roenick (2), Randy McKay (1), Adam Graves (1), Bob Probert (1), Dirk Graham (1), Doug Gilmour (1)
Best Coach: Scott Bowman (8), Al Arbour (4), Pat Quinn (4), Bob Gainey (3), Pat Burns (1), Darryl Sutter (1)
Best Team: Pittsburgh (17), Vancouver (2), Chicago (2)
Best Shot: Al Iafrate (5), Al MacInnis (3), Teemu Selanne (3), Brett Hull (2), Ray Bourque (2), Luc Robitaille (1), Doug Gilmour (1),
Chris Chelios (1), Pavel Bure (1), Steve Larmer (1), Mario Lemieux (1)
Best Fighter: Bob Probert (15), Gino Odjick (2), Tie Domi (1), Dave Brown (1), Marty McSorley (1), Mark Tinordi (1)
Best Bodychecker: Mark Tinordi (6), Scott Stevens (5), Bryan Marchment (3), Jocelyn Lemieux (2), Derian Hatcher (1), Rob Pearson (1), Darisu Kasparaitus (1), Adam Graves (1), Jeremy Roenick (1)
20 of 26 coaches took part. Coaches were instructed to consider the current season only, and could not vote for their own players.
Best Player: Sergei Fedorov (15), Wayne Gretzky (3), Ray Bourque (1), Doug Gilmour (1)
Best Goalie: John Vanbiesbrouck (6), Patrick Roy (5), Felix Potvin (3), Curtis Joseph (3), Mike Richter (3)
Best Defensive Defenceman: Ray Bourque (8), Chris Chelios (4), Scott Stevens (3), Teppo Numminen (1), Mark Tinordi (1), Nicklas Lidstrom (1), Sylvain Lefebvre (1), Eric Desjardins (1)
Best Offensive Defenceman: Brian Leetch (8), Ray Bourque (7), Paul Coffey (3), Chris Chelios (1), Al MacInnis (1)
Best Defensive Forward: Sergei Fedorov (6), Doug Gilmour (3), Brian Skrudland (3), Guy Carbonneau (2), Adam Graves (2), Joel Otto (1), Mark Messier (1), Wayne Gretzky (1), Ron Francis (1)
Best Penalty Killer: Sergei Fedorov (5), Doug Gilmour (4), Guy Carbonneau (4), Adam Graves (2), Mike Ridley (1), Neal Broten (1), Mike Gartner (1), Mark Messier (1), Gaetan Duchesne (1)
Best Bodychecker: Eric Lindros (9), Bryan Marchment (3), Scott Stevens (3), Wendel Clark (1), Keith Tkachuk (1), Darius Kasparaitis (1), Adam Graves (1), Mark Tinordi (1)
Best Faceoff Man: Ron Francis (10), Joel Otto (7), Doug Gilmour (1), Ron Sutter (1), Adam Oates (1)
Best Stickhandler: Jaromir Jagr (5), Sergei Fedorov (4), Alexander Mogilny (4), Wayne Gretzky (3), Alexei Zhamnov (1), Pierre Turgeon (1), Sergei Nemchinov (1), Eric Lindros (1)
Smartest Player: Wayne Gretzky (12), Doug Gilmour (4), Mario Lemieux (1), Chris Chelios (1), Ron Francis (1), Steve Larmer (1)
Hardest Working Player: Doug Gilmour (6), Adam Graves (3), Jeremy Roenick (3), Kirk Muller (2), Gary Roberts (2), Ray Ferraro (1), Sergei Fedorov (1), Craig MacTavish (1), Mike Gartner (1)
Most Underrated Player: Joey Mullen (4), Adam Graves (3), Brendan Shanahan (2), Keith Tkachuk (2), John Maclean (1), Joey Juneau (1), Sergei Zubov (1), Sergei Fedorov (1), Joe Nieuwendyk (1), Vladimir Malakhov (1), Mike Modano (1), Mark Recchi (1), Dave Andreychuk (1)
Best Fighter: Bob Probert (9), Craig Berube (2), Joey Kocur (2), Tie Domi (1), Cam Neely (1), Marty McSorley (1), Gino Odjick (1), Dave Brown (1), Shane Churla (1)
Toughest Player: Cam Neely (5), Eric Lindros (3), Wendel Clark (2), Doug Gilmour (2), Bob Probert (1), Scott Stevens (1), Chris Chelios (1), Marty McSorley (1), Mark Tinordi (1), Adam Graves (1), Rick Tocchet (1), Brendan Shanahan (1)
