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Old
09-17-2009, 09:23 AM
  #26
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(as an aside, if...and I don't believe it's going to happen...but if we don't make the playoffs this year, let's open up a thread so we can talk about things non-hockey and rant and rave, insult each other, and thus make the summer go by faster.
You need to read the stickied thread listing It was opened up in late May/early June this year.

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09-17-2009, 09:54 AM
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Only business that grows to the size where it has a substantial management, by the way. In effect, it creates its own bureaucracy, and people in those businesses also tend to avoid accountability.

The only difference is that a boss can hold them accountable and fire them at a whim in most states, whereas they can't do that in government due to tenure.
Not surprisingly, you take my innocent comment ("It also applies to private business") to highlight how it isn't exclusive to the public sector, and go off on an anti-statist libertarian rage.

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09-17-2009, 10:25 PM
  #28
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Acadmus wrote:



Yes sir, yes, you are! Now punish yourself!

(as an aside, if...and I don't believe it's going to happen...but if we don't make the playoffs this year, let's open up a thread so we can talk about things non-hockey and rant and rave, insult each other, and thus make the summer go by faster.
Perhaps Acadmus can institute a Rogue's Gallery for the Panthers board, hmm?

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Old
09-18-2009, 04:28 AM
  #29
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Perhaps Acadmus can institute a Rogue's Gallery for the Panthers board, hmm?
Nope - there isn't even one for HFBoards as a whole anymore Seems the rogues can't even abide by the simplest of guidelines.

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09-18-2009, 11:46 AM
  #30
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Sykora signed with Minnesota for a whopping 1.6 million - 1 year deal. Sheesh.

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Old
09-18-2009, 07:07 PM
  #31
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TOR and BOS agree on deal, conditional on kessel signing a contract with TOR.

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=291601

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09-18-2009, 08:21 PM
  #32
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TSN now reporting that the contract has been agreed on.

This will either go really big, or really, really bad.

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09-18-2009, 08:30 PM
  #33
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damnit, I hate Toronto and REALLY enjoy watching them stink it up out there like they have lately.

TO's in the same Division, I'm going to think there's a bit more wrong with Kessel than is out there since they're willing to move him there. Two firsts and a second, though, I'm glad we didn't go after him. Especially if we keep picking like we have of late.

Kessel does have to pass a physical, right? So, guess we'll find out more as we go.

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09-18-2009, 09:37 PM
  #34
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Kessel also can't play until November at the earliest. Pretty steep price for him, even though it's fair value.

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09-18-2009, 09:57 PM
  #35
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Personally glad we did not try to acquire him for that price. He's an excellent player, but I just don't think we need him, especially at 5.4 mil per year. He's a Right winger and we already have Horton and Frolik occupying those spots. You could say we could have traded Horton for Kessel but no we couldn't have. Would do nothing to help Boston's cap trouble.

Also, this means Toronto doesn't pick until the third round in the upcoming entry draft, and the 4th round, the following entry draft. That blows for Toronto. Boston definitely has a chance to snag some fine prospects with those picks. Plus, I don't like what I've heard about his attitude.

That being said, I'm glad we had no need for him.


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Old
09-18-2009, 11:10 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Booootthh View Post
Personally glad we did not try to acquire him for that price. He's an excellent player, but I just don't think we need him, especially at 5.4 mil per year. He's a Right winger and we already have Horton and Frolik occupying those spots. You could say we could have traded Horton for Kessel but no we couldn't have. Would do nothing to help Boston's cap trouble.

Also, this means Toronto doesn't pick until the third round in the upcoming entry draft, and the 4th round, the following entry draft. That blows for Toronto. Boston definitely has a chance to snag some fine prospects with those picks. Plus, I don't like what I've heard about his attitude.

That being said, I'm glad we had no need for him.
Absolutely right, we had no need for a 30+ goal scorer, since we are so dynamic offensively I am SURE we wouldnt have a problem with our "right wing" slot if Kessel was here. Frolik even stated that he likes to play LW, so there, problem solved. Whatever, we were never in the sweeps, so I could care less.

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09-19-2009, 02:30 AM
  #37
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Toronto won that trade easily. If you viewed those picks optimistically, best case scenario 1 of them becomes the player Kessel already is. Burke got a guaranteed young star and gave up what ifs.

The contract he has I'm not to thrilled about. I think Horton money is fair value, so Toronto didn't come out so good with that. Boston was backed into a corner. They got more than they would have got on an offer sheet which I bet Burke threatened to do. Boston's one of the few teams where I think they can loss Kessel and not really skip a beat.

A shame the Panthers didn't offer that package, but we all knew that wasn't going to happen.

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09-19-2009, 07:17 AM
  #38
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I hate this trade solely because a real good young American player is playing in Canada now.

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09-19-2009, 07:37 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthers_Fan View Post
Toronto won that trade easily. If you viewed those picks optimistically, best case scenario 1 of them becomes the player Kessel already is. Burke got a guaranteed young star and gave up what ifs.

The contract he has I'm not to thrilled about. I think Horton money is fair value, so Toronto didn't come out so good with that. Boston was backed into a corner. They got more than they would have got on an offer sheet which I bet Burke threatened to do. Boston's one of the few teams where I think they can loss Kessel and not really skip a beat.

A shame the Panthers didn't offer that package, but we all knew that wasn't going to happen.
Im not sure i'd want to deal a 2010 1st round pick. Its a deep draft, and we could potential pick up an extremely good offensive player there.

I think both teams win this trade. Toronto finally acquires a legit young potential star, while Boston gains cap space (a valuable asset in itself) along with 2 1sts and a 2nd. Those can be used to restock their system, or as trade assets to use at deadline day to hopefully push them over the top for a cup run. It hurts to lose Kessel, but for instance, i certaintly think Krejci is a better player than Kessel. Whilst losing Kessel to average cap management sucks, the return IMO is pretty solid. A good scouting staff can turn this trade into a very good one for Boston.

Toronto is taking a gamble here though. Kessel is dynamic, but i still believe that he is a relatively weak piece to place as the center piece of your core. Im not a massive fan of Kadri (though he is doing well in preseason) and the loss of what was likely a top ten selection in a very good draft will hurt them. Though i assume Burke will attempt to acquire a 1st rounder in another trade. The 2011 looks weak (though Larsson looks like a beast) so no great loss there. Kessel looks like a star, but he isn't one yet.

I don't think there is a clear definitive winner in this trade. Infact, i think its likely both teams will probably be very content down the line with their acquired assets. This is definitely more even that the Heatley trade.

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Old
09-19-2009, 09:55 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by pb1300 View Post
Absolutely right, we had no need for a 30+ goal scorer, since we are so dynamic offensively I am SURE we wouldnt have a problem with our "right wing" slot if Kessel was here. Frolik even stated that he likes to play LW, so there, problem solved. Whatever, we were never in the sweeps, so I could care less.
Do we need scoring? Yes we need scoring, but I think the problem will solve itself soon enough without it hurting us long term.You want to give up two first round picks and a 2nd? Yeah hes a good player but come on. I HIGHLY doubt Cohen would love to dish out 5.4 mil on him on top of it. Toronto fans will be crying when the entry draft comes and they have no picks in the first round, like wise the year after. I'd rather keep the picks and grow our own talent, thanks. We've been doing well the past couple of years taking that route anyway.


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Old
09-19-2009, 10:05 AM
  #41
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It's an even trade. Everyone's saying that nobody knows how good those 1st round picks will become, and that's true. But Toronto is still far from a playoff lock, and their 1st this year in a draft with a very good top end could turn out as good as Kessel, maybe even better. And then Boston still gets another 1st and a 2nd on top of that. I agree with J117, Kessel is a great young player, but he's not a superstar. I wouldn't make him the centerpiece of my rebuild either. It may look like a good trade now for Toronto on some levels, but down the road it could turn into a bad one.

If it was me, I wouldn't give up that much for Kessel. It's fair value, but I'd pass. I'm glad we're low on money so we didn't even try.

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09-19-2009, 10:07 AM
  #42
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Ron Wilson's like sandpaper, I can't help but wonder what happens when he starts demanding--in that oh so gentle style of his--that Kessel start playing defense too.