Best Shot: Brett Hull (6), Al MacInnis (4), Mike Modano (2), Mike Gartner (1), Ray Bourque (1), Jimmy Carson (1), Alexander Mogilny (1), Eric Lindros (1), Joey Mullen (1), Cam Neely (1), Sergei Fedorov (1)
Best Skater: Sergei Fedorov (8), Teemu Selanne (3), Paul Coffey (2), Mike Modano (2), Mike Gartner (2), Pavel Bure (1), Alexander Mogilny (1), Jeremy Roenick (1)
Best Pure Scorer: Brett Hull (7), Dave Andreychuk (6), Alexander Mogilny (2), Sergei Fedorov (2), Cam Neely (1), Kevin Stevens (1), Jaromir Jagr (1)
Best Playmaker: Wayne Gretzky (9), Adam Oates (5), Doug Gilmour (4), Sergei Fedorov (1), Craig Janney (1)
Most Infuriating Player: Ulf Samuelsson (5), Tony Granato (3), Marty McSorley (2), Theo Fleury (2), Dale Hunter (1), Keith Tkachuk (1), Doug Gilmour (1), Jamie Macoun (1), Warren Rychel (1), Shayne Corson (1), Keith Acton (1), Chris Chelios (1)
Best Coach: Pat Burns (6), Mike Keenan (4), Scott Bowman (4), Roger Neilson (3), Al Arbour (1), Jacques Lemaire (1), Ron Wilson (1)
Best Team: New York Rangers (13), Detroit Red Wings (6), Montreal Canadiens (1)
21 of 24 coaches took part. Coaches were instructed to consider the current season only, and could not vote for their own players.
[ ... ]
Best pure scorer: Mario Lemieux (10), Alexander Mogilny (3), Pavel Bure (3), Brett Hull (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Luc Robitaille (1), Geoff Courtnall (1)
[ ... ]
Best Penalty Killer: Dave Poulin (4), Doug Gilmour (2), Mario Lemieux (2), Pavel Bure (2), Dirk Graham (2), Sergei Fedorov (2), Mike Ridley (2), Gaetan Duchesne (1), Neil Broten (1), Craig MacTavish (1), Guy Carbonneau (1), Ron Wilson (1)
[ ... ]
Best Skater: Pavel Bure (8), Mike Gartner (4), Paul Coffey (3), Sergei Fedorov (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Pat Lafontaine (1), Chris Chelios (1)
lol at chris chelios being considered the best skater in the league by one coach
geoff courtnall being considered the best pure scorer by one coach
pavel bure being considered the best penalty killer by two ... although this probably says something about the foul myth that bure was the worst defensive forward to ever play the game
lol at chris chelios being considered the best skater in the league by one coach
geoff courtnall being considered the best pure scorer by one coach
pavel bure being considered the best penalty killer by two ... although this probably says something about the foul myth that bure was the worst defensive forward to ever play the game
Did you also note the fact that Mario Lemieux was right in front of him as best Pker?
A few coaches favor using speedy and shifty offensive forwards on the penalty kill to generate offense from shorthanded play. He was not there for his defense. He was there to score goals.
It does nothing to dispel the fact that Bure did figure 8's by his blueline 5 on 5 waiting for breakout passes, essentially leaving his team shorthanded so he could go on breakaway attempts. That is where his reputation comes from and that is bang on.
Did you also note the fact that Mario Lemieux was right in front of him as best Pker?