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09-19-2009, 10:12 AM
  #43
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Ron Wilson's like sandpaper, I can't help but wonder what happens when he starts demanding--in that oh so gentle style of his--that Kessel start playing defense too.
True, and that goes back to him not really being cut out to be the centerpiece of a rebuild. He's soft too, and has always been labeled as a primadonna. Let's see how he does without Savard centering him. If he still scores 40 goals, then I'll tip my hat. I have my doubts though.

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09-19-2009, 10:24 AM
  #44
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True, and that goes back to him not really being cut out to be the centerpiece of a rebuild. He's soft too, and has always been labeled as a primadonna. Let's see how he does without Savard centering him. If he still scores 40 goals, then I'll tip my hat. I have my doubts though.
I may be wrong, but didn't he play with Krejci alot? Admittedly the only games of the Bruins i did watch were to see Krejci, so i didn't follow Kessel that much.

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09-19-2009, 10:43 AM
  #45
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I may be wrong, but didn't he play with Krejci alot? Admittedly the only games of the Bruins i did watch were to see Krejci, so i didn't follow Kessel that much.
I think he played with Krejci too, but in most of the Bruins games I saw he played with Savard and Lucic.

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09-19-2009, 11:30 AM
  #46
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fwiw, had a conversation about kessel with the father of one of our kids after our game this AM. he's a long time season ticket holder who sits very close to the game. he's very happy with the trade. never liked kessel. his complaint? the kid was fun to watch when the game was wide open but didn't have the stones to grind it out when things get tough. exactly the opposite of the player you'd want to add to our group of Fs.

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09-19-2009, 11:33 AM
  #47
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Do we need scoring? Yes we need scoring, but I think the problem will solve itself soon enough without it hurting us long term.You want to give up two first round picks and a 2nd? Yeah hes a good player but come on. I HIGHLY doubt Cohen would love to dish out 5.4 mil on him on top of it. Toronto fans will be crying when the entry draft comes and they have no picks in the first round, like wise the year after. I'd rather keep the picks and grow our own talent, thanks. We've been doing well the past couple of years taking that route anyway.
How do you know that is what he would cost us (contract) if we traded for him? I would give up the picks for Kessel because he would probably propel us into the playoffs, thus having a late first rounder this year. Add that late first rounder, with the first rounder in a week draft next year, and I wouldnt be upset with losing those assets for another goal scorer on a team in need of scoring. I would love to add a young 30+ goal scorer to go along with the young core we have here already. Our core is good, but to add Kessel to a future of Weiss, Booth, Frolik, Nate, Ballard, Kullikov, Ellerby, Markstrom, etc., really makes it look even more optimistic. Like I said earlier though, it was never going to happen, so I could care less.

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09-19-2009, 02:09 PM
  #48
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My two cents? I'd prefer to keep sticking to the program that PDB has in place. We have a really young team, keep adding the pieces we need. Patience will win out.

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09-19-2009, 02:14 PM
  #49
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How do you know that is what he would cost us (contract) if we traded for him? I would give up the picks for Kessel because he would probably propel us into the playoffs, thus having a late first rounder this year. Add that late first rounder, with the first rounder in a week draft next year, and I wouldnt be upset with losing those assets for another goal scorer on a team in need of scoring. I would love to add a young 30+ goal scorer to go along with the young core we have here already. Our core is good, but to add Kessel to a future of Weiss, Booth, Frolik, Nate, Ballard, Kullikov, Ellerby, Markstrom, etc., really makes it look even more optimistic. Like I said earlier though, it was never going to happen, so I could care less.
I would have loved to get Kessel, but that seems a but much to me for a guy with an injury that will keep him out til December. No guarantees after that, either.

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09-19-2009, 03:40 PM
  #50
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I actually would be okay with 2 firsts and a second IF Kessel signed a long-term deal. The guy is a franchise forward that you can build your top line around, something we haven't had since Bure. We've had some good drafts, yes, but there's no guarantee with draft picks and Kessel is going to be one of the top scoring forwards in the league for years to come.

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