A few coaches favor using speedy and shifty offensive forwards on the penalty kill to generate offense from shorthanded play. He was not there for his defense. He was there to score goals.
It does nothing to dispel the fact that Bure did figure 8's by his blueline 5 on 5 waiting for breakout passes, essentially leaving his team shorthanded so he could go on breakaway attempts. That is where his reputation comes from and that is bang on.
ok, i know he wasn't there to be a defensive first guy, that's why i said lol at it, but the fact is he didn't cheat on the defender in vancouver to the same extent as he did later on in florida ... he didn't do that when he went straight through ray bourque and another bruin defender [no. 25, possibly paul stanton] to score that goal vs boston for example
it's about the western conference finals between vancouver and toronto [vancouver won that series 4-1]
Also, with the Canucks defending their one-goal lead in the final minute against a Leaf team that had pulled its goalie, there was Bure on the ice in a defensive posture, hounding centre Doug Gilmour. "I don't always use him that way," Quinn said with a smile. "It was just a hunch tonight. He's done it from time to time. I thought quickness was going to be an element, and he did get the puck a couple of times."
Its hard to get too much from these results because it seems every coach had different favorites.
The guys with 5-8 votes obviously deserve merit, but its hard to read to much else into the guys who got 1 vote in a category.
Nice to see these polls being dug up though. I hope to see many more.
I think these coaches polls have clear merit. I also wish they were either done each year (were they?) or that if they were done each year we had the results for each year. I think in a lot of ways they are more enlightening than AS voting or award voting. Better coaches vote than journalists. IMO. Better vote on specific talents as well.
I like these votes and maybe there are more that were held so far unreported on HF? I hope so and that someone can post them here.
21 of 24 coaches took part. Coaches were instructed to consider the current season only, and could not vote for their own players.
Best Player: Mario Lemieux (17), Chris Chelios (1), Teemu Selanne (1), Ray Bourque (1), Pavel Bure (1)
Best Defensive Defenceman: Chris Chelios (9), Ray Bourque (7), Scott Stevens (2), Steve Smith (1), Igor Kravchuk (1), Mark Tinordi (1)
Best Stickhandler: Mario Lemieux (14), Pavel Bure (3), Pat LaFontaine (1), Teemu Selanne (1), Jeremy Roenick (1), Wayne Gretzky (1)
Best Goalie: Ed Belfour (9), Kirk McLean (5), Tom Barrasso (2), Patrick Roy (2), Ron Hextall (1), Felix Potvin (1), Mike Vernon (1)
Best pure scorer: Mario Lemieux (10), Alexander Mogilny (3), Pavel Bure (3), Brett Hull (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Luc Robitaille (1), Geoff Courtnall (1)
Best Offensive Defenceman: Phil Housley (6), Ray Bourque (4), Chris Chelios (4), Paul Coffey (2), Brian Leetch (2), Steve Duchesne (1), Kevin Hatcher (1), Al MacInnis (1)
Smartest Player: Mario Lemieux (11), Ray Bourque (2), Adam Oates (2), Doug Gilmour (2), Wayne Gretzky (2), Chris Chelios (1), Pavel Bure (1)
Best Playmaker: Adam Oates (11), Mario Lemieux (9), Doug Gilmour (1)
Best Defensive Forward: Doug Gilmour (6), Joel Otto (5), Ron Francis (3), Dirk Graham (2), Brent Sutter (2), Murray Craven (1), Guy Carbonneau (1), Kelly Miller (1)
Best Penalty Killer: Dave Poulin (4), Doug Gilmour (2), Mario Lemieux (2), Pavel Bure (2), Dirk Graham (2), Sergei Fedorov (2), Mike Ridley (2), Gaetan Duchesne (1), Neil Broten (1), Craig MacTavish (1), Guy Carbonneau (1), Ron Wilson (1)
Best Faceoff Man: Joel Otto (4), Peter Stastny (3), Ron Francis (3), Doug Gilmour (2), Adam Oates (2), Peter Zezel (1), Mark Messier (1), Mario Lemieux (1), Steve Yzerman (1), Jari Kurri (1), Dale Hunter (1), Brent Sutter (1)
Best Skater: Pavel Bure (8), Mike Gartner (4), Paul Coffey (3), Sergei Fedorov (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Pat Lafontaine (1), Chris Chelios (1)
Hardest Worker: Doug Gilmour (6), Jeremy Roenick (5), Craig MacTavish (3), Kirk Muller (3), Kelly Miller (1), Pat Lafontaine (1), Ray Bourque (1), Joel Otto (1)
Most Infuriating: Chris Chelios (3), Claude Lemieux (2), Darius Kasparaitis (2), Dino Ciccarelli (2), Jeremy Roenick (2), Tony Granato (2), Dale Hunter (1), Doug Gilmour (1), Bryan Marchment (1), Jocelyn Lemieux (1), Rob Pearson (1), Marty McSorley (1), Kevin Dineen (1), Paul Broten (1)
Most Underrated: Larry Murphy (3), Kelly Buchberger (2), Ron Francis (2), Steve Larmer (2), Doug Gilmour (1), Adam Oates (1), Steve Chiasson (1), Kevin Stevens (1), Jeremy Roenick (1), Pierre Turgeon (1), Rod Brind’Amour (1), Kirk Muller (1), Joe Juneau (1), Tony Granato (1), Mark Recchi (1)
Toughest Player: Chris Chelios (7), Gary Roberts (4), Rick Tocchet (3), Jeremy Roenick (2), Randy McKay (1), Adam Graves (1), Bob Probert (1), Dirk Graham (1), Doug Gilmour (1)
Best Coach: Scott Bowman (8), Al Arbour (4), Pat Quinn (4), Bob Gainey (3), Pat Burns (1), Darryl Sutter (1)
Best Team: Pittsburgh (17), Vancouver (2), Chicago (2)
Best Shot: Al Iafrate (5), Al MacInnis (3), Teemu Selanne (3), Brett Hull (2), Ray Bourque (2), Luc Robitaille (1), Doug Gilmour (1),
Chris Chelios (1), Pavel Bure (1), Steve Larmer (1), Mario Lemieux (1)
Best Fighter: Bob Probert (15), Gino Odjick (2), Tie Domi (1), Dave Brown (1), Marty McSorley (1), Mark Tinordi (1)
Best Bodychecker: Mark Tinordi (6), Scott Stevens (5), Bryan Marchment (3), Jocelyn Lemieux (2), Derian Hatcher (1), Rob Pearson (1), Darisu Kasparaitus (1), Adam Graves (1), Jeremy Roenick (1)
Interesting to see Stevens in 3rd place for "best defensive defensemen" in 92-93. I think we generally assume he was a big hitter who didn't really focus on his defensive play until at least 93-94, but the coaches seem to think that wasn't the case.
Also interesting to see Bure on the list of best penalty killers.
I know these polls were both taken right at the height of Gilmour's dominance, but still, it is refreshing to see him score so highly in so many categories.
Interesting to see Stevens in 3rd place for "best defensive defensemen" in 92-93. I think we generally assume he was a big hitter who didn't really focus on his defensive play until at least 93-94, but the coaches seem to think that wasn't the case.
Also interesting to see Bure on the list of best penalty killers.
He was far more raw defensively back in the 80's and early 90's, although still very good. His defensive game did not hit its real peaks until he focused entirely on that aspect of his game. He also became MUCH better at judging when he could throw those big open ice hits without going out of position(Larry Robinson had a bit to do with that)
I seem to remember us having a discussion on whether he should have beaten Bourque for the Norris in 94 and a few claiming Bourque won only by "Reputation" points, and that Stevens was superior on both ends of the ice. The coaches 94 poll seems to nullify that, with Bourque winning top defensive defenseman honors by double that of the next player(Chelios), and second best Offensive defenseman honors(Only 1 point away from 1st Leetch).
Bure winning 2 PK votes out of 21 does not surprise me, given some coaches back then being much more open to speedy and shifty offensive forwards like Gretzky and Lemieux being used on the PK. getting 2 votes out of 21 is not all that impresive. I really wished they had to vote on 2nd and 3rd places for these polls so we could get a clearer picture
This poll was taken by US hockey magazine "Hockey Illustrated", and the results were summarized in the Toronto Star by Jim Proudfoot on January 22, 1965.
Best penalty killer
1. Bob Pulford
2. Don Marshall
No other players received votes.
Most dangerous on a breakaway
1. Gordie Howe
2. Dave Keon
Howe and Keon were tied after the coaches voted, so Sam Pollock was asked to cast the tiebreaker. He chose Howe solely on the basis of Howe's great experience.
Fastest Skater
1. Dave Keon
2. Bobby Hull
3. Henri Richard
4. Gilles Tremblay
5. Ralph Backstrom
Richard, Tremblay, and Backstrom were mentioned as receiving votes, but no order for the three of them was specified.
Hardest Hitter
1. Bobby Baun
2. Leo Boivin
3. Ted Green
Proudfoot noted that Boivin had previously been considered the league's hardest hitter.
Hardest Shot
1. Bobby Hull
2. Jean Beliveau
3. Gordie Howe
Beliveau was close behind Hull in the vote.
“Men who can burst out for goals strictly on their own”
1. Jean Beliveau
2. Camille Henry
I'm not sure how this question was worded in the poll, but this is how Proudfoot worded it in his summary.
Montreal Gazette of March 13, 1934 has a poll of hockey writers/editors conducted by Canadian Press in connection with the all star voting.
fastest skater:
Howie Morenz 10, Busher Jackson 5, Hec Kilrea 4, Mush March 4, Jimmy Ward 3, Herbie Lewis 2, John Sorrel 1, Cecil Dillon 1, Jerry Shannon 1, Buzz Boll 1, Georges Mantha 1,
best stickhandler:
Aurel Joliat 17, Johnny Gottselig 5, Frank Boucher 4, Joe Primeau 2, Larry Aurie 2, Bun Cook 1, Nels Stewart 1, Busher Jackson 1, Ace Bailey 1
hardest shot:
Charlie Conacher 32, Lionel Concher 1, Jimmy Ward 1
best line:
Jackson - Primeau - Conacher 28
Cook - Boucher - Cook 7
Given how little love he got here, I would expect The Great One to have gotten tons of "most underrated" votes, but he didn't get any of those either. What gives? He got plenty of offensive votes the next year in '94 ... did the guy just dry up in the eyes of voters?
I think this underlies a "what have I seen lately" bias in a lot of these polls ... ESPN fan polls are the same way. A coach is often going to overestimate a divisional rival or a guy who smoked his team just last week. Seems as though this poll caught Gretzky during a bad week.
He missed 39 games that year. That's why. And you do realize they are based on what was done the previous season...
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Best Skater: Pavel Bure (8), Mike Gartner (4), Paul Coffey (3), Sergei Fedorov (2), Teemu Selanne (2), Pat Lafontaine (1), Chris Chelios (1)
1993 poll next year it was
Best Skater: Sergei Fedorov (8), Teemu Selanne (3), Paul Coffey (2), Mike Modano (2), Mike Gartner (2), Pavel Bure (1), Alexander Mogilny (1), Jeremy Roenick (1)
I wonder how much really changed in the 1 year period or if this goes to show that a lot of voting and polling done even by experts such as coaches is very subjective and not very focused.
It just really jumped out at me, I mean Federov was in the middle of his MVP season, maybe more guys just noticed him in 94 than 93.
Great thread. For younger guys such as myself, we've never had a chance to see these guys play. It's nice to be able to attach a certain style of play to a well known name.
I find these invaluable - I'm hoping we can get more posted.
It's been a while since I have seen Coach's polls, but the player's polls from recent years are almost as good.
1994 St Louis Post-Dispatch Coaches Poll, in conjunction with Beckett Hockey Magazine.
From the St Louis Post-Dispatch, May 7, 1994.
Quote:
During the 1993-94 season, we asked the 26 head coaches in the NHL to give us their winner in 13 individual categories.
Coaches could not vote for members of their team.
Every coach participated. One note: The Edmonton answers were supplied by Ted Green before he was relieved as coach by Glen Sather.
Best Shot
1. Brett Hull (15) 2. Al MacInnis (5) 3. (tie) Cam Neely, Mario Lemieux (2).
Others: (1) Mike Gartner, Mario Lemeiux.
The category was for best shot, not necessarily the hardest.
That distinction wasn't necessary with Hull.
"Hardest and most accurate," Toronto's Pat Burns said.
"He puts it where he wants it more times than anyone else," Tampa Bay's Terry Crisp said.
Most Underrated
1. Adam Graves (4) 2. (tie) Joe Mullen, Steve Thomas, Keith Tkachuk (2).
Others: (1) Dave Andreychuk, Bob Bassen, Wendel Clark, Ron Francis, Dave Hannan, Dale Hawerchuk, Craig Janney, Curtis Joseph, Kevin Miller, Teppo Numminen, Lyle Odelein, Adam Oates, Paul Ranheim, Mark Recchi, Brendan Shanahan, Brian Skrudland.
With 20 players receiving votes, this was the most far-flung category.
Mullen, the ageless ex-Blues sniper, was named by Scotty Bowman of Detroit and Jim Schoenfeld of Washington.
Shanahan seems overqualified for this list. Burns didn't think so: "People don't talk about him. I love this guy. He does it all - scores, fights, hits, checks. He's a great player."
Pat Quinn of Vancouver chose Janney, and Darryl Sutter of Chicago took Joseph.
Grinders Bassen of Quebec, a former Blues player, and Miller fit the unsung-hero mold.
Blues coach Bob Berry went with Buffalo center Hannan.
Fastest Skater
1. Sergei Fedorov (10) 2. Pavel Bure (5) 3. (tie) Paul Coffey, Mike Gartner, Mike Modano, Alexander Mogilny (2).
Others: Jaromir Jagr, Nelson Emerson, Phil Housley, Slava Kozlov, Jeremy Roenick.
The vote totals more than 26 because Bowman and the Rangers' Mike Keenan of the Rangers each cast a blanket ballot for the Russian troika of Fedorov, Bure and Mogilny.
Barry Melrose of Los Angeles chose Housley. Berry chose Emerson.
Best Faceoff Man
1. Joel Otto (8) 2. Ron Francis (7) 3. (tie) Doug Gilmour, Eric Lindros, Mark Messier (2).
Others: Guy Carboneau, Travis Green, Kelly Kisio, Craig MacTavish, Adam Oates.
Brian Sutter of Boston and his brother, Darryl, took Gilmour. Jacques Lemaire of New Jersey named Oates.
Berry cast the lone vote for Kisio.
Best Defensive Forward
1. Sergei Fedorov (5) 2. (tie) Guy Carbonneau, Doug Gilmour, Joel Otto, Brian Skrudland (3).
Others: (2) Jari Kurri; (1) Mike Eagles, Ron Francis, Mike Gartner, Dirk Graham, Adam Graves, Claude LaPointe, Ron Wilson.
Berry took Wilson, who signed with Montreal when the Blues released him last summer.
Jacques Demers of Montreal, Pierre Page of Quebec and Darryl Sutter took Gilmour.
Keenan, who took Graham, participated under protest: "I wish they would recategorize that thing. The player who has the puck should get it. You're not going to score when they have the puck." Then it would go to Fedorov or Wayne Gretzky, he said.
Best Power-Play Point Man
1. (tie) Ray Bourque, Al MacInnis, Brian Leetch (6).
Others: (3) Sergei Zubov; (2) Paul Coffey, Phil Housley; (1) Chris Chelios.
Housley showed well despite missing most of the season with the Blues after being acquired from Winnipeg.
"Winnipeg's power play is not as good this year," Dave King of Calgary said, "and Housley's the reason."
Berry took MacInnis, the Calgary boomer.
Best Penalty Killer
1. Guy Carbonneau (6) 2. (tie) Sergei Fedorov, Adam Graves, Joel Otto (3)
Others: (2) Doug Gilmour, Mark Messier; (1) Ray Bourque, Neal Broten, Mike Gartner, Wayne Gretzky, Jarri Kurri, Craig MacTavish, Ron Wilson (1)
Berry chose Carbonneau, the best defensive player of his generation.
Terry Simpson of Philadelphia took Wilson.
Best Shot Blocker
1. Guy Carbonneau (12) 2. Craig Ludwig (4).
Others (1) Garth Butcher, Steve Chaisson, Mike Keane, Craig MacTavish, Craig Muni, Joel Otto, Mike Ramsey, Paul Ranheim, Kjell Samuelsson, Mark Tinordi.
This category was the stumper for most voters.
"That's a lost art," said Crisp, who chose Butcher.
"Carbonneau," King said, "but only because Curt Giles is gone. It's a dying art."
Berry chose Ramsey of Pittsburgh before the playoffs. Otherwise, he might have backed Dallas' Ludwig, who blocked many shots in the Round 1 sweep of the Blues.
Best Power Forward
1. Cam Neely (7) 2. Eric Lindros (6) 3. Brendan Shanahan (4).
Others: (2) Adam Graves, Jaromir Jagr, Mark Messier; (1) Wendell Clark, Mike Gartner, Kevin Stevens.
Neely, the big, bad Bruin with a bad knee, astounded many voters with his 50 goals in 49 games.
"On one leg," King said. "He's awesome. He's killed us this year. He got four goals in two games."
Al Arbour of the Islanders said, "On one leg, he's been unbelievable."
Burns again stood up for Shanahan, saying: "Brendan can do it all. Lindros doesn't do it all yet."
Melrose, Quinn and Simpson also backed Shanahan.
Berry - not allowed to choose his player, Shanahan - went with Lindros, the Philadelphia manchild.
Best Defensive Defenseman
1. Ray Bourque (8) 2. Chris Chelios (6) 3. Scott Stevens (4).
Others: (1) Ken Daneyko, Sylvain Lefebvre, Jamie Macoun, Teppo Numminen, Bob Rouse, Kjell Samuelsson, Ulf Samuelsson, Steve Smith.
Finding defensemen who specialize only in defense was a brain teaser.
"Are there any?" Crisp asked.
"Is Larry Robinson still in the league?" asked Berry, who opted for Kjell Samuelsson of Pittsburgh.
Ex-Blues captain Stevens led the Devils in scoring and the NHL with a plus-53 rating. "He's tough one on one," Burns said.
Best Goalie Stickhandler
1. Ron Hextall (21) 2. Tom Barrasso (3).
Others: (1) Dominik Hasek, Kirk MacLean.
In the words of Tampa's Crisp, "That's a walkaway."
He, Berry and nearly every other coach chose the Islanders' Hextall. He sometimes had trouble stopping the puck this season. When he did, he knew what to do with it.
The wandering goalie, who plays like a third defenseman, was the first in NHL history to shoot a puck into the opposite goal.
Schoenfeld said: "Hextall's the most, but not the best. Hasek reads the play well. He really jumps out of the net when the other line's tired. He's alert. He's aware."
Best Goalie Glove Hand
1. Curtis Joseph (17) 2. Patrick Roy (3) 3. Bill Ranford (2).
Others: (1) Grant Fuhr, Andy Moog, Felix Potvin, Mike Vernon.
Joseph almost dominated with his glove the way Hextall did with his stick.
Joseph won with little commentary from the voters. Either a goalie catches the puck or he doesn't. Joseph does. He was flattered at being the coach's choice.
"But you really should have another category for goalies: best at making the second save," Joseph said.
Player You Hate To Play Against
1. (tie) Ray Bourque, Mario Lemieux (3) 2. (tie) Sergei Fedorov, Dale Hunter, Wayne Gretzky (2)
Others: Keith Acton, Chris Chelios, Ron Francis, Doug Gilmour, Curtis Joseph, Darius Kasparaitis, Eric Lindros, Mark Messier, Cam Neely, Adam Oates, Lyle Odelein, Patrick Roy, Ulf Samuelsson, Brendan Shanahan.
With 19 players named, this was the second-most-diverse vote.
They ranged from the ridiculously pesky to the sublimely skilled to the sublimely ridiculous combination of both.
Berry dreads Lemieux because of "his overall skills, and the fact that when he's in the lineup, (the Penguins) win the majority of their games."
The pests surfaced in force.
Crisp chose Acton over Butcher, saying, "They drive you nuts."
The list is a who's who of personal nemeses.
Darryl Sutter took Shanahan, who roughs up his Blackhawks.
Kevin Constantine of San Jose took Joseph, who has baffled his Sharks.
Brian Sutter of Boston picked Samuelsson, whose hit a couple of years ago started Neely's leg problems with the Bruins.
Ottawa's Rick Bowness shudders at the sight of Oates: "He can beat you in a lot of different ways."
1958 Coaches' Poll, published in the March 22 edition of the Toronto Star
The six NHL coaches - Toe Blake, Billy Reay, Sid Abel, Phil Watson, Rudy Pilous, and Milt Schmidt - all voted.
Only the winners were listed for each category, and no vote totals were given.
The text of the article named some other players who received votes. I've included those in parentheses, but it is not necessarily a complete list of players who received votes.
Best and fastest skater - Henri Richard, Montreal (closest thing possible to a unanimous choice)
Smartest player - Gordie Howe, Detroit (Andy Bathgate)
Best passer and playmaker - Gordie Howe, Detroit (Beliveau was close behind)
Hardest shot - Boom-Boom Geoffrion, Montreal (Doug Mohns was mentioned prominently, Andy Bathgate)
Most accurate shot - Maurice Richard, Montreal (Camille Henry, Andy Bathgate)
Best stickhandler - Larry Regan, Boston (Andy Bathgate)
Best man on breakaway - Maurice Richard, Montreal (Camille Henry)
Best puck carrier - Gordie Howe, Detroit
Best penalty killer - Jerry Toppazzini, Boston (Red Sullivan had strong support)
Best referee - Eddie Powers (Red Storey)
Best fighter - Fern Flaman, Boston (Dick Duff, Henri Richard, Ian Cushenan, Lou Fontinato)
Best defensive forward, checker - Red Sullivan, New York (Bert Olmstead, Nick Mickoski, Alex Delvecchio)
Best hustler, hardest worker - Red Sullivan, New York (Vic Stasiuk, Claude Provost)
Hardest bodychecker - Leo Boivin, Boston (Pierre Pilote)
Most underrated - Tom Johnson, Montreal (Camille Henry, Johnny Bucyk, Andy Bathgate)
Most improved - Forbes Kennedy, Detroit (Dickie Moore, Lou Fontinato, Henri Richard, Brian Cullen)
Best goalie on screened shots - Terry Sawchuk, Detroit (Glenn Hall had strong support in both goalie categories as well, and Jacques Plante had some votes)
Best goalie, man against man - Terry Sawchuk, Detroit
Best defensive defenceman - Doug Harvey, Montreal (far and away the best defensive rearguard - Marcel Pronovost and Fernie Flaman were mentioned also)
Best attacking defenceman - Bill Gadsby, New York (Harvey was very, very close behind)
Do we have anything for capturing players and coaches' comments on intangibles? I have some stuff noted and sourced but, short of it coming up during a thread, is there a way to share it here so it can be referenced by anyone who wants it?
